View Full Version : A warning to all who are in love with freedom...!!
In 2002 I wrote on forums that Muslims wanna take over our countries in just one night, I don't know why I wrote that, it just came up in my mind and I wrote it down, now on september the 8th 2007 around 20.30 I was concentrated gazing in Shambavi Mudra and saw these inner visions like dreamlike states which confirmed to me what I already was thinking :
....from out of the suddenly appearing white expanding light, Glorious Gauranga is majesticly dancing in slow motion from the left to the right, armes raised up high to announce the times of love of God, brilliant shining stars surround Him, no one can stop Him, or stop Him smiling....
...the bottom of the crater is filled with a lake of heated anger, red and boiling, while at the same time big black screaming birds with fierce eyes containing red viens are flying around over all this, trying to attack the beholder with ferocious and never seen before force....
...and when the daylight dissapears and the Sun God withdraws his rays from out of the forest of peace, the lotus flowers of the blue lake close their soft pink petals and night falls in, you'll hear the silence represented by the artistic sounds of streams and waterfalls, the wind whispering through the leaves, the stars on the firmanent are shimering with good fortune and the cupper moon is dancing.....
...big black giant monsters with red eyes of devastation emerge from the tar of the molten asfalt of the roads from the in deep hellish sins sunken cities of no love whatsoever, destroying lovely build houses everywhere and squeezing the life force out of the people they meet with their stinking ugly strong hands or claws of Death, leaving them dripping with blood, swallowing their tongues and eyes popping out because of the squeezing pressure in hate, as they wished at that moment they were never born into this world...
...as the white moving soft streams of mists form the big beautiful cloud high up in the skies, the little angel girl is playing the Golden Harp which is creating with each stroke streams of Golden Shinin' Stars forming a cosmic highway and white rabbits, deer, doves, calves and tigers are surrounding the scenery, massaging the environment with their loving heartbeats, the stars are dancing joyfully around them....
...and then from out of the dark depts of the blackened Earth, cracked open, the Gates of Hell unlocked, releasing their soldiers of hatred, heading with tridents and other weapons to eradicate the goodness, nevertheless, white shining silhouettes, the angels, man and women, are pouring down endlessly from the skies with their weapons, resembling science fiction kinda laserbeams and more stuff I can't explain, protecting what is good with their love for life...
...I am the arrow moving upwards rapidly into the Caroussle of All Colors...
End of inner visions.
So there will be a war, but who wins ?
Here is the answer :
On July the first around 20.55 I was thinking back to the Muslims who want to see me dying a death from smoking, then a voice in my head said :
"Spanjolen", which means Spanish soldiers in English.
The Spanish once occupied our country, it was strange to hear this in context with the Muslims, but I thought back to the dreams I had about that Iranian police was in charge in some parts of our country and about the dream I had about the influx of Russian soldiers (Muslims) in our country and that I had to show my papers to them on the streets, near the Vierambachtsstraat in Rotterdam.
But.....as the Spanish were kicked out by us, in the same way the Muslims will be kicked out by us in the future, then I heard another voice saying :
"Je weet het, he ?" meaning "So you know, huh ?" in English
So we will win the war !!!
On september the 9th, just one day after the visions about the Muslim takeover which cannot be avoided, I think, I had these two visions in the same way as the other ones, I didn't know what to make of it, but later I realized it was about ......ME !!
...the big blue coloured head of stone with holes of erosion on it, which resembles the face of the Eastern Island statues, fell from the tops of the 5 meter wide big round trees who are reaching to Heaven & beyond, into an empty spot in the jungle, surrounded by these big giant green trees in a circle...
...it looked around helplessly & hopelessly like the candle on the cover of the cartoon of Suske and Wiske "De Zingende Kaars" or "The Singing Candle, and was seriously trying to transmit a message from the inhabitants of the Higher Worlds to the people of the world he descended into from such great heights, but hidden behind some trees there were masked sneaky and vicious cat people being attracted to the possible value of the blue stone who could be sold on their marketplaces in pieces...
So one of my tasks here on Earth is to warn people of this fact.
On September 21st around 00.30 I had again a few visions (I have more, but not really related to the story), here they are :
...a halo of yellow light surrounds a red shinin' circle that crops up, like a sun...
...people of all creeds and races (I feel) are running panick stricken from something into my direction, I clearly see a bearded Muslim man of around 45-50 years running with his arms outstretched as if asking for help and expressing his despair....
...a vague atomic bomb explosion with black silhouettes of people in front....
....then black dogs of hate...
...a squirl beneath a tree cracking a nut in peace...
Here is the ending of my visions as I thought they were stupid and I didn't wanna write tem down anymore. But it clearly suggests that the upcoming war will be an atomic one and that even Muslims are vitimized by it.
Brandon Heat
12-20-2008, 12:00 PM
Wow that's such a long post I'll have to come back read this and then proceed to answeer it.
_massive
12-20-2008, 02:30 PM
The next Nostradamus. Interpret as you like.
Brandon Heat
12-20-2008, 03:42 PM
Interesting read however is it true or not? And will we ever know? Could of possibly just wasted 5 minutes of life and I may come back asking for it.
Catbus
12-20-2008, 05:11 PM
Anyone wanna summarize it for a lazy bastard?
plg6067
12-20-2008, 07:41 PM
interesting... But you talk about Muslums like all of them beleive the same stuff, which is a terrible generalization... There are plenty of muslums who are just normal people like you and me, so thinking that "muslums want to take us over" is pretty darn offenceve....
There are plenty of muslums who love freedom just like you....
WhiteWolf
12-20-2008, 11:32 PM
interesting... But you talk about Muslums like all of them beleive the same stuff, which is a terrible generalization... There are plenty of muslums who are just normal people like you and me, so thinking that "muslums want to take us over" is pretty darn offenceve....
There are plenty of muslums who love freedom just like you....
thanks
Yes, I'm sorry, I don't wanna generalize of course, there are Muslims out there who are in love with freedom, so don't get me wrong.
I actually myself don't know what to think of these visions and voices, the situation now is pretty okay in the streets, seems like everybody loves our freedom.
I also don't know when this all is going to happen and what will happen in the Islamic countries in the future, but one thing is sure and that is that I know that it will come true, otherwise I wouldn't have had these visions and voices.
interesting... But you talk about Muslums like all of them beleive the same stuff, which is a terrible generalization... There are plenty of muslums who are just normal people like you and me, so thinking that "muslums want to take us over" is pretty darn offenceve....
There are plenty of muslums who love freedom just like you....
Like me :D
That's what I was trying to say in my last reply, not all Muslims are hateful and wretchful, and have terrible thoughts about our freedom.
And if you read my visions carefully then you will notice that in one vision there is the sentence : "of the roads from the in deep hellish sins sunken cities of no love whatsoever."
This means that our cities and the people who live in it are engaged in hellish activities like doing drugs, having too much sex with different partners for sex only, criminal cheating and having no true love of God in their hearts.
Islam is established by Mohammed, a prophet who established this religion BY THE ORDER OF THE LORD!!! says the Bhavisya Purana.
Whatever happens, happens for a reason.
If Muslims who happen to be not in love with freedom, take over this and other places in just one night, then there is nothing you can do about it, not even me.
What I am trying to say here as well, is that materialism and capitalism wil lbe destroyed BY THE ORDER OF THE LORD, cause that is what Islam in my opinion will do.
And Islam will destroy all those who are against Muslims in that one night.
Further the one who I follow, Lord Chaitanya, Krishna's incarnation, said that the purpose of Islam is to be spread all over the world, so that people wil ldevelop love of God, so Islam, whatever this religion is up to, will be responsible for this fact.
Enough said, I wish you all a Merry Christmas and a Happy Newyear !!!!
On Tue Sep 15, 2009 when I went to bed after being awake from 02.55am, at 09.00am I woke up with this very short dream :
"I was watching a football (soccer) match of John's Revelations.
The score was 6-1 and Islam had won."
This was weird and I didn't understand it, until I had the idea to look up chapter 6 verse 1 of Revelations because it is hinted at in the dream.
This is what I read in Revelations :
6:1 I saw that the Lamb opened one of the seven seals, and I heard one of the four living creatures saying, as with a voice of thunder, "Come and see!"
6:2 And behold, a white horse, and he who sat on it had a bow. A crown was given to him, and he came forth conquering, and to conquer.
6:3 When he opened the second seal, I heard the second living creature saying, "Come!"
6:4 Another came forth, a red horse. To him who sat on it was given power to take peace from the earth, and that they should kill one another. There was given to him a great sword.
6:5 When he opened the third seal, I heard the third living creature saying, "Come and see!" And behold, a black horse, and he who sat on it had a balance in his hand.
6:6 I heard a voice in the midst of the four living creatures saying, "A choenix of wheat for a denarius, and three choenix of barley for a denarius! Don't damage the oil and the wine!"
6:7 When he opened the fourth seal, I heard the fourth living creature saying, "Come and see!"
6:8 And behold, a pale horse, and he who sat on it, his name was Death. Hades followed with him. Authority over one fourth of the earth, to kill with the sword, with famine, with death, and by the wild animals of the earth was given to him.
6:9 When he opened the fifth seal, I saw underneath the altar the souls of those who had been killed for the Word of God, and for the testimony of the Lamb which they had.
6:10 They cried with a loud voice, saying, "How long, Master, the holy and true, until you judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell on the earth?"
6:11 A long white robe was given to each of them. They were told that they should rest yet for a while, until their fellow servants and their brothers, who would also be killed even as they were, should complete their course.
6:12 I saw when he opened the sixth seal, and there was a great earthquake. The sun became black as sackcloth made of hair, and the whole moon became as blood.
6:13 The stars of the sky fell to the earth, like a fig tree dropping its unripe figs when it is shaken by a great wind.
6:14 The sky was removed like a scroll when it is rolled up. Every mountain and island were moved out of their places.
6:15 The kings of the earth, the princes, the commanding officers, the rich, the strong, and every slave and free person, hid themselves in the caves and in the rocks of the mountains.
6:16 They told the mountains and the rocks, "Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him who sits on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb,
6:17 for the great day of his wrath has come; and who is able to stand?"
*So Islam is given permission by God to kill almost all the people on Earth, who will sit in Heaven, waiting for their revenge.
This dream of mine is predicting victory for Islam in the beginning of the Great Conflict which will happen in a few years only.
How can Islam become so victorious ?
Because they worship God and have mystic powers which they use for hunting down and tracking their opponants and enemies and thus all who are opposed to Islam.
I had another dream about the Islam on November 26th 2009 at 8.45am :
"I saw a world map and a man, who was a muslim, drawing with a marker thick lines along the borders of each continent, he started in the Palestine territories and ended in South America, Egypt was lying in South America, then a though said :
Islam will be triumphing worldwide !"
This is scary to me, it's the second dream I have concerning world domination of the Muslims, are there any other people out there who have dreams like this ?
Or maybe reassuring dreams that Muslims will be defeated after their victory ?
I know Nostradamus is telling us in quatrain 9 verse 44 the following :
9.44
Migrate, migrate from Geneva everyone,
Saturn will change from gold to iron ,
Those against RAYPOZ (Zopyra) shall all be exterminated,
Before the invasion the sky will show signs.
If you look at Saturn, then you will see an indication of how long this war with muslims will be. Saturn orbits the sun and one orbit takes some 28.5 years, Nostradamus tells us that gold will turn into iron, that means the Golden life we lead now will be turned into an Iron life, iron stands for weapons and war and imprisonment, so the war, according to Nostradamus, will last for around 29 years.
This is the reign of the anti Christ, as is predicted in another verse 8.77 :
8.77
Antichrist three very soon annihilated,
Twenty-seven years of blood endures his war.
The heretics dead, captive, exiled.
Blood, human bodies, red water, hail cover the earth.
It's pretty coincidental that in this verse Nostradamus predicts a reign of the Anti Christ as 27 years, almost one orbit of Saturn around the sun !!!
But who is RAYPOZ or Zopyra ?
Zopyra cut off his nose and ears, wounding himself and pretending to be a fugitive, and in this way delivered Babylon in to the power of his sovereign Darius.
This happened a few thousand years ago, Zopyra was a Persian, modern day Iran.
Why Geneva ?
This is about the Fourth Convention of Geneva, which Nostradamus warns us to abandon.
Why ?
Because traitors come into the Free West and will be responsible for overtrowing the governments of the West by means of a war in one night, so the radical Muslims will take over.
This is my conclusion !!!
CarmineEternity
12-04-2009, 12:30 PM
Freedom freedom freedom freedom!
Freedom!
Exactly, FREEDOM, but it seems to me that we have to fight for it again in the near future, because there ain't much freedom in Islamic countries such as Saudi Arabia, which they want to implement here in the West.
Bearsy
12-05-2009, 07:57 PM
I think it's right that this thread is in SB
We have to fight this Islamization of Europe :
There are powerful groups who are working towards the Islamization of Europe. That is a fact. What can we gain from closing our eyes and ignoring this? Even Libyan leader Muammar Ghadafi says: "There are signs that Allah will grant victory to Islam in Europe without swords, without guns, without conquest. We don't need terrorists, we don't need homicide bombers. The 50+ million Muslims [in Europe] will turn it into a Muslim continent within a few decades." A head of state confirms what our politicians deny. What else has to happen until we finally get it?
ninja9578
12-06-2009, 07:09 AM
I'm moving this to R/S.
grasshoppa
12-06-2009, 07:49 AM
Wow that's such a long post I'll have to come back read this and then proceed to answeer it.
I'm not going to bother...
Universal Mind
12-06-2009, 09:27 AM
There is about to be a huge war between Fundamentalist Muslims and American Southern Baptists for control of Europe. It will go global when the Mormons and Rastafarians jump in. Europe will be a Rastafarian empire within 30 years.
Alric
12-06-2009, 10:56 AM
...the bottom of the crater is filled with a lake of heated anger, red and boiling, while at the same time big black screaming birds with fierce eyes containing red viens are flying around over all this, trying to attack the beholder with ferocious and never seen before force....
Big black screaming birds clearly means the US's B2 stealth bomber, that will bomb the hell out of a country.
...big black giant monsters with red eyes of devastation emerge from the tar of the molten asfalt of the roads from the in deep hellish sins sunken cities of no love whatsoever, destroying lovely build houses everywhere and squeezing the life force out of the people they meet with their stinking ugly strong hands or claws of Death, leaving them dripping with blood, swallowing their tongues and eyes popping out because of the squeezing pressure in hate, as they wished at that moment they were never born into this world...
Big black giant monsters are our huge tanks. And the sunken cities are US aircraft carrierers which are like floating cities of war. Again they will bomb the hell out of a country then invade.
...and then from out of the dark depts of the blackened Earth, cracked open, the Gates of Hell unlocked, releasing their soldiers of hatred, heading with tridents and other weapons to eradicate the goodness, nevertheless, white shining silhouettes, the angels, man and women, are pouring down endlessly from the skies with their weapons, resembling science fiction kinda laserbeams and more stuff I can't explain, protecting what is good with their love for life...
Once the country is burning and beated, then we send in the land forces to take control. Tridents are clearly trident missiles, meaning we might nuke them as well. We have a ton of crazy weapons that fall down from the sky and blow the shit out of everything.
Its obvious. Your vision is saying the US is going to invade Iran, which you don't need a vision to suggest. Also, we will probably lose because our country will go bankrupt by then.
This is what Erdogan, the chief of Turkey, once said :
"The mosques are our barracks, the domes our helmets, the minarets our bayonets and the faithful our soldiers."
And now Erdogan speaks of discrimination against Muslims in Switzerland? Where are Muslims being discriminated against in Switzerland? The European elite allows the Islamic countries to walk all over themselves while bowing down to them.
Actually what we have to do is to rise up against these fuckers who dare to call themselves our "leaders", imprison and punish them all for their left winged betrayal and simultaneously kick out the radical muslims, then our countries will be peaceful again and only then the muslims will respect us, for now they think we are all pussies.
Wow. Gross exaggerations here.
The version with the rastafarians is more likely.
The Islamic Religion as a whole killing literally everyone with the use of
their godgiven, magical powers? right. Don't read so much anti-islam
biased stuff. The vast majority of muslims, who do not fit in any of the
media and politically biased profile, will pay the price. Don't hate now.
I'm sure I could interprete a scenario I would find more likely to happen
into your visions. Consider different possibilities, like your own possible
biased towards the subject - and your subconsciuosness basically translating
the message into a context you deem plausible. Or Maybe some images aren't
to be take as literal. Try on a few different perspectives for a fit, before you
condemn an entire religion of people.
There is no way that either an islamic nation, or the few radical sleepers
are going to be successful at what you are predicting. And that is even if all
of that fear-mongering about our safety was entirely true. And even if the islamic
radicals were after - not a solution regarding the middle east, not the destruction
of western culture and morals - but absolute world domination. Not even then.
Why Geneva ?
Maybe it's the Geneva Convention that's constantly being violated.
Xaqaria
12-06-2009, 05:13 PM
...If the Muslims want to fight, it is fine with us. We have wanted that fight for a long time. There is no room in the world for the Muslims any more. The Muslims or us, one of us will have to go. We know that the Muslims will lose, that they and their devilish, life-denying and destructive doctrines will be destroyed, Look around and see how the emigrants are increasing; even London has noticed. A brutal butcher sits in Moscow. They form the front, and the Muslims are behind them all. That no longer worries us, but we must see what is happening clearly and talk about it openly. Believe me, our enemies in the political confessional churches know that the hocus pocus they show to the world is only a bluff. They bluff anyway, and it depends on whether they can find enough idiots to believe them...
Original text; "The Jews or Us" (http://www.calvin.edu/academic/cas/gpa/ley3.htm) speech by Robert Ley (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Ley) May, 1939
If the Jew wants to fight, it is fine with us. We have wanted that fight for a long time. There is no room in the world for the Jews any more. The Jew or us, one of us will have to go. We know that the Jew will lose, that he and his devilish, life-denying and destructive doctrines will be destroyed (vernichtet), Look around and see how the emigrants are increasing; even London has noticed. In Rome, they found the smartest Jesuit they had. A brutal butcher sits in Moscow. They form the front, and the Jew is behind them all. That no longer worries us, but we must see what is happening clearly and talk about it openly. Believe me, our enemies in the political confessional churches know that the hocus pocus they show to the world is only a bluff. They bluff anyway, and it depends on whether they can find enough idiots to believe them.
Hate is hate. Give it up already.
erik, you're either a troll, in which case fuck off, or you're being sincere, in which case you're a delusional monster who typifies some of the most grotesque aspects of humanity.
Invader
12-06-2009, 08:00 PM
Yes, I'm sorry, I don't wanna generalize of course, there are Muslims out there who are in love with freedom, so don't get me wrong.
Idiot. I mean, I don't want to generalize of course, there must be some part of you that is rational, so don't get me wrong.
erik, you're either a troll, in which case fuck off, or you're being sincere, in which case you're a delusional monster who typifies some of the most grotesque aspects of humanity.
Xei, you're either a radical muslim lover, in which case FUCK YOU, or you are blind of the fact that a muslim take over is near, this is what they really want, but I guess you have some muslim friends who are "really nice".
Didn't you read this ?:
There are powerful groups who are working towards the Islamization of Europe. That is a fact. What can we gain from closing our eyes and ignoring this? Even Libyan leader Muammar Ghadafi says: "There are signs that Allah will grant victory to Islam in Europe without swords, without guns, without conquest. We don't need terrorists, we don't need homicide bombers. The 50+ million Muslims [in Europe] will turn it into a Muslim continent within a few decades." A head of state confirms what our politicians deny. What else has to happen until we finally get it?
Are you blind for the facts or are you political correct ? Which is a disease that will bring us down.
Here is a site which might open up your pityful eyes :
www.jihadwatch.org (http://www.jihadwatch.org)
Idiot. I mean, I don't want to generalize of course, there must be some part of you that is rational, so don't get me wrong.
Invader, what's in a name, nuff said.
There is no way that either an islamic nation, or the few radical sleepers
are going to be successful at what you are predicting
Dajo, oh no ?
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/6672806/Hidden-threat-from-al-Qaeda-sleeper-cells.html
Anyway, I am just warning you, and if you don't want to listen, then what can I do, I did my best.
You got the things a little twisted there. Do some more research.
I don't really want to get too much into a political discussion at this point,
but I want to point out two, in my opinion, very obvious flaws that will arise
out of exactly this kind of attitude:
Firstly, this stuff you propagate about Europe is just wrong. Often there
has been a media-biased attitude against muslims with broad generalizations.
"How dangerous is the Islam" (sounds like the entirety to me) was on a well
read magazine cover with an entire black background - seems like propaganda
to me, especially when you get a slightly different picture once you
actually do the research. People have been down this road before and it
ends in genocide.
Secondly, by enforcing all of the laws that are being passed in the US and the
EU to supposedly fight terror, you are giving away the very freedom,
voluntarily, that you say you love so dearly. A few fundamentalists with C4 in
their backpack are not threatening your freedom, misinformed and feardriven
decisions are.
--
But I am curious: What exactly would you propose the western countries do?
But I am curious: What exactly would you propose the western countries do?well, no more Arab oil, so make an effort for once and for all to use clean energy, build roads which have solar energy panels inside them, make cars run on water (they can) or on clean electricity, get rid of the oil problem and improve thereby our own countries.
For the rest, I don't agree with you on your two points, Islam is the most dangerous threat to the West now, not so called propaganda against Islam, so there must be the right to freely speak of our opinions.
The Islamic countries are hypocrites, just read this article, they ban churches, but are angry over the Swiss and their minaret ban, just read it all :
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2009/12/scholars-from-a-country-that-doesnt-allow-churches-or-synagogues-slam-swiss-minaret-ban.html
from :
http://thereligionofpeace.com/
If they come to power here, we lose our freedom and we have to fear "A few fundamentalists with C4 in their backpack".
Anyway, I clearly see that I cannot change the future, Islam is goint to triumph all over the world, I believe Nostradamus' quatrain 9 verse 44 which states :
9.44
Migrate, migrate from Geneva everyone,
Saturn will change from gold to iron,
Those against RAYPOZ shall all be exterminated,
Before the invasion the sky will show signs.
Geneva is clearly the fourth convention of Geneva which is abused.
Saturn is the duration of the upcoming war, one orbit of Saturn around the sun is somewhat 29 years, so that the golden life in which we are now in will be changed into a iron age of war, imprisonment and weapons.
This is the reign of the anti Christ, as is predicted in another verse 8.77 :
8.77
Antichrist three very soon annihilated,
Twenty-seven years of blood endures his war.
The heretics dead, captive, exiled.
Blood, human bodies, red water, hail cover the earth.
It's pretty coincidental that in this verse Nostradamus predicts a reign of the Anti Christ as 27 years, almost one orbit of Saturn around the sun !!!
Who is Raypoz or Zopyra ?
Zopyra cut off his nose and ears, wounding himself and pretending to be a fugitive, and in this way delivered Babylon into the power of his sovereign Darius.
Here are the lyrics of my song about Zopyra :
"There was a man by the name of Zopyra, he was a Persian traitor
Babylon was revolting in that time against King Darius
Zopyra cut of his nose and his ears to be accepted as a fugitive
he became a respectful military man and made the Persians flee
but that was already dealt with behind the backs of the naive Babylonians
so in this way he gained their trust and loyalty just to betray them in the end
Zopyra, you traitor, you are amongst us nowadays
Zopyra, you try to fool us and the left is not gonna be in your way 2x
Nostradamus, a man of wisdom tracked back his name
and used him to specify the things to come our way
there are so many Zopyra's now hiding under the Fourth Convention
of Geneve, that's why we should leave this otherwise we will repent
do you wish for Muslim rule or do you want to live in freedom
then stand up and fight for your right to be a human being
As I said, I can do whatever I want to do, but clearly I cannot change the future, it is set and the plan of The Almighty God, Islam is the Anti Christ.
Am I right ? The future will tell........
My point was that the threat stems from the laws accompanying the so called
'war on terror' that directly reduce the freedom of every citizen, here in Europe
and even moreso in the United States. To me it is clear that these actions
eventually inhibit a greater danger then the terrorists.
My first point was that condemning islam as a whole is no different than
doing the same to Jews.
And since you mention oil - don't you think that this could actually have
something to do with the situation we are in today?
This is redicolous, though. I just don't think it's appropriate to advertise this
kind of stuff here. And leave it without comment.
Edit:
By the way: If you believe that the form of terrorism is because of the
situation regardin oil, then it would actually help to retreat from taking
it. But if you believe that the islam has a 'religious agenda' to dominate
the world - not using the oil wouldn't change shit.
What do you think should be done to muslim living in the US or Europe?
You are proposing your 'thesis' with a lot of urgency. What steps to take?
My point: With what you have presented so far, you'll have some trouble
not sounding like a fascist dictator, when you'll be presenting 'your solution'.
Supernova
12-07-2009, 12:44 PM
make cars run on water (they can)
I think you're thinking of hydrogen, in which case the spent hydrogen is released into the air and forms water with the oxygen present.
As for the idea of a muslim takeover, I Just don't see that happening. The majority of muslims love peace and freedom just as much as the next guy.
As Dajo points out, these laws intended to protect us against terrorism are restricting our freedoms much more than islamic fundamentalists ever will. We're giving them exactly what they want.
make cars run on water (they can)
Nicely demonstrates what a complete lunatic you are.
Nicely demonstrates what a complete lunatic you are.
It's quite possible to have a car run on water. Imagine you have a waterfall from which you harvest electricity which in turn is used by a car. Then it runs on water... :cheeky:
Oh hardy har har. :P
Okay, cars can run on water in the same way that you could push a rock up a hill and tie it to your bumper and then give it a little push, and then your car would run on rocks.
I don't think you need a rock to get a car down a hill.
Dajo,
My point was that the threat stems from the laws accompanying the so called
'war on terror' that directly reduce the freedom of every citizen, here in Europe
and even moreso in the United States. To me it is clear that these actions
eventually inhibit a greater danger then the terrorists. I don't understand this, can you elaborate on this, I feel like I have all the freedom I want here, there is nothing that stands in my way of doing things what I wanna do, so please explain and give me examples, so I can reflect on this, maybe there is a website you can link here so I can visit it.
My first point was that condemning islam as a whole is no different than doing the same to Jews. Ever seen a jew blow himself up on a marketplace ? There is the obligation of doing Jihad in the Koran and every muslim must keep this obligation, that's why it is so dangerous, as for jews, I heard that they rule the world and that they like to see everybody engrossed in materialism and that is keeping the vast majority of people away for God Consciousness, which is bad, the life of a human being is meant to realize himself/herself as an eternal soul and get back to the Kingdom of God which is eternal and immortal, full of joy and happiness.
Materialism and capitalism are barriers, powerful barriers that prevent us from investigating who we are, servants of God.
We are so engrossed in thinking of a new car, or buying a few new clothes, looking pretty, having a nice house, which will not make us happy because all of these things are all temporary and not ever lasting, so it is called illusion or Maya or temptation or Satan.
After all, can you take these things, like your bank account, with you after physical death ? No !!!
After physical death we will have nothing but our deeds for God.
Then why are we running so much after these things, why are we craving for these material temporary things ?
Because the Jews are the ones who control the media, I heard, and because of the media we are bombarded with material stuff which will not make us happy, look at advertisements, they need a pretty lady to advertise a product, what the hell has a pretty lady to do with the product ??!! Nothing, but it sells !
Sex sells too, which is a major poblem in the West, there is so much illicit sex going on and they are promoting this every day, we should stick to one partner only, okay, I had a lot of illicit sex in the past, I was working behind a bar and there were many pretty ladies, sometimes I had 4 girlfriends in a week, but to become God Conscious you have to be celibate and I try this seriously.
So I am blaming the muslims for trying to take away our freedom, which include illicit sex (look how they deal in the Islamic countries with it) and I think that the Jewish Christian tradition are not promoting God Consciousness very well, they want to lead the people in general astray and the Muslims want to bring us back in God Consciousnes altough their concept of God is the different then ours, in Turkey there is a ban on building churches, where is the freedom in this ?
I saw not too long ago, a picture of two boys being hanged in Tehran, they were hanged because they were homosexual, they were "hanging out in Tehran" so to speak, this is what the West is facing, believe me.
No freedom !!!
And since you mention oil - don't you think that this could actually have
something to do with the situation we are in today?
This is redicolous, though. I just don't think it's appropriate to advertise this
kind of stuff here. And leave it without comment.I have heard in Holland that there is a secret deal between Muslims and the West and that is....oil for immigration, since the oil boycot in 1973 the amount of muslim immigrants has raisen explosively, this is not coincendental, the West is dependent on Arab oil and they were blackmailed by Arabs. Simple thinking.
What do you think should be done to muslim living in the US or Europe?
You are proposing your 'thesis' with a lot of urgency. What steps to take?
My point: With what you have presented so far, you'll have some trouble
not sounding like a fascist dictator, when you'll be presenting 'your solution'.well also very simple......NOTHING !!!! I have no "solution", it will be as God wants it to be, the world will be dominated by Islam in the near future, I cannot change it, nobody can change this, it's just the fact.
And that you call me a fascist dictator.....I'll take that as a compliment coming out of your pen, a big compliment. although I am not a fascist dictator, still I think it is a big compliment.
Xei
Nicely demonstrates what a complete lunatic you are.
You are such a fucknut, you don't even know about what you're talking here, didn't read any sane postings from you here, like Dajo has.
I don't think you need a rock to get a car down a hill.
Car ain't on a hill, it's on a road. Rock is on a hill.
You are such a fucknut, you don't even know about what you're talking here, didn't read any sane postings from you here, like Dajo has.
You think. That cars. Can run on water.
To address your paranoid conspiracies, despite the large influx of Muslims to Britain, the actual trend has remained a steady increase of secularism. A century ago everybody was a Christian. Now less than half of people are religious. As you say, the Swiss recently voted for a ban on building minarets. How is that evidence for Europe bowing to the will of Islaam? It shows the exact opposite.
Xei,
You think. That cars. Can run on water
Supernova,
I think you're thinking of hydrogen, in which case the spent hydrogen is released into the air and forms water with the oxygen present.
This is what I meant, I wasn't far from the actual proces.
Xei,
To address your paranoid conspiracies, despite the large influx of Muslims to Britain, the actual trend has remained a steady increase of secularism. A century ago everybody was a Christian. Now less than half of people are religious. As you say, the Swiss recently voted for a ban on building minarets. How is that evidence for Europe bowing to the will of Islaam? It shows the exact opposite.
I meant for the reactions of the Islamic world together with the reactions of the European politically correct "great thinkers", it's about time Europe would stand up, in my opinion the Muslims will get too much resistance to their plans of taking over Europe and America, then they will decide to take it over in one night, that's what my inner visions are confirming, here are some links to the reactions of the Swiss minaret ban I mentioned :
Good reaction from London :
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2009/12/poll-75-of-londoners-support-ban-on-minarets.html
The Saudi reaction :
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2009/12/scholars-from-a-country-that-doesnt-allow-churches-or-synagogues-slam-swiss-minaret-ban.html
Gaddafi's reaction from Lybia :
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2009/12/gaddafi-swiss-minaret-ban-invites-al-qaeda-attacks.html
Reaction from Pakistani Christians :
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2009/11/pakistani-christians-will-saudis-allow-construction-of-cathedrals-to-challenge-swiss-ban-on-minarets.html
Reaction from European leftists, the Dhimmies :
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2009/11/eurodhimmis-unite-against-swiss-minaret-ban.html
I think this ought to be enough to read about the subject.
It would be nice if you could provide some kind of statistical basis for your claims. That's something I'd be interested in seeing. The rest is just bunk.
I hope you can see that there is virtually no difference between your paranoia regarding a Muslim revolution and the way that Hitler viewed the Jews. (Yes I know, Godwin's law, but it's actually relevant here).
If you had any grasp of history you'd appreciate that it's thanks to the work of Muslims that we have our modern enlightened society.
This is what I meant, I wasn't far from the actual proces.
The 'actual process' currently involves getting the hydrogen from OIL which is the exact opposite of the point you were trying to make.
I don't even know where to start...
Learn some more stuff about the world, about what's going on in the
middle east and what this might have to do with the situation today,
read some unbiased history books, learn more about the role of governments
and how they have been abused in the past and what is important to prevent
it from happening again. Read many different sources on today's politics, delete
this jihad propaganda page from you bookmarks, don't believe everything you
hear and use some common sense.
You are misinformed about the situation in Europe. There is no big push
from the islamic citizens. Once in a while there is some trouble with a
mosque or something, some don't want it built and others do, but that's
about it. There is no need to stand up against that. The last time we
did such a thing in germany it ended in World War 2. I'm just not too fond of
that stuff.
I don't understand this, can you elaborate on this
There is a threat coming from an outside source. The safety of the citizens
is at stake. There need to be laws that let the government fight this threat,
but in order to do so we have to change the basic human rights a little, but
it's ok, because we do it for the safety and the freedom. We change a little
law here, a few months later do some adjustment there and noone will ever
notice how the freedoms are getting slimmer, because it is gradually happening.
The spying for example, of course we said we would only spy on the terrorist
subjects (which could be anyone including you) but wouldn't it make it also
a lot simpler to keep an eye on our own people? There is nothing more annoying
when you want to go fight a war over economic interest, when there is an aware
population spreading bad and counterproductive thought. That just ruins all
our plans for world domination peace and, honestly, spoils all the fun.
One thing leads to another, and more people are becoming a little nervous.
That makes it even harder for us to do our job, so we need to make sure not
too many of them get together and start rioting or something, so we
enforce some laws that prohibit these get-togethers and makes it legal to
violently bash down any form of protest arising. Thank God the media only
reports about what we tell them.
But everything went so well so far, why stop here? There are more things
that keep us from really exploiting all the other countries for ressources, all
that unneccessary bureaucracy. What if we would make a law that would let
the president make important decisions by himself, you know, when there
really is an imminent threat of terror. That'd be gread. A little more help
would be too, maybe we even implement a kind of army for inner affairs to
help out the police... and so on. Look, it's just an old story. It ends in genocide,
war, opression and you will not be able to remember what freedom even means,
if you blindly give into your fear and throw away all that prevents this stuff
from happening.
Research Art. 48 and Art. 23 in regard to how Hitler came into power.
Research HR-6166, martial law, patriot act and all of those words. If you
are interested in Europe check out the SWIFT agreement and what critics
have to say about the Lissabon Contract. Maybe watch Road To Guantanamo
or Taxi to the dark side, there is really quite a lot of stuff to get an overview.
Watch this:
http://video.google.de/videoplay?docid=6909612995471559345&hl=de&emb=1#
and this:
http://video.google.de/videoplay?docid=-368044677916140558&hl=de&emb=1#
Invader
12-08-2009, 09:56 AM
Invader, what's in a name, nuff said.
I apply a sweeping generalizing to yourself, after your own style, and all I
get in return is a cop out.
erik, the problem here is that you demonstrate clear religious prejudice
against Muslims and then go so far as to pass off your 'premonitions' as
facts, especially when they may be the result of an overactive imagination or
a receptiveness to media fear-mongering, probably both.
I hope you can see that there is virtually no difference between your paranoia regarding a Muslim revolution and the way that Hitler viewed the Jews. (Yes I know, Godwin's law, but it's actually relevant here).
Hate is hate.
They said it for me.
Perhaps you can direct a substantial response my way this time.
Alric
12-08-2009, 10:01 AM
Ever seen a jew blow himself up on a marketplace ? There is the obligation of doing Jihad in the Koran and every muslim must keep this obligation, that's why it is so dangerous, as for jews, I heard that they rule the world and that they like to see everybody engrossed in materialism and that is keeping the vast majority of people away for God Consciousness, which is bad, the life of a human being is meant to realize himself/herself as an eternal soul and get back to the Kingdom of God which is eternal and immortal, full of joy and happiness.
You make it sound like muslims blow themself because they are religious fanatics. This isn't actually true. It is actually a gurilla tactic used to attack someone with superior weapons.
In WW2 the japan was famous for their kamikaze pilots who crashed their planes into target on purpose to blow themself as well as their enemy up.
In vietnam, the enemy just charged into gunfire to die, in vein hope that some of them will get by. And because there was such a large number of people will to sacrifice themself, they were able to.
In fact, the dutch, germany and russia, had made large scale sucide attacks in the past. Even in the US, we have send soldiers on sucide missions, knowing it would be extremely unlikely for them to return.
The buddhist monks were totally against war, and they killed themself by setting themself on fire to protest the vietnam war.
The idea that only crazy religious fantatics are willing to die for what they believe in is false. The idea that they only want to kill people is stupid. They have set goals and things they are trying to accomplish. Many of them simply want the US to stop invading muslim countries.
You can hardly blame all muslims for what a few people do in other countries.
Dajo,
thank you for your elaboration on this point, thank you for the links, I will watch them in a minute.
Invader,
I only base my opinion on what I saw in dreams, my inner visions and what I read on jihadwatch, thereligionofpeace.com and the overal media, and of course, my own interactions with muslims in my hometown for years and years.
Xei,
The 'actual process' currently involves getting the hydrogen from OIL which is the exact opposite of the point you were trying to make.
well, in that case I made a fool out of myself.
Alric,
Thank you for your explanation.
Hey guys, I had realizations yesterday during meditation, again I saw many things, that's why I make it short and am not going to elaborate on your questions and points you want me to do, it's not that the ground under my feet is getting too hot because of you, I would love to discuss this and investigate everything further, but it's (for the time being) better for me to dive into my yoga (I am a yoga teacher) and to concentrate on recording a CD with my band (I am also a guitar player and composer).
You can think of me whatever you want, dumb, stupid, rascist, fascist dictator, islamophobe or whatever, but like I said, I base my conclusions on what I see, hear and witness and this is my conclusion.
Anyway, sorry to leave this discussion, it was just going to be very interesting, I didn't introduce myself, here is a video of me, performing on stage somewhere, I am the guitar player, there are more video's of me alone with guitar, but don't watch them, I can't sing !!!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dojrGWy88sM
Hope you like it !!
SkA_DaRk_Che
12-09-2009, 09:10 AM
You make it sound like muslims blow themself because they are religious fanatics. This isn't actually true. It is actually a gurilla tactic used to attack someone with superior weapons.
In WW2 the japan was famous for their kamikaze pilots who crashed their planes into target on purpose to blow themself as well as their enemy up.
In vietnam, the enemy just charged into gunfire to die, in vein hope that some of them will get by. And because there was such a large number of people will to sacrifice themself, they were able to.
In fact, the dutch, germany and russia, had made large scale sucide attacks in the past. Even in the US, we have send soldiers on sucide missions, knowing it would be extremely unlikely for them to return.
The buddhist monks were totally against war, and they killed themself by setting themself on fire to protest the vietnam war.
The idea that only crazy religious fantatics are willing to die for what they believe in is false. The idea that they only want to kill people is stupid. They have set goals and things they are trying to accomplish. Many of them simply want the US to stop invading muslim countries.
You can hardly blame all muslims for what a few people do in other countries.
That's completely ridiculous. There is a religious component to suicide bombings.
In fact, in my opinion, there are three main components to suicide Bombings. Financial, Political ,and Religious.
In much of the Islamic world, political and religious are often intertwined as there is very little separation of Religion and Daily life.
"So beautiful to the arab mind were the very material luxuries and pleasures with which Mahomet entranced the imagination of believers that in later years his soldiers would fling themselves recklessly against their enemies' spears in order to gain paradise the quicker.
Page 70. Europe in the middle ages.
Islamic Fundamentalists believe that martyrdom is a way into Paradise. Conversely they believe and those they trick believe that Suicide Bombing is an act of martyrdom and is thus worthy of direct ascent into Paradise. This doesn't mean a majority of muslims even believe this;however, a great deal of Islamic Fundamentalists do though. Their beliefs are based upon interpretations of Islamic Texts and history.
Qur'an (4:74) - "Let those fight in the way of Allah who sell the life of this world for the other. Whoso fighteth in the way of Allah, be he slain or be he victorious, on him We shall bestow a vast reward."
Qur'an (9:111) - "Allah hath purchased of the believers their persons and their goods; for theirs (in return) is the garden (of Paradise): they fight in His cause, and slay and are slain: a promise binding on Him in truth, through the Law, the Gospel, and the Qur'an: and who is more faithful to his covenant than Allah? then rejoice in the bargain which ye have concluded: that is the achievement supreme."
Bukhari (52:54) - The words of Muhammad: "I would love to be martyred in Al1ah's Cause and then get resurrected and then get martyred, and then get resurrected again and then get martyred and then get resurrected again and then get martyred." This is why modern-day Jihadists often say that they love death.
Muslim (20:4678) - During the battle of Uhud, Muhammad was desperate to push men into battle. He promised paradise for those who would martyr themselves, prompting a young man who was eating dates to throw them away and rush to his death.
Muslim (20:4655) - A man asks Muhammad "which of men is the best?" Muhammad replies that it is the man who is always ready for battle and flies into it "seeking death at places where it can be expected." (Tellingly perhaps, the next most saintly man in Islam is the hermit who lives in isolation "sparing men from his mischief.")
Muslim (20:4681) - "Surely, the gates of Paradise are under the shadows of the swords." After hearing Muhammad say that martyrdom leads to paradise, a young man pulls his sword and breaks the sheath (indicating that he has no intention of returning) then flings himself into battle until he is killed.
Religious Fanaticism and interpretations of islamic texts are the root cause of Suicide bombings. Suicide Bombers and those who encourage them believe that the west is conducting a Crusade against them, and that they are fighting a holy war.
If you're not convinced now, watch some videos of suicide bombers making their statements. Try You-tubing the 7/7 bombers in london for instance.
SkA_DaRk_Che
12-09-2009, 09:34 AM
In regards to the main theme of the this thread. There are some serious generalizations going on.
Yes, Europe has a problem with its Islamic Populations. No, its not as extreme as Erik makes it out, but at the same time its not a total non issue.
The integration of Islamic Immigrants in Europe is a major issue for them. They have problems with Muslim Youth in major urban centers who often commit crime and are not integrated. By some statistics, almost half of all crime in Sweden is caused by immigrants or the children of immigrants.
In Denmark, about 5 or 6% of the population is of immigrant origin. Generally, these people are from North Africa, the middle east,and Somalia. 75% of people imprisoned for rapes are from this 6% of the population according to Network Europe (radio).
Rape cases involving children under the age of 15 are six - 6 - times as common today as they were a generation ago. Most other kinds of violent crime have rapidly increased, too. Instability is spreading to most urban and suburban areas.
"According to a new study from the Crime Prevention Council, Brå, it is four times more likely that a known rapist is born abroad, compared to persons born in Sweden. Resident aliens from Algeria, Libya, Morocco and Tunisia dominate the group of rape suspects. According to these statistics, almost half of all perpetrators are immigrants. In Norway and Denmark, we know that non-Western immigrants, which frequently means Muslims, are grossly overrepresented on rape statistics. In Oslo, Norway, immigrants were involved in two out of three rape charges in 2001. The numbers in Denmark were the same, and even higher in the city of Copenhagen with three out of four rape charges. Sweden has a larger immigrant, including Muslim, population than any other country in northern Europe. The numbers there are likely to be at least as bad as with its Scandinavian neighbors. The actual number is thus probably even higher than what the authorities are reporting now, as it doesn't include second generation immigrants. Lawyer Ann Christine Hjelm, who has investigated violent crimes in Svea high court, found that 85 per cent of the convicted rapists were born on foreign soil or by foreign parents."
http://www.sullivan-county.com/wcva/fjordman.htm
In Britain,though a minority of the population, muslims are very vocal and many are demanding Shari'ah law. They want their own sets of laws to be governed by instead of using British law like everyone else.
The problems associated with mass immigration is that when you bring a lot of people from one nationality/culture/religion into a country en masse they tend to cluster around each other and form their own communities. This is a recipe for poverty, ghettoization and high crime and low integration rates into their respective societies. Especially when immigrants are coming to countries like Sweden, where their culture is often extremely different from their own countries. (Iraq, Somalia, Maghreb)
Another example of failure to integrate into their host societies.
Some Muslim immigrants admit their bias quite openly. An Islamic Mufti in Copenhagen sparked a political outcry after publicly declaring that women who refuse to wear headscarves are "asking for rape." Apparently, he's not the only one thinking this way. “It is not as wrong raping a Swedish girl as raping an Arab girl,” says Hamid. “The Swedish girl gets a lot of help afterwards, and she had probably fucked before, anyway. But the Arab girl will get problems with her family. For her, being raped is a source of shame. It is important that she retains her virginity until she marries.” It was no coincidence that it was a Swedish girl that was gang raped in Rissne – this becomes obvious from the discussion with Ali, Hamid, Abdallah and Richard. All four have disparaging views on Swedish girls, and think this attitude is common among young men with immigrant background. “It is far too easy to get a Swedish whore…… girl, I mean;” says Hamid, and laughs over his own choice of words. “Many immigrant boys have Swedish girlfriends when they are teenagers. But when they get married, they get a proper woman from their own culture who has never been with a boy. That’s what I am going to do. I don’t have too much respect for Swedish girls. I guess you can say they get fucked to pieces.”
Europe's immigration policies have not been very successful. They did no planning as to how they were going to integrate these people or how they were going to do with the problems associated with it.
In my opinion, European countries should encourage the intergration of their current muslim populations, halt further immigration until such time as their current muslim populace is well enough integrated, and in the mean time take in immigrants who are more compatible with European Values.
I have seen statistics out there which show which immigrant groups intermarry the most with their host populations in britain. From my recollection, It was less than 7% for Pakistanis and it as about 50% intermarriage rate for Afro-Caribeans.
Statistics like these should guide future immigration policies.
Qur'an (4:74) - "Let those fight in the way of Allah who sell the life of this world for the other. Whoso fighteth in the way of Allah, be he slain or be he victorious, on him We shall bestow a vast reward."
Qur'an (9:111) - "Allah hath purchased of the believers their persons and their goods; for theirs (in return) is the garden (of Paradise): they fight in His cause, and slay and are slain: a promise binding on Him in truth, through the Law, the Gospel, and the Qur'an: and who is more faithful to his covenant than Allah? then rejoice in the bargain which ye have concluded: that is the achievement supreme."
Bukhari (52:54) - The words of Muhammad: "I would love to be martyred in Al1ah's Cause and then get resurrected and then get martyred, and then get resurrected again and then get martyred and then get resurrected again and then get martyred." This is why modern-day Jihadists often say that they love death.
Muslim (20:4678) - During the battle of Uhud, Muhammad was desperate to push men into battle. He promised paradise for those who would martyr themselves, prompting a young man who was eating dates to throw them away and rush to his death.
Muslim (20:4655) - A man asks Muhammad "which of men is the best?" Muhammad replies that it is the man who is always ready for battle and flies into it "seeking death at places where it can be expected." (Tellingly perhaps, the next most saintly man in Islam is the hermit who lives in isolation "sparing men from his mischief.")
Muslim (20:4681) - "Surely, the gates of Paradise are under the shadows of the swords." After hearing Muhammad say that martyrdom leads to paradise, a young man pulls his sword and breaks the sheath (indicating that he has no intention of returning) then flings himself into battle until he is killed.
Thank you very much, GaryColemansGhost, for helping me out here, really appreciated, you know what I am talking about, although I tent to generalize and therefore make it extreme, but in my point of view, this is justified because this is what my inner visions are telling me, so I will not change my conclusion.
It is a fact that immigrants with a different culture don't respect our white and black women, they call them whores on the street when they pass by, I heard many of these stories in my hometown, it makes me angry, who do they think they are to do this ?!!?
They should be glad to live in our countries, for they are away from a situation which is far worse, namely war and poverty in their countries of origin, if you don't agree with our way of life, then keep your mouth shut and try to be happy, our countries take you in, give you social benefits and a house and what do we get back in return ?
Misery.
Anyway, GaryColemansGhost, with what you were writing down, you silenced all of the people who were here to criticize me all the time.
That's so cool !!
;)
some people have stuff to do..
some people have stuff to do..
Okay, that's all right, but me too and that doesn't prevent me from adding replies to this thread.
By the way,
I clicked on your links of Noam Chomsky, and I will keep it in mind to watch them soon, as on this public computer is no sound, so I cannot listen to it.
Here is another link, watch this movie for free :
http://www.obsessionthemovie.com/index.php
imran_p
12-10-2009, 11:36 AM
You sir are a very strange eprson. You don't even know what the word Muslim means. There are over 70 Tariqahs or denomination of Islam all preaching vastly different systems. My parents are Ismaili Muslims, they are very much Westernized. Ismailism preaches love, compassion, tolerance, altrusism, and pursuit of knowledge. Thankfully is was these morals that lead me away from the religion when I began to develop the intellectual curiosity that Ismailism encourages. If you want to talk about Islam do your research.
Second of all, you have no freedom, not really. You are bound by your culture and the world we live in. You have no freedom to be you, you are merely a product of this bullshit that we call civlization, birds have freedom, lions ahve freedom, platypuses have freedom. We don't.
And don't worry, the Muslim world has no power, not really. The power is in the hands of a small economic elite, not crazy terorists, they simply help the economic elite to go about their business, like invading countries and stealing there national resources and attemtoping to install puppet governments.
Imran,
in this case I am not talking about people like you, really.
I am talking about people who are fanatics, religious lunatics and the ones who want to take over the Western world and impose Sharia law upon us, as I can read you are a peaceful person and I am not refering to people like you, please don't take it as an offense.
Okay, I have to state this again :
NOT EVERY MUSLIM IS A TERRORIST AND HAS HATE FOR US !!!!
Well there are many fanatics like that from most religions. Why single out Islam?
Idolfan
12-10-2009, 01:01 PM
Wow erik really went for this. Is this a satire or not?
SkA_DaRk_Che
12-10-2009, 05:29 PM
.
Thank you very much, GaryColemansGhost, for helping me out here, really appreciated, you know what I am talking about, although I tent to generalize and therefore make it extreme, but in my point of view, this is justified because this is what my inner visions are telling me, so I will not change my conclusion.
It is a fact that immigrants with a different culture don't respect our white and black women, they call them whores on the street when they pass by, I heard many of these stories in my hometown, it makes me angry, who do they think they are to do this ?!!?
They should be glad to live in our countries, for they are away from a situation which is far worse, namely war and poverty in their countries of origin, if you don't agree with our way of life, then keep your mouth shut and try to be happy, our countries take you in, give you social benefits and a house and what do we get back in return ?
Misery.
Anyway, GaryColemansGhost, with what you were writing down, you silenced all of the people who were here to criticize me all the time.
That's so cool !!
;)
No problem.
by the way, you're from The Netherlands right?
Well there are many fanatics like that from most religions. Why single out Islam?
Because Muslims are blowing themselves up in Western cities and in some countries are campaigning to have their own religious laws to be ruled by rather than the countries own legal system(Britain). Plus Islam radicals are currently fighting a holy war against the west and everything it represents (democracy,separation of church and state,gay rights, women rights, right to practice any religion you want, freedom from religion etc).
Universal Mind
12-10-2009, 06:10 PM
Erik and GaryColemansGhost, I just want to say that I agree with you and am glad to see other people on this site agreeing with me. I have been arguing your view for years here, all by myself (with very few and rare exceptions).
Although I see the point that we might not be at war with fundamentalist Islam if we did not help establish Israel, defend Israel, and station troops in Muslim countries, the fundamentalists really do hate our guts because of our "infidel" statuses and lifestyles and how our Western influence is seen as a threat to Muslim culture. Why the hornets' nest came at us is a subject for debate, but at this point, we can't simply evacuate the Middle East and suddenly have peace. They will be satisfied with nothing less than a Muslim theocratic world with the Koran as the only law book.
SkA_DaRk_Che
12-10-2009, 10:24 PM
You sir are a very strange eprson. You don't even know what the word Muslim means. There are over 70 Tariqahs or denomination of Islam all preaching vastly different systems. My parents are Ismaili Muslims, they are very much Westernized. Ismailism preaches love, compassion, tolerance, altrusism, and pursuit of knowledge. Thankfully is was these morals that lead me away from the religion when I began to develop the intellectual curiosity that Ismailism encourages. If you want to talk about Islam do your research.
If i may interject. I know where your coming from. I have relatives who are Sufis and others who are very liberal sunnis.
However, Ismailis are the exception to the rule. Like Sufis they are regarded as Heretics and not real "muslims" by mainstream Sunnis and Shiites.
In fact, I would suspect in countries like Iran and Saudi Arabia that you can be whipped for practicing Ismailism or a Sufism or even possessing texts belonging to these texts as they regard it as blasphemy.
Second of all, you have no freedom, not really. You are bound by your culture and the world we live in. You have no freedom to be you, you are merely a product of this bullshit that we call civlization, birds have freedom, lions ahve freedom, platypuses have freedom. We don't.
And don't worry, the Muslim world has no power, not really. The power is in the hands of a small economic elite, not crazy terorists, they simply help the economic elite to go about their business, like invading countries and stealing there national resources and attemtoping to install puppet governments.
Please don't play semantics.
I have a feeling when he says freedom he means human rights. Like we have.
He is talking about freedoms which are suspiciously absent in many Islamic countries.
For example:
Freedom from religion, freedom of religion, democracy, the right to not be executed savagely and brutally for being attracted to a person of the same gender, the freedom for a woman to drive if she so wishes. Even the freedom to be a woman and wear trousers at the same time without being lashed 70 times(Sudan).
Seriously, just basic Human Rights is what he's talking about.
Also, Islamic nations do have power. Look up "Islamic Nations propose a ban on blasphemy".
Basically, since the publishing of the cartoons of Muhammad which offended muslims and caused rioting and violent protests, they are proposing an international ban on blasphemy so this does not happen again.
Notice how we cant publish cartoons of Muhammad without rioting and Islamic Fundamentalists plotting terrorist attacks against the country where they were published (Denmark), but Family Guy can make fun of jesus and the christian god all they want without anyone giving a flying fuck.
So what these islamic nations want is to stop anyone from making fun of their religion or making a mockery of it. Who knows what could fall under such a law. Theoretically, you could be tried for blasphemy against islam(If/When passed) under this law (in your own country) if you point out that Muhamad had sexual relations with a pre pubescent girl or if you make mention of the violent/homicidal scriptures in the qu'ran.
Experts say the bid stands some chance of eventual success if Muslim countries persist. And whatever the outcome, the campaign risks reigniting tensions between Muslims and the West that President Barack Obama has pledged to heal, reviving fears of a "clash of civilizations."
The proposal may have some support in the General Assembly. For several years the Islamic Conference has successfully passed a nonbinding resolution at the General Assembly condemning "defamation of religions."
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5iX2fakx508zGm4ff4XnCXYK260SwD9C2SQ401
Islam is trying to take our freedoms and rights away bit by bit. It starts with Shariah and a ban on "defaming" their religion....It's a slippery slope.
Erik and GaryColemansGhost, I just want to say that I agree with you and am glad to see other people on this site agreeing with me. I have been arguing your view for years here, all by myself (with very few and rare exceptions).
Thanks. I dont know about Erik but i plan on sticking around. And i hope Erik does too.
And here I am .....;)
Although I am not so intelectually blessed, I have my realizations and that's all right with me.
Did you know that Mohammed is mentioned in the Bhavishya Purana, he is exposed there as being a demon and the Bhavishya purana means "history of the future", it's an esoteric text written down 5.000 years ago by Vyasadev :
There was a mystic demon named Tripura, whom I have already burnt to ashes, he has come again by the order of Bali. He has no origin but he achieved a benediction from me. His name is Mahaoda and his deeds are like that of a ghost. Therefore, O king, you should not go to this land of the evil ghost.
the expert illusionist Mahamada (Mohammed) appeared at night in front of king Bhojaraja and said: O king, your religion is of course known as the best religion among all. Still I am going to establish a terrible and demoniac religion by the order of the Lord. The symptoms of my followers will be that they first of all will cut their genitals, have no shikha, but having beard, be wicked, make noise loudly and eat everything. They should eat animals without performing any rituals. This is my opinion. They will perform purificatory act with the musala or a pestle as you purify your things with kusha. Therefore, they will be known as musalman, the corrupters of religion. Thus the demoniac religion will be founded by me. After having heard all this the king came back to his palace and that ghost went back to his place.
http://www.lebensplan.com/puranas/islam.html
Now, Mohammed is named Tripura as well, Lord Shiva burned this demon to ashes, Mohammed was Tripurasur in a past life and came back as Mahamada (Mohammed). Reincarnation exists !
Who was Tripurasura ( asura means demon in Sanskrit)
Tripurasur was the son of Sage Gritsamad. One day the sage sneezed and from this was created a young boy who the Sage brought up as his own son. The sage taught the boy the Ganana Twam, Ganesh Mantra. Equipped with this mantra the boy meditated intensely on Lord Ganesh who ultimately blessed him. He was given three pura-s of gold silver and iron. Since he was the owner of these three pura-s he was given the name Tripur. Ganesh also bestowed on Tripur to be the most powerful, who none but Lord Shiva himself could destroy and after being destroyed by Lord Shiva he would attain mukti-salvation.
This boon made Tripur proud and he brought havoc in the entire world. He conquered the Nether world and then proceeded to takeover Heaven. He defeated Indra the king of heaven. His aggression made Lord Brahma hide in a lotus and Lord Vishnu in the Shirsagar. He soon also took over Lord Shiva’s Kailash Parvat and thus became the King of all the three worlds. The gods wondered on how to vanquish Tripurasur. Lord Narada told them that, since he had been granted a boon by Lord Ganesh himself it would be very difficult to vanquish him. He advised them to meditate on Lord Ganesh. Pleased Lord Ganesh decided to help the Gods.
Disguised as brahmin he visited Tripurasur and told him that he was a very enlightened Brahmin and could make for him three flying planes. Riding these he woud be able to go anywhere he wished within minutes. The planes could only be destroyed by Shiva.In return Lord Ganesh asked him to get him the statue of Chintamani which was at the Kailash Mountain. Lord Shiva refused to give the statue to Tripurasur’s messenger. The angry Tripurasur himself went to get the statue. A fierce battle started between him and Lord Shiva. He destroyed everything that belonged to the Lord Shiva who too retired to the Girikandar.
Lord Shiva too realized that he was unable to destroy Tripurasur because he had not paid his respects to Lord Ganesh. He recited the Shadaakshar Mantra to invoke Ganesh. On doing so from his mouth emerged Gajanan to grant Shiva a boon. Shiva continued his invocation of Ganesh who ultimately directed him on how Tripurasur could be killed. Lord Shiva was asked to recite the Sahastranam and then direct an arrow at the three pura-s of Tripurasur.
Lord Shiva followed these instructions and finally vanquished Tripurasur.
The place where Lord Shiva invoked Lord Ganesh he also created a temple for him. The town surrounding this temple was called Manipur. The village Ranjangaon is considered to be the place where Lord Shiva himself sought the blessings of Ganesh and ultimately destroyed Tripurasur.
http://bhavishyapuran.blogspot.com/
Basicly Mohammed is a demon and he meditated on Lord Shiva, there is a rumour that there is a Shivaling in the Ka'aba in Mecca, they broken it but it is there.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mIAHiGCS9L4
Enough to talk about again here, right ?
And yes, I am from The Netherlands, Rotterdam to be exactly.
erik, I don't really care what some batshit insane religious text says about some other batshit insane religious text.
Because Muslims are blowing themselves up in Western cities and in some countries are campaigning to have their own religious laws to be ruled by rather than the countries own legal system(Britain). Plus Islam radicals are currently fighting a holy war against the west and everything it represents (democracy,separation of church and state,gay rights, women rights, right to practice any religion you want, freedom from religion etc).
So what if they're campaigning? Let them campaign, nobody gives a toss. British law has not been changed and there is always a huge public outcry against any changes when the issue comes up. No government could ever get radical muslim laws through the commons.
Terrorism is not an inherently Islamic phenomenon; have you never heard of the IRA? Should we have bombed Ireland?
They will be satisfied with nothing less than a Muslim theocratic world with the Koran as the only law book.
There's a large number of Christians like that in the US, too...
The discussion about integration is nothing new. I just don't see a perticular
problem about people with an islamic belief opposed to another. To say there
is nothing is maybe tirivialising it, but this is a problem of immigration in
general and the fusion of different cultures in one habitat, not because they
are muslims.
The motives behind terrorism are up do debate. I personally don't see any of
the 'scary footage' as evidence, I find other explanations more likely. That
film from the 90s e.g. about iraq soldiers killing babies was staged (http://www.prwatch.org/books/tsigfy10.html) as well.
Again, a lot of what Noam Chomsky is saying in the links I posted presents
a lot more to the picture then the religious aspects and also give motive to
why the issue is 'degraded' to just islamic fundamentalism. How the media
seem to just ignore the questionable foreign policies is just beyond me.
And I still believe there is a danger in the laws that are being passed to
'protect' the people and a lot of the changes are already way beyond what
would have been reasonable. But even if you don't think so, this thread is
just way beyond the line - I would have hoped that we are past this kind
of prejudice thinking and dangerous generalizations in our 'civilized world'.
erik, I don't really care what some batshit insane religious text says about some other batshit insane religious text.
and this :)
SkA_DaRk_Che
12-11-2009, 12:39 PM
erik, I don't really care what some batshit insane religious text says about some other batshit insane religious text.
So what if they're campaigning? Let them campaign, nobody gives a toss. British law has not been changed and there is always a huge public outcry against any changes when the issue comes up. No government could ever get radical muslim laws through the commons.
I'm not against campaigning. People can campaign. That'as part of democracy.
Anyway, Shariah law has made its emergence in the legal system.
Today we learned that sharia courts (which have operated illegally in Britain until now) are being re-classed as tribunal hearings, making their judgments legally binding. According to the Daily Express, “new powers have been given to tribunals in London, Birmingham, Bradford and Manchester with the network’s headquarters in Nuneaton, Warwickshire. Two more courts are being planned for Glasgow and Edinburgh.” According to the Daily Mail, this “[…] new network of courts […] agree[s] to be bound by traditional sharia law, and under the 1996 Arbitration Act the court's decisions can then be enforced by the county courts or the High Court.”
It is almost unbelievable that this should occur in a modern, democratic, Western country, and, moreover, under a government that claims to be liberal, and to care about the right of women and homosexuals among others.
Or check this out from the Times.
Islamic law has been officially adopted in Britain, with sharia courts given powers to rule on Muslim civil cases.
The government has quietly sanctioned the powers for sharia judges to rule on cases ranging from divorce and financial disputes to those involving domestic violence.
Rulings issued by a network of five sharia courts are enforceable with the full power of the judicial system, through the county courts or High Court.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/faith/article4749183.ece
http://www.brusselsjournal.com/node/3522
Is this integration?
Please tell me. Are these people adapting to British Culture and values, or are they trying to change the UK to meet their cultural and religious values?
Terrorism is not an inherently Islamic phenomenon; have you never heard of the IRA? Should we have bombed Ireland?
I never said that terrorism is an exclusively islamic phenomenon.
The issue with the IRA was much different from Afghanistan, if that is what you are referring to. First. The IRA was a domestic terrorist group within the United Kingdom. Second, the Northern Irish authorities dealt with them as a matter of internal affairs. They had a police and military infrastructure to deal with them and to uncover and arrest their members.
The issue with Afghanistan is quite different. Afghanistan was a country where its bat shit crazy rulers, the Taliban harbored Al Qa'eda and let them operate in their country and carry out their attacks on the United States. They were complicit in an act of war against the United States.
The Taliban, Al'Qaeda, and their holy war on the West was an imminent threat to the United States and pretty much anyone else who didn't meet their demands.
SkA_DaRk_Che
12-11-2009, 12:58 PM
The discussion about integration is nothing new. I just don't see a perticular
problem about people with an islamic belief opposed to another. To say there
is nothing is maybe tirivialising it, but this is a problem of immigration in
general and the fusion of different cultures in one habitat, not because they
are muslims.
Look at the crime rates, the ghettoization of Muslims across Europe. From Oslo, to Paris, to Bradford.
Personally, i think the Islamic issue only exacerbates the problem of immigration. The other problem is that Europe has taken these people en mass where they cluster around each other, forming their own communities. What more, many of these people have very little education and are only capable of doing manual labour or non technical things. This only serves to continue the poverty, male integration process. Islam only serves to distance themselves from the local population even more via an ideology that is alien to our own (western) one. Many of them resent our countries and our values.
The problems in Europe surrounding Islamic Immigration is centered around stupid immigration laws, which failed to look at the future consequences of such immigration
The motives behind terrorism are up do debate. I personally don't see any of
the 'scary footage' as evidence, I find other explanations more likely. That
film from the 90s e.g. about iraq soldiers killing babies was staged (http://www.prwatch.org/books/tsigfy10.html) as well.
Again, a lot of what Noam Chomsky is saying in the links I posted presents
a lot more to the picture then the religious aspects and also give motive to
why the issue is 'degraded' to just islamic fundamentalism. How the media
seem to just ignore the questionable foreign policies is just beyond me.
Up for debate? No it's not. Like i said in a previous post. There are three components to Terrorism. Religious, Political and Financial. All of these combine together as a perfect storm to produce Islamic Terrorism. I can explain if you would like.
You are absolutely correct, there are foreign policy issues involved. But these Islamic terrorists response is totally inappropriate ways. They see bad foreign policy issues and all of a sudden they think that there is another Crusade going on and that they need to fight a Holy War and Islamize the entire world to remedy it.
I don't care what you say. There is no justification for flying planes into buildings full of unarmed civilians, or blowing up buses or going into a market and blowing everyone in there to kingdom kum.
The Islamic Militants think they can get their way simply by killing lots of people. They fire rockets at Israel for instance and think they can get their way. Then they go and hide in crowded urban centers and when Israel retaliates they claim to be the victims. These people are fundamentally irrational.
And I still believe there is a danger in the laws that are being passed to
'protect' the people and a lot of the changes are already way beyond what
would have been reasonable. But even if you don't think so, this thread is
just way beyond the line - I would have hoped that we are past this kind
of prejudice thinking and dangerous generalizations in our 'civilized world'.
I absolutely agree with you here. I am against these "patriot act" type laws which subvert our freedoms in the name of "security". It's a slippery slope.
imran_p
12-11-2009, 01:16 PM
Religion itself is a big big problem. And Islam is one of the bigger problems, I think everyone agrees that militant Islam is extremely dangerous, it's just a huge misconception that a majority of Muslims are extremists. You have to remember that Islam is 600 years behind Christianity and that in the past as Christianity was changing it has been responsible for a number of great atrocities and millions of deaths. Religion itself is a huge burden on "civilization"
SkA_DaRk_Che
12-11-2009, 01:38 PM
Religion itself is a big big problem. And Islam is one of the bigger problems, I think everyone agrees that militant Islam is extremely dangerous, it's just a huge misconception that a majority of Muslims are extremists. You have to remember that Islam is 600 years behind Christianity and that in the past as Christianity was changing it has been responsible for a number of great atrocities and millions of deaths. Religion itself is a huge burden on "civilization"
I'm very aware of the millions killed because of Christianity. I remember reading somewhere that in a 10 year period 5 million women were murdered/executed on suspicion of being witches.
Religion itself is a huge problem. I agree.
However, Islam is not 600 years behind Christianity. Just because it is 600 years older doesn't necessarily equate that they have a similar level of modernization/secularization that christianity had 600 years ago.
In the West we had things which happened in our histories which lead us down the path of Liberal Democracy. Instances which have not happened in Islam Civilization to my knowledge.
For one thing, we had the Greek and Roman Civilizations as predecessors who's philosophies had/have a huge influence on us today. Democracy for example.
Then we had things that happen during the great plague. During that time, Labour was precious so workers could use this as a bargaining chip for better wages/treatment.
The colonies like the American ones had some form of responsible government from the British. They wanted more freedoms and this culminated in the American Revolution and the declaration of independence.
These are all things that have happened through collective western history that have culminated in the present day incarnation of Liberal Democracy.
These are only examples of many, but each one of the instances have had huge effects on our lives today.
Islamic Civilization today is the product of their civilizations past history. Since the Islamic Golden Age they have been going backwards and in decline.
Weather or not we can artificially introduce these ideals of democracy and human rights successfully into islamic countries without these events having happened naturally as they did in our societies, we can not know. Only time will tell.
Universal Mind
12-11-2009, 03:37 PM
There's a large number of Christians like that in the US, too...
I know, and I live in their big cuckoo nest-- the Bible Belt. However, I am not exactly afraid to ride on airplanes with them. Like Imran and GaryColemansGhost talked about, I think democracy and the civilization advancement that come with it have really tamed Christians. Fundamentalist Christians still talk off the wall stuff and try hard to pass off the wall laws, but the Christian trends of burning accused witches, stoning adulterers and homosexuals, and initiating crusades ended a while back. That is part of why I am majorly hoping democracy will work out in Iraq and Afghanistan and spread to the rest of the Middle East.
Today we learned that sharia courts (which have operated illegally in Britain until now) are being re-classed as tribunal hearings, making their judgments legally binding. According to the Daily Express, “new powers have been given to tribunals in London, Birmingham, Bradford and Manchester with the network’s headquarters in Nuneaton, Warwickshire. Two more courts are being planned for Glasgow and Edinburgh.” According to the Daily Mail, this “[…] new network of courts […] agree[s] to be bound by traditional sharia law, and under the 1996 Arbitration Act the court's decisions can then be enforced by the county courts or the High Court.”
It is almost unbelievable that this should occur in a modern, democratic, Western country, and, moreover, under a government that claims to be liberal, and to care about the right of women and homosexuals among others.
Or check this out from the Times.
Quote:
Islamic law has been officially adopted in Britain, with sharia courts given powers to rule on Muslim civil cases.
The government has quietly sanctioned the powers for sharia judges to rule on cases ranging from divorce and financial disputes to those involving domestic violence.
Rulings issued by a network of five sharia courts are enforceable with the full power of the judicial system, through the county courts or High Court.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/com...cle4749183.ece (http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/faith/article4749183.ece)
http://www.brusselsjournal.com/node/3522
Is this integration?
Please tell me. Are these people adapting to British Culture and values, or are they trying to change the UK to meet their cultural and religious values?
This is extremely dangerous and the socalled people who should protect their civilians are not doing so by bowing down to muslim aggression, we are being fucked by our leaders who, according to me, are dreaming of an islamic society but are not daring to implement it quickly.
Here is an article coming from the web which exposes the mindset of our "beloved left politicians who are trying so hard to protect us" :
The Left's love affair with Islam
By Chuck Hustmyre
The union between the American Left and fundamentalist Islam seems like a marriage made in hell.
The Left hates religion, particularly Christianity, and has succeeded in ripping nearly all vestiges of it from American public life. Through the legal machinations of its lapdog, the American Civil Liberties Union, the Left has banned Christmas from public schools (http://thebulletin.us/articles/2009/11/28/top_stories/doc4b1197404c6b0483970247.txt), nativity scenes from City Hall (http://www.firstamendmentcenter.org/news.aspx?id=5937), and the Ten Commandments from courthouses (http://www.cnn.com/2003/LAW/08/27/ten.commandments/).
In liberal newspeak, "Happy holidays" has replaced "Merry Christmas." Holiday trees (http://www.wkyt.com/blogs/neilsnotebook/67045807.html) have replaced Christmas trees, and Christmas break has become "fall break."
Yet a few years ago, seventh-grade students (http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=26074) in California were required to participate in a religious studies program during which they were told to wear Muslim clothing, memorize passages from the Quran, and choose an Islamic name for themselves.
Interestingly enough, the ACLU did not file a lawsuit.
The American Left champions causes such as gay rights (including gay marriage), equality for women (suffrage, the right to work, etc.), and religious freedom (usually in the form of freedom from religion). Yet, fundamentalist Islam opposes nearly everything the American Left stands for.
In many Islamic countries, homosexuality is punishable by death. In Iran, a top government official recently said that torture followed by death (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,311025,00.html) is the appropriate punishment for being gay.
In Saudi Arabia, women can't vote, run for public office, or drive cars (http://edition.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/meast/03/05/saudi.arabia.woman.driver/index.html). Women are routinely jailed (http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/middle_east/article3321637.ece) and beaten for merely being in the presence of a man not related to them. The Saudi version of Dr. Phil provides televised lessons to men on how to properly beat their wives (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,307680,00.html).
In many Islamic countries, women are forced into arranged marriages and held as property by their husbands, something not exactly in line with progressive Western thinking. In some Muslim countries, women aren't even allowed to decide what clothes to wear. To reveal even the smallest patch of skin is a crime.
Religious freedom is often nonexistent under Islamic rule. In countries like Afghanistan and Iran, people who convert from Islam to another religion face public execution (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,188364,00.html).
So why does the American Left hate Christianity yet love Islam?
In this country, a shadow army of apologists works tirelessly to provide alternative explanations for faith-based Islamic violence--shootings, bombings, stabbings, and beheadings. These shadow soldiers work in government, media, and on college campuses. Most are members of the American Left. The rest are bureaucrats who have been cowed by the omnipresent specter of political correctness. You hear these apologists every time a Muslim goes berserk and murders people in the name of Islam.
That's an important distinction I'd like to be clear about. Every week someone goes nuts in this country and commits a sensational crime that captures the attention of the media for a few days. Last weekend, a convicted felon from Arkansas murdered four Seattle-area cops at a coffee shop. Before that, some nut shot up an Orlando office building.
Truly impulsive and insane acts of violence are unpredictable. But when horrific violence is based on a theology that preaches hatred, intolerance, and global conquest, there are usually plenty of warning signs. According to the FBI, imams preach jihad in at least 10 percent (http://www.canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/16756) of the United States' 2,000 mosques.
Certainly Army Major Nidal Hasan signaled his intent when he told fellow Army doctors that infidels (those who don't accept Allah as the one true God) should have their heads cut off and have burning oil poured down their throats. After telling everyone around him that non-Muslims should be killed and that the U.S. Army was engaged in a war against Islam, Hasan murdered 13 people at Ft. Hood, Texas.
Practically before the sounds of the last gunshots had faded, professional apologists in government and the media were saying Hasan was not a terrorist and that the shootings had nothing to do with his belief in Islam. Of course, the exact opposite is true. Nidal Hasan is a jihadist and he committed mass murder because of his belief in Islam.
Nearly a month after the shootings, the American Left is blaming the Ft. Hood murders on everything but Islam. Chicago Mayor Richard Daley took the opportunity of announcing the expansion of the city's Arabic language program in public schools to blame the killings on America's love affair with guns (http://www.foundingbloggers.com/wordpress/2009/11/chicago-mayor-daley-blames-fort-hood-on-americas-love-of-guns/).
Other apologists blame the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan (http://www.nowpublic.com/world/major-malik-nidal-hasan-and-ptsd-was-stress-disorder-blame-2510885.html), claiming Hasan, a psychiatrist, suffered from "secondary trauma" after hearing of the horrors of war from the soldiers he was counseling. Still others invented a new psychological malady, pre-traumatic stress disorder (http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=120162816), meaning the mere thought of going into a combat zone so traumatized Hasan that he snapped.
The proof that all of these excuses are just so much hot air is that Hasan himself told us why he shot more than 40 people before he did it.
Major Hasan's business card identified him as a "Soldier of Allah (http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/hasan-multiple-mail-accounts-officials/story?id=9065692)." He was in email contact with a militant Muslim imam who fled the United States and now operates in Yemen. He tried several times to contact al Qaeda (http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/fort-hood-shooter-contact-al-qaeda-terrorists-officials/story?id=9030873).
To anyone but an American Left apologist, Hasan's motive for murdering 13 fellow soldiers and wounding another 30 is quite clear: He did it because he was fighting for Islam. As Hasan repeatedly told fellow Army doctors, he is a Muslim first, an American second.
In unambiguous terms, fundamentalist Islam has announced again and again that it despises the values, culture, and traditions of America. The American Left does too.
Consistent with the Arabic proverb that the enemy of my enemy is my friend, the American Left has formed an alliance with fundamentalist Islam to transform this country into something far removed from its Judeo-Christian origins and ideals.
The mistake the Left is making is that its so-called progressive goals have nothing in common with the medieval tenants of fundamentalist Islam. Militant Muslims have no respect for American progressives, any more than they respect the very existence of Israel.
Fundamentalist Islam is using the American Left to advance its own agenda. Militant Muslims want Islam and sharia law to dominate the West. Their goal is to subvert the U.S. Constitution and our way of life to the will of Allah. The word Islam means submission.
What members of the American Left seem blind to is the fact that in countries where Islam dominates, their progressive ideas would be crushed and many of them would be thrown in jail simply because of their lifestyle choices.
Yet, the American Left continues to serve as apologist-in-chief for fundamentalist Islam.
Why?
Because deep down American Leftists are terrified of Islamic fundamentalists.
Last year, publishing giant Random House canceled the publication of Sherry Jones's novel The Jewel of Medina because it might be offensive to some Muslims. According to its own press release (http://www.randomhouse.com/rhpg/medinaletter.html), the publisher feared Muslim violence against its offices and employees. Apparently, Random House's fears were well founded.
In September 2008, three Muslim terrorists firebombed (http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2008/sep/28/muhammad.book.attack) the home and office of the British publisher who bought the rights to the novel.
In 2006, the Apple computer company drew howls of rage from Muslims who claimed the glass cube the company built outside its midtown Manhattan store was modeled on the Kaaba, the Muslim shrine in the Saudi city of Mecca, and was meant as an insult (http://blogs.zdnet.com/Apple/?p=305) to Islam.
The American Left's affair with fundamentalist Islam is essentially a love-fear relationship. The Left loves Islam's hatred of America and its desire to radically change this country, but the Left also fears what militant Muslims are capable of, especially if they turn their murderous rage on their so-called friends.
So the Left, like Neville Chamberlain with the Nazis, walks a tightrope, appeasing Muslims at every turn, offering excuses for Islamic violence, and hoping Muslim fundamentalists won't bite the hand that feeds them their excuses.
***
Chuck Hustmyre is an award-winning journalist and a retired federal agent. He is the author of three books and hundreds of magazine and newspaper articles. For more information visit www.chuckhustmyre.com (http://www.chuckhustmyre.com/).
Many of them resent our countries and our values.
Where are you from?
Actually as far as I can remember in germany most of the younger muslim
people liked germany and could identify with it (shown by some survey).
Anyway, you are right about most points I think, but in my opinion it's still
a problem of clashing cultures in general, a different one might have worked
out better, then again another one could have had been even more difficult
to integrate. The obvious media biased is not helping the situation, though.
The problems in Europe surrounding Islamic Immigration is centered around stupid immigration laws, which failed to look at the future consequences of such immigration
I agree. But I find all of this in favour of my argument that it is not the
Islam itself that is the (main) problem.
Up for debate? No it's not. Like i said in a previous post. There are three components to Terrorism. Religious, Political and Financial. All of these combine together as a perfect storm to produce Islamic Terrorism. I can explain if you would like.
Well, of course it is, every subject that is as complex as this has different
perspectives. You don't need to explain, I do know the arguments of many
opinions regarding the situation in the middle east and terrorism. It's just,
while I agree that religion is a factor, I don't think it is the main one, by a
long shot, especially not in the manner it is presented in the news.
You are absolutely correct, there are foreign policy issues involved. But these Islamic terrorists response is totally inappropriate ways. They see bad foreign policy issues and all of a sudden they think that there is another Crusade going on and that they need to fight a Holy War and Islamize the entire world to remedy it.
I don't care what you say. There is no justification for flying planes into buildings full of unarmed civilians, or blowing up buses or going into a market and blowing everyone in there to kingdom kum.
The policy issues are pretty huge though. Don't get me wrong, I am not
trying to justify anything here. I would never try to trivialize a terrorist
attack on the 'innocent population', but the reactions now are in my opinion
just highly hypocritical, because the western governments are guilty of the
exact same thing (SE-Asia, Central America). My point is that this cannot
be ignored in order to understand the issue. And it is not fair to the world.
I personally still think that this is more of a 'Wag the Dog' phenomenon.
A threat or 'everlasting war' blown totally out of proportion by very brilliant PR.
The Islamic Militants think they can get their way simply by killing lots of people. They fire rockets at Israel for instance and think they can get their way. Then they go and hide in crowded urban centers and when Israel retaliates they claim to be the victims. These people are fundamentally irrational.
And Isreal is using white phosphor rockets against the population in Gaza,
which is by the way only used to target the citizens, not militaries. I think
there is no way to just say that the palestinians are in the wrong here, while
the Israeli are the voice of reason. (Not saying that you did)
SkA_DaRk_Che
12-12-2009, 09:48 AM
Where are you from?
Actually as far as I can remember in germany most of the younger muslim
people liked germany and could identify with it (shown by some survey).
Anyway, you are right about most points I think, but in my opinion it's still
a problem of clashing cultures in general, a different one might have worked
out better, then again another one could have had been even more difficult
to integrate. The obvious media biased is not helping the situation, though.
Well, it's not just culture. The places these people where basically just imported from post world war II were often poor village areas, often mountainous, isolated. Not much education or literacy etc. They weren't exactly cosmopolitan in perspective and that translated, partly, to the failed integration of Europe's muslims.
By the way, in many Islamic Societies religion and culture are extremely intertwined, to the point where the lines blur much more so then in America or Europe.
What media bias are you talking about? Most of the media doesn't even talk about these issues at all or if they do, they water the arguments down considerably to avoid offending muslims. I even get the impression some media personalities are scared of doing so since the issues that happened with the Danish Cartoons.
I agree. But I find all of this in favour of my argument that it is not the
Islam itself that is the (main) problem.
I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree. As you know, i think Islam is a big wall in the way of progress in the muslim world.
I see countries like Iran with so much potential, with very industrious people held back by the enormous crutch that is Islam.
It's just,
while I agree that religion is a factor, I don't think it is the main one, by a
long shot, especially not in the manner it is presented in the news.
In regards to which conflict? I think the Israeli-Palestinian conflict has largely been quite secular (By middle east standards) up until recently with the advent of Hamas, Islamic Jihad and the rise of Hezbollah. While to me i see the religious factor in Afghanistan and Pakistan as being huge and probably understated to be honest.
The policy issues are pretty huge though. Don't get me wrong, I am not
trying to justify anything here. I would never try to trivialize a terrorist
attack on the 'innocent population', but the reactions now are in my opinion
just highly hypocritical, because the western governments are guilty of the
exact same thing (SE-Asia, Central America). My point is that this cannot
be ignored in order to understand the issue. And it is not fair to the world.
I largely agree with you; although, i will mention that the stuff that happened in SE asia and Central America was a product of the cold war environment and the necessity to stop the spread of communism.
This doesn't excuse the colonialism of France in vietnam, nor the wanton bombing of Vietnam and Cambodia, and the agent orange fiasco. Those could have been done much more sensitively to avoid as much as possible the death of civilians.
And Isreal is using white phosphor rockets against the population in Gaza,
which is by the way only used to target the citizens, not militaries. I think
there is no way to just say that the palestinians are in the wrong here, while
the Israeli are the voice of reason. (Not saying that you did)
I didn't mean to minimize the Israeli-Palestinian issue to such a level. I understand that it is a multi faceted issue with lots of fucked up extremists on both sides.
In the post you were quoting, i was highlighting the issue with Islamic Militants like Hamas and Hezbollah who attack Israel, and when israel retaliates they take refuge in densely populated urban centers, thus drawing fire on civilians once more. They then use these causalities to instigate more extremism and violence and so on.
I wasn't referring to the wider conflict(and im not saying you implying that i was, i'm just clarifying) (which is extremely complicated), i was only speaking to the behavior of islamic militants and their provocative tactics which in the end do no one any measure of good. Not even the people they are trying to "help".
In the post you were quoting, i was highlighting the issue with Islamic Militants like Hamas and Hezbollah who attack Israel, and when israel retaliates they take refuge in densely populated urban centers, thus drawing fire on civilians once more. They then use these causalities to instigate more extremism and violence and so on.
Inciting, inciting, inciting, these bastards are always inciting, even they sacrifice their own people, deliberately allowing them to be killed !!
Although I am convinced that the Americans in power back then on September 11th 2001 knew about what was going to happen and even participated in it...
see..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5akpnIFK-RM
I am still more attracted to fight the evil of Islam.
I deciphered the Nostradamus verse 9.44 and discovered an accompying verse with it, 8.77.
First 9.44 :
Migrate, migrate from Geneva everyone,
Saturn will change from gold to iron,
Those against RAYPOZ shall all be exterminated,
Before the invasion the sky will show signs.
With Geneva Nostradamus means the Fourth Convention of Geneva which regulates fugitives, this turns out to be lethal to the Free West in the future, the traitors are among us......why ?
Just read on....
Saturn is the duration of the upcoming war, one orbit of Saturn around the sun is somewhat 29 years, so that the golden life in which we are now in will be changed into a iron age of war, imprisonment and weapons.
Who is RAYPOZ ?
RAYPOZ is an anagram for Zopyra, Zopyra cut off his nose and ears, wounding himself and pretending to be a fugitive, and in this way delivered Babylon in to the power of his sovereign Darius. This happened a few thousand years ago, the same traitors are among us in the Free West now, pretending to be our friends, beware !!!
There was a man by the name of Zopyra, he was a Persian traitor
Babylon was revolting in that time against King Darius
Zopyra cut of his nose and his ears to be accepted as a fugitive
he became a respectful military man and made the Persians flee
but that was already dealt with behind the backs of the naive Babylonians
so in this way he gained their trust and loyalty just to betray them in the end
Zopyra, you traitor, you are amongst us nowadays
Zopyra, you try to fool us and the left is not gonna be in your way
Nostradamus, a man of wisdom tracked back his name
and used him to specify the things to come our way
there are so many Zopyra's now hiding under the Fourth Convention
of Geneve, that's why we should leave this otherwise we will repent
do you wish for Muslim rule or do you want to live in freedom
then stand up and fight for your right to be a human being
Let us now look at Centurie 8 quatrain 77 :
The antichrist very soon annihilates the three,
twenty-seven years his war will last.
The unbelievers are dead, captive, exiled;
with blood, human bodies, water and red hail covering earth.
In this verse he is more precise concerning the duration of war and who is the Anti - Christ, namely Islam.
He writes that the war of the Anti-Christ wil last 27 years which is almost one orbit of Saturn around the Sun.
There is another indication of this fact in another verse :
Centurie 9 quatrain 73 :
The king enters Foix wearing a blue turban,
he will reign for less than an orbit of Saturn;
the king with the white turban, his heart banished to Byzantium,
Sun, Mars and Mercury near Aquarius.
Here Nostradamus mentions that a King with a blue turban enters Foix in France and again he mentions Saturn, and more precisely, less then an orbit of Saturn around the Sun which is around 29 years.
So we will have 27 years of war against Islam, be prepared !!
Why ?
Well, another verse then :
Centurie 6 quatrain 80 :
From Fez the reign will reach those of Europe,
Their city ablaze & the blade will cut:
The great one of Asia by land & sea with great troop,
So that blues, fathers, the cross, will pursue to death.
Fez is in Marocco, so in this verse Nostradamus states that the law and government of Fez (Islam) wil come to Europe.
Well, there is more, the Islam is given power to conquer, we cannot avoid it, here's why :
Centurie 2 quatrain 29 :
The Easterner will leave his seat,
To pass the Apennine mountains to see Gaul:
He will transpire the sky, the waters & snow,
And everyone will be struck with his rod
Here Nostradamus clearly foresees that the Islam will beat everybody who is against it, it's pretty creepy, isn't it ?
Why will the Islam be so victotious ?
Centurie 5 quatrain 72 :
For the pleasure of the voluptuous edict,
One will mix poison in the faith:
Venus will be in a course so virtuous,
As to becloud the whole quality of the Sun
The answer ? Capitalism !
Poison in the faith is capitalism but also the left winged politicians who hate Christianity, secularism is also one reason why is goes wrong and Islam will wage war against us.
Another reason is expansion of Islam, they want to dominate the whole world and that has nothing to do with us, but with them, here is the verse :
Centurie 8 quatrain 59 :
Twice put up and twice cast down
the East will also weaken the West
Its adversary after several battles,
chased by sea will fail at time of need
Islam tried to conquer Europe twice, one time they were defeated by Karel Martel around 730 and another time the Turks came to Vienna and were defeated there, around 1500 or so, if you're interested in the exact year, look it up on google.
The third time they will be succesfull, but only for a while because we will kick their asses !!!!
Centurie 5 quatrain 74 :
Of Trojan blood will be born a Germanic heart
Who will rise to very high power:
He will drive out the foreign Arabic people
Returning the Church to its pristine pre-eminence.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
De sang Troyen naistra cœur Germanique
Qui deuiendra en si haute puissance:
Hors chassera gent estrange Arabique
Tournant l'Eglise en pristine preeminence
Centurie 10 quatrain 86 :
Like a griffin will come the King of Europe
Accompanied by those of Aquilon,
He will lead a great troop of red ones & white ones
And they will go against the King of Babylon.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Côme vn gryphon viendra le Roy d'Europe
Accompagné de ceux d'Aquilon,
De rouges & blancs conduira grane troppe
Et iront contre le Roy de Babylon.
Centurie 10 quatrain 96 :
The Religion of the name of the seas will win out,
Against the sect of the son of Adaluncatif,
The stubborn lamented sect will be afraid,
Of the two wounded by A & A.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Religion du nom des mers vaincra,
Contre la secte fils Adaluncatif,
Secte obstinée deplorée craindra,
Des deux blessez par Aleph & Aleph
The religion of the name of the seas will win out, the name of the seas is Mare, which Nostradamus uses for Christianity, namely Mare = Maria.
In other words, the Islam is fucked !!!
Invader
12-14-2009, 12:43 PM
the expert illusionist Mahamada (Mohammed)
Muh-ha-med
Ma-ha-ma-da
Still I am going to establish a terrible and demoniac religion by the order of the Lord.
Who is 'the Lord' in this case?
but having beard
Very vague, as all men of the region in question grow beards.
and eat everything.
Confusing and also vague. Followers of both Islam and Judaism (Christianity
as well, before some texts were removed) did not eat pork. I believe Muslims
also do not eat bottom feeders. That's from their text. How do they eat
everything? Can you explain?
They should eat animals without performing any rituals.
Muslims do kill animals for food in a ritualistic fashion, being that they have a
concept similar to "Kosher", and it is called "Halaal". If killing animals without
ritual is somehow evil, perhaps you ought to take a look at commercial food
distribution.
This is my opinion. They will perform purificatory act with the musala or a pestle as you purify your things with kusha.
Explain please. Undefined words mean nothing in an argument.
Therefore, they will be known as musalman
Interesting considering the French word for Muslim is Musulman.
Thus the demoniac religion will be founded by me.
For a religion that claims that idol worship is a bad thing, perhaps you can
explain how it is a 'demoniac' religion, as I believe I am missing the point.
It would so far appear that you only picked out the parts of the prophecy
that went along with your ideas and omitted that which did not. Address my
point and convince me otherwise, if you care to refute the accusation.
The religion of the name of the seas will win out, the name of the seas is Mare, which Nostradamus uses for Christianity, namely Mare = Maria.
In other words, the Islam is fucked !!!
The thread also appears to be degrading ever more into a state of hate for Muslims.
Please tread lightly.
SkA_DaRk_Che
12-14-2009, 01:13 PM
Fez is in Marocco, so in this verse Nostradamus states that the law and government of Fez (Islam) wil come to Europe.
Well, there is more, the Islam is given power to conquer, we cannot avoid it, here's why :
Well, in the time of Nostradamus i believe that Iberia (Spain) was under Moorish control, and i think Fez was the capital at the time of the Moors. Perhaps it was rather a reference to the politics of the time as Nostradamus saw it, that the Moors would eventually breach the Pyrenees and annex Western Europe into their empire?
"The great one of Asia by land & sea with great troop"
This may be a reference to the Islamic Empire which came about in the century after Muhammad's death. As you know it straddled all the way from Arabia to the Pyrenes and from Arabia to the border with China.
This also could possibly a reference to the Ottoman Empire and the Battle at Vienna, in a more modern context this could be a reference to the ascension of Turkey into the European Union and the resulting demographic shift in Western Europe.
Quote:
Originally Posted by erik
the expert illusionist Mahamada (Mohammed)
Muh-ha-med
Ma-ha-ma-daMahamada was the name Muhammad had in his past life as a Shiva worshipper, like Tripurasur was his name before his reincarnation as Mahamada, as Tripurasur he was burnt to ashes by Shiva.
Quote:
Originally Posted by erik
Still I am going to establish a terrible and demoniac religion by the order of the Lord.
Who is 'the Lord' in this case?
I think our Almighty God, there is only one Lord and that is God, that's why we cannot do anything about the fact that Islam will try to conquer the world, it is God's will !!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by erik
but having beard
Very vague, as all men of the region in question grow beardsYou're right about this, I agree that this is a bit vague, most of the Western Muslims shave up.
Quote:
Originally Posted by erik
and eat everything.
Confusing and also vague. Followers of both Islam and Judaism (Christianity
as well, before some texts were removed) did not eat pork. I believe Muslims also do not eat bottom feeders. That's from their text. How do they eat everything? Can you explain?
No, I cannot explain, never seen a muslim eating pork as far as I know.
Quote:
Originally Posted by erik
They should eat animals without performing any rituals.
Muslims do kill animals for food in a ritualistic fashion, being that they have a concept similar to "Kosher", and it is called "Halaal". If killing animals without ritual is somehow evil, perhaps you ought to take a look at commercial food distribution.Yeah, this one I also found a bit strange since muslims perform rituals before slaugthering an animal.
I am a vegetarian and I think it's plain evil to slaughter animals especially how they do this in modern times, all the slaughterhouses, in the west and in the east.
Quote:
Originally Posted by erik
This is my opinion. They will perform purificatory act with the musala or a pestle as you purify your things with kusha.
Explain please. Undefined words mean nothing in an argument.
No, I cannot explain as I don't understand what is meant by this, all that I know is that kusha refers to kusha grass which is used to sit on when meditating.
Quote:
Originally Posted by erik
Therefore, they will be known as musalman
Interesting considering the French word for Muslim is Musulman.
You say that the French word for muslim is musulman, the Bhavishya Purana speaks of musalman, which is different.
Quote:
Originally Posted by erik
Thus the demoniac religion will be founded by me.
For a religion that claims that idol worship is a bad thing, perhaps you can
explain how it is a 'demoniac' religion, as I believe I am missing the point.
It would so far appear that you only picked out the parts of the prophecy
that went along with your ideas and omitted that which did not. Address my
point and convince me otherwise, if you care to refute the accusation.
I didn't pick out parts that were appealing to me to serve my own interest, I copied and pasted the whole text !!
Well, the text says it is a demoniac religion, Mahamada (Muhammed) states in the text himself that he will found a terrible and demoniac religion, these are his own words, and he is right, just see the past of Islam, how they killed so many people in Africa and India, but maybe you like to close your eyes for this.
The world famous historian, Will Durant has written in his Story of Civilisation that "the Mohammedan conquest of India was probably the bloodiest story in history".
India before the advent of Islamic imperialism was not exactly a zone of peace. There were plenty of wars fought by Hindu princes. But in all their wars, the Hindus had observed some time-honoured conventions sanctioned by the Sastras. The Brahmins and the Bhikshus were never molested. The cows were never killed. The temples were never touched. The chastity of women was never violated. The non-combatants were never killed or captured. A human habitation was never attacked unless it was a fort. The civil population was never plundered. War booty was an unknown item in the calculations of conquerors. The martial classes who clashed, mostly in open spaces, had a code of honor. Sacrifice of honor for victory or material gain was deemed as worse than death.
slamic imperialism came with a different code--the Sunnah of the Prophet. It required its warriors to fall upon the helpless civil population after a decisive victory had been won on the battlefield. It required them to sack and burn down villages and towns after the defenders had died fighting or had fled. The cows, the Brahmins, and the Bhikshus invited their special attention in mass murders of non-combatants. The temples and monasteries were their special targets in an orgy of pillage and arson. Those whom they did not kill, they captured and sold as slaves. The magnitude of the booty looted even from the bodies of the dead, was a measure of the success of a military mission. And they did all this as mujahids (holy warriors) and ghazls (kafir-killers) in the service of Allah and his Last Prophet.
Hindus found it very hard to understand the psychology of this new invader. For the first time in their history, Hindus were witnessing a scene which was described by Kanhadade Prabandha (1456 AD) in the following words:
"The conquering army burnt villages, devastated the land, plundered people's wealth, took Brahmins and children and women of all classes captive, flogged with thongs of raw hide, carried a moving prison with it, and converted the prisoners into obsequious Turks."
That was written in remembrance of Alauddin Khalji's invasion of Gujarat in the year l298 AD. But the gruesome game had started three centuries earlier when Mahmud Ghaznavi had vowed to invade India every year in order to destroy idolatry, kill the kafirs, capture prisoners of war, and plunder vast wealth for which India was well-known.
http://www.hindunet.org/hindu_history/modern/moghal_atro.html
Quote:
Originally Posted by erik
The religion of the name of the seas will win out, the name of the seas is Mare, which Nostradamus uses for Christianity, namely Mare = Maria.
In other words, the Islam is fucked !!!
The thread also appears to be degrading ever more into a state of hate for Muslims.
Please tread lightly. Why hate for muslims, I don't hate muslims, I just say that they are going to conquer the west and then they will be fucked because they will be defeated, it's just a peak into the future, I don't hate, I am just warning you people of the fact that Islam is going to conquer the west and the world and by doing so, killing so many good people, you just wait and see !!!
Well, in the time of Nostradamus i believe that Iberia (Spain) was under Moorish control, and i think Fez was the capital at the time of the Moors. Perhaps it was rather a reference to the politics of the time as Nostradamus saw it, that the Moors would eventually breach the Pyrenees and annex Western Europe into their empire?
Fez is a city in Marocco, see :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fes
So Nostradamus warns us that Islam will come to Europe and conquer us.
@Soros,
Sorry I haven't answered to your posts yet, I have been a little preoccupied
and if I don't get around to answering in the next few days it might actually
be 2 weeks until I have Internet Access again.. just saying, I didn't forget.
At the time my focus is just elsewhere, but I do want to answer thoroughly.
Invader
12-16-2009, 10:02 PM
Well, the text says it is a demoniac religion, Mahamada (Muhammed) states in the text himself that he will found a terrible and demoniac religion, these are his own words, and he is right, just see the past of Islam, how they killed so many people in Africa and India, but maybe you like to close your eyes for this.
Close my eyes? I asked simple questions, and you did your best to answer.
I'm not turning a deaf ear your way.
I think our Almighty God, there is only one Lord and that is God, that's why we cannot do anything about the fact that Islam will try to conquer the world, it is God's will !!!
That makes very little sense. You associate the behavior of Muslim's to demons
and claim that their actions are the will of God. How is that so?
Quote:
Originally Posted by erik http://www.dreamviews.com/community/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.dreamviews.com/community/showthread.php?p=1249933#post1249933)
Well, the text says it is a demoniac religion, Mahamada (Muhammed) states in the text himself that he will found a terrible and demoniac religion, these are his own words, and he is right, just see the past of Islam, how they killed so many people in Africa and India, but maybe you like to close your eyes for this.
Close my eyes? I asked simple questions, and you did your best to answer.
I'm not turning a deaf ear your way.
Okay, I'm sorry.
Quote:
I think our Almighty God, there is only one Lord and that is God, that's why we cannot do anything about the fact that Islam will try to conquer the world, it is God's will !!!
That makes very little sense. You associate the behavior of Muslim's to demons and claim that their actions are the will of God. How is that so?
Well, I am not saying all muslims are demons, I am talking about the radical muslims here who are just dying to take over our countries and impose on us their religion, that's all.
Okay, there is karma, karma means that everything that you do will be followed by an equal reaction, so action-reaction, like the third law of Newton.
There is individual karma, karma for families and so on, karma exists also for nations and countries.
Since the west was so engaged in colonial activities starting from the 16th century and enslaved so many people, killed so many people, those people who did that will get it back, there are a lot of people nowadays from those times who reincarnated again, also there is a lot going on from older times and ages.
The reason why radical Islam will be unleashed on the west is that the west and the western people in general have bad karma, which the demons gladly wanna execute, understand my point ?
If I did sometihing wrong in a past life, then there is no good soul in the world who wants to execute my bad karma, in case I should be killed, good souls (angels) don't want to have this blood on their hands, demons on the contrary gladly accept the job, God speaks like this :
"This man killed this and this man and woman, so now he has to be killed twice"
Demons answer :
"I will do the job !"
Or in my case, I killed my brother in a past life and I had to pay for it by being scared for his life in 2007 and 2008 that demons would want to kill him so I had to take stupid actions every time to save his life, for example :
He said sometimes in that time :
"Wow, this shoots through my head" which means in Dutch : "Something comes up in my mind", in Dutch : "Dit schiet me ineens te binnen".
Then I became scared because now I thought that the higher psirit worlds had made him say someting like this (we are under control by higher beings). In this way, he gave permission, I thought, to allow others to kill him, so I said later : "Wow, and this shoots through my head".
So in this way, I told the higher beings that they should kill me instead of him, I was extremely sensitive in that time and got messages even from running water, I heard the water talk in a sinister way, terrible, this happened to me from october 2007 untill december 2007 and a bit at the end of 2008 when he got some attack and decided to go jogging at night, voices were telling me he would be killed in that night, each and every time, so I was each and every time, a bit fucked, so to speak.
We lived together in a house at that time, he on the third floor and I on the fourth floor.
And there is so much more karma which is there to be executed so the demons, they do this by the order of the Lord.
Understood a bit ?
nzguy
12-17-2009, 04:49 AM
Okay, there is karma, karma means that everything that you do will be followed by an equal reaction, so action-reaction, like the third law of Newton.
There is individual karma, karma for families and so on, karma exists also for nations and countries.
Since the west was so engaged in colonial activities starting from the 16th century and enslaved so many people, killed so many people, those people who did that will get it back, there are a lot of people nowadays from those times who reincarnated again, also there is a lot going on from older times and ages.
You seem to be placing a lot of emphasis on the bad karma that the West as a civilization attracted. Surely, the other positive things that western nations have done over the centuries (provided technology to less-developed nations, provided aid in times of need, implemeted vaccination programs) would counter-act the bad karma.
Also, wouldn't this way of thinking suggest that Muslims currently hold a lot of positive karma? Surely, for those who believe that the 9/11 attacks took place in the way the media suggest, the Muslims pissed away a lot of positive karma then, and by your way of thinking, transferred it to the west?
I'm hardly an expert when it comes to karma etc, but these are just some of my observations. I would be interested to hear what you think.
So in this way, I told the higher beings that they should kill me instead of him, I was extremely sensitive in that time and got messages even from running water, I heard the water talk in a sinister way
I don't mean to take the piss here, but have you undergone a thorough psychological examination recently? Your paranoia and hallucinations sound genuinely alarming.
Carôusoul
12-17-2009, 05:27 AM
Ok so we're all agreed then?
Nuke the middle east?
SkA_DaRk_Che
12-17-2009, 01:28 PM
@Soros,
Sorry I haven't answered to your posts yet, I have been a little preoccupied
and if I don't get around to answering in the next few days it might actually
be 2 weeks until I have Internet Access again.. just saying, I didn't forget.
At the time my focus is just elsewhere, but I do want to answer thoroughly.
No worries. Whenever you get the time go ahead and make your response. I'll follow suite shortly after;hopefully we can get a lively debate going on.
Looking forward to your reply. Cya then.
You seem to be placing a lot of emphasis on the bad karma that the West as a civilization attracted. Surely, the other positive things that western nations have done over the centuries (provided technology to less-developed nations, provided aid in times of need, implemeted vaccination programs) would counter-act the bad karma.
Also, wouldn't this way of thinking suggest that Muslims currently hold a lot of positive karma? Surely, for those who believe that the 9/11 attacks took place in the way the media suggest, the Muslims pissed away a lot of positive karma then, and by your way of thinking, transferred it to the west?
I'm hardly an expert when it comes to karma etc, but these are just some of my observations. I would be interested to hear what you think.
Well, I don't really know, the left winged politicians are still trying to promote Islam in the west so I think Muslims have a lot of karma to, at least, try to conquer the west, I had a dream the other day, September 15th 2009, in which I was witnessing a football game of Revelations of John, it was 6 - 1 and the Islam had won.
Then I looked up chapter 6 verse 1 of course because that is what the dream suggested and then I read about the four horses and, according to my dream, the white horse of conquest is gonna be Islam, so in that way they have this karma. They will be also the other horses, taking away the lives of so many people by war and so on.
Quote:
Originally Posted by erik http://www.dreamviews.com/community/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.dreamviews.com/community/showthread.php?p=1252451#post1252451)
So in this way, I told the higher beings that they should kill me instead of him, I was extremely sensitive in that time and got messages even from running water, I heard the water talk in a sinister way
I don't mean to take the piss here, but have you undergone a thorough psychological examination recently? Your paranoia and hallucinations sound genuinely alarming.
Hahaha, indeed I was paranoia but I had my senses together and knew what was going on at that time, these were not hallucinations, but genuine happenings, on one hand it was cool and on the other hand it was bizar, I was a prisoner of my thinking, although the thoughts were not really mine in those days.
nzguy
12-18-2009, 05:25 AM
Then I looked up chapter 6 verse 1 of course because that is what the dream suggested and then I read about the four horses and, according to my dream, the white horse of conquest is gonna be Islam, so in that way they have this karma. They will be also the other horses, taking away the lives of so many people by war and so on.
What makes you so sure that it will be Islam? I am sure there are plenty of people in the middle east who feel that the US-led wars in Afghanistan and Iraq have taken away a lot of civilian lives in needless violence.
I'm not saying that you're wrong, and I certainly do not want to start a political debate, but I guess your interpretation of the prophecy depends on your perspective.
Hahaha, indeed I was paranoia but I had my senses together and knew what was going on at that time, these were not hallucinations, but genuine happenings, on one hand it was cool and on the other hand it was bizar, I was a prisoner of my thinking, although the thoughts were not really mine in those days.
Ohk.
And if the thoughts were not your own... whose were they?
SkA_DaRk_Che
12-18-2009, 04:41 PM
Okay, there is karma, karma means that everything that you do will be followed by an equal reaction, so action-reaction, like the third law of Newton.
There is individual karma, karma for families and so on, karma exists also for nations and countries.
Since the west was so engaged in colonial activities starting from the 16th century and enslaved so many people, killed so many people, those people who did that will get it back, there are a lot of people nowadays from those times who reincarnated again, also there is a lot going on from older times and ages
I'm sorry but your beliefs are just merging New Age Bullshit with Pseudo Science.
So, if the West has accumulated bad karma over the centuries why are these societies so prosperous now a days? and by comparison why is Africa and Latin America, two continents which have been at the hilt of the West's so called colonialism not the most prosperous continents on earth and their nations the most wealthy and affluential ?
Or perhaps you would consider that your theories about karma and reincarnation are utter bullshit?
Nations and families have karma now? Not just individuals for their own actions? How does that work?
Where are you getting these mad theories from. Your beliefs seem to be New Ageism with a bizarre twist.
I don't want to insult you at all, but i think you may be suffering from some sort of Psychosis like Nz guy hinted at. If so, the sooner you get treatment the better because the worse this degenerates the less able you will be to make a recovery.
Quote:
Originally Posted by erik http://www.dreamviews.com/community/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.dreamviews.com/community/showthread.php?p=1253445#post1253445)
Then I looked up chapter 6 verse 1 of course because that is what the dream suggested and then I read about the four horses and, according to my dream, the white horse of conquest is gonna be Islam, so in that way they have this karma. They will be also the other horses, taking away the lives of so many people by war and so on.
What makes you so sure that it will be Islam? I am sure there are plenty of people in the middle east who feel that the US-led wars in Afghanistan and Iraq have taken away a lot of civilian lives in needless violence.
I'm not saying that you're wrong, and I certainly do not want to start a political debate, but I guess your interpretation of the prophecy depends on your perspective.
What makes me so sure it is Islam is that it appeared in my dream to be that way, so I think it will be Islam.
Quote:
Originally Posted by erik http://www.dreamviews.com/community/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.dreamviews.com/community/showthread.php?p=1253445#post1253445)
Hahaha, indeed I was paranoia but I had my senses together and knew what was going on at that time, these were not hallucinations, but genuine happenings, on one hand it was cool and on the other hand it was bizar, I was a prisoner of my thinking, although the thoughts were not really mine in those days.
Ohk.
And if the thoughts were not your own... whose were they?
I have to say that I was not so very paranoia, only in the beginning of the game which started on October 6th 2007, I have a dream from 2005, foretelling the events of that day, anyway, as you are not the body, you are also not the mind, the mind is a subtle covering of the soul, so the soul desires which gets translated into thoughts by the mind, sometimes we "know" what we are about to think, so there is knowledge in the soul.
As we are not the mind, it consists of different entities, I don't know who, but we are controlled by the Lord ultimately, and His agents.
Soros :
Quote:
Originally Posted by Erik
Okay, there is karma, karma means that everything that you do will be followed by an equal reaction, so action-reaction, like the third law of Newton.
There is individual karma, karma for families and so on, karma exists also for nations and countries.
Since the west was so engaged in colonial activities starting from the 16th century and enslaved so many people, killed so many people, those people who did that will get it back, there are a lot of people nowadays from those times who reincarnated again, also there is a lot going on from older times and ages
I'm sorry but your beliefs are just merging New Age Bullshit with Pseudo Science.
So, if the West has accumulated bad karma over the centuries why are these societies so prosperous now a days? and by comparison why is Africa and Latin America, two continents which have been at the hilt of the West's so called colonialism not the most prosperous continents on earth and their nations the most wealthy and affluential ?
Or perhaps you would consider that your theories about karma and reincarnation are utter bullshit?
Nations and families have karma now? Not just individuals for their own actions? How does that work?
Where are you getting these mad theories from. Your beliefs seem to be New Ageism with a bizarre twist.
I don't want to insult you at all, but i think you may be suffering from some sort of Psychosis like Nz guy hinted at. If so, the sooner you get treatment the better because the worse this degenerates the less able you will be to make a recovery.
Psychosis : any severe mental disorder in which contact with reality is lost or highly distorted
In those times I might have had a little psychosis, but what is reality ? There are different realities, we are now living in the gross physical reality, beyond all this are other realities, like subtle realities, where the subtle body goes in dreams and this is the realm where living entities from those realities make contact with ours.
Hey, ain't this a religion/SPIRITUALITY discussion, we are in this section, so spiritual talk is permitted here and you don't understand anything of spiritual things, it seems to me, like something new to you, family karma or karma for societies, tribes or whatever you get away with it in a rude way, but I will try to answer your questions.
The West, at this moment, is prosperous, but according to me, in the near future, we will have to face Islamic occupation, that's freaking bad karma, man !
Everybody has bad karma, so even Africa, with all his wars and massacres, God works in mysterious ways and if I could explain to you how it works, then I would be God, because I cannot explain this, everybody who did something wrong in a past life, will have to suffer the consequenses in a next life, maybe many Africans of today were the nazi's from yesterday, paying for their deeds.
Karma for nations, well, the Roman Empire emerged and fell down, that is something you can see as karma for nations.
What I am talking about is just spiritual mixed with the reality of today, we are facing Islamic conquest in the future altough it is difficult to see now cause the media is in control, although, yesterday I saw on Dutch television a news flash that Turkey doesn't allow Christians to build churches and that Christians are discriminated against there, so the media shows those things nowadays, it was a reaction about Turkey's statement about the Swiss minarets.
Anyway, I don't have a psychosis now, my thinking is clear and I am talking about what happened to me from October 2007 to December 2007 and around the end of 2008.
It was not a psychosis, I was just seeing and hearing things coming from different dimensions and I have no psychosis now !!!
And this can be discussed here, why not ?
SkA_DaRk_Che
12-21-2009, 08:47 PM
Perhaps you are right, that i know very little of spirituality and things of that sort, but what i do know is a bogus theory when i hear one.
There is no evidence for Karma at all. There is karma in a way. Say, I go to a restaurant and im a dick to the busboy or rude to the other staff. So they spit in my food there is an action (mine) and then there is a reaction (them spitting in my food).
That's a tangible action-reaction scenario.
What you are talking about is something completely intangible and furthermore: illogical.
If nations have their own "karma", then so do PTA associations, corporations, Eagle Scouts branches, and even (let's just say for laughs) brothels by your logic.
In a sense you can say that they do, the action-reaction scenario is sometimes played out with corporations for example, who abuse the locals and in turn they get driven out or lose their contracts.
What you're talking about is a complex web of reincarnation, "karma energy" and results.
The issue with the Islamization of Western europe is purely the result of liberal immigration policies and out of control political correctness.
If you tell me the Karma reincarnation cycle you are talking about is real, then i may ask you to simply provide some evidence for the existence of such a phenomenon.
Don't tell me what you know is true, tell me how you know it is true.
In this case, tell me how you know this karma reincarnation cycle stuff is real.
It was not a psychosis, I was just seeing and hearing things coming from different dimensions and I have no psychosis now !!!
lolz
Michael
12-22-2009, 10:30 AM
erik, i think the reason you had these "dreams", and "visions" is because you spend so much time filling your brain with these ideas and religious beliefs and nonsense, that you actually started believing that you yourself could be a prophet or some shit. Then, some thoughts and pictures popped up in your head and you were like O-M-G, I am being told things directly from god. This must be the truth because the fucking running water and my dreams told me so. Nostrodamus wrote down these vague statements and they can translate right into what I believe! amazing! some guy wrote down a story 5,000 years ago about islam taking over the world, so it just has to happen!!! western civilization is more powerful than eastern culture, so therefore the east must have better karma and therefore will conquer us.... The list goes on.... Your ideas are just ideas. There is nothing solid in your theory.
Plus, muslims and christians have always had major conflicts that will never be resolved until the religions dissapear and new religious beliefs take over the world. This is nothing new.
And if islam became the ruling religion one day, it isn't because of phrophecy, it's because they can't afford birth control and their population grew so huge that they could demolish us without weapons.... because until they have that many people, we fuckin own them.
ps: A lot of your ideas stem from several thousand year old paranormal beliefs... like reincarnation and demons and shit.... Get with the 21st century.
edit: just saw the shrooms in your avatar. maybe you should stop taking those. haha.
Don't tell me what you know is true, tell me how you know it is true.
In this case, tell me how you know this karma reincarnation cycle stuff is real.
Well, I can only give you examples, like the rise and fall of the Roman Empire, the Greek Civilization, The rise and fall of the Huns who almost conquered the Roman Empire, the rise and fall of the Saxon invaders in Great Brittain and there are so many more examples.
I first heard about karma for nations when I was in Rishikesh, India in 1998, Rishikesh is the yoga capital of the world and I learned yoga there.
I read this in a book written by Swami Sivananda or I heard it in a lecture from Swami Dharmananda, I don't remember.
But fact is that there is karma for nations, they rise and they fall, it's a cycle.
As far for reincarnation, I was always intriged by this fact and when I began to have realizations in dreams and through the medium of inner visions and thoughts, I knew that reincarnation was true.
But I cannot pursuade you that reincarnation is true, you have to find it out for yourself.
This happens to spiritual people, they find peace of mind and have realizations about their lives, I will give you a small account of what happened in a past life of me as a Templar Knight :
This happened to me in 2002 :
I was in Rishikesh, India for the 3rd time ( I am a yoga teacher and learned yoga there in 1998 and used to meditate on Shiva from 3 o'clock in the morning untill around 5 or 5.30. I did more yoga and I was in a receptive state.
When one day somewhere in november or october 2002 before I woke up, I or I had a dream. I was shown a peak inside the Akash chronicles (everything we think, feel, say or do is recorded in this subtle space, great yogi's can tab into this).
I was shown the following :
I saw a marketplace where everybody did their normal bussiness, it was a medieval marketplace, suddenly these people where under attack (I guess by muslims, i don't know for sure) and I witnessed a great slaughter among these people, blood etc....
The next scene was that I "floated" in the top of a wooden church, the woodcarvings were from extraordinary quality, i remembered to be in great joy seeing this. Then so many people fled or were driven into this church and the church, with the people inside where set on fire to burn to ashes.
Next scene and intuive knowledge where I was,I found myself in a prison camp in the desert.
This prison camp was divided into 2, one for the captivated Christians who were faithful to Christ, didn't want to convert to islam and were about to die by the sword.
The other side was for the Christians who agreed to fight with the muslims, I don't know if they had to convert or not.
Anyway, I was one of them who chose to fight with the muslims......but I did this in order to escape !!
So I must have had a plan.
Then I saw myself exchanging notes with fellow prisoners from, I think, the other side, just to let them know I was not a lowlife traitor, but I did this to escape and I might have invited some of them to go with me ( I learned later, by reading books on the Templars that it was quite out of the ordinary for a Templar to read and write, so I must have been a high ranking Templar).
So I was getting trained (this side was a trainings camp) to join the fight together with the muslims.
There was a muslim who had the task to guard me and my comrades ( I was not the only one who decided to join them). I had the strong impression that I had made friends with him.
The next thing I clearly saw, was that it was night and the muslim guard was suspicious, he looked through a round hole in his wooden door ( I saw this from the inside of his room) to oversee the prisoners ( he might have had some kind of knowledge of us escaping, a Godfeeling) and then I saw myself blowing my breath over the palm of my right hand into his face, he got tired and retired to his bed to get some sleep ( so I must have possessed some magic powers, cause I might have been out of my body doing this, I don't know).
So I opened up the door and took his shoes (sandals) with me, leaving the door open. I think I did this just to screw him one way or another, like proving my wickedness or sense of superiority towards him.
We had to hurry up ( I was not alone) and the next segment I still don't understand, that's why I think it must have been a dream, although i clearly felt that I was taken out of my body and when this all finished, I was gently brought back to my body.)
So we were in a hurry and then we run to a cave complex, we had balloons of all kinds of colors, purple, red, orange in our hands and with this, we floated into the caves downwards until we reached a cave where we got out ( I know, it sounds weird, I was not on drugs or so, again, I really don't understand this scene).
So we got out and entered a magical scene, a huge Cathedral was there to welcome us, we were so happy and relieved, I saw my men kneeling down before the Cathedral and then I saw that they wore white gowns with red crosses on the back ( I read in a book that I bought last year, that the Pope at that time ordered to sow a red cross on the back of the gowns, this was ordered in 1147, that's why i know this all happened after 1147).
One more thing, later I got through that I was a married and later joined the Templars, so that is called a confrater.
This is just a little part of my life as a Templar Knight, later I found out what happened with the prison guard, who he was and many more things about this life.
Anyway, even with this I cannot convince you of the fact that reincarnation exists, you must be a believer or not, simple !! And prove I cannot give you, others might be able to do so.
Michael,
edit: just saw the shrooms in your avatar. maybe you should stop taking those. haha
I love this socalled relgious nonsense you're talking about, I am very much into Vedic texts although I don't read that much, maybe it's where I get these inner visions from but they don't deal with muslims, they deal with ancient Indian stories, from India.
To be frankly, I don't know why the creatures up want me to know these things, I am surely not a prophet, or not even a small one, I am seeing these things for a reason and you don't have to believe me of course.
Anyway, we are facing Islamization and that's a real threat, not my inner visions and so on, that's just interesting.
Soros wrote :
The issue with the Islamization of Western europe is purely the result of liberal immigration policies and out of control political correctness.
I agree with you as this is clearly the case, but I am going further, the left winged politicians are selling us out here, they promote Islam deliberately and I am sure that the liberal immigration and political correctness are both "part of the plan", here in The Netherlands somebody said in the eighties that Holland is full : "Full is full", he said. Man, you should have seen and hear the reactions of the left, he was a rascist and a fascist and a neo nazi and so on, this is what they do nowadays as well, if someone is trying to oppose their plans.
This is how it is and will be if the left gets what it wants, namely Islamization of Western Europe and America.
Lucid_boy
12-27-2009, 07:43 PM
So, Erik, what about the holocaust? Was that all just bad jewish karma? Was the slaughter of 20 million people the result of the bad karma of europe? What had they done to incur this karma?
SkA_DaRk_Che
12-27-2009, 08:23 PM
So, Erik, what about the holocaust? Was that all just bad jewish karma? Was the slaughter of 20 million people the result of the bad karma of europe? What had they done to incur this karma?
Actually, the holocaust is estimated to be at about 12 million.
Also don't forget the millions of non jewish civilians who died during the war.
50 million people died during that war, a good junk of them were non combatants and non jews.
Originally Posted by Lucid_boy http://www.dreamviews.com/community/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.dreamviews.com/community/showthread.php?p=1264582#post1264582)
So, Erik, what about the holocaust? Was that all just bad jewish karma? Was the slaughter of 20 million people the result of the bad karma of europe? What had they done to incur this karma?
Well, what I know is that everything happens for a reason, the fact that an estimated 6 million Jews were murdered during the war, well, this you can call karma, if I get a bullet in my head tomorrow then it is karma.
Sometimes people speak of innocent lives being lost, but I don't know if they were so innocent by the means and workings of karma, please don't try to attack me because of this, but I will try to explain what karma is and try to explain the different types of karma :
Meaning & Significance of Karma
Karma is a Sanskrit word springing from the root “Kri” - “to do” or “to make” or more simply, “action”. The deeper meaning of Karma can be described as an infinite chain of the results of action that is perceived and performed. Karma is a concept of wisdom, based on the Ancient Vedas and Upanishads, which explains a system where beneficial events are derived from past beneficial actions and harmful events from past harmful actions, creating a chain of actions and reactions throughout a person's reincarnated lives.
When we talk about “Our Karma” we’re talking about the actions we’ve “sown” or performed in the past (including our past lives) that are the cause of what we “reap” in our current life situation. This either becomes our Karmic Burden or Karmic Baggage or our Karmic Blessing depending on whether we’ve performed positive or negative actions in the past.
Every action, either physical, emotional or mental, every movement occurring either on the plane of gross matter (Sthoolam) or on the astral planes (Sookshma), causes an emission of Energy. In other words, it produces a Seed.
Being a Seed, Karma fructifies or does not fructify immediately after it is sown. The innumerable Karmic Seeds we produce by our various actions - desire, aversion, love, hatred, happiness, etc. will undoubtedly produce, sooner or later, a positive or negative result according to the nature of the seed, if not in this life, then in some future one.
The Vedas propound, “Here they say that a person consists of desires. And as is his desire, so is his will. As is his will, so is his deed. Whatever deed he does, that he will reap.”
Karma should not be confused with Fate. Fate is the notion that man’s life is preplanned for him by some external power, and he has no control over his destiny. Karma on the other hand, can be corrected. Because man is a Conscious Being and he can be aware of his Karma and thus strive to change the course of events, with the help of superior powers.
Four Types of Karma
Karma is primarily of four kinds :
1. Sanchita Karma (Sum Total Karma or "Accumulated actions" or the Arrows in the Quiver)
Sanchita Karma is the vast store of piled-up Karma accumulated in the preceding and in all other previous births and yet to be resolved. In other words, it is the aggregate sum of yet unseen Karmas committed during innumerable previous existences. This is your total cosmic debt. Every moment of your every day, you are either adding to it or you are reducing this cosmic debt. It is waiting to be fulfilled in your future births. So unless and until the Sanchita Karma of a Soul is zeroed, it keeps on birthing in new physical bodies, in order to exhaust it's balance Sanchita Karma.
2. Praarabdha Karma (Fructifying Karma or "Actions began; set in motion" or Arrows in Flight)
That portion of the Sanchita Karma destined to influence human life in one or the present incarnation is called Praarabdha. In other words, Praarabdha Karma is Karmic Template (of that portion of Sanchita Karma) that is ripe enough to be experienced by you and alloted for this lifetime for you to work on. If you work down your agreed upon debt in this lifetime, then more past debts will surface to be worked on. And that much Sanchita Karma gets dissolved.
3. Kriyamana Karma (Instant, Current Karma or "Being made" or Arrows in Hand)
Kriyamana Karma is the daily, instant Karma created in this lifetime and that we create in our life because of our free actions. It refers to those which are currently in front of us to decide or act on. This contributes to our Future Karma in a big way. They can also be worked off immediately. These are debts that are created and worked off - i.e. for example, you park your vehicle in a 'No Parking Space', you get caught and you are fined (punished) immediately.
While some Kriyamana Karmas bear fruit in the current life, others are stored for enjoying in future births. Thus the Kriyamana Karma is classified into two sub-categories: Arabdha Karma - literally, ‘begun, undertaken;’ the Karma that is ‘sprouting’- and Anarabdha Karma - ‘not commenced; dormant’ or ‘The Seed Karma’. An example : two persons committ a theft and one of them get caught - Arabdha Karma - and the other one got away - Anarabdha Karma. The thief who got caught, immediately starts to feel the effect of the cause or the reaction to his action; he gets caught and goes to jail. The other robber who escaped, will have to experience, in this life or in a future one, the effect of this wrongful action.
4. Aagami Karma (Future Karma)
Aagami Karma is the Karmic Map that is coming, as a result of the merits and demerits of the present actions of your current birth. In other words, it is the portion of Karma that is created because of the actions in the present life and that will be added to your Sanchita Karma. If you fail to work off your debt, then more debts are added to Sanchita Karma and they become more Karmic Seeds and are served to you in more future lives.
In Vedantic Literature, there is a beautiful analogy. The Archer has already sent an arrow and it has left his hands. He cannot recall it. He is about to shoot another arrow. The bundle of arrows in the quiver on his back is the Sanchita Karma; the arrow he has shot is Praarabdha Karma; and the arrow which he is about to shoot from his bow is Kriyamana Karma. The result of the arrow that he is about to shoot is the Aagami Karma.
Here is a modern example : You go on a motor bike ride and get into an accident. The accident is your Praarabdha Karma – your allotted Karma for this life out of the entire Sanchita Karma of your Soul. To bandage the wound in order to minimize your suffering would be your Kriyamana Karma. To set an intention to be more careful in the future would be your Aagami Karma. To buy a bike light and reflectors in order to avoid future accidents would also be your Kriyamana Karma.
Catbus
01-01-2010, 01:20 PM
Well, what I know is that everything happens for a reason, the fact that an estimated 6 million Jews were murdered during the war, well, this you can call karma, if I get a bullet in my head tomorrow then it is karma.
... So what exactly did they do to deserve that?
Wel... I don't know since I am not God so I don't have acces to their karma, I guess they all did something terribly wrong in a past life, otherwise how can you explain something like this.
Sometimes I am thinking and pondering about the fact that everything is predestined, then I think about if there is really no coincendence and innocent victims of terrorist attacks, genocide, murders and robbery for instance.
Because the law of karma doesn't allow any innocent creature to be killed just like that, is my belief.
Would there be innocent victims, does something like that exist ?
But then that means that God is not just and righteous, because He allows innocent people to get killed or some other bad luck come over them, so you see my point ?
I like how when he asked you to explain how the Jews deserved the holocaust using your idea of karma, you just gave him a copy-pasted wall of text without linking it to Jews whatsoever.
Actually, no.
I don't like that at all.
Because the law of karma doesn't allow any innocent creature to be killed just like that, is my belief.
Would there be innocent victims, does something like that exist ?Newborn children death.
But then that means that God is not just and righteous, because He allows innocent people to get killed or some other bad luck come over them, so you see my point ? Yup. If a moral God exists, he'd be one callous motherfucker.
Alsooooo, there is no God.
I like how when he asked you to explain how the Jews deserved the holocaust using your idea of karma, you just gave him a copy-pasted wall of text without linking it to Jews whatsoever.
Actually, no.
I don't like that at all.
You see, I didn't write that Jews deserved to die, I wrote that they might had done something terrible in past lives to deserve it and that is something completely different.
And I am not such a yogi that can look into the Akashi Chronicles and see for myself what those people did that made them being killed in WOII.
I am not God so I cannot anwer that question why the Jews died in WOII.
That's impossible for me.
OuroborosEterna
01-05-2010, 09:21 PM
You see, I didn't write that Jews deserved to die, I wrote that they might had done something terrible in past lives to deserve it and that is something completely different.
And I am not such a yogi that can look into the Akashi Chronicles and see for myself what those people did that made them being killed in WOII.
I am not God so I cannot anwer that question why the Jews died in WOII.
That's impossible for me.
Your first paragraph contradicts itself. How is deserving to die because of past life sins any different than deserving to die? Also, are the Nazis then absolved of any responsibility on account of acting as the Universe's karmic police force? If not, wouldn't that just create a negative karmic feedback loop?
Ok. The karma debate is a little pointless in my opinion,.. so.. yeah.
I will just respond to Soros, because I said I would.
Well, it's not just culture. The places these people where basically just imported from post world war II were often poor village areas, often mountainous, isolated. Not much education or literacy etc. They weren't exactly cosmopolitan in perspective and that translated, partly, to the failed integration of Europe's muslims.
Culture is a wide term though. A non-cosmopolitan way of life is part of
ones culture in my opinion (especially if it is the fact for most), but I see
your point. And I recognize that you know more about the issue on
integration, I haven't particularly focused on this part. (There is a lot
you can focus your information-seeking on, so.. this didn't appear to
be as urgent an issue to me as others).
By the way, in many Islamic Societies religion and culture are extremely intertwined, to the point where the lines blur much more so then in America or Europe.
Europe is not a very religious place in the sense that noone really takes it
that serious or devotes their lifes to it (that much). In fact I think it is a little
odd for many to see others actually taking their beliefs seriously.
While in America and Europe religion and culture are not as interwined as
in other areas, there are other things that our lifes revolve around that have
become big parts of our culture, for example our whole system runs on consumption.
In my opinion a lot of our economical basis is based on a few beliefs as well,
not always rational or very well thought through.
What media bias are you talking about? Most of the media doesn't even talk about these issues at all or if they do, they water the arguments down considerably to avoid offending muslims. I even get the impression some media personalities are scared of doing so since the issues that happened with the Danish Cartoons.
I can't even remember the last time the Danish Cartoon thing was an issue.
Anyway, I read our media very critically and try to get many different sources,
but also make my own experiences.
Whenever I read about anything that has to do with Islam, it is something
negative. It's a case of a husband throwing acid in the wife's face, it's about
terrorism, it's about integrational problems, something negative.
The way it is presented (one of the reasons I resent the mainstream media)
is, it's always emotional, colours are used to underline the 'threat' and
the most 'shocking' phrases are singled out. I find it very hard to see
any objectivity in news-making these days (not that there ever was).
This has not been my experiences with people of the muslim belief and
I have had a bunch of conversations (mostly while or through travelling)
with people, who also had very different insights. For example my mother
has recently been to Iran and it was interesting to hear what she told me
about the people. One woman said: 'If the American's only knew they had
70million friends here'. Of course this is a little bit of a 'blue-eyed' statement,
but it leads me to the point that a population is not their government and
singled out, often emotional reports are painting just the negative picture
many people have in their heads. Not so much time ago it had been the
Jews, or the blacks. Anti-Islamism is no different, only that it is actually
somewhat socially accepted now, as the others were years back.
Another example was a muslim gathering in a somewhat political sense,
in which the speaker repeatedly 'preached' to be tolerant, to be accepting,
to be peaceful. This was in indonesia.
I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree.
I guess.
I don't see a certain way of living is more right than another (not implying
that you do), but I don't think it must be the goal of every country to become
industrial for example. It is a sad fact that one has to, in a globalized world,
in order to not get bullied, or that makes you 'interesting to the big leaders',
but it doesn't make another way wrong. This just generally speaking.. anyway.
I think that this, again, might be more of a problem of political leaders opressing
people in the name of the Islam. Many Iranians, who believe in Muhammed,
etc, would want to live much more freely (alcohol, headscarf) but are forbidden
to do so. In this case, it's not the Islam in my opinion that is the problem, but
a closed-minded execution of an extreme version of a religion forced upon the
people, not because of the spirituality in it, but in order to gain control.
In regards to which conflict?
While to me i see the religious factor in Afghanistan and Pakistan as being huge and probably understated to be honest.
In regards to Afghanistan. I believe that a lot has been manufactured
(not in a conspiracy sense, but in a manufacturing of content). Like I
think I said before, the reasons for the responses of the extremists are
much more connected to the US foreign policies than they are to religious
beliefs. In an earlier post I linked two lectures by Noam Chomsky adressing
this problem - since I will never be able to persuade them in a manner as
he did, please let him do the explaining in order to understand where I'm
coming from. :-) I would be happy if you took the time.
although, i will mention that the stuff that happened in SE asia and Central America was a product of the cold war environment and the necessity to stop the spread of communism.
Which is the official version, but as so often, not the correct one. I have a book
(again by Chomsky, but he is in my opinion the best source for certain foreign
policies) on this particular problem, but I don't have it here right now. When
I do, I will give you some sources that would suggest different explanations.
I can't do that off the top of my head.
But the domino theory (similar to the one in middle america) is more of a
pretense to persuade the general public into wars that have much more so
an economical background and are a way to stabilize a nations power on a
global scale (which the US and colonial countries in Europe always trie/d hard
to do). Many times this was done without having to go to war, but if other
means fail, this is the last option and it is used. The reasons nevertheless
are usually (I like to argue almost always) different than publicly proposed.
Carôusoul
01-06-2010, 08:17 AM
You see, I didn't write that Jews deserved to die, I wrote that they might had done something terrible in past lives to deserve it and that is something completely different.
And I am not such a yogi that can look into the Akashi Chronicles and see for myself what those people did that made them being killed in WOII.
I am not God so I cannot anwer that question why the Jews died in WOII.
That's impossible for me.
The jews died in World War 2 because of human beings.
Not because of a cosmic plan, not because of karma, not because of God, not because of natural order, not because of punishment, not because of spiritual ascendancy.
They died because human beings are capable of committing great evil upon one another. That's why. This isn't ambiguous or up for debate.
You can create as many nice ideas, religions and fairy lands as you like to escape the brutal reality of this world, but at the end of the day you're just trying to escape from reality, like a coward.
And to be honest it's pretty sad, sick, offensive and ignorant of you to try and suggest what you are.
Catbus
01-07-2010, 03:05 PM
Because the law of karma doesn't allow any innocent creature to be killed just like that, is my belief.
http://www.infinitedata.net/~tomo/harlequin5.jpg
Apparently, this baby wasn't innocent at all.
SkA_DaRk_Che
01-07-2010, 08:06 PM
.
I can't even remember the last time the Danish Cartoon thing was an issue.
Anyway, I read our media very critically and try to get many different sources,
but also make my own experiences.
http://worldnews.about.com/b/2010/01/02/danish-cartoonist-escapes-murder-attempt.htm
Well, recently a Somali man with connections to Al-Shabbah (the Somali equivilant of the Taliban) tried to murder one of the Danish cartoonist. He was apparently weilding an ax and a knife when he broke into his house.
Whenever I read about anything that has to do with Islam, it is something
negative. It's a case of a husband throwing acid in the wife's face, it's about
terrorism, it's about integrational problems, something negative.
The way it is presented (one of the reasons I resent the mainstream media)
is, it's always emotional, colours are used to underline the 'threat' and
the most 'shocking' phrases are singled out. I find it very hard to see
any objectivity in news-making these days (not that there ever was).
I agree that the media is very sensationalist, not just with issues on Islam. But most of the media that i sample goes out of their way not to insult Islam especially when covering terrorism. They try and take away the Islam factor when talking about religion (so as to be PC and not insult muslims). I know there are many others that do not do this, but many in the Main Stream Media do this nonetheless.
This has not been my experiences with people of the muslim belief and
I have had a bunch of conversations (mostly while or through travelling)
with people, who also had very different insights. For example my mother
has recently been to Iran and it was interesting to hear what she told me
about the people. One woman said: 'If the American's only knew they had
70million friends here'. Of course this is a little bit of a 'blue-eyed' statement,
but it leads me to the point that a population is not their government and
singled out, often emotional reports are painting just the negative picture
many people have in their heads.
Not so much time ago it had been the
Jews, or the blacks. Anti-Islamism is no different, only that it is actually
somewhat socially accepted now, as the others were years back.
Well, black or Jewish organizations were not plotting to cause mayhem and havoc in cities to the innocent populace. While i agree about your points about the majority of muslims being basically just normal people(most of my relatives are muslims actually), there is still problems with Islamism in these countries and the organizations that thrive within them.
Not long ago, i heard an interview with a former member of Al-Shabbah, the somali islamist organization i heard and it was a big turning point for me. Basically, the Al-Shabbah soldiers were told that their plans were to take over surrounding non muslim areas of Africa, then take over the wider non muslim world (West). This was a big turning point for me, since before then i thought the criticisms against Islam were basically propaganda and neo-con bullshit. Although, i am by no means a neo con and i think that the manifest destiny is really a disguised form of Corporate imperialism.
I don't see a certain way of living is more right than another (not implying
that you do), but I don't think it must be the goal of every country to become
industrial for example. It is a sad fact that one has to, in a globalized world,
in order to not get bullied, or that makes you 'interesting to the big leaders',
but it doesn't make another way wrong. This just generally speaking.. anyway.
ya man. This is a dog eat dog world. But it's always been that way, far before globalization.
I think that this, again, might be more of a problem of political leaders opressing
people in the name of the Islam. Many Iranians, who believe in Muhammed,
etc, would want to live much more freely (alcohol, headscarf) but are forbidden
to do so. In this case, it's not the Islam in my opinion that is the problem, but
a closed-minded execution of an extreme version of a religion forced upon the
people, not because of the spirituality in it, but in order to gain control.
Agree with you here as well.
In regards to Afghanistan. I believe that a lot has been manufactured
(not in a conspiracy sense, but in a manufacturing of content). Like I
think I said before, the reasons for the responses of the extremists are
much more connected to the US foreign policies than they are to religious
beliefs. In an earlier post I linked two lectures by Noam Chomsky adressing
this problem - since I will never be able to persuade them in a manner as
he did, please let him do the explaining in order to understand where I'm
coming from. :-) I would be happy if you took the time.
Which is the official version, but as so often, not the correct one. I have a book
(again by Chomsky, but he is in my opinion the best source for certain foreign
policies) on this particular problem, but I don't have it here right now. When
I do, I will give you some sources that would suggest different explanations.
I can't do that off the top of my head.
But the domino theory (similar to the one in middle america) is more of a
pretense to persuade the general public into wars that have much more so
an economical background and are a way to stabilize a nations power on a
global scale (which the US and colonial countries in Europe always trie/d hard
to do). Many times this was done without having to go to war, but if other
means fail, this is the last option and it is used. The reasons nevertheless
are usually (I like to argue almost always) different than publicly proposed.[/QUOTE]
Ok, I think we both made our points on the threat of the Islam.
The reason why I don't buy into the scary speeches is that I will
not be able to tell if the translation wasn't misleading or that they
have not been staged altogether (like the killing babies in Irak
thing or many of the flag-burning incidents). I'm sure there are
some extremist, but I just don't see an unproportional threat.
But as you've said before, we can just agree to disagree.
On a different note, I am very pleased about the peaceful way of the
conversation of this indeed very hot topic. It was fun! Thanks.
:)
SkA_DaRk_Che
01-09-2010, 05:27 PM
Just a quick note. I couldn't reply to all of your post yesterday, so i finished the rest here. Part of it got snubbed and what not and it came out kinda mangled because of the quote lines.
Ok, I think we both made our points on the threat of the Islam.
The reason why I don't buy into the scary speeches is that I will
not be able to tell if the translation wasn't misleading or that they
have not been staged altogether (like the killing babies in Irak
thing or many of the flag-burning incidents). I'm sure there are
some extremist, but I just don't see an unproportional threat.
But as you've said before, we can just agree to disagree.
I see your point, you are not sure wether the "threat" of islam are just smoke and mirrors used by politicians to further a political agenda or a legitimate issue?
Well, i agree with you in some way. I think the threat of terrorism is way overblown,and statistically thousands thousands more people die everyear of cancer,road accidents, biking accidents,murders etc than terrorism. That's not the threat i see Islam has. I agree with your points about a lot of it being just scary speeches and political BS to get votes and all that.
But the threat Islam poses is more ideological. Just to clarify:
The type of things Islamic leaders in Western Countries preach, the attitudes young muslims have towards their countries of birth have is much more dangerous. In the PC environment that allows shari'ah law to be practiced in britain for example, this can be very bad and very decisive and sets a bad precedent for other immigrants . They might think they can/should assert their religious/cultural identities in the same way muslims do instead of integrating fully into the host society and abiding by its laws (instead of using their own religious laws to be ruled by in the countries they immigrate to).
On a different note, I am very pleased about the peaceful way of the
conversation of this indeed very hot topic. It was fun! Thanks.
Ya, weird huh? Aren't islam/middle east topics supposed to degenerate into name calling and then the apposing interlocutors comparing each other's opinions to hitler and nazism?
but ya lol, it's been fun.
In regards to Afghanistan. I believe that a lot has been manufactured
(not in a conspiracy sense, but in a manufacturing of content). Like I
think I said before, the reasons for the responses of the extremists are
much more connected to the US foreign policies than they are to religious
beliefs. In an earlier post I linked two lectures by Noam Chomsky adressing
this problem - since I will never be able to persuade them in a manner as
he did, please let him do the explaining in order to understand where I'm
coming from. :-) I would be happy if you took the time.
Which is the official version, but as so often, not the correct one. I have a book
(again by Chomsky, but he is in my opinion the best source for certain foreign
policies) on this particular problem, but I don't have it here right now. When
I do, I will give you some sources that would suggest different explanations.
I can't do that off the top of my head.
I'm glad that you mentioned the foreign policies issue. I am not denying that many of the causes of Islamic Extremism are tied to actual foreign policies rather than just fundamentalism for the sake of fundamentalism. But the point you are missing here is the way the frustrations with foreign policy are being channeled. Islamic Extremists are channeling this resentment of the effects of US and other western foreign policy in the form of recruitment for terrorism and militant groups. They use these foreign policies as reason(s) for their...for lack of a better word their religious propaganda which asserts that the west is fighting a modern day crusade against the Islamic World.
While many of the grievances are in fact real, the way they are being channeled is completely counter productive to helping the people they are claiming to try to help and is really just an excuse for a religious agenda these people would have had anyways and which they would have justified in other ways (simply to reach their intended goals).
I'll look for your posts about Noam Chomsky by the way and see about watching the video. I've done some reading on him in the past, and watched some youtube videos of him too, seems like he knows what hes talking about.
But the domino theory (similar to the one in middle america) is more of a pretense to persuade the general public into wars that have much more so an economical background and are a way to stabilize a nations power on a
global scale (which the US and colonial countries in Europe always trie/d hard
to do). Many times this was done without having to go to war, but if other
means fail, this is the last option and it is used. The reasons nevertheless
are usually (I like to argue almost always) different than publicly proposed.
I think the domino theory was a valid one in the context of the cold war era. Communism was an ideology which advocated "world wide" revolution and the spread of thereof was a real danger to democracy and to Nato countries. More soviet satellites weren't exactly a good thing.
That said, i totally understand what you mean about the economical nature of US intervention, especially in the cold war era. It's not secret that many US interventions which were under the pretext of halting the spread of communism had primary if not entirely economic pretexts while the publicly advertised one was "to stop communism". I guess that was a conflict of interest situation?
But i think the issues as they are publicly proposed are a bit 2 dimensional, in that they present only one face of the situation. I'm sure the iran-contra affair for example had the urgency of anti-soviet intervention with it, but at the same time it had an economic motivation which was unacceptable to the public and could not therefore be presented to them. I'm not gonna deny this stuff.
Ouroboruseterna :
Your first paragraph contradicts itself. How is deserving to die because of past life sins any different than deserving to die? Also, are the Nazis then absolved of any responsibility on account of acting as the Universe's karmic police force? If not, wouldn't that just create a negative karmic feedback loop?
Okay, I see what you mean, so let me refrase this, I wrote :
You see, I didn't write that Jews deserved to die, I wrote that they might had done something terrible in past lives to deserve it and that is something completely different.
It was the plan of God that the Jews died in WOII, everything happens for a reason, God knew that the Jews who died in WOII did something wrong in past lives, so therefore He did sent the nazi's to the Jews, otherwise I have to accept that killings and murder and diseases are random and can happen to innocent people as well.
I can't accept this because I believe in the perfect being called God, He would never allow His children to get killed or so whenever they are innocent.
Carousoul :
The jews died in World War 2 because of human beings.
Not because of a cosmic plan, not because of karma, not because of God, not because of natural order, not because of punishment, not because of spiritual ascendancy.
They died because human beings are capable of committing great evil upon one another. That's why. This isn't ambiguous or up for debate.
You can create as many nice ideas, religions and fairy lands as you like to escape the brutal reality of this world, but at the end of the day you're just trying to escape from reality, like a coward.
And to be honest it's pretty sad, sick, offensive and ignorant of you to try and suggest what you are.
I suppose you are an atheist ?
You just don't seem to get it, huh ?
Soros and Dajo :
I see your point, you are not sure wether the "threat" of islam are just smoke and mirrors used by politicians to further a political agenda or a legitimate issue?
Well, i agree with you in some way. I think the threat of terrorism is way overblown,and statistically thousands thousands more people die everyear of cancer,road accidents, biking accidents,murders etc than terrorism. That's not the threat i see Islam has. I agree with your points about a lot of it being just scary speeches and political BS to get votes and all that.
But the threat Islam poses is more ideological.
Different divisions of the world have existed in Islamic religion and culture.The idea of divisions was suggested by Imam Abu Hanifa (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abu_Hanifa). Some are geo-political divisions that are derived from non-Qu'ranic traditions in Islamic culture (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_culture). These conventions delineate several divisions of the world called "Houses" or "Dar" - literally "place" in Arabic. Other geographic divisions of the world are described in the Qur'an (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qur%27an).
Dar al-Islam (house/abode of Islam; or Dar as-Salam, house/abode of Peace; or Dar al-Tawhid, house/abode of Union) is a term used by Muslim scholars (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ulema) to refer to those countries where Muslims can practice their religion freely. These are usually Islamic cultures wherein Muslims represent the majority of the population, and so the government promises them protection. Most Dar al-Islam areas are surrounded by other Islamic societies to ensure public protection.
Muslim scholars maintain that the labeling of a country or place as being a part of Dar al-Islam revolves around the question of religious security. This means that if a Muslim practices Islam freely in his place of abode despite that the place happens to be secular or un-Islamic, then he will be considered as living in the Dar al-Islam.
Dar al-Islam is also known and referred to as Dar al-Salam (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dar_al-Salam), or house/abode of Peace. The term appears in the Koran (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Koran) in 10.25 an 6.127 as a name of Paradise (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jannah).
According to Abu Hanifa, considered to be the originator of the concept, the two requirements for a country to be part of Dar al-Islam are :
Muslims must be able to enjoy peace and security with and within this country.
It has common frontiers with some Muslim countries.If the former does not apply then physical means such as Jihad (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jihad) can be used to correct the situation and in the latter case, individuals are required to do hijra (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hijra) to where they can practice their religion.
Dar al-Harb ("house of war"; also referred to as Dar al-Garb "house of the West" in later Ottoman (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ottoman_Turkish_language) sources; a person from "Dar al-Harb" is a "harbi") is a term classically referring to those countries where the Muslim law is not in force, in the matter of worship (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ibadah) and the protection of the faithful (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslim#Muslim_and_mu.27min) and Dhimmis (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dhimma). Territories that do have a treaty of nonaggression or peace with Muslims are called dar al-ahd or dar al-sulh.
The term refers to the relationship between an Islamic state and neighbouring non-Muslim states with whom it has not signed a peace treaty or pact.
In Reliance of the Traveller (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Umdat_al-Salik_wa_Uddat_al-Nasik), point w43.2, a hadith is referred to containing the exact word Dar al-Harb. Scholars have, nevertheless, disagreed on its reliability as is commented in Reliance of the Traveller.
Dar al-Kufr (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kafir) ("house/domain of disbelief") is a term used by Muhammad (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammad) to refer to the Quraish (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quraish)-dominated society of Mecca (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mecca) between his flight to Medina (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hijra_(Islam)) and his triumphant return (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conquest_of_Mecca).
For much of Islamic history (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_history), the preferred term used to describe non-Islamic societies has been dar al-Harb (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Divisions_of_the_world_in_Islam#Dar_al-Harb), emphasizing various Islamic countries' aspirations to conquer such territories and render them part of dar al-Islam.
A traditional Arabic saying attributed to Muhammad goes: "Unbelief is one community (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ummah)", or in other words, "infidels are of one nation", can be taken as expressing the view that distinctions between different types of non-Muslims are insignificant in relation to the overriding distinction between Muslim and non-Muslim. A more sound interpretation of this statement bases itself on the fact that the Qur'an and the Prophet himself treated the polythiests of Arabia, the People of the Book and the rest of the religions differently. The first group did not enjoy the right to live in Arabia after the Qur'an claimed that the truth was made clear to them and they rejected it only due to arrogance. The second group and also the third were allowed the right to live but as submugated humble people, paying a tax called jizyah. This means that not all the religions are equal. They are equal only being non-Muslims. The Prophetic statement should therefore be taken to refer only to the obvious fact that being non-Muslims all are another party.
Carôusoul
01-15-2010, 11:53 PM
Carousoul :
I suppose you are an atheist ?
You just don't seem to get it, huh ?
Oh you sure told me.
I'm going to stop responding to you now because there is a threshold of ignorance I just can't bear to the point of being offended and disgusted, and you fall well below it.
A Roxxor
01-17-2010, 05:35 PM
I believe in the perfect being called God, He would never allow His children to get killed or so whenever they are innocent
http://www.healthofchildren.com/images/gech_0001_0003_0_img0203.jpg
Hypothesis: discredited. Would you like to try again?
Hypothesis: discredited. Would you like to try again?
Well, I don't believe that innocent people, who did nothing wrong in past lives and in this life will be murdered or get a disease or so, but since we are all living on Earth, so a place of repeated birth and death (reincarnation), and with disease and old age, I personally think only people who have karma to work out in this life will be subjective to all the bad and good things on the planet, otherwise we wouldn't be here, but we would be in the spiritual worlds which are eternal, blissful and karma free.
Mmm, that makes me remember that only souls who worked out their karma would be in the spiritual skies, but that would be too easy, I guess, because our desires and attachments bring us to the mortal material worlds again.
Yeah, when do we move from the material worlds of gross matter to the spiritual worlds, which are eternal abodes ?
Is it when we have transcended all our desires or when we put ourselves into the service of the Lord, that we get a ticket to the worlds beyond heaven.
And one more thing comes to mind, we suppose to have free will in the material worlds, so if somebody would want to do something bad to a person, he/she has the opportunity to choose to do that or not, suppose that the innocent victim in question has no bad karma and would be having a good life without difficulties, and yet, something terrible happens to him/her because some other person uses his/her free will to do bad to him/her, then the evil that comes over the innocent person inflicted by the bad person will be translated into bad karma for the evil doer.
Not only that, the evil doer has to undergo the consequenses of his/her actions, this life or the next or more into the future.
But what about the innocent person ?
He/she supposedly didn't deserve to be treated badly, and it was not the plan of God.......
Now we are entering "confusion land" because I really don't know if it was predestined that something bad would come over the innocent person or that it was the abuse of free will by the evil doer.
This would make a interesting discussion....but as I pointed out, I believe in the perfection of God.
Then another thing, if bad events happen, whether it be a terror attack or a natural disaster, who can we hold responsible, since everything that happens is under control of God....
God or ourselves ?
I mean, did we do bad things in our past lives or this one to deserve misfortune, executed by a terror attack or natural disasters, like recently in Haiti.
If that is the case then the terrorists wil have to pay for their deeds in future lives or this life, but what about when natural disasters happen ?
Would we hold the agents of God responsible and what will be their karma ?
Oh, I believe in Gods and Goddesses.
It's a tricky subject....
A Roxxor
01-18-2010, 10:14 AM
Ok, cool.
So like, none of that is supported by any evidence or observations and quite frankly it just doesn't make any sense. You're just saying things without backing them up really.
Care to try one more time?
EDIT: What I want to know is how innocence is judged anyway. How is an undeveloped fetus not innocent? Why would it deserve to die without ever experiencing life? How do you reconcile christianity and reincarnation?
Catbus
01-18-2010, 10:31 AM
Well, I don't believe that innocent people, who did nothing wrong in past lives and in this life will be murdered or get a disease or so, but since we are all living on Earth, so a place of repeated birth and death (reincarnation), and with disease and old age, I personally think only people who have karma to work out in this life will be subjective to all the bad and good things on the planet, otherwise we wouldn't be here, but we would be in the spiritual worlds which are eternal, blissful and karma free.
But do you believe that there are truly innocent people? I don't believe that god will punish unicorns, and since their aren't any unicorns I'm automatically correct.
Lucid_boy
01-18-2010, 10:48 AM
Eric have you ever had anyone you truly loved die a horrible death? Based on your belief I think not (although part of me is thinking that this is exactly the reason you believe what you do). A few years ago, my mother died in a brutal car accident, I was sixteen years old. According to you, my mother did something horrible in this life or a past life that warranted death.
Now, this I MIGHT be able to belive is true, but the thing I don't get, is that you believe in a god that doesn't let harm are injury come to it's INNOCENT children. I don't get it, because the death of the one person I love more than myself, the death of the ONLY person I was willing to sacrafice myself for, has caused me more injury, more pain, more suffering, more confusion and sorrow and agony than you can possibly imagine. It has totally warped my view on the world and turned my life into a living hell. How does this fit in with that image of God?
That brings up an interesting question, all this pain I feel, that would have to be do to my bad karma, or else your god would be harming me with something that I haden't Karma-ically earned right? So, question, did I kill my mother or is your god harming innocents? Or perhaps there is some middle ground I have yet to see?
Lucid boy :
I am very sorry to hear your mother died, that is so freaking terrible, but according to my experiences I do believe that everything happens for a reason, although I am very sorry that you lost your mother.
Listen very good, all of you :
I am not God, so I cannot give you answers to your questions other then I already explained in my posts. I am not the All Knowing person that knows all the things people (including your mother) did in past lives or this life, believe me, Lucid Boy, I think your story of losing your mother at 16 years of age is just more than heartbreaking and I really hope you are all right now.
So, after this introduction I will try to answer your questions with my insufficiant knowledge.
A Roxxor :
How else then a undevelopped foetus has to die, it has to have a reason to die, I think, if you believe in the perfection of God, if you really trust Him, then everything will be happening for a reason.
This reminds me of my own story of a unborn foetus.
I had a relationship with a prostitute from 1991 till 1993 and in that time she became pregnant. But I didn't know if the child would be my child or a child from a client of her or any other guy who she met in the night life, yes, I didn't trust her too much, she couldn't be trusted at that moment, I was 23 and she was 16, and we were into the night life, exploring things.
Anyway, what happened was that she became pregnant and she continued to work in that club and she continued to use drugs and alcohol whenever she was pregnant, basicly, she didn't know that she was killing that little child inside her, after two months, (we were lying in bed) she became a little sick (chunks of meat coming out from her vagina) and we had to get her to a hospital.
What happened was that inside the hospital she became white as snow and almost passed out, she was lying on a bed and the foetus came out her vagina in little chunks of meat, she had poisened the baby !!! Because she did drugs and alcohol.
My girlfriend almost died in that phase from the poison the baby released.
Now.....I can think that was free will of my ex-girlfriend to poison the baby or it was my own incompetent behaviour that I allowed her to keep on working and didn't do anything to prevent her to work.
Basicly I want all of you to take knowledge of the purport of the great master, Swami Prabhupada, to this verse of the Sri Isopanisad which explaines everything :
isavasyam idam (http://sriisopanisad.com/i/idam) sarvam (http://sriisopanisad.com/s/sarvam)
yat (http://sriisopanisad.com/y/yat) kinca (http://sriisopanisad.com/k/kinca) jagatyam (http://sriisopanisad.com/j/jagatyam) jagat (http://sriisopanisad.com/j/jagat)
tena (http://sriisopanisad.com/t/tena) tyaktena (http://sriisopanisad.com/t/tyaktena) bhunjitha
ma (http://sriisopanisad.com/m/ma) grdhah (http://sriisopanisad.com/g/grdhah) kasya (http://sriisopanisad.com/k/kasya) svid dhanam (http://sriisopanisad.com/d/dhanam)
SYNONYMS
isa (http://sriisopanisad.com/i/isa) -- by the Lord; avasyam (http://sriisopanisad.com/a/avasyam) -- controlled; idam (http://sriisopanisad.com/i/idam) -- this; sarvam (http://sriisopanisad.com/s/sarvam) -- all; yat (http://sriisopanisad.com/y/yat) kinca (http://sriisopanisad.com/k/kinca) -- whatever; jagatyam (http://sriisopanisad.com/j/jagatyam) -- within the universe; jagat (http://sriisopanisad.com/j/jagat) -- all that is animate or inanimate; tena (http://sriisopanisad.com/t/tena) -- by Him; tyaktena (http://sriisopanisad.com/t/tyaktena) -- set-apart quota; bhunjithah (http://sriisopanisad.com/b/bhunjithah) -- you should accept; ma (http://sriisopanisad.com/m/ma) -- do (http://sriisopanisad.com/d/do) not; grdhah (http://sriisopanisad.com/g/grdhah) -- endeavor to (http://sriisopanisad.com/t/to) gain; kasya (http://sriisopanisad.com/k/kasya) svit (http://sriisopanisad.com/s/svit) -- of anyone else; dhanam (http://sriisopanisad.com/d/dhanam) -- the wealth.
TRANSLATION
Everything animate or inanimate that is within the universe is controlled and owned by the Lord. One should therefore accept only those things necessary for himself, which are set aside as his quota, and one should not accept other things, knowing well to whom they belong.
PURPORT
Vedic knowledge is infallible because it comes down through the perfect disciplic succession of spiritual masters, beginning with the Lord Himself. Since He spoke the first word of Vedic knowledge, the source of this knowledge is transcendental. The words spoken by the Lord are called apauruseya, which indicates that they are not delivered by any mundane person. A living being who lives in the mundane world has four defects: (1) he is certain to commit mistakes; (2) he is subject to illusion; (3) he has a propensity to cheat others; and (4) his senses are imperfect. No one with these four imperfections can deliver perfect knowledge. The Vedas are not produced by such an imperfect creature. Vedic knowledge was originally imparted by the Lord into the heart of Brahma (http://sriisopanisad.com/b/brahma), the first created living being, and Brahma (http://sriisopanisad.com/b/brahma) in his turn disseminated this knowledge to his sons and disciples, who have handed it down through history.
Since the Lord is purnam (http://sriisopanisad.com/p/purnam), all-perfect, there is no possibility of His being subjected to the laws of material nature, which He controls. However, both the living entities and inanimate objects are controlled by the laws of nature and ultimately by the Lord's potency. This Isopanisad is part of the Yajur Veda (http://sriisopanisad.com/v/veda), and consequently it contains information concerning the proprietorship of all things existing within the universe.
There is more to this purport but it doesn't deal with karma, therefore I left it out of this thread.
This verse clearly says that everything is controlled by the Lord, so if anything bad happens to you, you can blame the Lord for it, but if you believe in reincarnation laws and karma, you must see it as if something bad comes over you that it is your own fault or desire to have this experience.
You have to learn from it to become a better person than you are now.
And for your knowledge, I am trying to follow the Vedic (Indian) philosophy, rather than the Christian philosophy, but I know that in the years before 300 AD reincarnation was widely accepted by Christians because it was written in the Bible and then it was altered, here is some written knowledge of it ;
The controversy
During the period from A.D. 250 to 553 controversy raged, at least intermittently, around the name of Origen, and from this controversy emerged the major objections that orthodox Christianity raises against reincarnation. Origen of Alexandria, one of Christianity's greatest systematic theologians, was a believer in reincarnation.
Origen was a person devoted to scriptural authority, a scourge to the enemies of the church, and a martyr for the faith. He was the spiritual teacher of a large and grateful posterity and yet his teachings were declared heresy in 553. The debates and controversies that flared up around his teachings are in fact the record of reincarnation in the church.
The case against Origen grew by fits and starts from about A.D. 300 (fifty years after his death) until 553. There were writers of great eminence among his critics as well as some rather obscure ecclesiasts. They included Methodius of Olympus, Eppiphanius of Salamis, Theophilus, Bishop of Jerusalem, Jerome, and the Emperor Justinian. The first of these, Methodius of Olympus, was a bishop in Greece and died a martyr's death in the year 311. He and Peter of Alexandria, whose works are almost entirely lost, represent the first wave of anti-Origenism. They were concerned chiefly with the preexistence of souls and Origen's notions about the resurrection of the dead. Another more powerful current against Origenism arose about a century later. The principals were Ephiphanius of Salamis, Theophilus of Alexandria, and Jerome.
From about 395 to 403 Origen became the subject of heated debate throughout Christendom. These three ecclesiats applied much energy and thought in search of questionable doctrine in Origen. Again the controversy flared up around 535, and in the wake of this the Emperor Justinian composed a tract against Origen in 543, proposing nine anathemas against "On First Principles", Origen's chief theological work. Origen was finally officially condemned in the Second Council of Constantinople in 553, when fifteen anathemas were charged against him.
The critics of Origen attacked him on individual points, and thus did not create a systematic theology to oppose him. Nonetheless, one can glean from their writings five major points that Christianity has raised against reincarnation:
(1) It seems to minimize Christian salvation.
(2) It is in conflict with the resurrection of the body.
(3) It creates an unnatural separation between body and soul.
(4) It is built on a much too speculative use of Christian scriptures.
(5) There is no recollection of previous lives.
Any discussion of these points will be greatly clarified by a preliminary look at Origen's system. Although it is of course impossible to do justice in a few pages to a thinker as subtle and profound as Origen, some of the distinctive aspects of his thought can be summarized.
So they have altered the Bible to destroy the concept of reincarnation here.
And Catbus.......
Unicorns are immortal anyway !!! Lol...!
SkA_DaRk_Che
01-18-2010, 12:54 PM
Eric have you ever had anyone you truly loved die a horrible death? Based on your belief I think not (although part of me is thinking that this is exactly the reason you believe what you do). A few years ago, my mother died in a brutal car accident, I was sixteen years old. According to you, my mother did something horrible in this life or a past life that warranted death.
I think you make a very good point here. What Erik is trying to do is extract meaning from otherwise meaningless events. I don't mean to belittle your mother's death but it was intrinsically meaningless in a way because there was no reason for her to die, it was just a freak accident am i right? What Erik is doing is finding meaning in meaningless events ie cause and effect. Your mother dies in a random car accident, but some people will always find meaning in otherwise meaningless occurrences and try to justify it through Karma,"cosmic justice" and the like.
According to them any event in your life positive or negative is the direct reaction of a positive or negative action perpetrated by that individual (either in this life or one previous).
It was once said somewhere that human brains are at the very most basic pattern sensing machines. For some humans, when something random happens they can't grasp it, it has to be part of some greater scheme or pattern. The human brain is wired in a way to see patterns in events and other things. If there is no pattern, the human brain will invent one. Seeing images of animals or people in clouds is a perfect example of this.
If an event is not logically tied to a cause and effect scenario i.e. person dies tragically but for no apparent reason (they did nothing to bring on their death like get drunk and drive or provoke their death in some other way) then some people will go out of their way to justify the death in some way beyond the bounds of logic and reason ie claim the person provoked their death for something they did in a past life. Because the human brain is at its most basic element a pattern sensing machine, the human brain will try and make situations that don't fit a particular mold that they are used to fit into it. IE transforming a meaningless event like a random freak accident to a cause and effect scenario that fits a pattern (cause and effect).
This is just my theory though.
By the way, I'm sorry about the loss of your mother. You have my condolences. I've been down that road before.
Catbus
01-18-2010, 12:54 PM
I appreciate your humor, but I was being serious.
Thankx again, Soros !!!
Catbus.....do you really believe in Unicorns, I do, I am sure they exist somewhere in another dimension, not on this earth, but on another planet...why not ?
A Roxxor
01-18-2010, 04:34 PM
You had a sexual relationship with a minor? Who was a hooker?
Lucid_boy
01-19-2010, 10:11 AM
I think you make a very good point here. What Erik is trying to do is extract meaning from otherwise meaningless events. I don't mean to belittle your mother's death but it was intrinsically meaningless in a way because there was no reason for her to die, it was just a freak accident am i right? What Erik is doing is finding meaning in meaningless events ie cause and effect. Your mother dies in a random car accident, but some people will always find meaning in otherwise meaningless occurrences and try to justify it through Karma,"cosmic justice" and the like.
According to them any event in your life positive or negative is the direct reaction of a positive or negative action perpetrated by that individual (either in this life or one previous).
It was once said somewhere that human brains are at the very most basic pattern sensing machines. For some humans, when something random happens they can't grasp it, it has to be part of some greater scheme or pattern. The human brain is wired in a way to see patterns in events and other things. If there is no pattern, the human brain will invent one. Seeing images of animals or people in clouds is a perfect example of this.
If an event is not logically tied to a cause and effect scenario i.e. person dies tragically but for no apparent reason (they did nothing to bring on their death like get drunk and drive or provoke their death in some other way) then some people will go out of their way to justify the death in some way beyond the bounds of logic and reason ie claim the person provoked their death for something they did in a past life. Because the human brain is at its most basic element a pattern sensing machine, the human brain will try and make situations that don't fit a particular mold that they are used to fit into it. IE transforming a meaningless event like a random freak accident to a cause and effect scenario that fits a pattern (cause and effect).
This is just my theory though.
By the way, I'm sorry about the loss of your mother. You have my condolences. I've been down that road before.
Sounds like a good theory to me...although I think it is a widely expressed and known one. Sometimes the brain cannot cope with things that it finds emotionally damaging so it finds non-existent patterns. The question I have been pondering lately is; WHY is there information that the brain finds so damaging it has to use defense mechanisms such as this? Why can't it just say, 'hey this is bad but so is alot of other things and process and deal with the info. I get that it is because we have emotions-that is kind of self explanatory-but why does it go to the depth that it does?
hawheehawhee
01-19-2010, 12:04 PM
Yes, I'm sorry, I don't wanna generalize of course, there are Muslims out there who are in love with freedom, so don't get me wrong.
I actually myself don't know what to think of these visions and voices, the situation now is pretty okay in the streets, seems like everybody loves our freedom.
I also don't know when this all is going to happen and what will happen in the Islamic countries in the future, but one thing is sure and that is that I know that it will come true, otherwise I wouldn't have had these visions and voices.
You do realise that you're not in a cheesy film, don't you?
SkA_DaRk_Che
01-19-2010, 02:16 PM
The question I have been pondering lately is; WHY is there information that the brain finds so damaging it has to use defense mechanisms such as this? Why can't it just say, 'hey this is bad but so is alot of other things and process and deal with the info. I get that it is because we have emotions-that is kind of self explanatory-but why does it go to the depth that it does?
Well, some people are not emotionally strong. People can't cope with things of a tragic nature very easily, and a very small amount can't cope at all and thus develop psychological defense mechanisms be it repression of memories or disassociating in one way or another.
I know when something fucked up happens to me, i disassociate to such an extent that i feel like everything is a dream or i feel almost as if i were stoned out of my mind (at least i retain the dissociative effects of being really stoned); all without the use of drugs. That's just how i react to something i can't handle. I think it's the same with other people too. We can't deal with it or intellectualize it.
Some things are just so traumatic or heartbreaking that we can't just think "well at least I'm not a starving person in africa with aids" or something to that effect.
Catbus
01-19-2010, 06:15 PM
Thankx again, Soros !!!
Catbus.....do you really believe in Unicorns, I do, I am sure they exist somewhere in another dimension, not on this earth, but on another planet...why not ?
You completely missed my point, and I don't feel like restating it as it was blatantly obvious what I was getting at.
A Roxxor
01-20-2010, 02:17 PM
You had a sexual relationship with a minor? Who was a hooker?
.
Catbus :
You completely missed my point, and I don't feel like restating it as it was blatantly obvious what I was getting at.
I'm sorry, English is not my mother language so sometimes I don't understand the slang you guys use.
A Roxxor
You had a sexual relationship with a minor? Who was a hooker?
Yes, I had, at that time in 1991 I was 23 years old and she 16 and she was a prostitute, she did this from the age of 15, I guess to make up because at a younger age she saw her rich daddy collapse and dying on the floor and her family didn't get any penny, so I guess she wanted the rich life, no matter what.
I remember that I was very happy to date her, because she was very handsome and very populair with the people of the nightlife we were in at that time.
hawheehawhee
You do realise that you're not in a cheesy film, don't you?
Well, sometimes life feels like a movie, a dream, whenever days pass by they become a bit misty.
Yesterday I saw a documentary on DVD, which I bought, about the Iraqi heavy metal band Acrassicauda and I had to think about me, starting up this thread.
I mean, there you have 4 guys, Muslim in Iraq but not strict and in love with heavy metal, I just love those kind of Muslims and consider them my brothers, also because I love heavy metal myself.
So I was thinking about this thread and I don't mean that I don't like these kind of peace loving Muslims, caught up in the Iraqi civil war.
The type I am warning for are the guys who want to take over the West and want to turn it into a Muslim country.
Anyway, for the ones who want to watch Acrassicauda, here is the link to the documentary online :
http://www.snagfilms.com/films/title/heavy_metal_in_baghdad/
And on youtube :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RC3icYwYstg
the whole documentary on youtube :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QTJ1Ki4OM-g
It's amazing !!!
Heavy Metal Rules !!!!!!!
Carôusoul
01-21-2010, 05:55 AM
Yes, I had, at that time in 1991 I was 23 years old and she 16 and she was a prostitute, she did this from the age of 15, I guess to make up because at a younger age she saw her rich daddy collapse and dying on the floor and her family didn't get any penny, so I guess she wanted the rich life, no matter what.
I remember that I was very happy to date her, because she was very handsome and very populair with the people of the nightlife we were in at that time.
hawheehawhee
Heavy Metal Rules !!!!!!!
Man, just kill yourself already.
Wow !!!!!!!!!!!
I didn't know but these guys met their idols, Metallica, check it out !!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9pFTnNAiBJ4
Metal Rules !!!!!
Carousoul,
Man, just kill yourself already
I guess I can now call you officially a cuntnut, a fucknut and a bitchnut, because you are a sucker with nothing more than stupid comments and replies and you are not adding anything religious and spiritual to this thread, so go away !!!
Carôusoul
01-21-2010, 08:07 AM
and replies and you are not adding anything religious and spiritual to this thread, so go away !!!
Because boasting about fucking an underage prostitute is so spiritual and religious, right.
Carousoul,
Because boasting about fucking an underage prostitute is so spiritual and religious, right.
One thing is that I am not boasting about it, I mentioned it in relation with a reply by A Roxxor, in which he asked what karma an unborn child had if it wouldn't make it to the world.
And another thing is that I had a relationship with her from 1991 til 1993 so that is more than 17 years ago and for your information....I wasn't interested in spiritual and religious matters at all in that time, I only read a bit Nostradamus and that was around 1983- 1984.
You just seem to react vaguely and I am not welcoming you anymore, oh, and didn't you write :
I'm going to stop responding to you now because there is a threshold of ignorance I just can't bear to the point of being offended and disgusted, and you fall well below it.
So please stop responding and drag your ass somewhere else !!
As this thread is dealing with my warning to all of you folks out there, I can't withhold you the latest part of a dream I had.
Februari 27th 2010, 03.40am :
"I was reading a newspaper article and it said that Islam would conquer Holland and Belgium. It also said :
"We almost have Great Brittain"
End of dream part.
Now these little dream scenes are very important as they seem to say that Islam is almost done with England, the soldiers are put into place over there and are awaiting orders to take over England in just one night.
It will happen simulteneously, the take over, the Muslims will take over the whole of Europe for sure in one night and it will happen in the near future, not in 2012, but it will happen a few years later, I hope you all remember my warning to you !!!
Bless you...
Wow, I just took a look on jihadwatch.org and found this article about a radical muslim leader in England, expressing exactly what I am warning for, he ays Islam is not a religion of peace and that they will take over England, just read it for yourself :
http://www.cbn.com/cbnnews/world/2010/March/UK-Muslim-Leader-Islam-Not-a-Religion-of-Peace/
Now, if a man like this is able to say this, then why am I called a rascist whenever I take the trouble to warn you for these kind of people ?
Amazing.
They've been pumping people soooo full of anti- islamic fear indoctrination and propaganda in the papers, on the internet and on the TV's news that now they even dream at night of the Islamophobia that's been brainwashed into them during waking life.
Well I guess we could conclude that the media indoctrination of socio-political fear and division is a very effective means of Dream incubation.
SKA,
Amazing.
They've been pumping people soooo full of anti- islamic fear indoctrination and propaganda in the papers, on the internet and on the TV's news that now they even dream at night of the Islamophobia that's been brainwashed into them during waking life.
Well I guess we could conclude that the media indoctrination of socio-political fear and division is a very effective means of Dream incubation
you didn't pay attention to what the muslim leader in the UK is saying himself, I suggest you read this link I posted and then see for yourself if you still have the same opinion, the muslim leader is himself saying that they will take over the UK and make it Islamic, please read it to gain a full understanding, you'll get enlightened, I promise you.
You genuinely have nightmares of a conspiracy of aggressive conquest of Britain by Muslims?
Godwin's law permitting, you are honestly like a mini-Hitler.
Invader
03-04-2010, 10:07 AM
The solution is love.
imran_p
03-04-2010, 10:09 AM
SKA,
you didn't pay attention to what the muslim leader in the UK is saying himself, I suggest you read this link I posted and then see for yourself if you still have the same opinion, the muslim leader is himself saying that they will take over the UK and make it Islamic, please read it to gain a full understanding, you'll get enlightened, I promise you.
If your that convinced, I suggest you convert immediately.
Amazing.
They've been pumping people soooo full of anti- islamic fear indoctrination and propaganda in the papers, on the internet and on the TV's news that now they even dream at night of the Islamophobia that's been brainwashed into them during waking life.
Well I guess we could conclude that the media indoctrination of socio-political fear and division is a very effective means of Dream incubation.
I know, right.
But there are so many anti-government and anti-globalization threads
that I guess one regiliously fanatic anti-islam thread is not going to hurt.
Edit:
BTW Erik, I kindda liked your song :)
Xei,
You genuinely have nightmares of a conspiracy of aggressive conquest of Britain by Muslims?
Godwin's law permitting, you are honestly like a mini-Hitler.you're a fascist and you don't know it yet, but you are a radical muslim, you love to take away our freedom, I am pretty sure about that, you fuck nut ! Don't reply here anymore !
Imran_p :
If your that convinced, I suggest you convert immediately.No thank you, I rather fight these radical muslim assholes and die.
Invader :
The solution is loveI agree with you totally, but tell that to radical muslims terrorist assholes and their leftists friends, tell that to the deforestation demons and to the assholes who are hunting down whales in the ocean and to the ones who are beating seals to death for their skin and the list goes on and on......but I appreciate your reply, in a world without danger it would be mine too....
Dajo :
Edit:
BTW Erik, I kindda liked your song :)Thank you, I wrote many new songs lately and we are gonna record a CD within a few months, I am luckily not the singer, cause I can't sing.
Anyway, for the ones wo ae still thinking I am a little Hitler, here's what the radical Muslims are warning you about, just to let you know, cause I don't think any of you opened the link I provided :
UK Muslim Leader: Islam Not a Religion of Peace
Tuesday, March 02, 2010
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<script language="JavaScript" type="text/javascript"> document.write('<a href="http://oascentral.cbn.com/RealMedia/ads/click_lx.ads/cbn.com/cbnnews/world/L21/1456464809/Left/CBN/OperationBlessing_March_10/March_WS.html/554f7a30553075512b45344143384f41?http://clk.atdmt.com/3T1/go/207400654/direct/011456464809" target="_blank"><img src="http://view.atdmt.com/3T1/view/207400654/direct/011456464809"/></a>'); </script><noscript><a href="http://oascentral.cbn.com/RealMedia/ads/click_lx.ads/cbn.com/cbnnews/world/L21/1456464809/Left/CBN/OperationBlessing_March_10/March_WS.html/554f7a30553075512b45344143384f41?http://clk.atdmt.com/3T1/go/207400654/direct/011456464809" target="_blank"><img border="0" src="http://view.atdmt.com/3T1/view/207400654/direct/011456464809" /></a></noscript&g
WASHINGTON -- The Obama administration has released a review of its strategy in the war on terrorism. The report failed to even mention the word "Islam."
CBN News traveled to London to talk with Anjem Choudary, a leading Muslim radical who says Islamic teachings are what shaped his pro-jihad message.
Although both George W. Bush and Barack Obama have declared that Islam is a religion of peace, Choudary begs to differ.
A Religion of Peace?
"You can't say that Islam is a religion of peace," Choudary told CBN News. "Because Islam does not mean peace. Islam means submission. So the Muslim is one who submits. There is a place for violence in Islam. There is a place for jihad in Islam."
Choudary is the leader of Islam4UK, a group recently banned in Britain under the country's counter-terrorism laws. He wants Islamic Sharia law to rule the United Kingdom and is working to make that dream a reality.
While Islamic radicals in the United States usually prefer to speak in more moderate tones while in public, masking their true agenda, Choudary has no such inhibitions.
He has praised the 9/11 hijackers and has called for the execution of Pope Benedict. He also stirred controversy recently when video emerged of him converting a 10-year-old British boy to Islam.
Openly Praising Jihad
Choudary told CBN News his group is a "non-violent political and ideological movement" that resides in the UK under "a covenant of security."
Yet he openly praises violent jihad.
"The Koran is full of, you know, jihad is the most talked about duty in the Koran other than tawhid -- belief," he said. "Nothing else is mentioned more than the topic of fighting."
Several former members of Choudary's group have been arrested on terrorism charges.
"A very significant amount of former al-Muhajiroun people were involved in terrorist plots against this country," London-based terrorism expert Peter Neumann said. "A number of people have actually gone to Afghanistan, joined the Taliban and died fighting for the Taliban."
Choudary refuses to condemn acts of terror including 9/11 and the July 7, 2005 London bombings, which killed 52 people.
Islam More than Religion
CBN News asked Choudary for his thoughts on the 7/7 bombings on London's transport system, and whether he condemned them.
"For the people who carried it out, it was legitimate," he replied. "If you look at the will of the 7/7 bombers Mohammed Siddique Khan and Shehzad Tanweer, they would be justified. And there are many verses from the Koran and many statements to say that's the Islamic argument. And that is a difficult Islamic argument to refute. And there are many scholars who support that argument as well."
Choudary says his group is merely following core Islamic teachings and that Islam is much more than a religion.
"This particular belief is more than just a religion," he declared. "It is not just a spiritual belief. It is, in fact, an ideology which you believe in and you struggle for and you are willing even to die for, because you believe in that: That is your whole life."
Choudary seems to relish being called Great Britain's "most hated man" and pledges to continue his rallies calling for the overthrow of the British system.
Now......who is the Hitler here ?!!@??
imran_p
03-05-2010, 05:49 AM
Xei,
you're a fascist and you don't know it yet, but you are a radical muslim, you love to take away our freedom, I am pretty sure about that, you fuck nut ! Don't reply here anymore !
Imran_p :
No thank you, I rather fight these radical muslim assholes and die.
Invader :
I agree with you totally, but tell that to radical muslims terrorist assholes and their leftists friends, tell that to the deforestation demons and to the assholes who are hunting down whales in the ocean and to the ones who are beating seals to death for their skin and the list goes on and on......but I appreciate your reply, in a world without danger it would be mine too....
Dajo :
Thank you, I wrote many new songs lately and we are gonna record a CD within a few months, I am luckily not the singer, cause I can't sing.
Anyway, for the ones wo ae still thinking I am a little Hitler, here's what the radical Muslims are warning you about, just to let you know, cause I don't think any of you opened the link I provided :
UK Muslim Leader: Islam Not a Religion of Peace
Tuesday, March 02, 2010
The latest version of Adobe Flash Player is required to watch this video. Please click on the link below to download the latest version. Thanks!
http://www.cbn.com/App_Themes/Common/Images/160x41_Get_Flash_Player.jpg (http://www.adobe.com/go/getflashplayer)
<script language="JavaScript" type="text/javascript"> document.write('<a href="http://oascentral.cbn.com/RealMedia/ads/click_lx.ads/cbn.com/cbnnews/world/L21/1456464809/Left/CBN/OperationBlessing_March_10/March_WS.html/554f7a30553075512b45344143384f41?http://clk.atdmt.com/3T1/go/207400654/direct/011456464809" target="_blank"><img src="http://view.atdmt.com/3T1/view/207400654/direct/011456464809"/></a>'); </script><noscript><a href="http://oascentral.cbn.com/RealMedia/ads/click_lx.ads/cbn.com/cbnnews/world/L21/1456464809/Left/CBN/OperationBlessing_March_10/March_WS.html/554f7a30553075512b45344143384f41?http://clk.atdmt.com/3T1/go/207400654/direct/011456464809" target="_blank"><img border="0" src="http://view.atdmt.com/3T1/view/207400654/direct/011456464809" /></a></noscript&g
WASHINGTON -- The Obama administration has released a review of its strategy in the war on terrorism. The report failed to even mention the word "Islam."
CBN News traveled to London to talk with Anjem Choudary, a leading Muslim radical who says Islamic teachings are what shaped his pro-jihad message.
Although both George W. Bush and Barack Obama have declared that Islam is a religion of peace, Choudary begs to differ.
A Religion of Peace?
"You can't say that Islam is a religion of peace," Choudary told CBN News. "Because Islam does not mean peace. Islam means submission. So the Muslim is one who submits. There is a place for violence in Islam. There is a place for jihad in Islam."
Choudary is the leader of Islam4UK, a group recently banned in Britain under the country's counter-terrorism laws. He wants Islamic Sharia law to rule the United Kingdom and is working to make that dream a reality.
While Islamic radicals in the United States usually prefer to speak in more moderate tones while in public, masking their true agenda, Choudary has no such inhibitions.
He has praised the 9/11 hijackers and has called for the execution of Pope Benedict. He also stirred controversy recently when video emerged of him converting a 10-year-old British boy to Islam.
Openly Praising Jihad
Choudary told CBN News his group is a "non-violent political and ideological movement" that resides in the UK under "a covenant of security."
Yet he openly praises violent jihad.
"The Koran is full of, you know, jihad is the most talked about duty in the Koran other than tawhid -- belief," he said. "Nothing else is mentioned more than the topic of fighting."
Several former members of Choudary's group have been arrested on terrorism charges.
"A very significant amount of former al-Muhajiroun people were involved in terrorist plots against this country," London-based terrorism expert Peter Neumann said. "A number of people have actually gone to Afghanistan, joined the Taliban and died fighting for the Taliban."
Choudary refuses to condemn acts of terror including 9/11 and the July 7, 2005 London bombings, which killed 52 people.
Islam More than Religion
CBN News asked Choudary for his thoughts on the 7/7 bombings on London's transport system, and whether he condemned them.
"For the people who carried it out, it was legitimate," he replied. "If you look at the will of the 7/7 bombers Mohammed Siddique Khan and Shehzad Tanweer, they would be justified. And there are many verses from the Koran and many statements to say that's the Islamic argument. And that is a difficult Islamic argument to refute. And there are many scholars who support that argument as well."
Choudary says his group is merely following core Islamic teachings and that Islam is much more than a religion.
"This particular belief is more than just a religion," he declared. "It is not just a spiritual belief. It is, in fact, an ideology which you believe in and you struggle for and you are willing even to die for, because you believe in that: That is your whole life."
Choudary seems to relish being called Great Britain's "most hated man" and pledges to continue his rallies calling for the overthrow of the British system.
Now......who is the Hitler here ?!!@??
I don't think posting large amounts of copied material will help this discussion; I'm pretty sure nobody will read it.
In your own words could you tell me what your whole perspective on this is, as you obviously feel very strongly about it. What is the problem? What makes you so sure Muslims will take over the world/Britain? And what do you suggest we all do about it?
Please, in your own words.
juroara
03-05-2010, 01:23 PM
The only thing I dont understand is why you interpret your first vision to that of Muslims? I mean, you're first vision had demons and birds? Don't you think it's a bit racist to jump the gun and automatically assume those demons were muslims? Or did I miss the muslim reference in your vision? :?
Universal Mind
03-05-2010, 01:31 PM
I think I should mention at this point that Islam is a belief system, not a race. There is a huge difference. Also, radical Islam is not the same as ordinary Islam. Nobody is Hitler or a racist for having a problem with what radical Islam is doing to Britain or the rest of Europe. Radical Islam is extremely dangerous. It is a very unfortunate FACT.
Unelias
03-05-2010, 02:07 PM
I might be drunk, thus my intelligence is severely downgraded, but how has this anything to do with freedom?
Imran_p :
I don't think posting large amounts of copied material will help this discussion; I'm pretty sure nobody will read it.
In your own words could you tell me what your whole perspective on this is, as you obviously feel very strongly about it. What is the problem? What makes you so sure Muslims will take over the world/Britain? And what do you suggest we all do about it?
Please, in your own words.
In my own words, okay, here we go !
I used to live in Roterdam, Holland and we have a large muslim population, so I had muslim "friends" over there.
Well, one of these socalled friends, a girl, was always so cool with me and I with her, we met at the fitness gym and used to go jogging together, she liked to hug trees, wonderful.
We went to the Sufi muslims together to follow their evening program and it felt nice.
I remember when I called her one day and she said she had a job at the office, I said that it was nice for her and she said :
"Know your enemy"
At that point I gegan to think differently about this socalled Westernized Moroccan girl.
Then later I saw her on Dutch television, they followed her to Saudi Arabia in a doumentary, in that documentary I saw the leader of the Islamic workshop saying :
"Jihad is compulsary"
I thought, : My God, what are you doing and called her on the phone to invite her to my house, just months before I left for India.
We had a talk and I gave her a book called : "The hidden treasures of the Koran" about the personal feature of Allah.
Later I saw her again, after I had been to India, I met her on the bus and decided to go with her to her sister, and there she said with a threatening voic :
"Just wait until we get control here"
Now I knew it for sure, she had become a Jihadi, a hater.
And her sister, who walks around in Western clothes, signed a petition for implementing Sharia law in Holland and she joined the PvdA, a socialist party here, there she was kicked out because of her radical beliefs and now she is with the Muslim Party in Holland, they didn't score points in the elections.
Whenever I meet hem we are doing very friendly to eachother, like how are you, what are you doing lately and o on, but it is just a facade, they want to take power here and they are dressed as Western people, except for one sister, she wears traditional clothes after her visit to Saudi Arabia.
Then another socalled friend of mine, one day I asked him what he would do to me when Jihad would break out in Holland and he just said with words of hate :
"I would skin you alive"
He wears Western clothes as well, and because I pay good attention to what is happening in the world on internet, like www.jihadwatch.org , www.thereligionofpeace.com and www.memri.tv , and my own realisations and Nostradamus and Revelations, I came to the conclusion that Muslims want to conquer and are going to conquer (for a while) the West.
I don't trust any Muslim who follows the Koran, in this book there is mentioned :
al-Taqiyya", literally means: "Concealing or disguising one's beliefs, convictions, ideas, feelings, opinions, and/or strategies under certain circumstances
My socalled friends are following this, so how can I trust them, anyway, I am sure that Islam wants to take over the West and then the workld, period.
Juroara :
The only thing I dont understand is why you interpret your first vision to that of Muslims? I mean, you're first vision had demons and birds? Don't you think it's a bit racist to jump the gun and automatically assume those demons were muslims? Or did I miss the muslim reference in your vision? :?
Did I mention that in 2002 I wrote on forums on internet that Muslims are wanting to take over our countries in just one night ?
Well, in case I forgot, I wrote that and it was automatic writing, it popped up in my mind and I just had to write it, why ? I don't know, but now I think to make the people aware of the danger we are all facing.
And then in September 2007, I got these visions, whic confirmed to me what I was already thinking.
Yes, muslims are planning a huge take over, mark my words.
Unelias :
I might be drunk, thus my intelligence is severely downgraded, but how has this anything to do with freedom?
Because Islam takes away freedom when you follow the Koran and the Hadith to the letter :
Just one example ;
Hadith Qudsi 19:5: "The Prophet said that Allah commanded him to destroy all the musical instruments, idols, crosses and all the trappings of ignorance."
The Hadith Qudsi, or holy Hadith, are those in which Muhammad transmits the words of Allah, although those words are not in the Qur'an.
Muhammad also said:
(1) "Allah Mighty and Majestic sent me as a guidance and mercy to believers and commanded me to do away with musical instruments, flutes, strings, crucifixes, and the affair of the pre-Islamic period of ignorance."
(2) "On the Day of Resurrection, Allah will pour molten lead into the ears of whoever sits listening to a songstress."
(3) "Song makes hypocrisy grow in the heart as water does herbage."
(4) "This community will experience the swallowing up of some people by the earth, metamorphosis of some into animals, and being rained upon with stones." Someone asked, "When will this be, O Messenger of Allah?" and he said, "When songstresses and musical instruments appear and wine is held to be lawful."
(5) "There will be peoples of my Community who will hold fornication, silk, wine, and musical instruments to be lawful ...." -- 'Umdat al-Salik r40.0
Xaqaria
03-07-2010, 12:22 AM
And then in September 2007, I got these visions, whic confirmed to me what I was already thinking.
This is the reason why your assertions do not hold any weight. See; Confirmation Bias (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias)
Invader
03-07-2010, 12:58 AM
Because Islam takes away freedom when you follow the Koran and the Hadith to the letter
I do not understand. Those who convert are making the choice to follow the words of the Koran. They can just as easily not convert and remain non-Muslim. Islam can't take away freedom any more than any other religion (unless it's forced on you by some form of crusade, in which case it's still people and not the religion itself that's doing the forcing).
Also, a little research on Islam and music yields an interesting fact: The scholars of the Koran and the Hadiths tend to disagree on different aspects of music. The only thing that is universally agreed on, however, is that music that contains messages that are 'sinful' in nature is prohibited, which makes sense if one chooses to hold beliefs against things of that nature in the first place. The prophet is mentioned as having been in the company of those who were singing or otherwise playing music as well without making a fuss about it, which stands in contradiction to the idea that all music is forbidden.
That was the result of a little Google.
Xaqaria :
This is the reason why your assertions do not hold any weight. See; Confirmation Bias (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias)
Okay, have it your way, I trust on the spiritual values of what I saw and heard, I know that the muslims will take over the West in just one night, it will happen in 2016 or 2017, this is also a realization of me, when all muslims here are radicalized (forcefully or not by radical muslim) and they came up with a reason to attack (which they are fabricating themselves and blame us for it).
YOU JUST WATCH AND SEE !!!
Invader ;
Also, a little research on Islam and music yields an interesting fact: The scholars of the Koran and the Hadiths tend to disagree on different aspects of music. The only thing that is universally agreed on, however, is that music that contains messages that are 'sinful' in nature is prohibited, which makes sense if one chooses to hold beliefs against things of that nature in the first place. The prophet is mentioned as having been in the company of those who were singing or otherwise playing music as well without making a fuss about it, which stands in contradiction to the idea that all music is forbidden.
That was the result of a little Google.
You hold a little google to be more superiour than Mohammeds own words, which I will repeat again here :
Hadith Qudsi 19:5: "The Prophet said that Allah commanded him to destroy all the musical instruments, idols, crosses and all the trappings of ignorance."
The Hadith Qudsi, or holy Hadith, are those in which Muhammad transmits the words of Allah, although those words are not in the Qur'an.
Muhammad also said:
(1) "Allah Mighty and Majestic sent me as a guidance and mercy to believers and commanded me to do away with musical instruments, flutes, strings, crucifixes, and the affair of the pre-Islamic period of ignorance."
(2) "On the Day of Resurrection, Allah will pour molten lead into the ears of whoever sits listening to a songstress."
(3) "Song makes hypocrisy grow in the heart as water does herbage."
(4) "This community will experience the swallowing up of some people by the earth, metamorphosis of some into animals, and being rained upon with stones." Someone asked, "When will this be, O Messenger of Allah?" and he said, "When songstresses and musical instruments appear and wine is held to be lawful."
(5) "There will be peoples of my Community who will hold fornication, silk, wine, and musical instruments to be lawful ...." -- 'Umdat al-Salik r40.0
And to give you an example what will happen with the people in general who play music, here is an article I found on jihadwatch.org :
Afghan musician hopes the Taliban will go away so he can play again
The Taliban believe music is un-Islamic. Why? Hadith Qudsi 19:5: "The Prophet said that Allah commanded him to destroy all the musical instruments, idols, crosses and all the trappings of ignorance."
DERA ISMAIL KHAN, Pakistan -- Mohammad Akbar says he prays every day for the Pakistani army to crush the Taliban so he can make sweet music once more without fearing for his life.
"They smashed it into pieces and warned me of serious consequences if I ever played it again," said Akbar as he recalled the day two years ago that the Islamists forced him to give a recital of his rubab -- a traditional lute-like instrument that is popular in Pakistan and Afghanistan.
"I recite from the Holy Koran every morning and pray for the success of the military operation and when they are defeated I will buy another rubab," he said. [...]
Akbar looked visibly distressed as he spoke about his ordeal which started two years ago when a Taliban delegation turned up at his home, following a tip-off from one of his neighbours.
Not knowing they were from the Taliban, he served them tea, played his rubab and sang for them in his living room.
And then they grabbed the instrument and smashed it.
"It was a warning from them. I was forced to stop playing an instrument that I started playing in 1981," he said.
Pakistan has seen creeping religious conservatism over the years in parts of the northwest and in July 2007 Taliban extremists launched a bloody insurgency to impose a harsh brand of Islamic law in the Swat valley.
Memo to AFP: "religious conservatism" in the Western sense doesn't involve smashing musical instruments, blowing up music stores and murdering musicians.
They blew up hundreds of music and DVD shops in the troubled North West Frontier Province (NWFP), calling the practice against the tenets of Islam.
Shop owners were forced to display the pro-Taliban material which ranged from tirades against the United States to gruesome clips of beheadings and bomb attacks.
Tears rolled down Akbar's cheeks as he talked about one of his very close friends Ahmad Shah, whom he says was executed by Taliban for playing the flute.
"They slit his throat because he ignored their warning," said Akbar.
The musician also recalled his childhood friendship with Qari Hussain, a reputed mass trainer of suicide bombers whose home town is now surrounded by the army, saying that Hussain also did not like his hobby of playing the rubab.
When he confronted Hussain, who returned to South Waziristan in 2007 after living for years in Karachi, about the Taliban's behaviour, he received an icy reply.
"I went to him to lodge complaint but he asked me to be thankful to God that they did not kill me on his request," he said....
Invader
03-07-2010, 05:10 AM
You hold a little google to be more superiour than Mohammeds own words, which I will repeat again here
By mentioning his actions. Yes. That displays an obvious conflict. The fact that what you posted also did not come out of the Koran, their holy book, is a huge factor. If playing music was sinful in Islam, it would be mentioned in the holy book. A hadith cannot be held as superior word to the Koran for Muslims. Even the call to prayer is sung. The whole Koran is recited out loud as a song.
I will also say again that people must choose to convert, and that a religion by itself can't force anything onto people. The religion is not being forced onto Europeans, is it? You did not address this. You seem to be focusing on the actions of a group of people called the Taliban and associating said actions to all Muslims.
Okay, if you don't believe me, I will start with the history of Jihad, which is compulsary for every muslim, it all began with the forcefully converting the Arabs to Islam and then this happened :
How the Jihadis mercilessly vandalized Zoroastrian Persia and wiped out Zoroastrianism from the land of its birth.
After the Arabs of the Arabian peninsula had been subjugated, the Muslims turned on their northern neighbors the Persians and the Byzantines.
Today when the Mullahs and Ayatollahs rule Iran, we might tend to think that they have always been characteristic of Iran. Not many know that Iran was the first nation that waged a short but bloodied campaign of battles with the Jihadi hounds that were unleashed on an unsuspecting world by Mohammed.
Iran was the first country that lay blocking the path of these bloodthirsty maniacs who were out to impose their Islamic creed on all those who succumbed to their ruthless march. The Persians (and the Byzantines) were both unfit to defeat the Muslim Arabs, as till then in human history nowhere had a people been worked into a frenzy to go out defeat the adversary and convert the defeated and weak to a creed that imposed the same paranoia of converting still others who were unfortunate and weak to fall before the bloodthirsty Islamic Jihad.
Till the rise of the murderous creed of Islam, the world had known only imperial conquests, where the conqueror, be he Alexander, Cyrus, Julius Caesar, Hannibal or any other, the war took place between the opposing armies. The fate of the battle was decided on the battlefield alone. The common people, the unarmed civilians were not in danger of a victorious adversary imposing anything more than new taxes and new administrators.
The Muslim Arabs hounds who set their eyes on Persia (and the rest of the world) wanted not just to conquer land and impose new administrators and taxes, but they wanted to impose a creed on the Persians and make them as bloodthirsty in turn, to attack, other parts of the world. Those who fell victim to the swords of the Jihadis could only save their lives by becoming Muslims, and in turn themselves become bloodthirsty.
Islam was, and still is, a curse on humankind from the word go. At the pain of death, Islam spread like wildfire into Persia, making the Persians also into bloodthirsty wolves like the Muslim Arabs. It was the Persians who a hundred years later were to take this bloodthirsty creed to the Turks and the Turks in turn a few hundred years after that were to attack Byzantine and the Balkans.
Today the Persians (Iranians) have faint memories of their pre-Islamic past. The glories of Cyrus and Darius, of Pasargade, Persepolis, Ctesiphon, of Zarathushtra, and the Shah-Nameh. The student community is becoming increasingly aware of their pre-Islamic past mainly through the websites on the Internet, that tell the true story of Iran. And this adds fuel to the restlessness of the young among the Iranian population.
Today, they must realize that the twilight of the Mullahs is the last twilight before the dawn of the post-Islamic Iran. Iranians, need to not only overthrow the Mullah regime, but also discard Islam and return to their pre-Islamic Zoroastrian roots. Here we shall trace the struggle waged by Iran (Persia) against the Arab Hordes who forcibly imposed Islam on the defeated Persians at the pain of death and torture.
As they had done to provoke the pre-Muslim Quraish of Mecca into battle by raiding their caravans, the Muslim Arabs followed the same tradition of raiding the adversary when they turned on their first non-Arab neighbor the Persians. There were no caravans to loot now, since the Muslim Arabs were now dealing with a settled civilization.
So the Arabs started attacking the border towns and harassing the civilian Persian population. The people of the border areas along the Euphrates river petitioned the Persian king Yazdjurd (Yazdgard) to save them from the depredations of the Muslim Arabs. The king sent a reconnaissance force under the command of a general named Jaban. This force first approached the town of Hira that had been occupied by the Arabs. On seeing the Persians approach, the Arab force withdrew towards the desert into the oasis town of Namraq (modern Kufa) to draw the Persians into the desert, a terrain that the Arabs were familiar with, but the Persians were not.
The Arabs were on camels in addition to their infantry. The Persians were on horseback. While cavalry gave an advantage while fighting on normal terrain, they were a liability in the desert. With the Persians in the desert, the Arab force caught up with it and inflicted a defeat, and forced it to withdraw. The Persian reconnaissance force then withdrew to join the main Persian army at a town called Kasker.
Here another Persian general named Narsi had assembled a good concentration of forces. This town was well away from the border. Kaskar was so far away from the Muslim camp that Narsi felt that no Muslim attack could be imminent. But Abu Ubaid, the Muslim commander, thought otherwise. He thought that it would have a good psychological effect if in the wake of the battle of Namaraq itself, the Muslims rushed to Kaskar and deal with the Persian forces there before the forces under Jalinus, another Persian general could come to their assistance. This shows the Muslim daredevilry, which we must outmatch with our cowboy spirit, if we are to destroy Islam and win the war on terror.
Abu Ubaid accordingly ordered a march across the Suwad to Kaskar. Dashing across the Suwad the Muslim forces appeared at Kaskar before the astonished Persians. The Persians hurriedly brought their military into formation and the two forces faced each other at Saqatia a few miles from Kaskar.
The strategy of the Persians had been to defer action till the arrival of the force under another Persian general named Jalinus who had set off with additional forces. The strategy of the Muslims was to press the attack and force immediate decision. With this element of surprise, the Arabs kept the initiative in their hands and fell upon the Persians as soon as they reached the Persian camp. With this momentum, the Arabs were able to overwhelm the Persians at Kasker too and force them to retreat to the east, beyond the Euphrates.
Lessons from the Battles of Namraq and Kasker
The Arabs took these battles in their favor due to their guile in forcing the Persians into hostile and unfamiliar terrain and keeping the initiative in their hands, by pouncing upon the adversary the minute they sighted the Persians. These first defeats set the tone for future Arab-Persian battles and the ultimate defeat of Persia by the Arabs.
The lesson here is to keep the initiative always in our hands if the aim is to stun and defeat the Muslims. By going about a slow and conventional start, America has emboldened the Muslims to carry out attacks on other Western targets, as the Sassanid Persians did by their dithering and letting the Arabs take the initiative at the Battle Kasker, conveyed to the Arabs that they could overwhelm and stun the Persians if they kept the initiative in their hands.
Although the Muslims today cannot defeat the West, the West is giving them a lifeline by allowing the initiative to slip. On the other hand, the Muslims by staging dramatic attacks on Western targets like those at London, Beslan Madrid after 9/11, are living up to their tradition of keeping the initiative in their hands and hitting at their adversaries where they least expect to be hit. The lesson which these first battles between the Persians and Arabs give us today is to keep the initiative in the war on terror completely in the hands of the West and to hit the enemy where it hurts most – by nuking Mecca during Hajj. And carrying out large scale attacks during Ramzan and regular attacks to coincide with the Friday noon prayers across the most populous towns in the Islamic crescent.
Lessons of the Battle of the Bridge (Al Jisr) - 14 A.H. 636 C.E.
At the next major clash which is known as the Battle of the Bridge between the Persians and the Arab Muslims, the Persians used elephants for the first time, which were new for the denizens of the desert the Bedouin Arab Muslims. At the battle of the Bridge (the Battle of Al Jisr in Arab chronicles), the Persians used their elephants to trample over the Arab attackers. They even trampled the Arab general, due to which there was panic among the Arab army which stared retreating. The Persians chased the Arabs up to the Bridge on the Tigris river, which then marked the boundary between the Persian empire and the domain of the Arabs.
The Persians stopped at the bridge and chased the Arabs across it, but did not follow the Arabs into the Arabian desert. The Persians wasted an opportunity to utterly defeat the Muslims by going right into Arabia and hunting down the Muslim Arabs in their homeland and slaughtering them in the same manner in which the Arab Muslims slaughtered all their adversaries and speaking to the Muslims in the only language they understand – that of blood and death.
This the Persians did, as that was how battles had been fought from time immemorial till the beastly Muslims came on the scene. Alexander did not slaughter his adversaries, neither did he forcibly convert them into Greeks. Nor did the Romans do this neither did the Byzantines, nor did the Persians.
The Persians and the Byzantines had been fighting for four hundred years till before the Arab Muslims invaded both their empires, but neither the Persians nor the Byzantines exterminate each armies to the last man, not did they torment each other’s civilian populations, and less so did they try to convert each other’s civilian population to their own faiths the way the Arab Muslims were to do with both. Today we find no Zoroastrians in Iran, Afghanistan or Baluchistan, which were rued by the Persians. As we do not find any Christians in any significant number in Syria, Jordan or Turkey which were Byzantine provinces.
With the Arabs it was going to be different. The Muslims were to slaughter all defeated armies to the last man, and then terrorize the civilian population to embrace Islam. Had the Persians known this and had they decided to respond in the same way, they should have slaughtered he entire fleeing Arab army at the Battle of Al Jisr (Battle of the Bridge) and then they should have gone into nook and cranny of Arabia (as Mohammed had done) to convert the newly converted Arab Muslims to any religion, but the vicious creed of Islam.
The Persians cannot be blamed for not doing this, since they did not know the kind of enemy that they were facing, so they allowed the retreating Muslim army to flee. An army that was to come back again to slaughter the entire Persian army at Qadissiyah and in all other battles where the Arab Muslims faced the Persians and all other adversaries, after which they were to terrorize the civilian population to embrace Islam.
But while the Persians can be forgiven for not having done that to the Muslims, today when we know what Islam is all about and we have the track record of Islam to see, it is foolish and suicidal not to do this. By “this” we mean to not just defeat Islam on the battlefield, but to forcibly convert the Muslims to any other religion, but their accursed creed of Islam by giving them a choice of giving up Islam or death. This is the lesson for us of the battle of Al Jisr (the battle of the Bridge).
An opportunity to do this was lost by the Franks at the Battle of Poitiers in 732, by the Austrians and Poles at the battle of Vienna in 1683 by the Hindus at the Battle of Tarain in 1191 at the Battle of the Bridge by the Persians in 634, and more recently at the six day war in 1967 by the Israelis; the liberation of Afghanistan in 2001 and Iraq in 2003, after which we should have forced the defeated Muslims to choose between abjuring Islam, or embracing death. But for this the non-Muslim do not yet have an understanding of their enemy – the Muslims.
We have not yet realized what can defeat Islam, once and forever. And so we have repeated the folly of letting a defeated Muslim army and nations go scot free at all these and at and countless other battles at which the victorious non-Muslims had the Muslims at their mercy. The lesson for us to learn fast is never to allow the murderous Muslims to retreat unmolested after they have been defeated, but to press on with consolidating the victory by giving the Muslim the choice of abjuring Islam or embracing death. Inhuman as this may sound, it is the only workable way of defeating Islam once and forever.
All our acts of letting Islam survive after every defeat were costly mistakes that came back to haunt humankind time and again the last time spectacularly on 9/11, and which is bound to repeat itself over and over again till the world decides that enough is enough and puts a full and final end to the menace called Islam.
The seminal Battle of Ghadasia (Cadesia or Qadisiyah) with the Persians (15 A.H., 637 C.E.)
At this seminal battle fought over four days, the Persians were led by a capable general named Rustam-e-Farrokhzad (Farokh Hormazd), and only the foul tactics of Saad-Ibn-Waqas, the Arab Muslim commander could bring defeat and death to Rustam and the Persian army. Under Saad-ibn-Waqas, the Muslims very effectively used the tactic of luring the Arab contingent to defect from the Persian army, join the Arab Muslims and betray their non-Muslim Zoroastrian paymasters. This way the Muslims could get to know the weaknesses of the Persian army and devise tactics to trick and defeat the Persians.
One of these tactics was the cutting off the girdles of the Howdas (seats) of those who were riding the elephants, so that the howdas along with the riders would fall and thus the elephant would become directionless. The elephants played havoc on the Arabs at beginning of the first day of the battle. But when the Arab contingent who had defected, betrayed the Persian paymasters and told the Arab Muslims to cut the girdles of the elephants, the elephants became directionless and useless. This was one foul tactic that the Muslims used to defeat their more superior Persian adversary.
The second tactic told by the defectors was to blind the elephants in one eye only, so that they would lose direction and flee away from the direction, of its attackers. When this gruesome act was done, the elephants turned around away from the Arab-Muslim tormentors and broke through the Persian ranks, causing disorder in the Persian army and opened up passages for the Muslims to advance into the Persian ranks. This was the second tactic which the defectors told the Arab Muslims to use, due to which the tide of the battle turned in favor of the Muslim - so much for Allah giving them victory.
The Arabs and Persians had agreed at the beginning of the battle not fight after sundown, but when the tide of the battle began to turn against the Persians on the third day of the battle, the Arabs attacked the Persians all through the night, shouting Allah-o-Akbar. This was the Night of Clangor, which sealed the fate of the battle in favor of the deceitful and barbaric Muslim Arabs.
The victory was a result of deceit, which the adversaries of the Muslims today need to remember when fighting the Muslims. Today the Muslims try to deflect the American effort at war, by many such tactics based on their mean psychology of deceit. They say that the 9/11 attacks were the handiwork of the Jews (sic). They say that they are fighting in self-defense and so they kill innocent civilians, women and children (at Beslan). They march in droves in the “Peace Rallies” in which they are encouraged by their socialist and communist 5th columnist bedmates – those accursed snakes in the grass.
This kind of deceit has been used by the Muslims in all their encounters all through the 1400 years of their existence. This base and mean mentality of the Muslims will have to borne in mind and countered if we are to finally defeat the Muslims in our generation and to permanently end the menace of Islam.
Lessons from the Battle of Ghadasia (Cadesia or Quadsiyyah) with the Persians (15 A.H., 637 C.E.)
It was at this battle that the Muslims demonstrated one of their unique techniques of decapitating the body of the commanding general of the opposite army and displaying his body to his troops to demoralize them into retreat and defeat – something which neither Alexander, nor Cyrus, nor Darius, nor Julius Caesar, nor Hannibal had done.
During the night of clangor, the Arabs waylaid the Persian general Rustam, and once they set their hands on him, they beheaded him much in the same way as Zarqawi does today with his Western captives. After this Arabs displayed Rustam’s decapitated body to the Persian army at the next morning of the fourth and final day of the battle of Qadisiyah (Cadesia).
The grisly sight of their general’s headless body riddled with arrows lying on the battlefield with his severed head pierced on a spear paraded by the depraved Muslims was a sight that even the war-hardened Persian army was not used to. This sealed the fate of the battle, and the Arabs could make short shrift of the remaining Persian army, killing it to the last man, except a few who managed to retreat towards their capital Ctesiphon, which was the next target for the attacking Muslims.
The lessons for us here is to realize the depravity of the enemy we face in the Muslims – an enemy who dances on corpses, displays body parts as souvenirs, who distributes candy to celebrate death of an adversary. Against such a ghoulish adversary, we are fully within our rights to use all the weapons in our arsenal, to reduce the enemy to dust across the entire swath of the Islamic crescent from Morocco through Algeria, Libya, Egypt, Arabia, Iran, Pakistan up to Malaysia and the Indonesian archipelago.
The Persians, who were one of the first non-Arab people, on whom the Muslims fell upon, had a tradition of single combat, which they used in many battles. The strongest person from each army would fight the champion of the adversary’s army. The winner’s army would be deemed to have won the battle, and the actual battle was not then fought, as both the armies were honor-bound to abide by the result of the duel.
The duel was a test of strength and skill. The opponents were not bound to kill their adversary, but only to defeat him, and in most cases the defeated champion was allowed to return to his camp, and his army withdrew thus preventing a battle and saving of many lives. The Persians, the pre-Islamic Turks, the Greeks and Romans had used this practice of single-combat to settle the result of many a battle. This practice was fine as long as both the adversaries were bound by honor.
But with the coming of the dishonorable Muslims, the single combat, became a farce. It was now one more tool to humiliate the enemy and to demoralize it before the actual combat could begin. Even if the Arab Champion was defeated, the Arabs would nevertheless attack the opposing army. And if the Arab champion was victorious, he would not just defeat the opposing adversary but kill him, after which the Arab army would thereupon fall on the opposing army and a carnage would follow.
The Arabs never allowed their adversaries to escape by retreating. They found sadistic glee in slaughtering their defeated opponents to the last man. The Persians were the first to bear the brunt of this beastly mentality of the Muslim Arabs.
The Persians had specialized a practice wherein they nurtured champions who were called Hazar Mard (A thousand men), which meant that these champions had the strength of a thousand men and who would fight off a champion from the opposing army to stave off the need for an actual battle.
Arab chroniclers have gloated about the heap of bones that marked every encounter of the Persians and the Arabs. At the battle of Al Madain (Tessfoon or Ctesiphon) the capital of the Sassanids, Arab chroniclers tell us that a huge camel like Persian champion named Shahryar, challenged the Arabs to a duel of single combat. They refer to him as a camel like man, perhaps since he could have had a protruding lower lip, that would have made his face look like that of a camel which also has a protruding lower lip.
This Persian champion had the Arab champion at his mercy, and was about to pin him to the ground, when the Arab champion, on realizing that he could only defeat the Persian with foul tactics, bit the Persian’s thumb so hard that he crushed it between his teeth. When the Persian momentarily withdrew writing in pain, the Arab stabbed him to death. This is one example of the foul tactics using which the Arab Muslims defeated their adversaries.
Do you want me to go on, JiHAD IS COMPULSARY FOR EVERY MUSLIM AND THEY ARE NOW IN OUR COUNTRIES, ALTHOUGH UNDER THE BANNER OF SECULARISM, BUT WHEN THEY RADICALIZE, TAKE THE KORAN AND THE HADITH TO THE LETTER, THEY WILL SURELY TRY TO CONQUER US, IT'S DANGEROUS, AND YOU CAN'T MAKE ME THINKING THE OPPOSITE WAY, iSLAM, oh, these damned capitals, anyway, my point is to not trust islam !!!
And the above I have copied and pasted from my group on Facebook :
"The Truth about Jihad and it's history"
I created this group and I have posted the whole history of Jihad, and remember my words : Islam is always spread by means of the sword.
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=341847188474#!
I sincerely hope you will join so that you can read for yourself how Islam, "the religion of peace" was spread throughout the world.
Invader
03-07-2010, 02:49 PM
I read all of it. A lot of appeal to emotion. That's an understatement.
Do you want me to go on
Actually no, I understand now. I checked out your facebook group and saw that you sport a picture of a Christian soldier (a templar, yes?). I figured your fear was due to the genuine belief that you were having visions, or as the result of some kind of media propaganda. Instead I find that you're a fanatical member of one world religion fearmongering about the fanatics of another world religion. That strikes me as pretty normal.
(You may have made that clear somewhere else in the thread, but I had only just noticed)
Islam is always spread by means of the sword.
Right. Always. All of the converts in the U.S., for instance, were converted through violence. And- Oh wait, no, they weren't...
I am not defending anything so much as I am pointing out the inconsistencies of your views.
you're a fascist and you don't know it yet, but you are a radical muslim, you love to take away our freedom, I am pretty sure about that, you fuck nut ! Don't reply here anymore !
I'm an atheist you pathetic person.
I'm an atheist you pathetic person.
Nono, you're a radical muslim. And a fascist. :D
Invader :
Quote:
Do you want me to go on
Actually no, I understand now. I checked out your facebook group and saw that you sport a picture of a Christian soldier (a templar, yes?). I figured your fear was due to the genuine belief that you were having visions, or as the result of some kind of media propaganda. Instead I find that you're a fanatical member of one world religion fearmongering about the fanatics of another world religion. That strikes me as pretty normal.
(You may have made that clear somewhere else in the thread, but I had only just noticed)
Yes, I have this profile picture of a Templar Knight, I am attracted to this period of time in history, not only because it appeals to me, but I joined the Templar Knights in a past life, in medieval times, I know 13 or 14 past lives of me, I know, it sounds weird to say that, but man, did I have realizations in the past about this, I saw and heard so much !!
Another thing, I regularly change my profile picture, I have a profile picture on Facebook of 4 smurfs as well, which represents 4 aspects of my personality, I am also a yoga teacher.
My warnings to you guys are genuinly based on my inner visions and my dreams and not upon that I am a member of the Templar Knights, I am not a member of the Templar Knights and I am far away from being a Christian, I am a Hinduist, I worship Krishna, although I am Caucasian, I am attracted by Hinduism and the spirituality of India, the motherland.
So I am not a Christian nor a Temple Knight.
Quote:
Islam is always spread by means of the sword.
Right. Always. All of the converts in the U.S., for instance, were converted through violence. And- Oh wait, no, they weren't...
I am not defending anything so much as I am pointing out the inconsistencies of your views.
You're right about it, people in the US convert nowadays because they are attracted to Islam, I made a mistake, sorry.
But in other countries it happens that muslims kill people who don't wanna convert to Islam, here's an example :
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2010/02/pakistan-taliban-behead-3-sikhs-for-refusing-to-convert-to-islam.html
A sizeable number of Sikhs lived in the tribal belt, particularly Aurakzai Agency, till the Taliban imposed jiziya (http://www.jihadwatch.org/2009/07/taliban-collecting-koran-mandated-religion-based-tax-in-pakistan.html) or religious tax on them in 2009," in accordance with Qur'an 9:29 (http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/009.qmt.html#009.029). "Three Sikhs beheaded by Taliban in Pak," from the Economic Times (http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/politics/nation/Three-Sikhs-beheaded-by-Taliban-in-Pak/articleshow/5601345.cms), February 22 (thanks to all who sent this in): NEW DELHI: In what threatens to cast a shadow on the upcoming Indo-Pakistan talks scheduled for February 25, three Sikh youths were beheaded by the Taliban in Pakistan's Federally Administered Tribal Area (FATA) region after they allegedly refused to convert to Islam. Their severed heads were dumped at a gurudwara in Peshawar. The Sikh youths -- identified as Jaspal Singh, Sarabjit Singh and Baronat Singh -- had gone to realise the money owed to them by some people in the FATA region adjoining Afghanistan, when they were abducted by the Taliban militia. They were allegedly told by the Taliban to embrace Islam or face death. When the Sikh youth refused, their heads were chopped and sent to the Bhai Joga Singh Gurudwara in Peshawar. A sizeable number of Sikhs lived in the tribal belt, particularly Aurakzai Agency, till the Taliban imposed jiziya or religious tax on them in 2009. Most members of the community, faced with increasing pressure from the Taliban to convert to Islam, have since fled to cities across Pakistan
Now, these kind of things are still going on, it happened this year !!! And the radical Islam will take power in the Western world o we will see an increase of those kind of things here as well, whenever they take power.
Xei ;
I'm an atheist you pathetic person.
So what are you doing then here, defending radical Islam on the forum religion/spirituality and calling me names ??
If you want to "broaden your horizon" why don't you buy yourself a nice present in the form of a Holy Koran ?
Dajo :
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xei http://www.dreamviews.com/community/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.dreamviews.com/community/showthread.php?p=1363063#post1363063)
I'm an atheist you pathetic person.
Nono, you're a radical muslim. And a fascist. :D
Sometimes I am going to far in my language, but why is an atheist defending radical Islam anyway ?
SkA_DaRk_Che
03-08-2010, 08:22 PM
Sometimes I am going to far in my language, but why is an atheist defending radical Islam anyway ?
He is not supporting radical Islam, rather he is dispelling your widely imaginative and irrational fear of Islam. I don't think anyone here denies Islam is a fucked up religion (just as Christianity is for that manner) or that it poses problems for society (again, just like Christianity does).
However, you are distorting any tangible facts to the point where what you say verges on Propaganda and psychosis. I mean you are having visions of a dystopian Islamicized Europe, which to put it mildly is fucken nuts. That is not to say that Islam in our societies is not an issue, but you are simply writing fiction with your xenophobic dystopian nightmares.
SkA_DaRk_Che :
He is not supporting radical Islam, rather he is dispelling your widely imaginative and irrational fear of Islam. I don't think anyone here denies Islam is a fucked up religion (just as Christianity is for that manner) or that it poses problems for society (again, just like Christianity does).
However, you are distorting any tangible facts to the point where what you say verges on Propaganda and psychosis. I mean you are having visions of a dystopian Islamicized Europe, which to put it mildly is fucken nuts. That is not to say that Islam in our societies is not an issue, but you are simply writing fiction with your xenophobic dystopian nightmares.
Why talking about fear ? I don't fear Islam, I even don't fear death or God, why should I fear something in the first place, fear is for the ignorant, not for me.
Secondly, I do believe in my inner visions, dreams, thoughts, Nostradamus and what the Holy Bible says in Revelations, there will be a war with Muslims and I am warning you people for it, again, they will take over in just one night, it's a tactic well known and used in pevious wars, just think of the Kristal Nacht, it's one example.
Okay, you migt be right that I am engaged in Propaganda against Islamic Jihadi's who want to take over the West, it's a fucking real danger ! And it needs fucking real resistance for the governments are allowing more and more muslims in our countries. And they know what will happen !
And I have no xenophobic dystopian nightmares, it all comes to me very calmly and quietly in the night, I am very relaxed whenever the inner visions or dreams are telling me things and I don't do drugs !
But hey, have it your way, one day you will wake up and say :
"My God, that fucker Erik was right after all !"
imran_p
03-10-2010, 07:05 AM
hahahaha. I don't like using words such as crazy, generally. But you sir, are one crazy fucker.
BigFan
03-10-2010, 10:07 AM
He is not supporting radical Islam, rather he is dispelling your widely imaginative and irrational fear of Islam. I don't think anyone here denies Islam is a fucked up religion (just as Christianity is for that manner) or that it poses problems for society (again, just like Christianity does).
umm, that's your opinion about Islam, not everyone else believes that it's messed up, so, I wouldn't try to pass that off as a fact. Maybe you should actually learn more about the religion instead of just listening to the news or reading random internet sites.
@erik :lol: I do have to admit that the news have done a great job causing phobias especially Islamphobia. Two smple statements that anyone can understand. Unless someone wants to convert to Islam out of their own free will, they are not a Muslim because I and a lot of other muslims wouldn't agree of their conversion by force neither would my religion itself. Second, learn some more about a religion before planning to critize it.
SkA_DaRk_Che
03-10-2010, 12:11 PM
umm, that's your opinion about Islam, not everyone else believes that it's messed up, so, I wouldn't try to pass that off as a fact. Maybe you should actually learn more about the religion instead of just listening to the news or reading random internet sites.
Man my family is Muslim, from a Muslim Country and I grew up in this religion for the first years of my life. Get off your high horse, Islam is no different than any other Religion. They(religion) are all cancers on humanity, and yes they are "fucked up".
BigFan
03-10-2010, 09:14 PM
Man my family is Muslim, from a Muslim Country and I grew up in this religion for the first years of my life. Get off your high horse, Islam is no different than any other Religion. They(religion) are all cancers on humanity, and yes they are "fucked up".
Again, that's still your opinion and growing up in a religion doesn't mean that you actually understand it. It takes years of dedication and some more and even then you've only touched the surface. Also, whether religions are all cancers on humanity or not is again your opinion and I don't plan on arguing about it, however, it's still NOT a fact. Conflicts can start due to religion, no doubt, however, that has to do with HUMANS and the way that some humans think they are superior to others due to their culture, color, religion, etc.... It's NOT the fault of the religion. If you knew anything about religions, you would know that they all tell you to practice good habits such as honesty, kindness, being helpful, etc.... which all help drive society forward. Maybe you should have actually really tried to understand Islam more before dropping the ball, but, that's not my problem and I'm not here to convince you of anything.
SkA_DaRk_Che
03-11-2010, 12:54 AM
Again, that's still your opinion and growing up in a religion doesn't mean that you actually understand it. It takes years of dedication and some more and even then you've only touched the surface. Also, whether religions are all cancers on humanity or not is again your opinion and I don't plan on arguing about it, however, it's still NOT a fact. Conflicts can start due to religion, no doubt, however, that has to do with HUMANS and the way that some humans think they are superior to others due to their culture, color, religion, etc.... It's NOT the fault of the religion. If you knew anything about religions, you would know that they all tell you to practice good habits such as honesty, kindness, being helpful, etc.... which all help drive society forward. Maybe you should have actually really tried to understand Islam more before dropping the ball, but, that's not my problem and I'm not here to convince you of anything.
That fact is that religions are extremely malleable. They have been used to encourage donating to the poor and other acts of charity, and yet those very same religions have been used to justify murdering, treachery, genocide...You name it. No religion has one true nature, they are by their very nature malleable and open to extreme interpretation to justify just about anything. And in any case, people do not need books which contain in some cases very profane material to instruct them to be good and honest human beings.
As for the fucked up aspects, just read any holy book of an Abhrahamic faith and you will see what I am talking about. These books hail from a time when human beings where superstitious and ignorant to the world...
Again, that's still your opinion
I think that's a pretty good point. Religions in general are too diverse
and complex to just state a 'fact' to describe every facette, so it is just
basically your opinion, which you are free to have. (same kind of goes
for erik, even though I strongly disaprove of this thread)
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