Thread: Hell, injust punishment

I don't think you go there if you mess up a "bit". I personlly believe that it goes by how you live your life overall. If you spent your life being a good, kind person then minor things will be forgiven. Almost killing someone isn't a "small" thing however. I am talking more about things like you don't always go to church but your nice, or you have sex before you marry but you love them, or you get mad and curse at a family member but you normally act nice and love them. Things like that won't get you sent to hell.

Having a hard life isn't an excuse to act bad though. Everyone has problems, some worse than others but we all do. The basic principle is that you get back what you have done, and in that way God does not send people to hell, they send themself.

Personlly I wouldn't want to see even the worst of people sent to hell forever. I don't like seeing people hurt, even when they do deserve it, so them being there "forever" seems to be an extrame. Even though I don't like it, its far from unjust. Can't expect to live your life as an evil person and go on unpunished.

not unpunished, of corse not, but going to a place for eternity for something you did in your past makes no sense, is there any sin that can never be forgiving, (aside from what hitler and lots of other mass murderers and such did)

If you kill someone you are sent to prison for life. You only have one life so going away for 70 years because you did something bad young would really suck. Will you forgive the 95 year old person who rapped and murdered 15 people then drank their blood and laughed about it? Its all 70 years in the past.

you see but that is just sick, thats like a charles manson or hitler type thing, i would understand an eternaty for that,

Well what if you ran into a bank and shot 3 or 4 people then drove out and ran over 3 kids? Not really a planned thing just a little to greedy and bad things happened when you tried to get away.

i believe that if the intents of your soul were pure then you should still be punished, but not for an eternity, because after all your soul is being punished, not your physical body, not your physical bad intentions, dont you think your soul crys when you do things like that, cuz deep inside you know how your gonna pay for that.

Not that I'm justifying killing thirty people, but who gives anyone a right to judge us (talking spiritual here)? I mean, what if you don't feel like going to hell? You didn't ask to be born in the first place (not saying you could but, it's sort of forced on you), so you should be able to have fun here if you choose.

Besides, if I'm going to go to heaven, and it's sooooo good there, why couldn't I just kill myself? My life could be the worst existance ever. Lost my job after 40 years, just before becoming Vice-President due to some embezzling charges that I had nothing to do with. My wife leaves me, and my kids are brats that are now poor brats, and thus hate me. I drink too much. I harm myself to escape, but it just get's worse. The physcological toll is immense. Religion isn't doing anything for me, but I still have faith in god. I don't want to cause anymore harm to myself or others, so I kill myself. Then I find myself in hell because I did that.

Pretend this guy is called Matt.

{Insert God Here}: Well Matthew, you were a pretty good follower of faith. You gave some money to the poor, but you still could have done better. But when you got fired, you could have just got another job. What is stopping thou from living his life after that?

Matt: forty...forty years, God...FORTY YEARS! That's how long I've been working for that Corporation! You say money doesn't bring happiness, but I was happy! It's called physcology, God. Maybe, I don't know, I've become used to my happy and successful life?

God: I understand your plight, but this is not about me. It is about you. You shouldn't have committed suicide, Matt.

Matt: B-b-b-but, but God! I needed to escape! I wanted to be happy!

God: I am sorry Matthew. Suicide is not the answer.

Matt: NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!

Alright that's a little exaggerated, but still, it brings certain things to mind.

No offence but that guy sounds a bit crazy. I don't know if what you do when you go insane counts or not.

God knows everything you've done. Your state of mind, your health, your feelings, etc etc. He won't give you something injust.

First off, Stalin, you did choose to live before being born and also you had the choice of your parents.

Second, Outer Darkness (Hell) is a place for the extremely wicked people.

Third, if you truly repent of whatever evil you comited, even if you were controlled by the devil, you will not be cast into hell. But you will be only allowed to enter into the lower Celestial levels of Heaven.

i like what IZ had to say about this, makes alot more sense, eternal suffering should only be for the extremely wicked, celestail kingdom sound a bit LDS, my family is LDS. but i guess i only beleive in what feels right, not what may seem right, so i turned to LSD insted of LDS, heh. my relegion is "Self". find the answers in your self, not in a book. ok way off subject, im gonna shut up now, peace

i dont know a whole lot about religion, but the idea of eternal torture is way to extreme for any kind of act you can do on earth. I don't even think hitler deserves that kind of punishment. I think what hitler deserves is a long time (15,000 hours) in hell, then have his existance destroyed. Or he would have to feel 2x the pain he suffered. He would feel that pain, and the feelings he caused, for as long as all of these people have felt it (that means all the suffer time of all the people summed up), then have his existance destroyed.

If somebody was insane and believed that everybody was trying to kill him, then he kills a bunch of people, does he deserve to be punished? No, it wasn't his fault.

Let's see...how many people's death's was he directly responsible for in the holocaust (excluding soldiers on all sides; that's a governmental kind of thing--war)? 6 million? So say he get's 6 million days in hell, that 1,643 years. Do you think that is a just punishment? Though we have no right to judge anyone, only god can do that, what do you think?

Having your "existance destroyed" it worse than hell. And if your going to do it, might as well just to it to start with.

I don't think a day for killing someone is right. Should spend the same amount of time the person would of lived if he didn't kill him. So if he kills a kid that is like 5 he should stay in hell for 90 years or something. Add up every person he did, with bonus years each time someone died in a really painful way and he still be there a VERY long time.

how would having your existance destroyed be worse than hell? You wouldn't care, you wouldn't think, you wouldn't feel pain, it's not bad or good.

As long as your in hell your still you, if your existance is destoryed then you are nothing. All that you ever was is lost. Of course you wont care because you will be forever dead and gone. Reason people believe in god and stuff in the first place is because the thought of being nothing but a pile of dirt when you die is far to scary for them to handle.

But you would never know you didn't exist. I've pondered this thought for many times.

The thought of not existing isn't scary to me, just interesting...
I mean, you wouldn't feel pain, but you wouldn't feel happy either. You wouldn't feel anything. It's totally undescribable by any standards; you would need to be supernatural or a god or something to comprehend such an "existance".

Well yea, after the fact your nothing so you couldn't care. But you would be nothing. It would really suck if all you are is nothing, just a pile of dirt. People don't want to hear they are nothing but a pile of dirt, that is why people believe in a soul. They hope they are more than nothing. They don't care where they go as long as there is something, anything is better than nothing.

Its easy to comprehend, nothing is just nothing. Your just gone, simple as that. Its nothing to fear, if thats what happens when you die not much you can do about. All I know is I wouldn't wish that on anyone.

I'm talking about comprehending the "Feeling". Which leads me to think about reincarnation: maybe you can't be non-existant, so reincarnation is the only way to stay around.

Originally posted by Kaniaz
God knows everything you've done. Your state of mind, your health, your feelings, etc etc. He won't give you something injust.

I agree... God is just - But he also gives some people what they do not deserve: grace!

I think it's an injustice that ANYONE would be allowed into a place like heaven -based on their own merit.

If we truly got what was "just" (what we deserved) NONE would be allowed into heaven because we ALL deserve hell.

"The fool says in his heart, "There is no God." They are corrupt, and their ways are vile; there is no one who does good. God looks down from heaven on the sons of men to see if there are any who understand,
any who seek God. Everyone has turned away, they have together become corrupt; there is no one who does good, not even one."
Psalm 53:1-3

Originally posted by evangel+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(evangel)</div>

<!--QuoteBegin-Kaniaz

God knows everything you've done. Your state of mind, your health, your feelings, etc etc. He won't give you something injust.

If we truly got what was \"just\" (what we deserved) NONE would be allowed into heaven because we ALL deserve hell.
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Do you believe in this punishment?

I believe that the entire human race is fallen (sinful, imperfect, mortal, etc.) and in need of redemption. Therefore, nothing we "do" can be seen as good or righteous, unless we have the clothing of perfection (Christ) which is brought about by the sacrifice of a perfect human being... Thus, those who are clothed in Christ will be deemed righteous (given the gift of eternal life) in God's eyes, but not because of anything they have done - only because of God's grace -which comes about through faith in Christ.

So, yes, I do -for some, though I cannot ultimately say or know who.

It is also very difficult to find out what the Bible say about this.
(By reading the Bible, I get different viewpoints about it all the time. )

Originally posted by Human
It is also very difficult to find out what the Bible say about this.

Actually it's not. Anyone can pick up a copy at a library or bookstore and read it for themself. I'm not saying there is only one right view, but the orthodox Bible interpretations are pretty standard in their translation (KJV, NKJV, NASB, NIV...) -I know that some wacked translations also exist, but that is why it's up to the individual to be a student and not just swallow what the preacher, teacher, priest, or anyone else says. And there are ways to determine which translations have withstood tests and undergone the scrutiny needed to validate them -by textual analysts, historians, and all kinds of translators both secular and religious...