Thread: We're All Philosophers!

No, not all people are philosophers. Philosophizing requires critical thought and a comfort with constant questioning, the ability and even desire to tear down of old beliefs in favor of new, sometimes nebulous ideas that result from logical analysis, and in general, a willingness to live in a world of uncertainty. The vast majority of people prefer answers, not questions - hence the preponderance of religious followers and political party-liners.

I agree with Peregrinus.

In short, so many people are so used to having their realities structured and dictated for them, they don't posses the ability to analyze their own surroundings and come to philosophical observations and conclusions that outline a line of thinking that is truly unique to them.

Philosophy, as I understand it, (and as she stated) includes the ability to view a given situation with objectivity, taking the situation, often from many different perspectives, to come to a logical conclusion about the situation that may or may not contradict the notion you had before it.

Many people are just incapable of doing that, honestly.

So we all could be, If we chose to. and some would be good some great and some uuuum well, suck!

But I agree that the majority of people I associate with are not seekers.

There are a lot of people in this world who are content with what simply is without question. More than you might think.....Some people are just kind of dead inside, you know?

Everyone, I mean, everyone, has a philosophy about life. They don't necessarily have to describe it verbally. And those who don't talk about it usually are the ones who honor their philosophy the most. The other side of the spectrum of people who, talk talk talk....

Originally posted by Gwendolyn
There are a lot of people in this world who are content with what simply is without question. More than you might think.....Some people are just kind of dead inside, you know?

“A considerable percentage of the people we meet on the street are people who are empty inside, that is, they are actually already dead. It is fortunate for us that we do not see and do not know it. If we knew what a number of people are actually dead and what a number of these dead people govern our lives, we should go mad with horror.”
George Gurdjieff (philospher, mystic, genius, and certified quack, 1873-1949)

or at best, some are only sleeping, and wake up for brief moments once or twice a year...

Originally posted by Gwendolyn
There are a lot of people in this world who are content with what simply is without question. More than you might think.....Some people are just kind of dead inside, you know?

Yeah, nicely said.

I do fear that alot, really alot of people. Mostly people with less intelegence then the average (smart) dreamviews user, are really dead inside. To question, to philosophise, makes us human. People that follow other people without questioning is worse then being a computer, at least Then you are rational...

It's kind of sad.

Originally posted by Gwendolyn
It's kind of sad.

Well dog's and cat's are dead inside too, not like they are all that much thinking. And some dog's and cat's can be a hell of a lot fun.

Stupid people can be fun. I mean they make great presidents, governours, other political jobs, clows, McDonalds employees, bums and shoe salesmen.

Originally posted by Neruo


Well dog's and cat's are dead inside too, not like they are all that much thinking.

Dogs and cats think on the ultimate level: they survive. They think about exactly what they need to do to get what they want. They are in touch with the earth, and therefore don't need to bring all of those outside emotions into it. They can't be dead inside.

Actually, I wish people were like this in a way. Humans think they are so great...LOL. I can't say I don't like being able to think, but we aren't any better. A human becomes dead inside when they ignore the corrupted shit around them and settle into their own little world and put on their rose colored glasses. We have the need to think about things, yet some people don't because they don't care. Now, if dogs had the need to think about things, they would..Then we'd have little dog philosophers too.

Originally posted by Gwendolyn


Dogs and cats think on the ultimate level: they survive. They think about exactly what they need to do to get what they want. They are in touch with the earth, and therefore don't need to bring all of those outside emotions into it. They can't be dead inside.

Actually, I wish people were like this in a way. Humans think they are so great...LOL. I can't say I don't like being able to think, but we aren't any better. A human becomes dead inside when they ignore the corrupted shit around them and settle into their own little world and put on their rose colored glasses. We have the need to think about things, yet some people don't because they don't care. Now, if dogs had the need to think about things, they would..Then we'd have little dog philosophers too.

Yeah, I do agree that humans think they are oh so great. Really stupid. We are just evolved animals, and still animals. Some people think humans arn't animals.. ha.

Intremezzo: Gorrila's can learn to talk with their hands, and they are not all that stupid. One gorrilla mother even told her kids to 'behave' or do something else or a 'big dog' would come, or something. The point is that the animal though that up himself. Make's me wonder, and feel bad, about how smart other animals might be.

Back to the reply, well survival-instinct is good, and pure, I guess. However a dog left in the woods wouldn't eat some nice dog-food with smiling people on the package, it would tear rabbits apart, and the cute little rabbit would die chocking in his own blood.
But not after the cute little rabbit was all out of carrots and ate his children.

The point: Nature can be harsh aswell. That's why humans are more stupid then animals. Animals can't think: Hey lets keep those rabbits in cages so I can then turn them into rabbit burgers, and let some board of dog-house-wifes form a board so the rabbits will be killed painlessly. Humans do know what they are doing. I think it's unnatural not to think, and allso do what is 'right'.

Then again, what is right. From the point of evolution, survial is 'right'. So killing off forests and animals to create more living space is 'natural'.

But even then, some humans should think, for they can, but they don't.

I suppose instead of saying that humans are stupid, just animals.. we could also say that humans are indeed animals but they are both equally beautiful creatures Yes they do have their (major) downsides but they are capable of lots of beauty (all kinds) and love.. at least so I like to believe

Also, I believe 'not thinking' is not always a bad thing. Feeling is also good Thinking to much will just hurt your head.. for instance it's nice to ponder on the concept of 'after life' for instance and figuring out what this means for you. But it's also an art to find something that you have peace with and can let rest instead of thinking and thinking again. Yes, revising your visions is good too but continuous stream of thought will hurt you head and get you nowhere

However I do think it's sad that a lot of people fail to think for themselves.. but I'm not sure if this has a lot to do with 'philosophy'

Anyway, that's why I feel and think

Not thinking is like accepting you are stupid (or atleast not be able to know everything, for no-one can't) and totally giving up finding truth.

Relgion is the easy way out for instance, becouse you do not know what happens after you died (and stuff), you pass your questions on to an imaginairy friend (jesus/god).

However, feelings are great. But one that feels can think. One that thinks can feel. And one can do neighter, or one. It's rather unrelated, in my oppinion.

Koko has been asked about death several times, especially when her kitten, All Ball, was killed by a car. The following conversations were published in our The Gorilla Foundation's biannual publication, Gorilla.

Gorilla, Volume 8, Number 1, from December, 1984.
One day Koko was having a conversation with Research Assistant Maureen Sheehan.
MS: Where do gorillas go when they die?
Koko: Comfortable hole bye.
MS: When do gorillas die?
K: Trouble, old.
MS: How do gorillas feel when they die, happy, sad, afraid?
K: Sleep.

Gorilla, Volume 8, Number 2.

December 18, 1984, three days after All Ball had been killed, with
Dr. Penny Patterson:
PP: Do you want to talk about your kitty?
K: Cry.
PP: What happened to your kitty?
K: Sleep cat.
PP: Yes, he's sleeping.
K: Koko good.

Originally posted by Lucius
I suppose instead of saying that humans are stupid, just animals.. we could also say that humans are indeed animals but they are both equally beautiful creatures Yes they do have their (major) downsides but they are capable of lots of beauty (all kinds) and love.. at least so I like to believe

Also, I believe 'not thinking' is not always a bad thing. Feeling is also good Thinking to much will just hurt your head.. for instance it's nice to ponder on the concept of 'after life' for instance and figuring out what this means for you. But it's also an art to find something that you have peace with and can let rest instead of thinking and thinking again. Yes, revising your visions is good too but continuous stream of thought will hurt you head and get you nowhere

However I do think it's sad that a lot of people fail to think for themselves.. but I'm not sure if this has a lot to do with 'philosophy'

Anyway, that's why I feel and think

This is pretty much what I intended to say. I just had a hard time saying it, and putting it as beautifully as that....

Every human ('tis a generalisation my friend) is capable of logical thinking. Some people use their logic and developed ideas more than others. A philosopher, in my eyes, is somebody who can take or develop complex ideas, analyze them, add to them, and simplify them also for the less intelligent. Philosophy has been here to broaden our insights and give us new concepts to study. Everyone is capable of introducing new philosophical content, but only few actually do.

In that sense everyone is CAPABLE of being a philosopher. It's just the fact that many do not choose to be one.

Some people can't handle logical thinking and just don't care, there usualy people with unclear minds who get confused reather qickly, aside from that some people are smarter and can realy be brilliant I my self think about philosophy atleast everyday but I think alot, and I enjoy thinking, often when i was a kid I didn't pay enough attention and often walked with my head down, used to never pay attention in anything, some people just love to think, some would reather pay attention to the outside world.

Originally posted by wombing


“A considerable percentage of the people we meet on the street are people who are empty inside, that is, they are actually already dead. It is fortunate for us that we do not see and do not know it. If we knew what a number of people are actually dead and what a number of these dead people govern our lives, we should go mad with horror.”
George Gurdjieff (philospher, mystic, genius, and certified quack, 1873-1949)

or at best, some are only sleeping, and wake up for brief moments once or twice a year...

Luk 9:60 (1161) Jesus2424 said2036 unto him,846 Let863 the3588 dead3498 bury2290 their1438 dead:3498 but1161 go565 thou4771 and preach1229 the3588 kingdom932 of God.2316

Originally posted by Peregrinus
No, not all people are philosophers. Philosophizing requires critical thought and a comfort with constant questioning, the ability and even desire to tear down of old beliefs in favor of new, sometimes nebulous ideas that result from logical analysis, and in general, a willingness to live in a world of uncertainty. The vast majority of people prefer answers, not questions - hence the preponderance of religious followers and political party-liners.

Very true.
I think we all believe we are philosophers.
I began to think how people respond. To add to what you say Peregrinus, it does take critical and a conscious decision to think. To think!
Think happens. So we all think we are philosophers. But in all actuality we are learned responders.
The true philosopher, as you pointed out has to tear down old conditioned thought patterns and build new ones. Or try to.
The biggest part of peoples thinking is involuntary. Most often thinking happens to you. So for many people they do not think. "I think" is a false statement. I sleep, I get hungry. Sleep happens, hunger happens and thinking happens.
If you become aware that thought is a process, as any other of the body, you then can detach from this process and give true unconditioned thought. Ones own true thought process.
You would be amazed how often, if you analyze your thoughts, that is is a naturally uncontrolled process. A thought pattern based on memory.
Of coarse memory can serve a purpose, but not a purpose to contaminate the freedom of unrefined thought. The place where philosophy comes alive.
It all made sense to me last night as I tried to think of this topic. It may be a bunch of rhetoric. I hope not.
I just thought of a good example. Apply of coarse to any given conversation and put it into context.
6x8 = 48 = a learned response automatic. (for most)
12+5x3 = 51 an action process of thought (for most)
Consider how a proposed question to many people can be the 48 to them. Is that THEIR philosophy???

I think, therefore I am? No!
I am , therefore I think!

[quote]I think, therefore I am? No!
I am , therefore I think!
I don't think you can put a "therefore" in there. I lot of people exist without thinking (or at least without critical thought).

12+5x3 = 51 an action process of thought (for most)

[nit-picking]
Well actually, if one adheres to the accepted order of operations in mathematics, the answer is 12+5*3 = 27 because you have to do the multiplication first. 12+(5*3) = 12+15 = 27
[/nit-picking]
Although, really, I guess I just proved your point about that requiring an active thought process...

Originally posted by Peregrinus+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Peregrinus)</div>

<!--QuoteBegin-howetzer

I think, therefore I am? No!
I am , therefore I think! Idea

I don't think you can put a "therefore" in there. I lot of people exist without thinking (or at least without critical thought). [/b]

While you may be correct with the math, I argue that thinking is a function. Regardless of how minimal in some it is...as I said, it happens.
Now when you say even critical thinking it still may be a conditioned response or stimuli in response from an action not your own.
But you can make the conscious decision to think.
A better example (without math )
You blink involuntarily.
You can blink consciously at your will.

But is your point that philosophy is more deep seeded in root than that of an involuntary thought? Or do you not feel there is involuntary thought?

I began to think how people respond. To add to what you say Peregrinus, it does take critical and a conscious decision to think. To think!
Think happens. So we all think we are philosophers. But in all actuality we are learned responders.
The true philosopher, as you pointed out has to tear down old conditioned thought patterns and build new ones. Or try to.
The biggest part of peoples thinking is involuntary. Most often thinking happens to you. So for many people they do not think. "I think" is a false statement. I sleep, I get hungry. Sleep happens, hunger happens and thinking happens.
If you become aware that thought is a process, as any other of the body, you then can detach from this process and give true unconditioned thought. Ones own true thought process.
You would be amazed how often, if you analyze your thoughts, that is is a naturally uncontrolled process. A thought pattern based on memory.
Of coarse memory can serve a purpose, but not a purpose to contaminate the freedom of unrefined thought. The place where philosophy comes alive.

No I doubt that very much, I am sure most people in this world will believe anything told to them without questioning it

Originally posted by darklordofall
No I doubt that very much, I am sure most people in this world will believe anything told to them without questioning it

That may be so. But that does not mean they do not believe what they have been told.
They are often wrong but when questioned they will argue this believed fact which is only a preconditioned thought that is entirely someone else's.
I propose that it takes effort to think. To use the actual process and not rely on conditioned responses.