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    Thread: Patjunfa's workbook

    1. #51
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      tnks. that's generally how I approach stabilisation. it can be good as an initial focus to become grounded in the dream and channel attention away from sabotaging thoughts such as happened in that LD. was strange how those thoughts came as an unexpected wave which was hard to counter. that's why I wish I'd focused on something stabilising at that point..
      done a number of good wbtb's over last week. not much effect. enjoying the wbtb though... bits of writing and/or music...
      I've really wanted to try out the TOTM before the month is over as flying in space is an old goal. experience vastness of mind. also making yourself big enough to hold onto the moon. good skill building in those tasks...I found last couple of months TOTM gave me good learning's... don't know what's behind dry spells though...part of many lucid dreamers experience. why does it happen though?...can become a bit of a viscous cycle as Aaronoscar has pointed out before. harder to put enthuasism and confidence in when it feels like its been a while since last quality lucid...goina keep up wbtbs. somewhat negotiating early bed times with wife as were enjoying a Netflix series and bed time is only real time...also considering trying Galantamine again to break the dry spell. long time ago I used to find it good. last times trying it left me feeling seasick so haven't felt like it. may experiment with again as want to get back to lucid exploration...
      " The bad news is your falling through the air, nothing to hang on to, no parachute. The good news is that theres no ground" - Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche

    2. #52
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      On WBTB at mo. Lovely clear night when clouds part, so have had a nice 3am wander. Such a nice time to be awake, looking around knowing a blanket of unconsciousness or dreaming covers all the houses nearby.

      I was thinking, I woke at 3 as per my plan. I can wake myself pretty much at any time and as often as I plan during the night, generally, and without alarm. There's some ability to carry intention and awareness throughout the night...need to find my way of transferring this ability into effective LD practice...

      Time to fit in with what my friends are doing and become unconscious. Subtle difference will be my awareness dancing consciously through internal states. TOTM, flying to a star (towards one anyway) getting nailed tonight!
      Good luck to all dreamers out there
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      " The bad news is your falling through the air, nothing to hang on to, no parachute. The good news is that theres no ground" - Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche

    3. #53
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      Quote Originally Posted by Patjunfa View Post
      On WBTB at mo. Lovely clear night when clouds part, so have had a nice 3am wander. Such a nice time to be awake, looking around knowing a blanket of unconsciousness or dreaming covers all the houses nearby.

      I was thinking, I woke at 3 as per my plan. I can wake myself pretty much at any time and as often as I plan during the night, generally, and without alarm. There's some ability to carry intention and awareness throughout the night...need to find my way of transferring this ability into effective LD practice...

      Time to fit in with what my friends are doing and become unconscious. Subtle difference will be my awareness dancing consciously through internal states. TOTM, flying to a star (towards one anyway) getting nailed tonight!
      Good luck to all dreamers out there
      Loving this entire post!!
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    4. #54
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      no lucidity. had underlined obvious dream signs, went back to bed at 4. practiced SSILD. woke a bit startled that it was almost morning at 6.20 (usually after a wbtb, I'd wake a couple of times and have a sense of the passage of time). tryed for a WILD. didn't fully get to sleep but to a lovely rested inbetween space and got up in really good mind state at 7.15
      the quest continues.
      " The bad news is your falling through the air, nothing to hang on to, no parachute. The good news is that theres no ground" - Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche

    5. #55
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      Finally broke the dry spell! Decided to try Galantamine again to help.

      Started with a bit of a weird WILD. Body was plesently relaxted, loud roaring sounds. Noticed my heart was beating faster than usual. Hypnogogia for a good while but not solidifying…tried to lift out of bed, or rub hands in case I could move. Kind of can move…not quite able to get hands together…floating in the room, spinning without direction. Could make sea sick but is fine. Send thanks to the dream and dream world, feels better, still no control in dream, think to try and turn on the light, may make the room brighter, still cant control arms properly to touch switch…turning round, try again…not quite. Find myself near window, bit more control and solidish-ok will go out-move out through window…still semi around me-floating up around house-v green walls-can see hands more vividly- do a bit of Tai Chi then wake

      Had spent a long time getting back to sleep and dream had felt quite light, so sense the Galantamine was having me too awake, so got up and took a tiny bit of melatonin. And after some good sleep and non lucids a lucid started

      I a big room, cool music in background “nice- Soundtrack!”, look at hands, reminding self this is a dream-a friend appears, lots of boken (wooden swords) on ground-cool, we do some sword work, him with sword, me with knife, defending it, then with 2 knives, hes teaching me
      Non lucid - A woman at the door of place I’m staying in-become lucid, mmm, could have sex if I let that woman come in…then think, no better things I want to do with dream “how will I get to Space?” (as per dp)…call out, walking in garden with others. A woman there crouches down, I climb onto her back, we jump up high, I’ve fist raised, looking up-greyish…after a time I say “I can see stars”! lots of them..keep traveling, white dots all around. Think I’m meant to describe solar system, becomes cool blueish with red orbs/lights. Find myself back in big house/manor (like as if it’s the next morning)-walk to window, quite high up (5 storys?)- musical intstruments around-say to a woman there, “can I have a hug please?”-feels like lovely contact-tender- say to another woman…also lovely hug- a number of women there, 2 hugging…I walk out, considering next task but wake

      Delighted to have a TOTM b4 end of month. Hope moving out of dry spell. Nice to have good experience with supplement’s. Wouldn’t see myself using them often though
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      " The bad news is your falling through the air, nothing to hang on to, no parachute. The good news is that theres no ground" - Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche

    6. #56
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      Congratulations Patjunfa! A WILD and a DILD later, very nice!
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    7. #57
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      DEILD success last night. Hope that gives me a new direction for play. didn't have too many hours sleep so just intended wake after dream, as happened. Reformed. played with DC, called out Shadow come to me. Charlie Morley, dressed as a devil was there, playing Piano. I sat behind and asked him to teach me something, showed me stuff on keys...Not massive but kinda cool n nice to be building confidence again, esp with relatively short hours sleep
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      " The bad news is your falling through the air, nothing to hang on to, no parachute. The good news is that theres no ground" - Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche

    8. #58
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      Nice! Another DEILD! And Charlie Morley.

      DEILDs sound like something that could work for you well to regularly supplement your standard WILDs and your DILDs with additional focus towards them.

      Congratulations!
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    9. #59
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      No lucidity the last while. Been doing some WBTB's with SSIlD and MIlD, but not as much as I'd like if really going for it. Watching a series on Netflix with my wife which competes for early nights. Sleep ins are a long distant memory. Been trying DEILD a bit. As I've mentioned before, I have a good ability to wake up whenever I want, often seeing the clock regularly through the night in an undisturbed sort of way. I've thought this could be a good ability to pair with DEIlD attempts. While it's worked sometimes for me, even on nights with not that many hours sleep, I feel I have a good bit to learn with it as a technique. When I set DEiLD intention, I commonly wake after a dream and impulsively stretch or turn over, making an easy transition more difficult. Yesterday during the day I was playing with the intention of noticing any impulses to stretch or change position, then wait a moment. At night I was setting the intention of noticing the impulse to stretch or change position, assuming this may come after a dream and sleep cycle. I noticed once, paused as per plan, was recalling the dream and then stretching impulse sneaked up on me and I was stretching b4 I knew it.
      I like it as an induction as it doesn't wake me up so much, that if there's noise around, I still get to sleep easily. Will keep playing with
      " The bad news is your falling through the air, nothing to hang on to, no parachute. The good news is that theres no ground" - Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche

    10. #60
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      Quote Originally Posted by Patjunfa View Post
      Been trying DEILD a bit. As I've mentioned before, I have a good ability to wake up whenever I want, often seeing the clock regularly through the night in an undisturbed sort of way. I've thought this could be a good ability to pair with DEIlD attempts. While it's worked sometimes for me, even on nights with not that many hours sleep, I feel I have a good bit to learn with it as a technique. When I set DEiLD intention, I commonly wake after a dream and impulsively stretch or turn over, making an easy transition more difficult. Yesterday during the day I was playing with the intention of noticing any impulses to stretch or change position, then wait a moment. At night I was setting the intention of noticing the impulse to stretch or change position, assuming this may come after a dream and sleep cycle. I noticed once, paused as per plan, was recalling the dream and then stretching impulse sneaked up on me and I was stretching b4 I knew it.
      I like it as an induction as it doesn't wake me up so much, that if there's noise around, I still get to sleep easily. Will keep playing with
      That day practice is a good idea to help remember to stay still when in the more foggy stage of brief awakenings. Opening the eyes to look at the clock is good for statistics, but it is better to keep your eyes closed when going for DEILDs...though it doesn't have to end your chances…so if you forget and do open your eyes, don't worry that you opened your eyes and just get back to trying to go back into the dream. That urge to stretch or adjust your position is often difficult to resist, so that is another situation where you might want to try to reach your mind back towards dreamland and away from your waking body, but if you must stretch - do so briefly and then reach again for dreamland. Some people like to imagine their head sinking deep into the pillow or their body sinking back into the bed.
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    11. #61
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      Been a while since posting. Still been a generally dry spell, with the effect that practice lost some momentum. It felt like the key was not working any more in the way I had become used to using it. What seemed like the same approach, method, mindset etc.I'd be curious to know what actually happens, why things work sometimes and with similar seeming conditions another time, nada... At a point I kinda choose then just record the night, build more curiosity and naturalness to sleep and dream life, which has been nice in some ways. Cultivating gratitude upon waking feels really nice. I don't ideally want lucid practice to build frustration and striving mindset. There seems such balance between setting intent and mindfully flowing with whatever happens or pulling back a bit if getting too tense. yet if not enough intent, then refocusing...
      Had a nice short WILD last week. did a WBTB and then 61 point relaxation technique, which used to be a favourite. Lovely transition into sleep, v relaxed mind, energetic streamings as body seems to be floating upwards. Then a fairly short Lucid, with good awarness but not much direction.
      Rebuilding intent now. A bit of the momentum still not back enforce ie. reality checks arent as frequent as could be, and other aspects of confidence etc.
      Had nice lucid group meeting the other day. Having others to chat about lucidity is exciting. Also with Aaron back in Ireland, setting goals together really builds enthusiasm.
      Bonus TOTM looks v interesting. Make your Mind into a tower and explore different levels. Goina do this soon as I can. Feels good to be back with intent.Thanks Fogelsbie for all your help so far.
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      " The bad news is your falling through the air, nothing to hang on to, no parachute. The good news is that theres no ground" - Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche

    12. #62
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      Quote Originally Posted by Patjunfa View Post
      Been a while since posting. Still been a generally dry spell, with the effect that practice lost some momentum. It felt like the key was not working any more in the way I had become used to using it.
      Continuing with the key analogy, usually a key works great but there are occasions where you may need to jiggle the key, oil the latch, replace the lock, or double check that we are using the original key for the lock. Sometimes we need to try something a little different and sometimes we need something quite a bit different to get back into our "groove." This is where good notes on what exactly you are doing during strong periods of lucidity comes in handy. Feel free to use this workbook to track what all you are doing at any given moment.

      What seemed like the same approach, method, mindset etc.
      So it could be that you are forgetting some key parts of your approach, method and mindset or it could be that you just need to change up your approach a little to keep it fresh while giving yourself a chance to get back to regular LDs and get your confidence back. It is not uncommon for me to cycle through a number of different practices but always maintaining a core of some type of awareness work and WBTBs.

      At a point I kinda choose then just record the night, build more curiosity and naturalness to sleep and dream life, which has been nice in some ways. Cultivating gratitude upon waking feels really nice. I don't ideally want lucid practice to build frustration and striving mindset. There seems such balance between setting intent and mindfully flowing with whatever happens or pulling back a bit if getting too tense. yet if not enough intent, then refocusing...
      This sounds like a good approach. I have seen the negative effect of trying too hard or stressing about trying to become lucid. We have these competitions on DV from time to time and people that know how to lucid dream sometimes have trouble during the competition and when they take a more "what will be will be" attitude while still putting in appropriate effort (or riding on the effort up until the point they decided to relax), they often break their little dry spells.

      Had a nice short WILD last week. did a WBTB and then 61 point relaxation technique, which used to be a favourite. Lovely transition into sleep, v relaxed mind, energetic streamings as body seems to be floating upwards. Then a fairly short Lucid, with good awarness but not much direction.
      Congratulations! Pat yourself on the back for nice successes like this and even the little successes in between. Little successes can be things like "Good job!..I was quite mindful in that situation which allowed me to react more beneficially."

      Had nice lucid group meeting the other day. Having others to chat about lucidity is exciting. Also with Aaron back in Ireland, setting goals together really builds enthusiasm.
      Bonus TOTM looks v interesting. Make your Mind into a tower and explore different levels. Goina do this soon as I can. Feels good to be back with intent.Thanks Fogelsbie for all your help so far.
      You're very welcome. I wish I had a magic bullet to pass you (closest thing I know to a magic bullet is WBTB) but I know that you can do it, you just have to find what actually works for you to get you back to regular lucidity. I do envy that you have a lucidity group and a friend that shares your interest in lucid dreaming that you can see on a regular basis.
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    13. #63
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      Quote Originally Posted by fogelbise View Post
      I do envy that you have a lucidity group and a friend that shares your interest in lucid dreaming that you can see on a regular basis.
      Defiantly fortunate in this regard. Asides from being able to chat about lucid stuff n share enthusiasm and reflections, its v nice on wbtb to have a friend. A bit like going for a run with a friend stops you backing out and being lazy. Other day myself and Aaron met on wbtb n went for lovely walk under clear stary night. Feels like a good USS of time on wbtb. Didn't result in lucidity but a couple of FA's n a DC talking about dreams.
      Nice to have a carryover from wbtb. Defiantly has an effect .
      with the FA's. I intend RC'ing on awakening and as soon as I see my family after wbtb. Yet a regular dream sign (as happened also on this night) is that one kids comes and wakes me early. I know I've had at least 1 LD where I've RC'd when this happens. Yet for the predictibility of this dream sign occurring after wbtb, its odd how I almost never become lucid with it...

      [QUOTE]Feel free to use this workbook to track what all you are doing at any given moment./QUOTE]
      Tnks.this workbook has been v useful so far. Keeping track of my efforts would b good to b clear on what efforts I am making and help focus more on what I am doing which is in my control, and less just on lucidity, which is less in my control


      On wbtb at mo. Gives me time to post here. Back to bed now. 4.30 am. Tnks n here's hoping for a lovely lucid spell for everyone
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      " The bad news is your falling through the air, nothing to hang on to, no parachute. The good news is that theres no ground" - Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche

    14. #64
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      Have you tried using MILD with visualization of both the kid waking you up early and then realizing that you are dreaming and doing the same MILD with visualization of seeing your family after WBTB?
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      Yeh. Being familiar with it now I generally plan and visulise this and also RC when I see any of them in morning. Almost never actually get it tho...think its a fear of being disturbed after effort of slowly getting to sleep, as has actuay happened at times. Also sometimes I wake myself up to say hi, frustratingly...
      Had a few short LDs over last while. 2 in 1 night, 1 of which spontaneous n v early on. Short n undramatic but nice. Did a bit of tai chi in one and met my old dog in another, visualised a lead and went running with him. enough to get me excited about being back in the lucid playground. Also familiar again with the feel of lucidity
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    16. #66
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      Congrats on the LDs! It's good to see you around Patjunfa.

      Quote Originally Posted by Patjunfa View Post
      ...think its a fear of being disturbed after effort of slowly getting to sleep, as has actuay happened at times. Also sometimes I wake myself up to say hi, frustratingly...
      I like to assume the sounds of family, or of just about anything, are HH's and many times it leads me quickly into a dream. I bet if family are really there that they wouldn't mind you continuing to snooze, they'd probably think you were just deep asleep…But, assume that it is just HHs and it keeps you in appropriate dreamy thoughts conducive to DEILDing or at least getting back to dreaming with a chance of a DILD especially considering that you were just thinking dreamy thoughts (those HHs!).
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    17. #67
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      hiya
      Consciously I assume and expect it as a HH, but mostly that doesn't filter through into expectations while in dreamland. Similar to how I have two regular dream signs of something martial arts related (I teach martial arts) and something sexual (I'm a bloke ). Im fairly good at RC'ing in all these situations in waking life. sometimes I visualise them all as going back asleep. I'm sometimes unsure with MILD if I should visualise being lucid with just the last dream or with 1 or all current dream signs... sometimes this can feel a bit unfocused yet sometimes I feel like trying to cover all bases. hoping for an early night tonight and a wbtb. also entering summer season soon so will b more relaxed and hopefully more time for lucid dreaming

      all the best
      " The bad news is your falling through the air, nothing to hang on to, no parachute. The good news is that theres no ground" - Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche

    18. #68
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      Quote Originally Posted by Patjunfa View Post
      sometimes I visualise them all as going back asleep. I'm sometimes unsure with MILD if I should visualise being lucid with just the last dream or with 1 or all current dream signs... sometimes this can feel a bit unfocused yet sometimes I feel like trying to cover all bases.
      The last dream can be powerful if it is still vivid and fresh in your memory. I believe that anything that you can visualize vividly, while recreating a strong feeling of the moment of becoming lucid, will pay dividends.

      All the best to you as well!
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      Been a good while since I've posted.
      I'd been on a dry spell. Hasn't properly let up to allow sustained periods of long quality lucids. However there have been some beautiful shorter lucids arriving

      2 particularly nice one's
      In one I call out 'can I kno what is beyond the sense of the passage of time'. My daughter in the dream says no, or not possible at this time. I call out may I experience non dual awareness, I start to float, looking downwards, my vision broadening beyond normal perspective...not sure do I become the air
      In another lucid, I dissolve into light, a darkish purplish light, mind is very silent,absorbed in experience, I realise that this is always underneath experience...sense of Being consciousness underneath its contents...reflect that th experience is lasting, like a meditative experience in a LD. Goes on into a FA. Lovely afterglow from this. Plugging back into the sense of recognition

      I like the TOTM at the moment, entering a poster and also going back to witness my own birth. These are my current dream goals. Alongside just feeling confident in having regular lucid access again. Been a while since done good WBTB and RC's are a less frequent practice at the moment. Becomes somewhat self reinforcing. Good lucids motivate good practice which helps induction. Dry spells starve motivation so I don't put as much in to creating the conditions. Such a nebulous skill to develop. Very different to learning martial arts or music, which at some level you consistently get better at...now and August should still be good times of relaxed enough schedule. Still mostly doing MILD, occasional WILD efforts, some WBTB, RC's in day, sometimes visualising becoming lucid. Sometimes needing just to focus on recall to build this to enable practice. When on form I may wake a few times by intention and write some dreams. Fingers crossed for a nice lucid period and for ongoing skill development
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    20. #70
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      Not super habit over last week has been waking at about 3-4 with recall n writing setting intention and on subsequent wakings not wishing to write case I either wake my wife or find it hard to go back asleep. Holding onto a number of dreams in short term memory seems to overfill the bank and when I actually wake finally at about 8 these days I sometimes have no recall. Intention now is to write only a few words on subsequent wakings. For the sake of later recalls and also to become quicker at journaling.
      " The bad news is your falling through the air, nothing to hang on to, no parachute. The good news is that theres no ground" - Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche

    21. #71
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      It's good to see you back here and to hear about your lucids. Yes, I don't think that it ever becomes "like riding a bike." Maybe for a select few naturals. I was listening to Daniel Love's youtube new "lucid minds" live stream and he mentioned after decades of practice, it still requires effort. I am sure Sageous would say the same thing as well as he talks about preparing for his WILD dives. It certainly still requires effort for me, but there is also such a thing as trying too hard in this endeavor.

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