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    Thread: Daytime awareness is difficult

    1. #1
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      Daytime awareness is difficult

      I don't want to just make a thread of me complaining or anything, but why is staying aware during the day so difficult? I suppose a lifetime of being relatively unaware during the day? Humans probably aren't made to maintain 100% awareness, I don't know.

      I really want to get my first lucid dream, and awareness during the day seems like the most direct route. But I hate having to constantly direct my focus to that.

      I desperately want to become lucid, but I'm still obviously not willing to do what it takes to get that first moment of lucidity. What I want to do is something like Naiya's simple MILD technique, but even that is difficult to focus on, or have any faith that it will work.

      I think I've developed a problem in thinking that daytime awareness is the only way for me to become lucid. Like that section in ETWOLD titled "lucid dreaming is easier than you may think". I'm making it harder for myself.

      So the question is, how do I turn this around? How can I believe that intention and autosuggestion type stuff can get me lucid? Is the subconscious really that powerful?

      Thank you and I hope this didn't come off as too much like complaining.
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    2. #2
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      It's part of getting older. A big part of remaining attentive and aware is having novel experiences, and the longer you live, the more what you experience is just a rehash of something else you've experienced. Even if the details change, the basic gist of it all stays the same. On top of that, we start going through the motions like its muscle memory because it helps us live comfortable, rather secure, lives. The more you mindlessly go through the same routine without interrupting it, the more you're working with known quantities--it's all familiar territory.

      Maintaining a high level of awareness through this can actively get in the way of this at times. It's easier to respond to wants without thinking about why you want that thing or why you're doing what you're doing at all. These wants have been what has worked for you so far, so wanting them is reinforced. Think about it... why do you want food? It seems like a ridiculous question to ask. You know full well that it's because you're hungry, you want something to do with friends, you like the flavor, it's comforting, etc. There isn't a reason to question why you would want food. In that same way, our daily activities and the way we react to things are easier and easier to just do rather than question. Thinking about why you want to go to work seems like a waste of time and energy when you know you need the money to maintain your lifestyle and otherwise survive. Thinking heavily about what you're doing, why you're doing it, the way you're doing it, etc. are really only things you need to do when you don't have previous experiences and knowledge to fall back on. Mindlessness, in a sense, is encouraged and reinforced in several ways as we get older because it's simply what works.

      I guess the best way to put it is that all of your mental processes and physical activities become streamlined for efficiency somewhere along the line. This efficiency comes at the cost of higher levels of conscious awareness. The way you turn it around is to work from within the system itself. That's the reason for establishing habits. Eventually you reminding yourself to stay aware becomes a habit of yours, and you regularly question what's going on and why it's happening. Essentially, you internalize a conscious desire to be more aware and an unconscious desire to remind yourself to do so manifests. Working within the system like this takes a bit of time, but once it starts working, it starts feeding on itself pretty quickly as long as you remain disciplined.
      Last edited by snoop; 01-06-2017 at 04:48 AM.

    3. #3
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      What are you trying so hard to stay aware of during the day? I personally find night work to be much more effective. wbtbs, meditating, and such. Read up on LDing throughout the day when you have time. maybe some meditation or something. work on being aware some of the time first before becoming aware all the time.

      I personally find most awareness techs to be a waste of time. You are aware during the day, just of the things you choose to be aware of. your job, your family, your driving. habbits are not the enemy. just add aware of the state you are in on the list of things you are aware of. being aware of the states doesnt mean that you notice every little thing you do all the time and everything that is happening.

      just relax, enjoy your dreams, enjoy your sleep, do some meditation (even if it short, like... an RC, yes every type of guided thinking is meditation), do some wbtbs (many mini and longer ones too), and just enjoy your waking life and dream life. If you try to be aware of everything all the time, you will just be frustrated.

      There are also techs called ADA/RCs. Also stressful, but they have more payoff. instead of focusing on everything, focus on one thing all the time. breathing, blinking, gravity, light, temperature, etc. whenever it messes up, you are in. this takes a long stressful time and most things have gone to show that it isnt very helpful to people with no exp.
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      I will be on hiatus again, if you have any questions, then read these threads and PM me after.
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      Well, thanks for the advice. I would need to just chill out and let it happen in good time.
      I've been on the forum for years, so I know about every technique/mindset, there is to know.

      It's just that I
      a)doubt my ability to become lucid
      b)still don't think I deserve to become lucid (low self esteem)
      c)have so many things in waking life to worry about that aren't easily fixed

      So yeah, I should really stop making threads that don't help anybody. But thank you for any advice, I appreciate it.

    5. #5
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      If you doubt your ability to become lucid, remember that we live in society that is filling us with the idea that things should happen quickly. Political change, health change, happiness change, intellectual change, everywhere you go you see people who want change, even on this very forum people want consistent lucid dreams after a few years. But life doesn't work that way, change takes time. From a spiritual perspective, lucidity or awareness only happens if you work towards a more conscious life, from a brain sciency perspective the parts of the brain (prefrontal cortex) that is self-aware and reflective is shut down during REM-sleep. So when we are beating ourselves up for not becoming lucid we are literally beating ourselves up over a complete natural and healthy function of our brain. This happens so that we can believe that we are in a real meaningful scenario for a moment in order for us to be able to learn and grow from the experience. If you are a buddhist it is no different from physical life.

      The point is, no matter how much internet wants to sugar coat the lucidity practice. The truth is, it's not something easy.

      However! It might not be easy, but it is SIMPLE.

      From my experience, the closest thing you can come to a magic pill, is not a change in what you do, but rather in how you do it.

      Don't deserve to become lucid? It's not about deserving or not deserving it's simply about being lucid.

      Worry in your life that aren't easily fixed. That basically sums up the human experience. What if it doesn't have to be fixed?

      What I want to arrive at with this post is that: There is one simple activity to lower doubt about lucidty, low self-esteem and your waking life worries.

      If you are still reading I thank you for your patience. Patience is key to all of these. Let's look at the brain.

      One day I had a realisation where I thought: If I play a computer game on a sh*tty computer I would suck no matter how much skill I have because my experience of the game would be different than for everybody else. Wouldn't it be the same for life if my brain wasn't working properly? This made me interested in the brain.

      Here is what I learned:

      The prefrontal cortex is the most evolved part of our human brain and the very thing that makes us different from animals. It governs our higher cognitive functions, self-awareness and alot of other interesting things. But if this governs self-awareness wouldn't it be great if we somehow could train this part of the brain like a muscle and make it grow? Well...We can! If we activate this area of the brain more often, the grey matter actually increses in this area, making it more powerful over time. What happens then is that our cogntive function enhances which makes us more capable of dealing with problems and it also makes us less reactive to external stimuli, leaving us less stressed so we have less cortisole flowing our blood and more dopamine flowing in our brains, making us generally happier and effective!

      Does this affect our dreams? Oh yes! Less stressful dreams and more awareness and more control, easier to become lucid in.
      Also did you know that your conscious brain's function has never been to solve problems, that's your subconscious mind's job. The conscious brain function is to identify problems, become aware of them. This is why creative solutions from great thinkers happened while they were not focusing on their work. So your intuitive ability to see solutions improve with a better functioning brain as well!

      Alright enough theory. What activity is capable of producing such amazing results?

      The act of doing ......... NOTHING!

      Also called meditation. It might sound too good to be true, if this was true, why doesn't everyone do it? Well why does everyone rather drink Coca-Cola that gives them cancer rather than kale and broccoli juice that is filled with tons of vitamins and antioxidants? We don't think for ourselves, we are trapped in societal and social habits, overvaluing thinking is one of them in this era of overstimulation and constant information processing. Ok let's explain meditation briefly.

      Many people try meditation and get frustrated and say that it seems pointless and they don't get why sitting at a chair doing nothing for 20 mintues a day would help at all. I was one of those people, until I came across a really powerful mindset: Accept the present moment exactly as it is. If you are a beginner, allow yourself to just make it a habit to sit on the chair for 5 min a day and slowly increase over time. No goal what so ever, it's ok to think it's ok to scream, but just sit at the chair! Over time you will probably develop an interest and the mind wants to look for MORE information and find breathing exercises and mantras and God knows what. The methods are not bad, but the key lies in just enjoying the action and observing, just abiding in awareness itself. This isn't something you have to intellectually understand, it comes with time, just sit.

      One day you might just find yourself laughing at your own mind, realising that thinking about life is like a dog chasing its own tail. When the dog finally catch the tail it thinks now what? When you see this illusion you are free from the mental prison or hamster wheel that you weren't even aware of being in.

      And you see life as it is, you see your dream as it is in both waking life and sleeping life.

      Also, when you experience life through this enhanced brain you no longer need some technique or method to be lucid and aware, you ARE lucid and aware. You don't need to read books about willpower, you HAVE willpower. You don't need anything external to become happy, you ARE happy. In other words all day awareness, lucidity, creatvity, happiness, intelligence, is your BEING not your DOING.

      So again here is a short description of everything above:

      Path to happiness: Make a habit to sit on a chair for 5+ min > Have no goal except just sitting at the chair.

      Why? Because you grow your prefrontal cortex, increasing dopamine, self-awareness, lucid dreams, you are no longer trapped inside your head.

      If this is so life changing, how come the greatest thinkers of the world didn't came up with this and shared it with the world?!
      > Because stilness can't be conveyed with words. Although in this post I have tried.

      If all of this still seems crazy, just try it and log your thoughts and emotions for a week and see what happens.

      It's just sitting at a chair for a few days, what's the harm?

      And if your rational mind wants to dismiss meditation as spiritual nonsense. Here is some science backing all of this up.

      http://news.harvard.edu/gazette/tag/...ss-meditation/

      I hope this will be helpful to you or someone else reading this.

      I wish you all guys a happy life.

      Peace!
      Last edited by MasterMind; 01-07-2017 at 02:36 PM.
      Travis E., snoop, Mgc88 and 3 others like this.

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      Wow, that may be the single greatest post I've ever read on Dreamviews.

      All I can say is hopefully someday I'll be on this site posting the news of my first lucid. And I've already been wanting to meditate, but it does feel like I'm doing it wrong. From what I understand, that's a common problem.

      Everyone thank Mastermind for the wisdom.
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    7. #7
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      Quote Originally Posted by Mgc88 View Post
      Wow, that may be the single greatest post I've ever read on Dreamviews.

      All I can say is hopefully someday I'll be on this site posting the news of my first lucid. And I've already been wanting to meditate, but it does feel like I'm doing it wrong. From what I understand, that's a common problem.

      Everyone thank Mastermind for the wisdom.
      I am glad you appreciated it.

      Yes it's a common problem to worry about meditation. But a calming truth is that you can't meditate wrongly, just sit and trust. Read about meditation to get the idea, but it's mainly just about sitting and allowing it to happen on its own.

      You're welcome. I used to complain and feel a bit down in my life a few years ago and then inspiring people on internet helped me get back on my feet, the least I can do is help someone else.
      Last edited by MasterMind; 01-07-2017 at 06:31 PM.
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    8. #8
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      This is one area where I part with Sensei: I think daytime awareness is very important. If you're not lucid during the day, how can you expect to be lucid at night, in the dream state, with its inherent foggy awareness and inhibited access to memory? Full-time lucidity (meaning, as much as you can manage) I believe is the path. Yes night work is important, but to me advanced LDing is about becoming a lucid person 24x7. Achieving LDs takes a perfect storm of conditions, preparation, and mindset/intention.

      The path to LDs starts with excellent dream recall (a sign that your dream awareness is growing), increasingly vivid and present (you feel like you're really there in the dream) dreams (which come from learning to pay attention to all life experiences), and then adding in the intention to be lucid in dreams.
      FryingMan's Unified Theory of Lucid Dreaming: Pay Attention, Reflect, Recall -- Both Day and Night[link]
      FryingMan's Dream Recall Tips -- Awesome Links
      “May I awaken within this dream and grasp the fact that I am dreaming, so that all dreamlike beings may likewise awaken from the nightmare of illusory suffering and confusion.”
      "...develop stability in awareness and your dreams will change in extraordinary ways" -- TYoDaS

    9. #9
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      Quote Originally Posted by MasterMind View Post
      Many people try meditation and get frustrated and say that it seems pointless and they don't get why sitting at a chair doing nothing for 20 mintues a day would help at all. I was one of those people, until I came across a really powerful mindset: Accept the present moment exactly as it is. If you are a beginner, allow yourself to just make it a habit to sit on the chair for 5 min a day and slowly increase over time. No goal what so ever, it's ok to think it's ok to scream, but just sit at the chair! Over time you will probably develop an interest and the mind wants to look for MORE information and find breathing exercises and mantras and God knows what. The methods are not bad, but the key lies in just enjoying the action and observing, just abiding in awareness itself. This isn't something you have to intellectually understand, it comes with time, just sit.
      I never really understood that whole 5 min. a day is enough, as well, even for beginners. To me, it felt like a waste of one’s potential, not pushing yourself to the limit. Think about it, 5 min. of practicing any skill seems worthless, you’re accomplishing nothing at all. That is, of course, if one can go further. For example, consider exercise. If I can do 10 pull-ups, but limit myself to 1 or 2 a day, then my muscles aren’t working to their fullest capacity. I once read what the guidelines proposed for physical activity to diabetic or high blood pressure patients. They recommend at least 30 min. of exercise (say walking) for X amounts of days (at least 3-4). What’s interesting is that they specify, the 30 min. only start to count the moment one reaches a certain heart rate level (70-80% your maximum heart rate), catered to each individual patient. Otherwise, the activity itself won’t benefit you.

      I wonder, do eastern practitioners sit for 5 min. a day when initiating meditative practice for the first time? Sometimes, I think the suggestion itself is incomplete or left too vague. So, perhaps it’s not that sitting for 5 min. a day is OK to begin with, but one should attempt to practice for however long that person can sustain it. So, 5 min. a day is enough, if that’s the most I can do. However, if I can keep at it for longer than that, then I should go for it. I remember in my case, I felt bad with myself at times because I knew I could meditate for longer. I decided to commit and figured I could extend it over to an hour. Now, I’m not anyone to give advice on meditation (I have a lifetime yet to learn) but I do feel I get closer to that lucid mindset if I follow a philosophy that drops the limiting mental barriers all together from the beginning.

      Nevertheless, that whole 5 min. thing takes a whole new level of meaning when you consider the following: the real meditative practice begins the moment you stop the meditative session. I’m reminded of a quote I read somewhere (can’t remember who it was) that said, the focus is not on meditation when you sit to practice, the focus is on meditation the moment you get up and return to life. It makes a lot of sense when you look at it from that perspective. What, you meditate 5 min., 15 min., 1 hour, or more, only to finish and return to mindlessness for the rest of the day? No, you use the session to remind you of what it means to meditate, and then you use that knowledge to apply it after. This way, the meditative session looks more like a controlled environment from which you can study and refine your skills, and not the be-all and end-all of meditation. It’s like the difference between studying for a test and applying that knowledge to real world events. In the end, 5 min. a day could appear insufficient or enough, depending on how you look at it.
      Last edited by Silence11; 01-10-2017 at 03:19 AM.
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    10. #10
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      Quote Originally Posted by Silence11 View Post
      In the end, 5 min. a day could appear insufficient or enough, depending on how you look at it.
      I get where you are coming from I have been an idealistic perfectionist all my life. I agree with what you are saying and in fact, to even suggest meditation as a practice can be a too big of a stretch for someone new. You got to see the possibilities for yourself to even become motivated. That is why I wrote the post from so many angles and perspectives.

      But when I started out with meditation I did it the other way around, I started by trying 1 hour, because the science is based on people who meditated for 40 min and I also attempted to WILD by having the goal to lay still for 1 hour and 30+ min to enter REM. So I aim HIGH. You can probably guess how that ended... As for all perfectionists their biggest problem are too big goals. So I sat and was frustrated because it was impossible to make 1 hour of meditation fun or a habit that I could keep up. But then I read a book about habits and they emphasized the importance of the habit, not the result, it's even mentioned in the the bhagavad gita:

      "We are entitled to the actions, not the fruits of the action."

      And that really stuck with me. So I decided to make the action of the practice itself the goal. IF I went and sit at the chair that's my only criteria for success. I allow myself to be happy if I just keep the habit, so I even started with 1 min. And then when 1 min felt too easy, I increased.

      When you are used to meditation though, the ideal is to not be limited to time at all, in buddhist texts, meditation even goes beyond the mind, time and space.

      I can also mention that I used to be shy so I went out and socialised and talked to girls to really conquer that fear. And the biggest fear was the fear of rejection, to fail. But when I made the action itself the goal, I had succeeded by just walking up to the girl. That was also a powerful way to train myself to see that rejection or failing only exists as a concept in the mind, more often than not it's actually the unconscious fear of failure that is the cause of the failure itself. Most importantly of all when you see the change, you see how helping yourself not only is of value to you, but to others.

      But when you lower your criteria for success (or happiness) you enjoy the practice and life itself. < This mindset is what converts frustration into FUN!

      So when someone thinks "I failed! " you think: I did it!

      When someone gives up early, you continue and reap the rewards of sticking it out!

      Also a thing to leave you with because this would be something I would like to have understood when I was new to meditation.

      There are TONS of books and theories and ideas and thoughts, brilliant texts, thinkers, methods, courses, about meditation.
      But even though this is good to motivate yourself, the practice is basically just making sitting a habit.

      Over time ALL answers become intuitive and simple.

      “Clear your mind of questions.” – Yoda

      Peace!
      Last edited by MasterMind; 01-10-2017 at 11:39 AM.
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