Thread: Who Should I Vote For?

Since I know you value my opinion so much , I will give you some advice. Do you believe that you own yourself and everything that you have legally acquired? Do you believe that when your things are taken from you by force or threat that is wrong, no matter who does it? Do you think every one should be free to do whatever makes them happy, as long as it doesn't hurt anyone else? Do you disagree with the intiation of force and violence? Do you not mind voting for somebody who will never win? Then vote Libertarian. Or if there is no Libertarian running, vote Green, I'm not really sure what they stand for, but at least they are not a Republicrat.

You should probably do some research to see which parties fit best with your beliefs. Hopefully we will someday have a viable third party in this country.

Well, it's probably going to be near impossible to fight through all the propaganda and make an informed choice about a candidate you trust. But if you can get by that, I'd say vote for the person that you think least likely to call the Constitution of the United States of America "just a goddamn piece of paper."

Hope that helps!

Well... democrats are really only hoping for votes on account of people wanting a landmark. (first black or women) Neither of which are qualified... But on the other hand, republicans gave us bush.... so... third party? HEHE. jk. don't go throwing your vote away.

fuck all that.

It’s painful to submit to our bosses; it’s even more stupid to choose them. The best way to vote is to pick up paving stones and toss them.

Originally Posted by metcalfracing

Well... democrats are really only hoping for votes on account of people wanting a landmark. (first black or women) Neither of which are qualified... But on the other hand, republicans gave us bush.... so... third party? HEHE. jk. don't go throwing your vote away.
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The beauty of the American 'democracy'. OH! YOU CAN VOTE!!! But between bad and worse.

Really, how many people think both candidates suck? America doesn't have a healthy political system, you need a few more parties, a few more viewpoints for that. You just CAN NOT divide people into 2 groups like in America. But hey, you are either with us, or for the terrorist. The absolutism is just sad.

OPTIONS:

If you want a better democracy (not perfect by all means):
-Immigrate, like to Europe.
-Get reincarnated in a rich family so you can actually get into politics with all the right ties, so you can change the system from within.

If you want to stay in America, or the reincarnation backfired:
-You are fucked, choose for the people that have the least tendency to fuck people over: the democrats. Or vote blank if you want to protest. If all people that dislike the system would vote blank, that would send out a Strong message to the country and the government.

Curently, I'd abstain
you can pick between people who are going 2 act lyk twats who tell you they will act lyk twats (republicans)
and people who are going to act like twats and tell you theyll act lyk repsoisnble eladers (democrats)

Imran

I don't vote, out of principle. I do go to the voting booth though, I just spoil the ballot paper.

So, of course, I'm going to suggest you don't vote. From a purely cost-benefit analysis, what do you get out of it? Nothing. When was the last time you heard of an election being one by just one vote?

However, if you do vote, my suggestion: From what I understand, the American "democratic" system is structured so that, in practice, there are only two parties that have, and are ever likely to have, any significant representation. So, speaking as a non-american, I strongly urge you, IF you vote, to vote democrat. Why?

I like my country (for the most part), and I like the world. I don't want a warlike america fucking up the world like it has been under the current republican regime.

TBM - I don't think you should take the current administration and nail down Republicans.

This is a good time juroara. Because you have time. Take note and watch the two parties. As 3FLryan pointed out Both parties are going to be mud slinging, as they say.
That is politics. That is why it is essential to watch how each party reacts over time. For the president is a mere figure head. It is who is in power , meaning the house and the senate that is of major importance. Who is the majority and the minority.
I feel confident as you watch the actions of both parties that you will see that Republicans have a more down to earth, conservative and steadfast approach.

Originally Posted by Howetzer

I feel confident as you watch the actions of both parties that you will see that Republicans have a more down to earth, conservative and steadfast approach.[/b]

What is that even supposed to MEAN, Howetzer? I don't want to get into a heated argument right now (mainly seeing as I'm going away for the long weekend, public holiday in my country), but what you just said sounded like the exact same sort of vaguely positive, meaningless affirmation as the same tripe spewed by politicians during campaigning. "Down to earth and steadfast"? I mean, come ON! Are you sure you don't write propaganda slogans as a nightjob, howie?

Originally Posted by The

What is that even supposed to MEAN, Howetzer? I don't want to get into a heated argument right now (mainly seeing as I'm going away for the long weekend, public holiday in my country), but what you just said sounded like the exact same sort of vaguely positive, meaningless affirmation as the same tripe spewed by politicians during campaigning. "Down to earth and steadfast"? I mean, come ON! Are you sure you don't write propaganda slogans as a nightjob, howie.[/b]

Is this statement not biased?

I like my country (for the most part), and I like the world. I don't want a warlike america fucking up the world like it has been under the current republican regime.[/b]

This is why I ad viced her to give it time. Watch, learn. Her decision is her choice.
I put my two cents in as did you. I just was not as forth coming.

Originally Posted by Howetzer

Is this statement not biased? [/b]

Oh, my beef wasn't with you being BIASED. My beef was with you making vaguely possitive comments such as that seen in the exact same sort of propaganda spiel such as that seen during election campaigns, and which really serve no pupose but to cloud judgement and disguise meaning. I mean, I'd agree with "conservative" as an informative descriptor and indication of opinion, but "steadfast" and "down to earth" don't actually give any information or opinion but just serve as vaguely positive adjectives - they're weasel-words.

But in any case, yeah, I'll shut up now.

Originally Posted by Moonbeam

Since I know you value my opinion so much , I will give you some advice. Do you believe that you own yourself and everything that you have legally acquired? Do you believe that when your things are taken from you by force or threat that is wrong, no matter who does it? Do you think every one should be free to do whatever makes them happy, as long as it doesn't hurt anyone else? Do you disagree with the intiation of force and violence? Do you not mind voting for somebody who will never win? Then vote Libertarian. Or if there is no Libertarian running, vote Green, I'm not really sure what they stand for, but at least they are not a Republicrat.[/b]

I like that advice...well except for the green thing then I'd obtain. And what's the difference between a Republicrat anyway?

Our government has been usurped by the large corporation (not saying all corporations are bad or even that corporations in general are bad) through lobbying and bureaucratic sellouts, that's where the propaganda/brainwashing comes in. My point is that We The "People" need to take America back and make her a beautiful thing again.

Just something to think about. Good luck and vote well!

Originally Posted by The

Oh, my beef wasn't with you being BIASED. My beef was with you making vaguely possitive comments such as that seen in the exact same sort of propaganda spiel such as that seen during election campaigns, and which really serve no pupose but to cloud judgement and disguise meaning. I mean, I'd agree with "conservative" as an informative descriptor and indication of opinion, but "steadfast" and "down to earth" don't actually give any information or opinion but just serve as vaguely positive adjectives - they're weasel-words.

But in any case, yeah, I'll shut up now.[/b]

First off I think you should give juroara a little more credit. Who is to say I am clouding her judgment? I would suspect, "Strongly urge you to vote democrat", a bit more along the line of persuasive.
And who are you to tell me what words I can use and which I can not? Conservative is OK but others our weasel words. Well personally I think weasel words are more like --

I don't vote, out of principle. I do go to the voting booth though, I just spoil the ballot paper.[/b]

Should I wait for a list for you to compile for words I can use?

All coming form someone who is not even a US citizen. Further more doesn't even try to represent anything. So you should not even have a set of words.

Enjoy the public holiday that was probably voted into act at some point.

Like you blue meanie, if i was in the US id abstain
not for the same reasons as you, its a pathetic reason

I'd abstain because of a lack of a good candidate and the lack of a good party
Not because elections aren't won by one vote
pah
live by that code and you will never ever do anything
"every little helps"
Imran
=)

Originally Posted by imran_p

Like you blue meanie, if i was in the US id abstain not for the same reasons as you, its a pathetic reason

I'd abstain because of a lack of a good candidate and the lack of a good party
Not because elections aren't won by one vote[/b]

Oh, that's not MY reason for not voting, that's just the reason I was suggesting to juroara for her not voting. Obviously, it's not my only reason - if it were, why would I go to the election booth and spoil my ballot paper, if the only reason I don't vote is because it;s not worth the effort?

Originally Posted by imran_p

All coming form someone who is not even a US citizen. Further more doesn't even try to represent anything. So you should not even have a set of words. [/b]

Why should the fact that I am not American or that I don't vote preclude me from having the right to hold and express an opinion on this subject?

Originally Posted by imran_p

Enjoy the public holiday that was probably voted into act at some point. [/b]

Ummm, I'm sorry, I'm not getting what you're meaning or refferring to here, could you explain yeslef a bit more?

In any case, maybe you should PM me rather from replying on this thread, howie - this is going off-topic, and maybe the off-topic posts should be removed too, or split into another thread in Philosophy, to prevent from clogging up juroara's thread - I'm sorry for dragging this off-topic, juoara.

Actually juoara, The Blue Meanie and I are giving you a very good example of politics.

Originally Posted by Moonbeam

Since I know you value my opinion so much , I will give you some advice.
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maybe I am libertarian, not sure yet. I'll be sure to look into them though, thanks for the advice


and um..uh..thanks for the display of politics guys and thanks for the advice either way. some of you feel its not even worth voting. I felt that way for years also, since all the candidates looked like idiots or liars. But, not voting didn't seem to help either. Those idiots and liars still got into office right?

I'll probably be voting third party if Im disattisfied with everything Xb Im sure any third party can do a better job than Bush

Originally Posted by juroara

maybe I am libertarian, not sure yet. I'll be sure to look into them though, thanks for the advice
and um..uh..thanks for the display of politics guys and thanks for the advice either way. some of you feel its not even worth voting. I felt that way for years also, since all the candidates looked like idiots or liars. But, not voting didn't seem to help either. Those idiots and liars still got into office right?

I'll probably be voting third party if Im disattisfied with everything Xb Im sure any third party can do a better job than Bush[/b]

I think this is one of the BIG issues that does need to be addresses. --The Third party.
There is no chance for a third party candidate to win under the current system. Voter reform is so needed but the politicians who got into office via the old way are not knocking down doors to change it.

Originally Posted by juroara

maybe I am libertarian, not sure yet.
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Here is the quiz where you can find out. I put it in the other quiz-thread but I don't think anybody but Keeper took it.

Originally Posted by Moonbeam

Here is the quiz where you can find out. I put it in the other quiz-thread but I don't think anybody but Keeper took it.[/b]

No offence directed to you Moonbeam. I take the test too.

Something is wrong if you have to take a quiz to determine what defines your political standing.
If at all it should be categorized.
At any rate, it should be a guide to ask yourself those questions and determine them through your own process of self evaluation and thought.

I know, just a little thing to think about.

Originally Posted by Howetzer

TBM - I don't think you should take the current administration and nail down Republicans.
I feel confident as you watch the actions of both parties that you will see that Republicans have a more down to earth, conservative and steadfast approach.
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Just to interject on this point: You might as well say, "Hey, vote Republican because they are 'good' and 'nice.' Don't vote democrat because they are 'not as good' and 'not as nice.'" Say it out loud. Sounds funny, doesn't it? Well, that's what 99.99999% percent of campaigning comes down to (on both sides of the coin), using vague affirmative statements and vague accusations that play on peoples emotions. That's why your comment sounded like propaganda.

Originally Posted by 3FLryan

Just to interject on this point: You might as well say, "Hey, vote Republican because they are 'good' and 'nice.' Don't vote democrat because they are 'not as good' and 'not as nice.'" Say it out loud. Sounds funny, doesn't it? Well, that's what 99.99999% percent of campaigning comes down to (on both sides of the coin), using vague affirmative statements and vague accusations that play on peoples emotions. That's why your comment sounded like propaganda.
[/b]

However, if you do vote, my suggestion: From what I understand, the American "democratic" system is structured so that, in practice, there are only two parties that have, and are ever likely to have, any significant representation. So, speaking as a non-american, I strongly urge you, IF you vote, to vote democrat. Why?

I like my country (for the most part), and I like the world. I don't want a warlike america fucking up the world like it has been under the current republican regime.[/b]

How then is the above staement to be received?

I was confident enough to state that if she did her part, that she would conclude that the words I used were a fundamental base for conservatives. But I guess to hell with using tact.

There is a lot of political jargon that voters have to sift through to make a well rounded decision. But because you have likely heard president Bush use steadfast, it is a propagandist statement?

Words like that are propagandist and confusing, because I could apply them to anything I believe in. To an anarchist, if she did her research, she would find that anarchism is "more down to earth and steadfast" than anything else.

A true, non-propagandist statement would say something about the actual beliefs of the republican party, such as "If you do your research, I'm sure you will find that Republicans support lower taxes than Democrats," instead of attatching a vaguely positive label to them such as "down to earth." That is why "conservative" as you used it did not sound propagnadist, because it actually has a measurable truth value.

Oh, and the above statement you asked about is clearly biased and doesn't give any actual reasons for voting democrat.