After some extensive research on hookahs, the more I appreciated it and disliked it. Why?
I'll start off with what I don't like. Hookahs, being identified with adolescent-college campus antics, have gotten a stigma attached to them. If I could somehow prevent the spread in America, I would, because the people smoking them really make it look bad. Their approach to it is a "drug adventure" attitude and they are always looking for the thicker smoke and the best high. Since the hookah came to America, it has taken on a different style, more like a nightclub/party experience rather than a cultural one. It just overall looks.. bad. The way they want the "cool" and "hip" flavors and the "awesome" high and the "huge clouds" that are NOT what the hookah was meant to do. It really makes me mad, because the hookah, with it's pipes, easily looks like a narcotic drug machine. (especially to conservative adults) I have a feeling that had not the colleges got to it first, the hookah would be much more popular among grown people and not have such a horrible "look" to them.
Traditional hookahs, however, look to be wonderfully cultured compared to cigarettes (and even pipes and cigars) and are truly works of art. It simply comes down to this: The point is not to get high, in fact regularly there is high at all. It is not about the biggest clouds, in fact that means that the smoke is too thick. The true purpose of a hookah is peaceful and patient meditation, which is most exemplified in the Middle East. Hookah lounges there are not loud, noisy places, but quiet places to gather socially and converse. The smoke is cool, sweet and light. Preparing a hookah for smoking takes time. You need coals, shisha, water, ice... After smoking, it needs to be carefully cleaned. I have visited forums where people smoke their American "hookahs" over 12 times A DAY. Actually, it's more of a WEEKLY thing. The flavors to a hookah add a whole new dimension to it. You can have it minty and smooth, or sweet and fruity. There are hundreds of flavors and on top of that careful blends by specialists. Each hookah is hand blown, painted and polished to perfection. But Americans, as usual, chain smoke heavy tobacco in the strongest flavors with the harshest smoke multiple times a day to a noisy background.
If I do take this up, it will be seperate from the modern American movement. It will be with respect and appreciation for the culture behind it. Personally I'd take a light, smooth, refreshing flavor with iced water for cool smoke, and smoke it Sunday nights.
I think that Americans are really getting extreme with their craze for adventure. I mean, try to talk any Eastern person onto a roller-coaster. Movies are SMASHFESTS where the main character kills/blows up/sets on fire/obliterates as many buildings/people/vehicles as he can. Music is over the top LOUD and IN YOUR FACE with people screaming into the microphone. Nobody wants do drive a mini Euro car. Nope, it's the trucks and SUV's and the fastest car on the market (not like you can go that speed anyway) The news is packed with gruesome details. Getting drunk is a hobby. Doing really stupid things is a good way to make friends. Skateboarding, BMXing and other activities are pushing the limit. Football is a "brawl with a ball" and hunting is about getting the most raw tonnage during the season, and people would hunt with a Comanche Gunship if given the chance. Video games are really maxing out on first-person shooters. Nightlife is WILD. Our food is becoming so loaded with chemicals, colorings, MSG and fats that we are killing ourselves with every burger, fry and pop-tart. Amusement parks are seriously OVERLOAD on rides. Faster internet connections=more YouTube videos in given amount of time. Even our humour gets really bad sometimes. (Comedy films are really just shitpits, sorry) They are really pushing the limit on MPAA ratings. G movies hint at adult content, PG movies regularly feature sexual references, PG-13 movie regularly feature softcore sex, and R movies are really excessive on the sex and violence. Drugs are a national pastime. Gang violence is cool and promoted in a positive light. Criminals are more and more becoming anti-heroes and not breakers of the law. RAW wrestling is extremely violent. Our speech is obscene and loaded with sexual, perverse and, well... fecal references.
Any thoughts on this?
Also, feel free to talk about Hookahs.
Last edited by Vance; 07-16-2008 at 09:30 PM.
"Peace be upon you"-Altaïr Ibn-La'Ahad
I agree 100%. Whenever I smoke it with my freinds, they are either getting bragging rights for coolest smoke rings (which can be nice), most amount of smoke, and most hits and stupid laughtery. I think what your doing is good, just make sure your not doing it with friends like mine who just fuck the buzz up. seriously
Hmmm... The point of smoking weed for me is to get superstoned, and I don't care what my paraphanalia looks like. (That is when I make the mistake of smoking weed. Drugs are bad. Don't do drugs.) Modern entertainment is PATHETIC, except for South Park and a few other T.V. shows, but You Tube is the greatest invention of my life time, though the general commenters on that web site are life forms so stupid I didn't even know until recently that such stupid humans exist. If you want to see some real cartoons, watch the old ones on Boomerang. I love really good gangster rap, but I do find it disgusting that so many people think it's cool to really be like the characters described in gangster raps. I don't think movies teach kids much that they haven't already learned from their friends. Wrestling sucks compared to how it was back in the days when they went all out to make it look real and it was all good guys vs. bad guys. Kid's today know it's fake. When I was a kid, too many other kids didn't know it was fake. A kid physically attacked me in elementary school over an argument over whether wrestling is real. Toilet humor is ridiculously popular these days, which is baffling. It was never funny in the first place except maybe when I was in the third grade, it's gross, it's way overly used, it is the same three jokes over and over and over, and it is time for it to go away. America's obsession with thrill sports and other thrill activity is a good thing because thrills enrich life. We are not going to be here forever, so let's have major experiences while we are here. People need to take nutrition much more seriously, but I think megavitamin and megamineral supplements are absurd and dangerous. Food gives you what you need, as long as you cover all four food groups at pretty much every meal and cover both fruits and vegetables every day. Doing stupid things has always been a good way for young people to make friends, and with some walks of life, it has always been a requirement. I think reality T.V. shows are illustrating that too many people like to watch innocent people suffer and get humiliated, but at least they are not getting killed in coliseums by gladiators and lions. I am very glad that the upcoming generations fanaticize classic rock like I do. It is a sign that the greatest music of all time will live forever. Thank you.
Originally Posted by really
Gotta love the States, right?
Good job mentioning South Park, UM. Not a lot of people appreciate the quality of comedy in that show.
Still can't WILD........
I agree with you to a point. Back in high school when hookahs caught on, everyone had to have one, and it turned into a big pissing contest. The thing is though, once you get past that, you're still going to sit down with friends and chill out. Now, this might be a bit more loud and boisterous than you might like, but its not as if it's all blowing smoke rings, and competing. I've personally never even encountered that. Every time I have smoked from a hookah, with friends or strangers, all we have done is sit, relax, and converse. There might be the odd comment thrown in if someone should take an extremely large pull, or blow a really nice smoke ring, but I don't see this as negative. It's the type of thing that sort of brings people closer and make them more comfortable.
Regardless of what you are doing, you can't just do it to be the best, because you never will be. Once that novelty wears off, if you keep on doing that thing (smoking from a hookah, hunting, bxming whatever) it is going to be because you enjoy it.
Yeah, a lot of American culture sucks, but there are assholes in every walk of life, who do things for the wrong reasons, and make it look bad. Just cause a guy buys an Escalade to look like a gangster doesn't mean everyone did. Maybe you bought that Ferrari not because you want to open it up and go a few hundred miles an hour, but because you see it as a triumph of engineering, and a piece of art. People don't hunt to kill as much stuff as they can. It's a great bonus to get that shot yeah, but any real hunter is going to enjoy a trip regardless of whether he even sees an animal or not.
Most people suck, but if someone is into a past time, I'll give them the benefit of the doubt that they truly appreciate it. Even if they don't, they're probably enjoying themselves on some level, and I wouldn't begrudge anyone for enjoying themselves if it doesn't bring harm to anyone else.
I was more referring to the general hip movement. Someone took a look at a hookah and said "that would be pretty sweet" and started the whole thing. People smoke weed out of those things (which is really stupid) and other chemicals. If I were an Eastern person that introduced an American to a hookah, I would expect a more interesting response than "man, that's some good shit." Same applies to everything else. I was just pointing out a general trend that you would not find anywhere else.
"Peace be upon you"-Altaïr Ibn-La'Ahad
If you have a sense of caring for others, you will manifest a kind of inner strength in spite of your own difficulties and problems. With this strength, your own problems will seem less significant and bothersome to you. By going beyond your own problems and taking care of others, you gain inner strength, self-confidence, courage, and a greater sense of calm.Dalai Lama
Yeah, South Park is great, aside from the toilet humor. It is a result of multiple marketing. Trey Parker aims his scripts at a lot of different audiences, and it works. That is why the show is so successful. What is so great about the show, to me, is its spontaneity and social/political satire. The stupid toilet jokes are there just to attract idiots and children. A lot of people like the show because they think the characters are cute. The portrayals of celebrities get the attention of another crowd. A whole lot of stuff is going on in a South Park episode. Unfortunately, some of it gets in the way of the real greatness.
you're welcome.
as to Mr. Vance. it seems that your post seems to focus on young people's stupidity. but i think i know why. it is mostly 40 year old guys who love thrill sports. young people are actually stupid enough to play them. myself included. Drugs are a national past time. but it's been like that for 45 years or so. getting drunk is a staple of life. this has always been the case.
"beer is living proof that god loves and wants us to be happy." -Benjamin Franklin-
as you can see, the masses on youtube have plenty of brain cells they never use. what's the harm in losing them? [that was a joke]
but my point is that this is a trend that has been coming on for a very long time. if it isn't ever-present.
as for hookahs? they are awesome. and as for the trying to get the biggest hit, smoke ring, etc, i am fully guilty. but i didn't even know you could get a buzz of a hookah. the tobacco is very weak. but who can deny the beauty of smoke? why wouldn't you want to shoot huge spouts of it out of your mouth? and then contort the smoke into shapes with your lips and tongue? it is a beautiful thing. smoke will always fill me with awe. and i will always try to fit as much as possible in my lungs when smoking a hookah.
as a smoker of cigarettes, i like to take advantage of the "softness" of hookah smoke. and there are much better ways to smoke pot than out of a hookah. it should be used specifically for tobacco.
overall, humans are fucktards. we must learn to deal with our own stupidity or learn to overcome it. sadly i see neither happening soon.
e-x--p---a----n-----d------> yourself.
It's not so much poop itself that is funny, as the way people respond to this integral part of their lives, including when they look at toilet humor and say, "That is not funny."
That shit is hilarious
It's not what's coming out of your ass that's funny, but what's going on in your head.
If you have a sense of caring for others, you will manifest a kind of inner strength in spite of your own difficulties and problems. With this strength, your own problems will seem less significant and bothersome to you. By going beyond your own problems and taking care of others, you gain inner strength, self-confidence, courage, and a greater sense of calm.Dalai Lama
It's not so much poop itself that is funny, as the way people respond to this integral part of their lives, including when they look at toilet humor and say, "That is not funny."
That shit is hilarious
It's not what's coming out of your ass that's funny, but what's going on in your head.
So if it were common for comedy shows to try to get cheap laughs by referring to dirty feet, it would be funny if people said, "That's not funny."? Even after it's in every comedy film, stand up routine, and comedy T.V. show of the past ten years? Huh huh huh, dirty foot.Ha ha, nasty toes.
Please tell me that's not all that funny so I can think it's hilarious.
No, it's kinda funny. Nasty toes
So if it were common for comedy shows to try to get cheap laughs by referring to dirty feet, it would be funny if people said, "That's not funny."? Even after it's in every comedy film, stand up routine, and comedy T.V. show of the past ten years? Huh huh huh, dirty foot.
If you have a sense of caring for others, you will manifest a kind of inner strength in spite of your own difficulties and problems. With this strength, your own problems will seem less significant and bothersome to you. By going beyond your own problems and taking care of others, you gain inner strength, self-confidence, courage, and a greater sense of calm.Dalai Lama
http://youtube.com/watch?v=gOQYxH9GZ18&feature=relatedNo, it's kinda funny. Nasty toes
Ah, but the show was founded on toilet humor. In fact, Matt Stone and Trey Parker got together in college because of their common interest in making fart jokes (hence, Terrence and Phillip (which represent matt and trey)).
I have to say that their political comedy is the best they do. The best of all being the Earthday Brainwashing Organization people who use the Jedi mind trick wave to convince people that global warming is real and that Republicans are responsible. I laughed for days.
Still can't WILD........
I am just going to go into denial and pretend that isn't true.
Trey, who does all of the writing, is about the best I have ever come across at noticing the absurdities of society and politics and ragging the Hell out of them. One of the funniest moments in the entire history of the show was that "Getting gay with kids is here..." singing bit they did to make fun of how people use kids to push alarmist ideas. I also loved the 9/11 conspiracy satire, the double episode about rival atheist factions going to war with each other, the Johnny Cochran Chewbacca defense, and... Well, I could fill up a whole lot of this thread with stuff like that. I also love the way they expose how full of shit certain celebrties who try to be activists are. On The Tonight Show, Leno asked Matt and Trey what their deal is with Barbara Streisand, and Matt said something like, "Well you see, we... HATE... her." I thought that was so funny.
Insult my South Park intelligence again. See what happens.
http://www.southparkzone.com/episode...-the-Blow.html
Here, entertain yourself with the first 10 minutes.
Actually the whole fucking episode is hilarious. But yes, your examples were incredibly good moments in the SP universe.
Last edited by Half/Dreaming; 07-17-2008 at 08:27 PM.
Still can't WILD........
http://youtube.com/watch?v=Qw9oX-kZ_9k
The credits always say Trey Parker is the only writer. (?)
There's always going to be a majority of people who don't think for themselves. That's a given in any society. Not just America (though the ratio does seem to be much worse here). Either way there's no point in ranting as there's nothing we can do about it. You can seek out those who are similar to you, or accept the antics of the masses and just go with it. I ended up doing both.
Either way, check out social psychology (if you haven't already) if you're interested in why these things occur. It does a great job in explaining conformity and how so many people's innate need to be in groups turns them into impressionable trendy pawns of the media/others. For example, Asch's famous line study.
He had a group of three lines of different lengths, and another one that matched one of the three lines. A participant was lead to believe he was in a group of test subjects, but the entire group was in on the experiment itself. When they were asked, they all gave the wrong answer purposefully. When the participant's turn came around he ended up conforming and giving the wrong answer instead of his own.
See? Not a very difficult question, but an astounding number of people managed to get it wrong the first and second times they were asked. Really shows how conformity and groupthink stifles individuality, which seems to be your issue with people here. When combined with shit like MTV and other media telling people what's trendy and what to want in life (good ol western culture for you), the groupthink becomes painstakingly uniform. Anyway thought you might find it interesting, in my opinion it explains a lot.
Yea....I know. That's why mentioning that Trey was the writer in your previous post was insulting my intelligence. Roger?
Still can't WILD........
Well, that was for all of the non-experts who are eavesdropping on our conversation. The genius associated with the name Trey Parker must be communicated to the world. But if you thought I was insulting your intelligence, then ha ha. What'cha gonna do? Your kill Al Qaeda training ain't got shit on my days with the WCW.
Cracka please. I have been trained in realistic martial arts. Your body slams and diamond-cutters from the WCW aint got shit on my skills, boy. Thats not even mentioning my rifle skills. I'd like to see you choke slam me from 300 yards away.
Yes, indeed, the genius of Trey Parker should be communicated to the world. I am convinced that people who don't like South Park are people who are either incapable of truely understanding good satire, or just don't know enough about the show to catch the subtle underlying themes. Those bastards. O, there's also one kind of people that don't like South Park. Hippies. Left wing hippies.
Still can't WILD........
Keep in mind that the hippie-hate comes from the sado-fascist fat kid, while the most credible character on the show, Stan, is also the most left-leaning.
I can't claim to be a full-time hippie, but I have worked as a full-time environmental activist and taken many a psychedelic journey while dancing barefoot to bands influenced by the Grateful Dead, and I find South Park hilarious.
If you have a sense of caring for others, you will manifest a kind of inner strength in spite of your own difficulties and problems. With this strength, your own problems will seem less significant and bothersome to you. By going beyond your own problems and taking care of others, you gain inner strength, self-confidence, courage, and a greater sense of calm.Dalai Lama
e-x--p---a----n-----d------> yourself.
STOP. I intended to write a thread about hookahs, and added a rant to it so it would be more worthy of extended discussion. However, a discussion this extended does not deserve to live.
From now on, talk about hookahs.
"Peace be upon you"-Altaïr Ibn-La'Ahad
What do you all think of non-hookahs? Discuss.
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