What You All Must Understand (Believers and Non Believers)

[spiritofthewolf]

I have been reading and somewhat replying to some peoples comments about Christianity and the Bible.... Alot of people have some negative views on Christians... I myself am a Christian..I must stand up for what is true and what is right... You must all understand that we are in a spiritual battle..even if you dont believe you are in a spiritual battle... If you do not believe it lets Satan more easily minuplate your mind,actions,thoughts,decisions because you do not have a solid ground to place your feet and every part of your soul.. Alot of people think that when they get all angry and mad and yell at somebody or say bad things about Christians its really them saying it... But sadly, it is not.. It is actually the actions of Satan working through them..Just like Jesus Christ can work through us, so can Satan..... Now you must be like..How do you know this... Well if they were SAVED and a Christian they would not ridicule people for being people..they would have loving and open arms...People talk about the BIBLE being just a story and its all made up, when again, it has been proven fact over and over again...dont believe me....take the time to read a book by Lee Strobell called "A Case For Christ" It is about an Atheist Professor who sets out to disprove Jesus Christ and who he was, but in the end becomes a believer himself because quote himself says "There is just too much evidence proving Jesus Christ and The Bible" I understand that everyone has their own opinions/beliefs and what not..But are you really willing to risk your eternal life for your own opinions.? I use to be a non believer and even did not like God but through my life events and where I am today there is no doubt there is a God.. I have heard personally many accounts by people and read books about the subjects of being brought down to hell or even brought up to heaven.. Just recently a lady around the Raleigh North Carolina area was in a hospital and was clincally dead for 4 hours.. The doctors did all they could and the coroner was on the way to come get the body.. The family was around the body and in the room and they all prayed....She ended up coming back to life and left the hosptial a few days later....Coincidence?? or Miricale??? Too bad there are no coincidences in life, and Miricales come from the Lord All in All people's eyes must be opened to the fact that there is and has always been a spiritual battle going on..Satan will tell you lies that are one inch away from the TRUTH.. He wont tell you that getting involved with drugs could cause you to go to jail or even cause you to have an addiction.. He will tell you.. "Oh come on, its fun, it feels good" Or he will even tell you "I dont see why everybody doesnt do drugs" Trust me, Ive over come a 5 year drug addiction, its crazy stuff.. I have been sober for 2 years and there is no way I just magically "Quit"... Satan is the greatest deciever of them all...You maybe reading this thinking "This guy is full of it, or stupid" but that is what the Devil wants you to think.. He doesnt want you to Love Jesus Christ and believe the Bible.....So when you are done reading this ask yourself this question.. Is this my true beliefs...or is it of Satan...If you are a believer...you already know the answer.....

[27]

Oh, I see so all of the atheists on this forum aren’t just people with a different opinion, they're possessed by the devil. Look man, this should be a place to discuss religion and accept others beliefs, not try to convert everyone to your ideas. In short, you're not helping.

[Bonsay]

What you don't understand is that if I decided to be a christian I'd be lieing. You can't just believe whatever you want... at least I can't. Convince me that trains don't exists, which also works for convincing me that god exists. I could say that I beleive that trains don't exist, but that wouldn't stop me from moving out of it's way, if I was about to be run over. Even if there is a god, it's his fault. Everything is his fault. So either he'll send me to heaven for doing what he made me do, or send me to hell for his amusement. If that's the truth, then I'd rather be with Satan. At least he doesn't hide his true nature. So it's a win, win situation really. Not believing anything is the best in my opinion, it sets you free to enjoy this strange life without any bullshit. I'd rather seek for the truth, then decide that something was true. It's quite obvious that nobody knows what's going on. When I can only be sure that I exist, no silly book or Jesus can convert me. Don't worry about satan controlling me, I'm most likey further away from him then the church is.

[Kushna Mufeed]

Satan is the greatest deciever of them all...You maybe reading this thinking "This guy is full of it, or stupid" but that is what the Devil wants you to think.. He doesnt want you to Love Jesus Christ and believe the Bible.....So when you are done reading this ask yourself this question.. Is this my true beliefs...or is it of Satan...If you are a believer...you already know the answer..... And if you're like me, you believe that the belief that God has begotten a son who has died for all your sins and been ressurected is yet another deception of the devil. Who are you to say the devil hasn't decieved you? I'm pretty sure Jesus never told anyone to worship him.

[Serkat]

Well, I have both the Satanic Bible and the Christian one and certainly the Satanic one far exceeds the Christian one both in humor and content. I'd much rather be a Satanist than a Christian. So, to answer your question, I am very much a believer in Satanism, individualism and not surrendering yourself to a higher authority, thank you very much.

[Rakjavik]

If you do not believe it lets Satan more easily minuplate your mind,actions,thoughts,decisions because you do not have a solid ground to place your feet and every part of your soul.. Personally I don't think the big red man with horns is running around and whispering in my ear. What we have is called Free Will, which you do not have because you're running your life by a 2000 year old book. Well if they were SAVED and a Christian they would not ridicule people for being people..they would have loving and open arms... How can that be? If they were, then they wouldn't be following the bible. People talk about the BIBLE being just a story and its all made up, when again, it has been proven fact over and over again...dont believe me....take the time to read a book by Lee Strobell called "A Case For Christ" In my opinion that book was terrible. Basically the whole time the guy is just using the bible to prove the bible, and some stuff they had to stretch so far it was laughable. I understand that everyone has their own opinions/beliefs and what not..But are you really willing to risk your eternal life for your own opinions.? Pascal's Wager is getting really old....... I use to be a non believer and even did not like God So you didn't believe in god but didn't like him at the same time? How can you dislike something you don't believe in? but through my life events and where I am today there is no doubt there is a God.. I have heard personally many accounts by people and read books about the subjects of being brought down to hell or even brought up to heaven.. Look up a study on NDEs. They are bullshit. The family was around the body and in the room and they all prayed....She ended up coming back to life and left the hosptial a few days later....Coincidence?? or Miricale??? Too bad there are no coincidences in life, and Miricales come from the Lord http://www.nytimes.com/2006/03/31/health/31pray.html Talking about the study of prayer in medical situations, answer? It's call chance and luck. Just like everything else in life. He (Satan) wont tell you that getting involved with drugs could cause you to go to jail or even cause you to have an addiction.. He will tell you.. "Oh come on, its fun, it feels good" Or he will even tell you "I dont see why everybody doesnt do drugs" No, common sense tells us that, and as for the end part, that's called peer pressure in high school, not satan. Trust me, Ive over come a 5 year drug addiction, its crazy stuff.. I have been sober for 2 years and there is no way I just magically "Quit"... Good job! And i really do mean that. Some people use the 12 stepper, you used religion. Whatever works, works. Satan is the greatest deciever of them all...You maybe reading this thinking "This guy is full of it, or stupid" but that is what the Devil wants you to think Full of it? no. Stupid? Well... being stupid, but not is stupid. You found something that works for you, great! Now just remove the whole thing where you look at others and think they are going to hell, that they have not reached enlightment, that you have your morals from god and they don't have any morals, that they have satan whispering sweet nothings into their ears, and....... THAT YOU ARE RIGHT AND EVERYONE IS WRONG!!!!! Just my 2 cents. peace.

[spiritofthewolf]

I read through alot of peoples posts, and to clarify some things, when i look at people I dont think "They are wrong and I am right" who am I to say that? I am no better then anybody else, we are all sinners and have fallen short of the Glory of God..You and Me and everyone on this earth deserve to perish in Hell because of our Sinning nature..But God so loved the world he gave his only begotten son so that we would not perish but have everlasting life..... I was reading these posts and my heart began to ache, I asked the Lord "What do I do?" I went to brush my teeth and he sent me a verse... Matthew 13:11 "You have been permitted to understand the secrets of the Kingdom Of Heaven, but others have not. To those who are open to my teachings,more understanding will be given, and they will have an abundance of knowledge. But to those who are not listening, even what they have will be taken away from them. That is why I tell you these stories, because people see what I do, but they dont really see. They hear what I say, but they dont really hear, and they dont understand" Jesus said STORIES because he was telling his disciples stories about a farmer spreading seed on different types of lands to try and make the seeds grow...Jesus was referring the seeds as people and their faith in how their faith may grow or not grow due to situation in life and how Satan may decieve them... Psalm 12:15 "Fools think they need no advice, but the wise listen to others" Psalm 15:23 "Everyone enjoys a fitting reply, it is wonderful to say the right thing at the right time" Psalm 15:33 "We may throw the dice, but the LORD determines how they fall"

[lonestarx]

Oh wow.... this is really sad. So everyone who posted in this thread. Answer me this if GOD is such a mean being and sends you to hell for his amusement, why send his son to die for us? if he was so heartless why not just destroy earth or open up hell unto earth so the demons could come and kill us? why have a earth? why not make one big heaven instead of having a earth and the sun? answer is he cares thats why. He cares so much that he gave us freewill.. which means to choose jesus or not.

[Merlock]

Now take all the above and put it in terms of objectivity. We are all self-aware conscious beings. It doesn't matter whether we were created by someone or if there is a god in this world. We have ultimate potential for ultimate power and knowledge. Thus, there is no being that is ultimately more powerful and knowledgable than us. Hence, if a god does exist in this world, it doesn't truly matter to us unless that deity confronts us and it becomes our unavoidable concern. You see, it doesn't matter whether God is in heaven and looking over all the people in this world, and it doesn't matter if the Devil is in hell trying to subdue us. We all have unlimited potential. You can gain enough power and knowledge to summon up the Devil and incinerate him on the spot, if he has a physical body. You can gain enough power to do absolutely anything... And yet, for whatever reasons, you choose to follow a philosophy/religion instead of forging your own, instead of doing what you decide. Yes, we are all equal. Any god is ultimately equal to any educated man in our society and to any savage but self-aware and conscious man in the midst of a forgotten jungle. The difference is only in the amount of power and knowledge any of the above mentioned beings has at the moment. But that differenece doesn't block us off from our potential. So a simple question arises: why do you follow someone's teachings if you are ultimately all-powerful and can do anything? *awaits accusations of blasphemy*

[lonestarx]

also we are his greatest creation. dont believe me? angels are awsome arent they? amazing beings who could fly and be with GOD. Also built for war against satan. But GOD placed us higher than them. For those who believe we have authority over the angels thats right over these angelic giants, we get crowns of gold, we get robes white as snow, we get to walk the streets of gold. The threasurs of heaven are for those who believe. Why risk enternal torture for what you think is right...

[Merlock]

Why risk a lifetime of wasted potential for what you think is right? Until you communicate directly with a deity, through prayer verbally or mentally, or in whatever way, you have no knowledge of their existence. And if you do communicate with a deity in every prayer (who am I to say otherwise, people don't have to share everything about themselves), sure, that proves to you that a god exists in this world. Fine. But you can still gain enough power to do absolutely anything and no god or devil, no demons or angels will be able to stop you. You say we "get" crowns of gold and robes as white as snow and "get" to walk the streets of gold? I'm not going to ask anyone what to do with my existence. If I want, I will either ask for or take those crowns and robes and I will either walk along those roads in a friendly manner or crush anyone in my path, having first acquired enough power and knowledge to do so. The class system of nobles and peasants has been destroyed in our modern society but religions still cling to it, it seems. The peasants too thought that their lords were ultimately superior. They bowed to them and served them. But then, when they grew wiser, they realised that they were equal and rose up against them. So what's the point in remaining a peasant? Is it comforting to think you have a master? Perhaps to some. But it's also diminishing. The very thought of being ultimately less powerful than another being is bogus.

[lonestarx]

LOL nice merlock. Answer me this though: why do you think you have a unlimited potential for knowledge? you said it yourself bud we can summon satan and have power beyond our dreams BUT the question is why? Its because we were MADE IN THE IMAGE OF GOD!! thats right our potential, our power, knowledge and what not is because we were MADE IN THE IMAGE OF GOD. God is the almighty, it makes sense for us, his greatest creation to be all knowledgable and all powerful ON THIS EARTH.

[skysaw]

Well if they were SAVED and a Christian they would not ridicule people for being people..they would have loving and open arms... Then tell me please. Where are these saved people? Every Christian I've ever met has been just as eager to ridicule as anyone else. On the whole, I look at all the religious people I know against all the non-religious people I know. And you know what? The non-religious ones are much more tolerant of other people and beliefs in general. What does this mean to you?

[Replicon]

On the whole, I look at all the religious people I know against all the non-religious people I know. And you know what? The non-religious ones are much more tolerant of other people and beliefs in general. What does this mean to you? Actually, I find it's more even. Whether they're theists, deists, atheists or agnostics, I've found tolerance (and lack thereof) to be pretty evenly distributed. @OP: But are you really willing to risk your eternal life for your own opinions.? You are implying that belief is a choice. This fundamental lack of understanding not only makes your entire argument fall flat on its face (don't even have to go into the Satan stuff), but also has the potential to make you into a less tolerant person (e.g. towards gays).

[spiritofthewolf]

Actually, I find it's more even. Whether they're theists, deists, atheists or agnostics, I've found tolerance (and lack thereof) to be pretty evenly distributed. @OP: You are implying that belief is a choice. This fundamental lack of understanding not only makes your entire argument fall flat on its face (don't even have to go into the Satan stuff), but also has the potential to make you into a less tolerant person (e.g. towards gays). I have nothing against Gays what so ever..Do I think the action of being GAY is wrong yes, but do i automatically shun that person away...no... I am not here to say "You must believe!" I can not make anybody believe, I can only deliever the message that Christ has asked us all to do..It is your choice if you want to deliever that message or not...In the end we will all be judged according to our works..... There have been people that have said the Bible is a lie...Well would you let someone kill you for a lie, or would you give up everything you had right now for a lie...Judas gave up Jesus for 30 pieces of silver, but in the end realized his mistake, and tossed them back, and hung himself.. Now if Jesus was a lie, you really think he would do that? What about Peter? He ended up being cruxcified UPSIDE DOWN...which is way worse then being up right.. Now you really think that they would give up their lives and everything they had for a Lie...We all know none of us would...so why would they?

[Bonsay]

Oh wow.... this is really sad. So everyone who posted in this thread. Answer me this if GOD is such a mean being and sends you to hell for his amusement, why send his son to die for us? if he was so heartless why not just destroy earth or open up hell unto earth so the demons could come and kill us? why have a earth? why not make one big heaven instead of having a earth and the sun? answer is he cares thats why. He cares so much that he gave us freewill.. which means to choose jesus or not. What cool dude. I have a chocie, but if I chose something else I got eternal suffering. He never asked me if I wanted to exist, if your god exists I'm just a slave of his, even worse than that actually. Why wouldn't he open the hell on earth and let deamons come an kill us? Actually it sounds like something god would be more then willing to do. Also I don't believe in free will, so he never gave me that either. When you are an allpowerfull being, sending your son to death means nothing at all, so he did that for his amusement, it's not my fault if he is a sadist. People have died in way worse ways than Jesus did, it's funny because it was in the name of god a lot of times. I'm glad he cares, I could teach him a thing or two about caring. He could get rid of hell, for a start. also we are his greatest creation. dont believe me? angels are awsome arent they? amazing beings who could fly and be with GOD. Also built for war against satan. But GOD placed us higher than them. For those who believe we have authority over the angels thats right over these angelic giants, we get crowns of gold, we get robes white as snow, we get to walk the streets of gold. The threasurs of heaven are for those who believe. Why risk enternal torture for what you think is right... That's bullshit. If I'm so above angels, why don't they go to hell instead of me? Flying really isn't that amazing, perhaps if you are an uneducated farmer 2000 years ago, which I'm not. Crowns of gold, white robes, golden streets... it's all meaningless if you aren't a farmer 2000 years ago, who could only dream of a better life, where he is not a slave and poor. This religion was a great tool for the rulers in those days: work, pray and shut up in this life and you'll be happy after you die or else... hell. Sorry, streets of gold don't motivate me.

[lonestarx]

also I found something intresting my teacher told us. For many years the bible was thought of as a lie because ( I forgot what the name was) it spoke of a acient city that was not real so therefore untrue But several years later they FOUND the city underground. The bible is indeed the word of GOD. Ever wonder when we say the name Jesus everyone crinches or their hearts jump or they simply refuse to hear anything aboult it. Its because that name gives of so much power. Try to prove the bible wrong; u cant.

[Carôusoul]

The christian God does not exist. I don't care about any of your experiences or anything you have to say unless you can rationally show me even a scrap of evidence for his existence. You're brainwashed into believing from birth (I assume from your style of argument ie. Take god for granted and work from there.) Look at your beliefs objectively, for just one moment. You'll see how ridiculous it is.

[Bonsay]

also I found something intresting my teacher told us. For many years the bible was thought of as a lie because ( I forgot what the name was) it spoke of a acient city that was not real so therefore untrue But several years later they FOUND the city underground. The bible is indeed the word of GOD. Ever wonder when we say the name Jesus everyone crinches or their hearts jump or they simply refuse to hear anything aboult it. Its because that name gives of so much power. Try to prove the bible wrong; u cant. Try to prove the Flying Spaghetti Monster... u can't. So much power...I don't want to hear anything about it, I'm resting from the heart jump. Although I don't agree with their tactics they get a point across... Also here's a funny video on that matter, which you might find very insightfull.

[Carôusoul]

Try to prove the Flying Spaghetti Monster... u can't. So much power...I don't want to hear anything about it, I'm resting from the heart jump. Although I don't agree with their tactics they get a point across... Also here's a funny video on that matter, which you might find very insightfull. This needs editing to be " you cant DISPROVE the flying spaghetti monster"

[lonestarx]

prove there isnt a God then? what you cant? Yea Im sorry I believe that heaven awaits me and a perfect world instead of I guess what becoming soil. The evident truth is, its your choice. Me and spiritofthewolf could argue with u till the cows come home. We try to convert cause thats what the Lords said to do. The way we look at it ur headed into a deathtrap wouldnt u want someone to warn u? just the same. Your headed to a horrible place where ull be tortoured forever and were just trying to warn...

[Carôusoul]

prove there isnt a God then? what you cant? Yea Im sorry I believe that heaven awaits me and a perfect world instead of I guess what becoming soil. The evident truth is, its your choice. Me and spiritofthewolf could argue with u till the cows come home. We try to convert cause thats what the Lords said to do. The way we look at it ur headed into a deathtrap wouldnt u want someone to warn u? just the same. Your headed to a horrible place where ull be tortoured forever and were just trying to warn... prove there isnt a china teapot and two spoons orbiting the moon then? what you cant? yea Im sorry I believe that tea awaits me and a perfect level of milk and sugar instead of I guess what having coffee. The evident truth is, its your choice. Me and GeorgeForeman could argue with you til the cows come home. We try to convert cause that's what the china teapot has said to do according to a book I found. The was we look at it ur headed into a coffee house wouldnt u want someone to warn u? just the same. Your headed to a horrible place where you'll drink coffee forever and were just trying to warn... I think you'll find, dear christian, you can't disprove any of the above.

[spiritofthewolf]

we can argue and argue all we want about all this...but we know one thing for sure, we will all die.....and in the end the truth will be revealed....the truth is Jesus Christ...he said it himself.. "I am the TRUTH, the way, and life, nobody comes to the father except through me" One day every knee will bow.....

[Needcatscan]

You sound like an indoctrinated 12-year-old. And for the love of a non-existent god, please stop capitalizing TRUTH. You are a sadly disillusioned christian and completely stuck in your own way of thinking. Why aren't Muslims right? They have a holy book, they have a god, they have a prophet. Why aren't Jews right? The first half of your book is their holy book. Why aren't Hindus right? Jainism? Buddhism? The church of John Frum? To quote Sam Harris: "Most religions have merely canonized a few products of ancient ignorance and derangement and passed them down to us as though they were primordial truths." In a nutshell, religion was born from the infancy of our species to explain things our ancestors couldn't. Why when some ships sail did the hurricanes come and destroy them? Well, obviously there is a god behind it, Poseidon! What is this big glowing thing in the sky that keeps our planet alive and us warm? It must be a god, we'll call it Ra! So on and so forth. Ask yourself a question, if our ancestors who created the first religion with the first god knew what we know today about cosmology, biology, astronomy, etc. would the thought of god ever have arisen? You sit at your computer and type things like TRUTH and HELL and HEAVEN, but you have absolutely no basis for those except for the scribblings of an ancient book written by people who thought the earth was flat, the earth was the center of the universe, seizures were actually demonic possession, and sickness, pestilence, and drought were god's ways of punishing people. Yet you believe it as if god came down in the clouds and told you himself. I was just like you when I was a teenager living at home. I was a christian warrior, a fighter for god. Then you know what happened? I grew up. it is time spiritofthewolf and lonestarx to grow up and let go of "faith as a child". Because that's what it is, child-like faith, because children will believe anything, just like I'm sure 90% of us who live in america believed in this crap when our parents taught it to us. Just like you realized that Santa Claus wasn't real, the teenage mutant ninja turtles weren't real, you need to step back and see that the omnipotent, omnicient, loving creator, hell, and heaven aren't real. PS. Lee's books The Case for Christ and The Case for Faith were extremely UNconvincing, and I read those before I became an atheist.

[cuddleyperson]

can a Christian just answer one question for me please. You know the bible warns of false prophets, well Jesus does in Matthew. "For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been from the beginning of the world until now, no, and never will be. And if those days had not been shortened, no human being would be saved; but for the sake of The Elect those days will be shortened. Then if any one says to you, 'Lo, here is the Christ!' or 'There He is!' do not believe it. For False Christs and false prophets will arise and show great signs and wonders, so as to lead astray, if possible, even the elect. Lo, I have told you beforehand. So, if they say to you, 'Lo, He is in the wilderness,' do not go out; if they say, 'Lo, He is in the inner rooms,' do not believe it. For as the lightning comes from the east and shines as far as the west, so will be the coming of the Son of man. Wherever the body is, there the eagles will be gathered together." (Matthew 24:21-28 RSV) Things is... how do we know he isn't a false prophet himself? We should not trust one who puts himself equal to god or higher. Yet Jesus does this and opnely says he is here to change his fathers rules, circumvent them. He is putting himself above God, saying they are separate beings, how do we know he was not a false prophet making us believe in a very similar but slightly different God, which would mean we would be worshiping a false idol.( however he also says they are same, so it depends which scripture we examine). ALSO. God says disease and non-believers are under Satan's influence yes? You say it yourself in this thread. So maybe you Christians are stronger then us, you can resistant and see past lies and deceit, we are the weaker ones who couldn't fight Satan's lies. Does that mean we deserve endless suffering? Our limbs being severed over and over, never ending pain and suffering beyond imagination, just because we couldn't resist Satan? Is God not responsible for his children, he is supposed to be a all loving being and he can do ANYTHING. Can he not save us? He have not heard his words properly, can he not come to us at death and show that we are wrong, then give us the chance to free our selfs of Satan's grasp? This is a small feat for a being who could in fact destroy Satan and Hell if he wished. Why does he not save his weak children as we humans help the sick and the mentally handicapped? Also you say there is a spiritual war? I find it interesting that since in the words of your God Muslims, Hindus, Buddhist and all others who worship false idols will go to hell, we large majority of humans are doomed to hell. God is losing the majority of his children, he is losing this war. Yet Satan is simply a fallen angle, where as God is the ultimate being. He has not stopped these false religions from growing as large as they have done, does he not care? Why not show himself to us or sent another messenger to perform the many public miracles that were needed for followers to believe 2000 years ago? Also as you know Christians are only 2000 years old. Though Jews are older and follow your God. But what about ancient religions, those who have many Gods ruling over elements, nature etc. They are not your God, yet they existed before. Does God continually change his mind about how he wishes to be worshiped, or did he only show himself to the Jews and let earlier generations and parts of the world worship false idols and in so doing doomed them to Hell, or is Hell a new concept that your God created? These are just a few of my queries, any replies would be great.