Police Brutality

[Tsen]

Alright, I only just found out about this today. I've got this friend, a 6'6" black guy. He's hilarious, and an awesome guy. For the sake of anonymity, I'm going to call him Jack. Well, the other day, a guy robbed a bank in Layton. Here's the official police description:
"Police describe the robber as a black male in his mid-20s, wearing a blue jumpsuit-- like what a mechanic wears-- and wearing white gloves. If you have any information, please call police." (Taken from KSL news)
Here's the deal. That description covers a number of people in the THOUSANDS. I mean, the jumpsuit--perhaps not. But a black male in his mid 20s? That's not exactly precise.
Well, Jack was hanging out at the comic book store where my other friend works. Jack decides to go to the restaurant next door to grab some lunch. The restaurant and comic book store are both relatively close to the bank--within a few blocks. Well, he's out getting lunch, and after about fifteen minutes my friend in the comic book store starts to wonder what's taking him so long--he was just running into a fast food place to grab some food and then come back. A few minutes later, police come and inform my friend that he's got to lock down the comic book store, so he does, and when he goes outside, the buildings are surrounded by swarms of police cars and helicopters.
Turns out, moments after walking into the restaurant, Jack was assaulted by police. They physically threw him to the ground at gunpoint, put him in handcuffs, roughed him up and told him he was going to jail for robbing a bank. They interrogated him, still at gun point, despite the fact that he was in hand cuffs on a chair and completely unarmed.
Lovely mess.
Well, Jack had his backpack with him. The police (without a warrant or Jack's permission) open it because they told Jack that they thought he was hiding the money in there.
Now here's the thing. Jack's...well, a geek. He grew up in the rough parts of New York, but there's no denying it--he's REALLY geeky. This is the guy who taught me how to play Dungeons & Dragons. He plays tournament Pokemon cards, too. Yeah. Geeky.
Well, when they open up the bag, guess what comes out-- a massive pile of Pokemon cards and a case full of dice. Do they let him go? No! They continued to rough him up and interrogate him for several hours.
Well, after they finally determined he wasn't guilty, they offered him $20,000 in appeasement. I told him not to take it--any lawyer worth his salt could get him over $1,000,000, but I'm not sure if he'll take my advice.

Either way, this seriously pisses me off. Especially because I know race was a major issue in the case--if it was a white guy, I highly doubt that three police officers would have guns in his face roughing him up and interrogating him. So yeah. Just had to vent that out.

(By the way, I also love how the news avoided reporting on this altogether. There's a few articles online about the robbery, and it was on television, but NOBODY has reported a thing about how Jack got assaulted by police officers.)

[NeAvO]

That sucks :| .

I know this guy that was being tormented by corrupt cops as well.

[Jimmie Lynne]

The police are just useless all around in my oppinion. Well. . . I'm sure most police are decent but not the ones where I grew up!

My bestfriend was beaten by her step father when she was 17. She had to go the hospital. They thought she might be bleeding internally. Her face was one huge bruise and her lip and nose were both bleeding. He had actually thrown her across the room at one point. She filed a police report. They took photos of her injuries and everything. This man had a record of violence because he'd been arrested for starting several drunken bar fights. Her mother also witnessed the attack and recieved several blows herself trying to defend her daughter from her husband. What happened to him? Absolutely nothing. They didn't arrest him. They didn't even question him.

BUT if you have more than two cars in your driveway the police will be there in a heartbeat to check and see if there is any underage drinking going on. I went to several pizza and movie get togethers at friends houses where the police turned up insisting that they be allowed to come in because they had reasonable suspicion of underage drinking. (Not one of us was underage and there wasn't so much as a beer in the house.) They always claimed there had been a noise complaint from a neighbor but seeing as how we were all sitting around quietly watching tv and eating pizza. . . it's very unlikely that was the case.

One of my friends (friendly white guy, no record) was arrested and had his car impounded for going too slow on a residential street. He was driving down the street at 5 mph looking for an adress in the dark on a road with no street lights and a cop pulled him over and accused him of "casing the neighborhood". This all happened two doors down from my friends uncle's house. (that was the address he had been looking for) The uncle came outside and assured the cop that nothing weird was going on. My friend's girlfriend, who was in the passenger seat assured the cop that they weren't doing anything wrong. . . AND still the guy arrests my friend and won't even let him park his van in his uncle's driveway. He has it towed to impound where my friend has to then pay $200 the next day to get it out. When they got to the police station my friend was questioned and NOT charged with any crime, thank goodness, and will no longer set foot in my home town.

All of these things happened in the place where I grew up. A tiny tiny little town. They are so bored they make mountains out of mole hills. . . and yet so lazy when they have a REAL crime, they file it away and don't DO anything about it.

Another example I just remembered. . . my best friend's house was broken into. Everything electrical that could be carried down the stairs was stollen. A window was open in one of the bedrooms so she knew that's how the theif had gotten in. The police came over so she could file a report and at first he didn't even want to come in the house to look around. He just wanted her to describe what was stollen on the front lawn. She got him to come in and look at the inside and when she asked if he could finger print the window to try and catch the guy who robbed her, he looked at her like she was nuts and said, "We don't take fingerprints for this sort of thing."

[The Blue Meanie]

I'm fully in support of police brutality.

Some police most certainly need to be brutalised.

[badassbob]

As far as I'm concerned the police are absolutely pathetic. They don't help anyone.

I've had my name taken down by the police several times, and my parents are always notified.

It usually goes something like this; Let's say you're hanging around with a few mates on a friday night having a good time when a police car comes speeding down the road with its sirens going. They usually get out and come over to report to you that there's been a group of youths going round causing trouble. They blame us, take our names, tell our parents and they don't know a thing about wether or not we have been responsible for what's happened. The next day my parents find about my "anti social behaviour" and I get in a load of trouble. I've recently been informed that if my name is taken one more time, I'll have to go to court and I will most likely end up with an ASBO.

Because of this we now run every time we see a police car with the sirens on coming towards us, which makes us look more guilty - there's no way to get around getting in trouble. I may as well take a couple of molotov cocktails and a knife out with me every friday night for all the difference it would make.

The whole system is a load of crap. The police just make examples in the hope that it will actually affect something.

[The Blue Meanie]

Why don't you sue the police for defamation? You certainly have a case. The police are taking your names repeatedly and telling your parents you're causing trouble.

[Jimmie Lynne]

As far as I'm concerned the police are absolutely pathetic. They don't help anyone.

I've had my name taken down by the police several times, and my parents are always notified.

It usually goes something like this; Let's say you're hanging around with a few mates on a friday night having a good time when a police car comes speeding down the road with its sirens going. They usually get out and come over to report to you that there's been a group of youths going round causing trouble. They blame us, take our names, tell our parents and they don't know a thing about wether or not we have been responsible for what's happened. The next day my parents find about my "anti social behaviour" and I get in a load of trouble. I've recently been informed that if my name is taken one more time, I'll have to go to court and I will most likely end up with an ASBO.

Because of this we now run every time we see a police car with the sirens on coming towards us, which makes us look more guilty - there's no way to get around getting in trouble. I may as well take a couple of molotov cocktails and a knife out with me every friday night for all the difference it would make.

The whole system is a load of crap. The police just make examples in the hope that it will actually affect something.
[/b]


What's an ASBO? (I'm American, our terms must be different)

[NeAvO]

What's an ASBO? (I'm American, our terms must be different)
[/b]
Anti Social Behaviour Order. Basically disturbing the peace ect.

[Ynot]

What's an ASBO? (I'm American, our terms must be different)
[/b]
anti-social behaviour order

it's a british thing
and it doesn't work

innocent people tend to get Asbo's by accident
mate of mine got one for repeatedly pee'ing against someone's fence whenever he walked back from the pub drunk

[Jimmie Lynne]

In America had a man been caught repeatedly (or probably just once) peeing in public he would have been arrested for public indecency. . . or do they ticket for that? I don't remember.

[FreshBrains]

Wow, I guess I'm lucky. As far as I know, my town's police force is competent. There's always been at least one police officer at our schools ('Officer Bob', we've always called him, even after he retired and became a teacher) and what few crimes we've heard of have been dealt with. I'm amazed at some of the things people have been describing - grounds for a lawsuit and one hell of a payment on the police's part.

[Ynot]

my problem with Asbo's is that it effectively criminalises actions that aren't against the law

the Asbo itself is a civil injunction order
but breaking the Asbo is a criminal offence (max 5 years in prison)

http://www.asboconcern.org.uk/asbowrong.html

[badassbob]

Why don't you sue the police for defamation? You certainly have a case. The police are taking your names repeatedly and telling your parents you're causing trouble.
[/b]

Well I'd like to but it's too much of a hassle. Also, eveyone else round here gets the same treatment and I'm sure there have been complaints before and nothing seems to have been done about it. I don't think suing them would work out, after all, it's not America :wink: .


Wow, I guess I'm lucky. As far as I know, my town's police force is competent. There's always been at least one police officer at our schools ('Officer Bob', we've always called him, even after he retired and became a teacher) and what few crimes we've heard of have been dealt with. I'm amazed at some of the things people have been describing - grounds for a lawsuit and one hell of a payment on the police's part.
[/b]

Yeah I suppose it all depends on where you live. I live on a crappy council estate (lowedges). Throughout Sheffield as long as I've remembered there has been a lot of racial tension, and it's generally not a nice atmosphere when you're out on the streets with your mates in the evenings. Which is why you have to hang around in groups, it's better when you're with a lot of other people.

[Alric]

Police are getting totally out of control all over. If you don't think so try getting a speeding ticket or something, and then get out of the car. I guarantee no matter who you are, they will draw a gun on you and threw you on the ground and cuff you. Even if your a 90 year old lady.

[TweaK]

So how did this work out? Did he sue them for billions gazillions trillions of bucks or did he take the twenty grand?

[Tsen]

This only happened last week, things are still unfolding. I don't get to talk to him very often now that I'm up in Logan, either, so I don't know for sure. I think he's at least trying to talk to the ACLU or some other people about legal action, but I can't say for sure.

[TygrHawk]

Police are getting totally out of control all over. If you don't think so try getting a speeding ticket or something, and then get out of the car. I guarantee no matter who you are, they will draw a gun on you and threw you on the ground and cuff you. Even if your a 90 year old lady.
[/b]

I don't think this is anything new. I was taught 30 years ago that you NEVER get out of your car when you are pulled over, unless the officer asks you to. You also keep your hands in plain sight, lest they think you're going for a gun or something. I don't blame the cops for this -- they have no idea what to expect when they pull someone over.

Of course, this has nothing to do with the heinous acts described in Tsen's first post -- that's just inexcusable.

[Alric]

Well I just wanted to show you how they think. They assume all people are armed and they will treat you as such. A lot of them also assume your guilty right away as well. To a lot of them people are just criminals and they have no respect for them. Which is why they will beat you if they feel like it.

[AlternateReality]

i always go and grab a bite to eat after i rob banks.

[Jess]

Tsen your mate could sue the F*** out of the police, make sure he does - assault...false imprisonment...

Although I bet there's some fascist law now that allows this sort of thing since 9/11, but he should still try, I'm probably exaggerating.

[fly by night]

A friend of mine that I used to work with told me a liitle story about the police and a little revenge.

In the town were he was living, at the time, there were kids that would always get herassed by the police in one way or another, especially this one female cop. She always had a habit of taking the kids who she couldn,t charge with any crimes, and drive them to a rural part of town and drop them off in the middle of no where so they would have to walk home. This would be humiliating for the kids.

I guess it did get to be a habit because one day the kids grew tired of it and they set her up. They had a whole group of them wait and hide in the area where she was famous for dropping them off. As shs came down the road and stopped to drop off a couple more youths, they ambushed her and over powered her.
They took her head and forced it into the window of her own police cruiser and rolled the window up tightly around her neck. Not enough to stop her breathing but just enough so that she was trapped. Next they pulled her pants down to her ankles and just walked away!

Sweet

[badassbob]

I guess it did get to be a habit because one day the kids grew tired of it and they set her up. They had a whole group of them wait and hide in the area where she was famous for dropping them off. As shs came down the road and stopped to drop off a couple more youths, they ambushed her and over powered her.
They took her head and forced it into the window of her own police cruiser and rolled the window up tightly around her neck. Not enough to stop her breathing but just enough so that she was trapped. Next they pulled her pants down to her ankles and just walked away!

Sweet
[/b]
Now that is justice!

[sargentpepper882]

people come on


yes, there is a problem with some of the executive side of the law


but honestly


think were you would be without the police


honestly
i woudl love having a couple corrupt cops if that meant having the thousands of other just ones


some of the police system is corrupt and that needs to be stopped btu honestly,

hwo can you sau that al teh polie have gotten out of hand?


it would be absolute anarchy of there was no law enforcement


adn anarchy never works


history has showed us that


o wait

no it hasnt


all anarchist societies ahve collapsed within weeks


hence no history

[FreshBrains]

Wow... might want to lay off of the enter key there, pal. Your keyboard might get up and run away.

Anyway, anything happening yet, Tsen? Did he take the $20,000 or is he going to sue the police right through their pants?

[Tsen]

I still haven't got a chance to speak to him directly about it yet, so I don't know his reasoning, but I heard the other day that he took the $20,000.
I really wish he would've pressed charges, because this was just so blatantly wrong...

[sargentpepper882]

Wow... might want to lay off of the enter key there, pal. Your keyboard might get up and run away.

Anyway, anything happening yet, Tsen? Did he take the $20,000 or is he going to sue the police right through their pants?
[/b]


i know but, notice that after every sentence you write, which is two, you had pressed enter.

Hooray for ratios because using them, you contradicted yourself


and also, i find it easier to read than giant walls of text

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[The Blue Meanie]

:wtf:

[AlternateReality]

I still haven't got a chance to speak to him directly about it yet, so I don't know his reasoning, but I heard the other day that he took the $20,000.
I really wish he would've pressed charges, because this was just so blatantly wrong...
[/b]
I think he could've gotten alot more than that.
my mom's lawyers is predicting about that because someone hit her car and she got some herniated or something discs in her spine and couldn't work for awhile.

[fly by night]

I heard on the radio a couple weeks ago. This guy robs a bank and as he is fleeing the scene he gets robbed by another guy for the loot. They both were aprehended. What are the odds?

Here is a funny story that happened to me about 25 years ago.

I was coming home from highschool and I had lost my keys to get in my house. I went around to the side of our house and pulled a ladder out from under our porch. I set the ladder in the driveway beneath our bathroom window. I climbed the ladder and managed to crack open the window just enough to wiggle my body in head first.

I,m in my house for about 20 minutes when I hear a knock at my front door?,who should it be but 2 police officers asking me for my ID. They push there way into my living room as I pull out my wallet for my ID.
I explain my situation and once they knew I lived there they told me how my neighbours called them because they seen a pair of feet entering our side window!

I pointed to some family pictures on our walls and said; look ..if I don,t live here then someones got my picture on their walls. The look on their faces was priceless. I know they wanted to kill me at that moment for being such a smart ass but I could,t help it.

I,m actualy glad they showed up in that situation and i,m also glad my neighbours are keeping a keen eye out. That could have easily been an attempted break in and they would have been caught but still, being a teenager and all the times I have been hasseled by the police I felt I had to give them a hard time.

[Neruo]

I just don't understand such stupid cops. Not only are they racist, they are allso total idiots for wasting time on someone who is Clearly not a crook... I mean indeed, any black man could have been the bankrobber...

Well, at least het gets 20.000$... alot of people are willing to get accused and slapped around a bit to get that. Still, no price justifies such stupid behaviour.

[Alric]

You do know that the money comes out of the tax payers of that state right? When you think about it that way, your spending tax money paying people off because the police are acting like morons. What a waste.

And no there shouldn't be corrupt police. Its always unaccetpable to have corruption even if most are really good.

[icedawg]

That's awful, that really is.

The main points I wanted to make seem to have been already made by others. The first being that there's a consequence to every action. Indeed, your friend deserves some restitution, but I think the $20 000 is more than fair. He could probably sue for more (or at least, he could have if the case was more publicized than it was); but, that money has to come from somewhere right? Police only have so much money in their operating budget. Perhaps $1 million for this case (which seems excessive, but it was the suggested figure) would translate into fewer police walking the streets next year. Perhaps not, but you see the point I'm making...people who sue institutions or corporations for excessive amounts of money are hurting more people than they realize (directly or indirectly causing layoffs and whatnot). There needs to be the threat of sanction and reprisal in order to keep these entities in check of course, but that recourse (vis-a-vis suing in this case) needs to be commensurate.

Furthermore, you can all bitch about the police as much as you want, but the fact is everyone makes mistakes, and I can promise you all that none of you would like this world very much if there were no police. Life is full of compromise...we have to sacrifice something to get something back (i.e. we have to take the good with the bad...there's no such thing as a perfect police force). Unfortunately for your friend, he ended up having to sacrifice more than the average person should, so again I reiterate that some compensation is in order (namely the $20 000 offered).

[Alric]

If they cut out the morons I would be more than happy to have a few less of them.

[Tsen]

I agree with Ice, we need a police force regardless of our feelings towards them, but I am still deeply offended that such blatantly racist and bigoted people can become members of the police force, and then pull off actions such as this one and cost the tax payers thousands of dollars.

[Jlick]

I can promise you all that none of you would like this world very much if there were no police.
[/b]

I think i would perfer people who protect the innocent people over courrupt people who work the system.

just my 2 cents

[Tsen]

But nowhere near all police work the system. Even the ones who roughed up my friend. Yeah, they were out of line: They abused their power. But they weren't in any way working the system, they were just nasty people who like to throw around their power because it makes them feel tough. Honestly, I believe that they ought be banned, at least temporarily, from the police force and required to pay the $20,000 themselves. Why should the tax payers shoulder the burden of their irresponsibility?