Thread: Chakras...Only respond if you can spell

Originally posted by mongreloctopus
I recently had a strange experience with somewhat of a Taijutu expert who, through the course of his training, had learned a wide variety of ancient japanese healing systems that involve the use of accupressure, massage and chakras. I am pretty skeptical by nature, but lately I have come to the realization that assuming that I know what's real and what isn't is pretty naïve...

So...I am interested in hearing from someone who has actual knowledge of anything substantial chakra-related. I'm not interested in links to websites, because I can just as easily as anyone else type "chakra" into google. Also, if you can't spell, have a poor grasp of english grammar, don't sound like you know what you're talking about, and especially if you don't know what you're talking about, don't bother responding. I am looking for real insight.




Also, as I said above, I am trying to be more open-minded, but this does not extend to anything new-age related (only the ancient)...So, if thats from where your knowledge comes, I am not interested.

Wow.

Let me try and explain best as I can in a nutshell.

The body is a vehicle to what has been termed the soul or spirit, much as a car is a vehicle. It serves purpose for certain things, there is one quote that may be of interest to you that I have heard often in regards to this, "we are not physical beings living a spiritual purpose, we are spiritual beings exploring a physical reality" more or less, (not verbatim). There is more, you have other bodies, though more subtle are most equally important in their own rights, if not more. One of these bodies has been termed the etheric or energy body, in which, as you may guess, contains the chakras. If you can think of the physical body, how it will take in food and air and heat and produce energy in many forms from these substances so does the energy body take in raw energies, in which it will be refined within chakras and provide for you. Even so, the energy body has a greater effect on the physical than most are able to realize, as you may well have inclinations towards in what you described in the above healing methods. But think for a moment if one was not getting enough raw energy to their energy body, what else should be expected but ailments?

That is about the best I can describe or am apt to atm as I am quite tired, and since you didnt ask a specific question. I am open to more discussion on msn chat if you like any time, and prefer you pm me first about this.

i don't have much time right now, but i'll throw a couple concepts out there for you to investigate.

firstly, i understand your disdain for the 'new age' literature and teachings. much of it is indeed superstitious nonsense, and a waste of time. however, any 'new age' teaching which has any substance is derived from 'ancient sources'. from meditation techniques, to sacred geometry, even lucid dreaming (the ancient egypians spoke of one's twin' or 'ka' which could leave the body), etc.
the new age itself refers to the supposed 'age of aquarius', which is based upon various astrological systems dating back thousands of years.

anyways, to address your interest in the chakras.

i am positive you would find the scientific experiments of Hans Jenny to be of considerable interest as you look into chakras. These experiments are primarily based upon the principle of sound, and its interaction with matter.
as each chakra has a corresponding hand position and vocal mantra, you obviously see how this is relevant...

The basic setup used by this brilliant doctor/scientist consisted of a circular metal plate which was hooked up to a crystal oscillator which generated pure tones (completely audible), which in turn vibrated the metal plate.

upon this vibrating plate he placed various liquids, pastes, spores, and metal filings, and documented the results.

i have the book in which all his major findings are presented (complete with excellent pictures), as well as two videos which show his experiments in progress.

if you go to this link, you will find two pictures. they are of a drop of water which is being vibrated with two different audible vibrations. they are not computer generated, it is simply the light making the vibrational nodes visible

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cymatics

. the vibrational patterns generated through the plate cause various substances to form patterns. many resemble ameoba, honeycombs, a human iris, geological formations, etc.

essentially, his conclusion was that all of existence is generated by 'sound', in the purely vibrational sense. or, as the ancient vedic/'hindu' tradition states "Nada Brahma, the world is Sound". incidentially, the same ancients who claimed the world is sound are those who formed the first recorded chakra systems.

of particular interest is a device which Jenny invented called the tonoscope. essentially, it translates the human voice into vibrations, which are transmitted to the same circular plate used in his other experiments.

when different tones are uttered into the tonoscope, elaborate, completely reproduceable patterns are formed in whichever substance is placed on the surface. he mostly used a spherical spores for tonoscope experiments.

the results are startling. each vowel produces a very distinct pattern, which is the same every time. the vowel "A" is shown at the top of this page http://s010600e029332f52.ss.shawcable.net/...s/cymatics.html

as ones intonation changes, the visual manifestion changes accordingly. keep in mind, every one of these experiments is completely reproduceable, and has been verified meticulously.

and, although i have yet to find video or pictoral records, it is said various sakskrit and hebrew letters were uttered into the device in some experiments. some (not all) produced the written form which the ancients used as the visual symbol.

and the most interesting by far is when the ancient symbol OM is uttered into it by a an experienced mantra practioner. the ancients ascribed a visual representation to this sacred sound, called the Shri Yantra. They claimed the sound OM and the Shri Yantra were two manifestations of the same vibration.

picture four on the following link shows a picture of the pattern formed when OM is uttered properly into a tonoscope. this was taken after the last traces of "mmm" had died away.

http://www.healingsounds.com/sounds/projec...t_om_chart.asp#

Again, keep in mind that OM is the mantra which is said to correspond to the sixth chakra, or "third eye".

Interestingly, even modern scientists without spiritual leanings speak without embarrassment of 'seeing something in the mind's eye". the 'mind's eye' which is thought to be connected to the pineal gland, one of the main eight parts of the endocrine system

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Endocrine_system

these endocrine centers do not EXACTLY correspond to the locations of the chakras as some claim, but they are close enough to warrant further investigation.


and to offer my purely anecdotal evidence for the legitimacy of the chakras, i have been experimenting with them practically for a month now. i have found third eye meditation (using the mantra OM) to substantially increase my visual and creative faculties. as well, lucid dreaming has increased. *it is interesting to note that some claim melatonin helps induce lucid dreams. melatonin is a product of the pineal gland (bovine pineal gland in the case of melatonin pills)*

as well, on one occasion while centering on the throat chakra, i actually felt a rather unusual sensation which i can only describe as an 'opening' or 'release' occur. this was early on in my experiential research, when i was fairly skeptical. which only makes it less likely to have been a product of self-hypnosis, etc.

so much for not having much time. i'll leave you with that for now, and will expand or clarify any points you may have some other time.

definitely look into cymatics though. even if you write off chakras as bullshit. the book is expensive, but amazing. it has dozens of photos, so which are full-page, and in colour. not a single photo is computer generated.
http://www.cymaticsource.com/

consider that the human voice is capable of reproducing any tone within its audible spectrum. consider we are the only animal with such sophisticated vocal abilities. consider how much of the meaning of language has been shown to be held in the tone of words, rather than the words alone..consider how ancient alphabets and their pronunciations creates ordered patterns when visually represented.

hans jenny was a student of rudolph steiner, who was one of the 'founders' of the new age movement...

ahh! you've made me late!

Originally posted by mongreloctopus
I recently had a strange experience with somewhat of a Taijutu expert who, through the course of his training, had learned a wide variety of ancient japanese healing systems that involve the use of accupressure, massage and chakras. I am pretty skeptical by nature, but lately I have come to the realization that assuming that I know what's real and what isn't is pretty naïve...

So...I am interested in hearing from someone who has actual knowledge of anything substantial chakra-related. I'm not interested in links to websites, because I can just as easily as anyone else type "chakra" into google. Also, if you can't spell, have a poor grasp of english grammar, don't sound like you know what you're talking about, and especially if you don't know what you're talking about, don't bother responding. I am looking for real insight.


Also, as I said above, I am trying to be more open-minded, but this does not extend to anything new-age related (only the ancient)...So, if thats from where your knowledge comes, I am not interested.

I am an old man and among my credentials I hold a High Initiation into Kundalini Yoga. As to my abilities to spell and to conjoin words gramatically, well, you review some of my threads and determine there whether I pass your grade. But keep in mind, that many apparent errors in spelling and some slips of grammer result from carelessness in typing or insufficient editing. You may wonder why I would not take more time to double check my work, but then, once you review the body of my work, you might discern that what is there must have kept me quite busy enough as it was. I tell everybody who is concerned with budgetting their Time, that it takes one 20% of the time to do a Job to 80% perfection, and in most cases 80% is well good enough. One could spend the entire morning shining and polishing an essay but substantially it would be not much different in basic message then one whipped out in 30 minutes.

Now, you need to ask yourself whether you really think yourself worth all the extra effort. Why, a proud goose that you appear to be should probably just go and ____ himself.

Anyway, about Chakras... it is a broad subject. What would you like to know?

wHy d0 u aS00m D@t 1s sP3L1n @b11337ies @nD l3V3l 0v gR@muR h@v @n1T1nG t0 d0 with 1s W1zduM

translation: Why do you assume that one's spelling abilities and level of grammar have anything to do with one's wisdom? And I'm really sorry but I just couldn't resist I'm not mocking you at all, just having a little fun. Poor grammar and 'leet speak' actually crack me up, and a lot of people can't help because simply, english is not their first language.

What if there was an ancient asian master that does not speak english as his primary/native language, what if he has poor grammar? That would be a missed oppertunity wouldn't it? Because he's not going to post anymore =P

As for the chakras, yes there might be energy fields of some sorts but I think the more symbolic meaning of them is much more important. The teaching of chakras show that each chakra covers a certain area in life, with certain aspects belonging to it. They also show that people can have several qualities belonging to that chakra which indicate whether or not this chakra (more concrete: area of life) is balanced.
They teach us what is balanced and healthy, what might make you and those around you most happy (the primary goal of all beings).

The chakras also teach that each area is equally important, as they all affect each other. Developing only your higher chakras would not be a very good idea, so saying for example that the third eye is superior to the root chakra, is false. After all, the root chakra is carrying the third eye.

I think the chakra are just a spiritualised way of teaching true balance to life. There are few people these days with completely opened, balanced chakras. So yeah.. I do believe there is a spiritual something to the chakras, but we should primarily be concerned with that we can deal with directly. So not so much the 'energy' but rather the emotions/feelings that belong to a certain chakra.

What I do like about chakras, is the color system. The colors connected to certain chakras; when you learn a little about them I think you can use them to your advantage. But of course, the meaning of the colors are rather universal. Blue is calming and deep, no matter what. Red is passionate and full of psysical energy. Green is soothing, balanced and gentle.

I think it's enough for most people to just read a basic, simple book on it that doesn't go to 'deep'. Even if it is new agey, the new age stuff really isn't all that bad, as long as you don't take every single word seriously. Learn the general meanings of the chakras and the colors and then begin working on yourself, give your own meaning to it.

I think somebody that is not afraid to look at himself inside and knows himself, can feel what chakras are open/closed/over active, and they can work from there. I think chakras are primarily a way to work on yourself, as person, human and soul To find balance

I suppose you might feel this post is useless to you, mongreloctopus. And maybe it is, but I guess I just felt like I should say something, I hope you won't consider me a nuisance, as I'm not trying to be such Besides, this post is for everybody that wants to read it, not just you.

Good luck on finding the knowledge and wisdom you seek ^_^

Bad spelling and grammar simply annoy me, and I dislike reading long texts full of errors. Typos are different from not being able to spell, and it is easy to discern which is which. I'm not sure how many people would agree, but in my personal experience spelling and grammar are clear indications of knowledge, ambition for knowledge and the desire to be as articulate as possible. When it comes to something I do not understand but would like to understand, I am only able to learn from those that mirror my mentality to a certain degree--that is, those who also feel the need to ensure their spelling and grammar are proper. Anyway--

I thank Asher for a very extensive response that was full of interesting information and leads. I will investigate this 'cymatics' and probably after a few days follow up with some more questions.

I hate bad spelling too, but I make no excuses for it but acknowledge straight forwardly that the reason is because I am a snobbish prick who asks help from people that I'd just as soon spit on. Yes, I'm a real sweetheart, that way, and still somehow think that people won't despise me for my obnoxious attitude.

Originally posted by Leo Volont
I hate bad spelling too, but I make no excuses for it but acknowledge straight forwardly that the reason is because I am a snobbish prick who asks help from people that I'd just as soon spit on. Yes, I'm a real sweetheard, that way, and still somehow think that people won't despise me for my obnoxious attitude.

Whoa - that was unexpected!

Spelling and grammar errors highlighted in red.
[quote]I recently had a strange experience with somewhat of a Taijutu, massage and chakras. I am pretty skeptical by nature, but lately I have come to the realization that assuming that I know what's real and what isn't is pretty naïve...

So...I am interested in hearing from someone who has actual knowledge of anything substantial chakra-related. I'm not interested in links to websites, because I can just as easily as anyone else type "chakra" into google grammar, don't sound like you know what you're talking about, and especially if you don't know what you're talking about, don't bother responding. I am looking for real insight.


Also, as I said above, I am trying to be more open-minded, but this does not extend to anything new-age related (only the ancient)...So, if thats




...Pay no mind to me, I'm just messing with you. But honestly, how could I resist?

in advance for the -- but sometimes I just gotta let go. Especially when posting at 3:00am.

Originally posted by burns91
Whoa - that was unexpected!

Not entirely. You'll come to know and love our Leo. Or not.

And Asher, for someone who didn't "have much time" right then, you sure did post a whopper!

But really, starting out a plea for help by essentially saying "don't bother responding unless you're as intelligent as I think I am" is probably not a good way to ensure quality responses. Or at the very least, you're making sure that you won't get some potentially good replies that you might have gotten otherwise. Not trying to be mean, just a little constructive criticism, if you could please take it that way.

Mark75 -- nice. He did have it coming.

Originally posted by Leo Volont
I hate bad spelling too, but I make no excuses for it but acknowledge straight forwardly that the reason is because I am a snobbish prick who asks help from people that I'd just as soon spit on. Yes, I'm a real sweetheard, that way, and still somehow think that people won't despise me for my obnoxious attitude.

I hate to go against a tidal wave but.... Mr. Volont, Perhaps you can enlighten me.

I dont understand what is so horribbly wrong and evil about him asking that you type well when responding to his* topic?

Am I missing something here?

All Im seeing is a bunch of criticism and bad mouthing without seeing a logical reason for it

P.S. I have many experiences with Kundalini myself, but I didn't take yoga

Idk, If I can add some philosophy of my own to this: Respect is something to be earned, but remember your manners. But I think what we can do is respect his choice and free will in regards to the title of his* thread. All in all considering its not really hurting anyone

Originally posted by namaka


I hate to go against a tidal wave but.... Mr. Volont, Perhaps you can enlighten me.

I dont understand what is so horribbly wrong and evil about him asking that you type well when responding to his* topic?

Am I missing something here?

All Im seeing is a bunch of criticism and bad mouthing without seeing a logical reason for it

P.S. I have many expeirences with Kundalini myself, but I didn't take yoga

have you noticed that On Line everyone... nearly everyone... tacitly agrees to refrain from criticizing typos, misspellings, syntax errors... all so that we can all feel free to say what we have in the time we have to say it without having to waste unnecessary time in editing for publication. As I said earlier, one can write to 80% of Perfection in 20% of the time it would take to be 100% Perfect, and yet the message is the same in either case. So this Tacit Social Agreement to lighten up and go easy on spelling and grammer is a positive and beneficial thing.

But every once in a while a real prick comes along and wants to screw up a good thing.

Originally posted by Leo Volont


But every once in a while a real prick comes along and wants to screw up a good thing.

Well, I thought this topic was pretty good until.....

I still do not see a good enough reason for it? Why are you getting so upset over this? What exactly is the big deal?

Originally posted by namaka




Well, I thought this topic was pretty good until.....

I still do not see a good enough reason for it? Why are you getting so upset over this? What exactly is the big deal?

Can you read?

The guy comes on our Page and tells us all that we are stupid.

I took exception to that, but apparently you are used to it.

Oh, I see now.


I was wondering how this>

Originally posted by Leo Volont+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Leo Volont)</div>

have you noticed that On Line everyone... nearly everyone... tacitly agrees to refrain from criticizing typos, misspellings, syntax errors... all so that we can all feel free to say what we have in the time we have to say it without having to waste unnecessary time in editing for publication. As I said earlier, one can write to 80% of Perfection in 20% of the time it would take to be 100% Perfect, and yet the message is the same in either case. So this Tacit Social Agreement to lighten up and go easy on spelling and grammer is a positive and beneficial thing.[/b]

Justifies this

Originally posted by Leo Volont@

But every once in a while a real prick comes along and wants to screw up a good thing.

But if you think he is calling you stupid.... Maybe thats just what you perceive?

What if he just wants and intelligent reply? One he doesn't have to go through the hastle of trying to decipher misspellings

He never called you stupid, you assumed he did though

<!--QuoteBegin-Leo Volont
Can you read?

The guy comes on our Page and tells us all that we are stupid.

I took exception to that, but apparently you are used to it.

I can read, but just to make sure I wan't wrong, I looked at his posts for the word 'stupid', even so I did not find it.

Alright so there is no problem if you want to express you opinion, but please at the same time do try to stay on topic and talk about the chakras as the topic suggests We don't want the spoil the topic, do we? 8)

One little comment is alright, but don't deticate the rest of the topic to the whole grammar issue (and everything that followed), or it'll have to be split.

Originally posted by Lucius
Alright so there is no problem if you want to express you opinion, but please at the same time do try to stay on topic and talk about the chakras as the topic suggests We don't want the spoil the topic, do we? 8)

One little comment is alright, but don't deticate the rest of the topic to the whole grammar issue (and everything that followed), or it'll have to be split.

Thanks. I was really just trying to avoid a response consisting of:

hay shukrus r cool i am a sikic wizard who can make shukras turn purpl or red using my therd eye and if u want to no how i found out abut it u can go to my websit www.imanidiot.copm kthxbye

Originally posted by Mark75
Spelling and grammar errors highlighted in red.





...Pay no mind to me, I'm just messing with you. But honestly, how could I resist?

Just a side note, "Taijutu" is not spelled incorrectly. It is the Romanji form of a japanese word (or rather, two words), that is pronounced "tie-je-tsu", but not spelled that way...

All things aside, I have found the chakras a most interesting subject. I can't say I really 'believed' in them until just recently. I tried meditating on certain ones, and the results were truly amazing. I also used gemstones during the meditation. Specifically, I first did a meditation I had read about for the third eye chakra. That's the one that influences psychic ability. I used fluorite stones. I've also more recently done meditations for the root chakra with a garnet stone. (I took a test and the root one showed weak, while the third eye which I'd already meditated on, tested highest.) It is said that the goal is to have the chakras in balance, so that no one chakra is dominant and others are weak. I'm still in the process of working on mine. Good luck working on yours. I think you will be pleasantly surprised with the results too.

Originally posted by Lucius
Alright so there is no problem if you want to express you opinion, but please at the same time do try to stay on topic and talk about the chakras as the topic suggests We don't want the spoil the topic, do we? 8)

One little comment is alright, but don't deticate the rest of the topic to the whole grammar issue (and everything that followed), or it'll have to be split.

Actually the topic SHOULD have been about Chakras, but the Thread Starter deliberately decided to conjoin the topic with one of overt literacy and editorial skills. Since he brought up the topic, then why should we not pursue it. Obviously it is as or more important to him then are chakras. Indeed, if he is interested most in any Chakra, it must be the Anal one.

Originally posted by namaka


I can read, but just to make sure I wan't wrong, I looked at his posts for the word 'stupid', even so I did not find it.

As Forrest Gump has said, "stupid is as stupid does".

Stupid is when somebody says says you can't spell or use good grammer and so you are beneath talking to him, and you don't know that he just called you 'stupid'.

Originally posted by WaaayOutThere
All things aside, I have found the chakras a most interesting subject. I can't say I really 'believed' in them until just recently. I tried meditating on certain ones, and the results were truly amazing. I also used gemstones during the meditation. Specifically, I first did a meditation I had read about for the third eye chakra. That's the one that influences psychic ability. I used fluorite stones. I've also more recently done meditations for the root chakra with a garnet stone. (I took a test and the root one showed weak, while the third eye which I'd already meditated on, tested highest.) It is said that the goal is to have the chakras in balance, so that no one chakra is dominant and others are weak. I'm still in the process of working on mine. Good luck working on yours. I think you will be pleasantly surprised with the results too.

Actually, the benefit of all these stones, besides fueling one side of the New Age Industry is marginal. What is really effective is what they call Pyramid Power, but for pyramid power, the essential element there is simply the point -- any object that tapers down to a tip works just fine. Most quality ball point pens work much better than the most elaborate and arcane collection of semi-precious stones. Simply point the ball point pen, or other pointy object, even one's finger if that is all that available, into the chakra and it will energize, providing it is already tied into an open power structure and ready to go.

Originally posted by mongreloctopus



Just a side note, "Taijutu" is not spelled incorrectly. It is the Romanji form of a japanese word (or rather, two words), that is pronounced "tie-je-tsu", but not spelled that way...

Taijutsu is how it’s romanised, for the record. It consists of two kanji: One that means "body" and the other means "technique", if I’m not mistaken.

Wait, what the hell am I doing? No one cares about that!

Anyway, I’ve worked with stones and color for years, and I thought I had a grasp on how the chakras work. Turns out I was wrong. Lucius has been educating me in depth about them. I have learned a lot from him in the past few months. I couldn’t have asked for a better teacher.

Originally posted by Leo Volont


Actually the topic SHOULD have been about Chakras, but the Thread Starter deliberately decided to conjoin the topic with one of overt literacy and editorial skills. Since he brought up the topic, then why should we not pursue it. Obviously it is as or more important to him then are chakras. Indeed, if he is interested most in any Chakra, it must be the Anal one.

The Anal chakra, better known as the root chakra.

It is not completely strange to say that if somebody is interested to learn about the chakras and balance them, the root ('anal') chakra is the first one to start out with. I consider the root chakra to be one of the most important/most important chakras, even though that's wrong to say because they are all equally important. And I'm talking universally speaking here because each person has his/her strongest most important chakra, the one they live from most strongly. Like for myself I believe this to be the 4th/heart chakra.

But, I was talking about the mentioning of the 'anal chakra' . A lot of people (especially in the 'new age' scene) claim/feel that the 1st chakra and its color red is the 'lowest' chakra, one generally strong in primitive, not very spiritual people. This might be true, but it is in fact so that the root chakra is very very important. After all, it is that chakra that carries all the others. Like the bottom of a pyramid. If the bottom of a pyramid where to be smaller than the middle or top, guess what's going to happen? Indeed, not a very stable pyramid. The root chakra and its color red represent plenty of good things like passion, the will to exist and live, willpower in general, strength and fitness, energy. It's the same with auras, so many people consider 'red' to be bad in an aura, but its not. Mind you, white is supposed to be the 'perfect/enlightened aura' and white is also the color of the 7th chakra (which isn't really a chakra on it's own, but more where the energy flowing through the rest of the chakras is released). And white is all colors put together, including red Of course an /overload/ of red is bad, but an overload of anything is bad. Except for white.. because white is all colors/rainbow colored so no color is dominate and there is perfect balance.

Quite a great deal of spiritual people have strong and developed 5th and 6th chakras, but they lack the lower chakra energy which makes them depressed and lost at times. A strong person has strong legs to carry him. A three needs strong roots to live. And the higher chakras need the lower chakras to really function properly. Again.. of course it is highly rare to see somebody with strongly developed lower ASWELL as higher chakras.
-------

Anyway, that was my attempt at bringing this all back on topic without going nazi. I would like to request anybody to stop making posts in here about the whole grammar issue. We teased him, and complained about it, and he explained himself. You might not agree with him, or you might think its dumb. If so, just don't post here or I'll just delete it Forgive and forget is an art. Not that there was much of a problem to begin with..

So, talk about the chakras or things related to it here and respects the 1st poster's wishes, we have talked enough about the grammar issue all together.

Yes, I had one Kundalini Guru who absolutely insisted that after energizing the the entire Chakra complex, that the safest next step had to be fixing the ability to take the Energy down to the Base Chakra. there can be a great many pathologies involved with an imbalance of energies in the higher Chakras, all of which can be remedied by taking the energy all the way down to the Base.

But I should add the reminder here that one can even get in trouble with the Base Chakra. it can act like a valve between the Ida and the Pingali Channels -- the Left and the Right, the hot and the cold. If one inadvertantly focussed more in the right side then the left side of the Base Chakra, then one will turn on the heat. Once I was forced marched and we came into a freezing rain. It turned on the Right Side of my Energy System from the Base Chakra and was able to keep warm where some of my fellows were overcome by the cold. But later that night when I was sleeping I found myself in a fever. It finally occurred to me that I had neglected to turn off the heat and so thought over to the left side of the Base Chakra and just that fast the heat simply radiated away, and I was able to fall back to sleep.