• Lucid Dreaming - Dream Views




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    Thread: How to SD?

    1. #1
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      How to SD?

      I'm seeking information on how to SD. By SD, I don't mean having a dream very similar to what another dreamer experienced. I want to know how multiple dreamers can share the same dreamspace in real time. Assuming both dreamers are already skilled with lucidity and control, what would the dreamers need to do in order to experience true SD?

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      That has been discussed here many times. It is unclear if this is even a possibility. None of us have had clearly shared dreams like you are talking about. Some have had experience that may be hard to explain, or that give hope for this.
      Peace Be With You. Oh, and sure, The Force too, why not.



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      A few people here are confident to have shared dreams or shared astral projections.

      I have no solid enough proof they are possible- I try that for years.

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      I cannot confirm any personal experiences of shared dreaming and I cannot confirm how it is done. However, I think it would be fun to take a crack at hypothesizing how it might scientifically work.

      Our dreams are based on the state of our perception during the time the dream takes place.

      At a given moment, it is possible for our state of perception of that moment to become based on another person's state of perception of that moment. This is known as "perspective-taking."

      If two people's states of perception of each other at a given moment become each other's states of perception of that given moment, they share the same state of perception of each other at that given moment, which becomes the basis of a shared dream.

      I just learned about "perspective taking" from looking it up. I don't know much about it, but it on the surface it seems like legitimate phenomenon. If it is legitimate, it seems to me that the success of shared dreaming is based on the timing, accuracy, and mutuality of the dreamers' perspective taking of each other up to the time of their dreams.
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      Quote Originally Posted by Psionik View Post
      A few people here are confident to have shared dreams or shared astral projections.

      I have no solid enough proof they are possible- I try that for years.
      I'd like to know what those few people have to say on this topic.

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      Here is at least one shared dreaming tutorial that has been created here on Dreamviews. Shared Lucid Dreaming Tutorial

      What is mentally possible while awake is possible while dreaming. While two people are awake, it is possible for them to mentally share a common situation involving each other. Therefore, while dreaming it must be possible for two people to share a common situation involving each other.

      I notice various shared dreaming tutorials advise the two people to get in mental agreement with each other in some way. For example, I have seen more than one shared dreaming tutorial advise the two people, while awake, to agree to meet each other somewhere when they are dreaming.
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    7. #7
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      Quote Originally Posted by Dreamzilla View Post
      I'd like to know what those few people have to say on this topic.
      It would be nice to hear from them, if only because they tend to be interesting people. But, unfortunately, you will likely find them not directly answering your OP. Generally, I've found, folks who say they have DS'd usually offer as proof things like "Because I said so," or "because I was there," or perhaps "Because my friend remembers dreaming things that ere just like the stuff I dreamed," and offer as technique little more than things like "Both of you get lucid and you just do it," or "I really don't know how it works or how to do it; it just happens." In the context of their posts, and perhaps their position of being unable to explain a transcendental phenomenon that is happening to them, I really have no problem with all that and truly hope that what they're saying is true (more in a sec), but in the context of this thread's request, you very likely wouldn't get much technical help from them.

      That said, I also truly hope that someone comes on board and proves me wrong!

      My main problem with SD'ing is not so much how to do it, but how it can occur at all. Here are three issues that I feel must be resolved before a SD can occur:

      * There needs to be some physical activity or vehicle that allows two minds to link up in their dreams (brainwaves are simply not enough, in my opinion).

      * There needs to be a way to find each other among the billions of other dreaming minds in this world.

      * Above all there needs to be a way to communicate, to form an image in your partner's mind that she can understand, once you're there.

      I'm not saying that any of these things are impossible, and I sincerely hope that they are possible, because if SD'ing is possible, it would indicate that a whole new chapter would need to be written in the physics books, and that is very exciting!

      Finally, and in full disclosure, I regularly experience an odd phenomenon that I call finding myself in other people's dreams, which could be interpreted as a sort of inadvertent SD'ing. It's not exactly what we're talking about here, but you might find it interesting; if you are curious, here is a link to a very old thread I once started about it (feel free to necro!).


      Also:

      Quote Originally Posted by dolphin View Post
      I cannot confirm any personal experiences of shared dreaming and I cannot confirm how it is done. However, I think it would be fun to take a crack at hypothesizing how it might scientifically work.

      Our dreams are based on the state of our perception during the time the dream takes place.

      At a given moment, it is possible for our state of perception of that moment to become based on another person's state of perception of that moment. This is known as "perspective-taking."

      If two people's states of perception of each other at a given moment become each other's states of perception of that given moment, they share the same state of perception of each other at that given moment, which becomes the basis of a shared dream.

      I just learned about "perspective taking" from looking it up. I don't know much about it, but it on the surface it seems like legitimate phenomenon. If it is legitimate, it seems to me that the success of shared dreaming is based on the timing, accuracy, and mutuality of the dreamers' perspective taking of each other up to the time of their dreams.
      Quote Originally Posted by dolphin View Post
      What is mentally possible while awake is possible while dreaming. While two people are awake, it is possible for them to mentally share a common situation involving each other. Therefore, while dreaming it must be possible for two people to share a common situation involving each other.

      I notice various shared dreaming tutorials advise the two people to get in mental agreement with each other in some way.
      But are those ways that actual SD'ing (in my opinion, showing up in someone else's dream, and both you and the other dreamer understand what is occurring) can occur, or are they explanations for how two people can have remarkably similar dreams?

      What you describe, to me, is what dreamers often mistake as a shared dream, but not the actual presence of two consciousnesses in one dream. Yes, two people who are very close and have very similar life experiences might tend to dream of the same things, but is that actually SD'ing?

      Finally:

      For example, I have seen more than one shared dreaming tutorial advise the two people, while awake, to agree to meet each other somewhere when they are dreaming.
      This is a very good idea, but doesn't it imply that both SDer's have already mastered whatever techniques are necessary to resolve all the issues I noted far above?
      Last edited by Sageous; 01-15-2018 at 07:14 PM.
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    8. #8
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      They are explanations for how two people can have remarkably similar dreams. I think this is the closest one can get to having a shared dream as you describe. I'm not sure if it is possible for there to be two consciousness's in one dream.
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      I once participated in an informal experiment to see if the other dreamers and I could do this. We did not manage to share any dreams—nothing that was even disputably a shared dream, much less indisputably— but a few times, there were similarities between our dream content that seemed odd enough to call a coincidence—or other interesting connections. For instance, I had a dream where I was in Ukraine—something that had never happened before, in any of the previous 4,438 dreams in my journal. And then I found out later—only after the dream— that one of the people I was trying to share dreams with was living in Ukraine. That’s a little hard to explain—but it’s not going to convince any skeptics, either.

      Quote Originally Posted by sivason View Post
      That has been discussed here many times. It is unclear if this is even a possibility. None of us have had clearly shared dreams like you are talking about. Some have had experience that may be hard to explain, or that give hope for this.
      So yeah - basically this.

      But if sharing dreams is possible, I’d say you’d have a much better chance of doing it with someone you’re close to—and, possibly, having a better motivation to try it than just being curious.

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      I think a perfectly shared dream would be nearly impossible - a dream scene isn't a place, it is more of a projection, and two different people won't project exactly the same thing.

      Telepathy in dreams I absolutely believe in. But for me it would tend to be harder to do with someone I'm close to, because there generally wouldn't be enough meaningful and previously unshared thought content to act as the driving force behind the experience, or a clear way to separate it from other thoughts and memories.

      The lack of a plausible mechanism is a problem. It doesn't cause me to doubt my experiences, because I know that the physics models that we use to define our 'plausible mechanisms' do not capture all of reality. For myself, the lack of a plausible mechanism is a problem mostly because if I had some kind of reasonable model, the experiences would be less confused. Increasingly, a lot of the content in such dreams is very abstract and strange, like I'm trying to interpret something that I'm not understanding at all well.

      I think that the 'in other people's dreams' experience of Sageous is the same thing I'm talking about, but I think those aren't their dreams, those are their mental spaces, so to speak, and they're not necessarily even asleep.

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      Quote Originally Posted by Dreamzilla View Post
      I'd like to know what those few people have to say on this topic.
      Those are believers. I don't have experience which would suggest reality of dream sharing.
      One of them is "Man of Shred".

      Now, what "Shadow of wind" suggest is more real explanation. But it is one which can explain everything, even shared dream as imagination. I may be in the shared dream and not know it- since persons I meet there may look completely different, the place may look completely different, actions may be completely different... all because it is filtered through my subconscious mind. And their the same. Even approach I try- to be as observer without active thinking, with as small interference as possible may be flawed. Or maybe it would better to say insufficient.
      It may be even complete imagination. One can have supposedly shared dreams, but when it is with someone you know and speak about your dreams, then there is possibility to initiate similar types of dreams without sharing them. High similarity may be the result of collective superconsciousness or limited telepathy(if those things exist?)
      I don't exactly like it, because it goes against what I believe from my experiences. My OBEs are victim as well if this is true. But it is possibility I need to think about all the time.
      Last edited by Psionik; 01-17-2018 at 01:30 PM.
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    12. #12
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      Quote Originally Posted by Psionik View Post
      Those are believers... One of them is "Man of Shred".
      There's also Waking Nomad and Raven Knight, though I don't know if either of them still posts here. Waking Nomad changed his name some time ago, and I don't remember what it is now.

      EDIT ok, Waking Nomad's new screen name is Baron Samedi - he created the tutorial linked by Dolphin above. Guess my whole post is pretty irrelevant now. D'oh!
      Last edited by Darkmatters; 01-17-2018 at 05:08 PM.
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    13. #13
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      Here’s an example of what I call dream telepathy. A few years ago I read a short story that begins with an image of an owl picking up a mouse, which bites its talon. The story was old, but I hadn’t read it before. That night, in place of my usual lucid dream there’s just a lucid silence. The next day, my sister, who I didn’t grow up with and whom I talk to only once or twice a year, e-mails me about a dream she had that night which begins with her picking up a mouse which bites her on the finger. That’s followed by other content which meant nothing to her, but which provided an insight to me in relation to a metaphysical question I’d thought of the previous day, and was easier for her to put into words because her chemistry vocabulary was different than mine. There was also a detail in my otherwise silent dream that connected to hers, but I’ve since forgotten it.

      You may regard this as a random coincidence, but considering the mouse image, the lack of communication and shared external events, and that I had many other similar experiences for several years, I don’t find that explanation very plausible. It is not a ‘shared dream’ of the Waking Nomad variety, but I think this type of connection was present in those other people’s imaginings. I also had a couple of experiences in relation to him.

      Self-doubt is a big damper on psychic experience. If you’re objectively honest and critical, it makes such experience a lot more difficult, because it prevents imagination from moving freely. Irrational people who don’t question themselves tend to have more such experiences as a consequence. Their interpretations may be largely delusional, but that doesn’t mean there’s nothing there at all.
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