Thread: Aliens created us!

Originally Posted by Pensive Patrick

One of the few things that really get to me in life is people who just completely discount explanations of events simply because it defies belief. Give it a chance. It's possible, that's all. You really can't argue that it's completely impossible.

If something defies logic and goes against all empirical evidence on whatever they are trying to provide an alternative explanation for... then I have every right to disregard it/criticise it/be sceptical of it.

Originally Posted by bluefinger

If something defies logic and goes against all empirical evidence on whatever they are trying to provide an alternative explanation for... then I have every right to disregard it/criticise it/be sceptical of it.

Sure, be sceptical, but don't rule it out completely or "disregard it" as you say. It's still possible.

Originally Posted by Pensive Patrick

Sure, be sceptical, but don't rule it out completely or "disregard it" as you say. It's still possible.

It's also possible (though utterly minutely so) that I will accidentally discover a cure for cancer lying on the ground tomorrow, despite knowing absolutely nothing about medicine. But what's the point of entertaining all these "possibilities"? Better to disregard it, and spend my time doing something more productive, than walking along examining the ground for anything that could be related to cancer.

Originally Posted by RedfishBluefish

It's also possible (though utterly minutely so) that I will accidentally discover a cure for cancer lying on the ground tomorrow, despite knowing absolutely nothing about medicine. But what's the point of entertaining all these "possibilities"? Better to disregard it, and spend my time doing something more productive, than walking along examining the ground for anything that could be related to cancer.

I think the likelihood of aliens being in contact with us in some point in our history is slightly more likely than that scenario.

Originally Posted by Pensive Patrick

I think the likelihood of aliens being in contact with us in some point in our history is slightly more likely than that scenario.

And yet, what evidence do you have to suggest that it is a likelihood as opposed to simply illogical crock?

Sure, be sceptical, but don't rule it out completely or "disregard it" as you say. It's still possible.

Possible, maybe; true, no. Just as it's possible that I might find a tub of anti-cancer on the ground today, but it still isn't true that I will. Ask me tomorrow if you like.

Originally Posted by bluefinger

And yet, what evidence do you have to suggest that it is a likelihood as opposed to simply illogical crock?

Countless billions of planets out there. Probably life out there. Possibly intelligent life out there. Possible intelligent life contacting us. We know so little about the universe, it's silly to think that we know enough to make dramatic assumptions like "aliens were not involved in our history".

Originally Posted by Xei

Possible, maybe; true, no. Just as it's possible that I might find a tub of anti-cancer on the ground today, but it still isn't true that I will. Ask me tomorrow if you like.

That's a completely illlogical statement. You can't say that something is possible, but not true. That doesn't make sense! How do you know if it's true or not? Were you able to witness the entierity of human evolution to see if there were aliens involved at any point?

Originally Posted by Pensive Patrick

Countless billions of planets out there. Probably life out there. Possibly intelligent life out there. Possible intelligent life contacting us. We know so little about the universe, it's silly to think that we know enough to make dramatic assumptions like "aliens were not involved in our history".

Countless stars out there, depending on the location within a galaxy, the type of the star, any planets the star system has, if any are in the habitable zone, etc. All of this scattered across vast distances of space. Secondly, look at how long it took for intelligent life to emerge here on Earth. For another planet elsewhere to go through the same process and have intelligent life evolve more or less in the same time frame as us, and to progress to the point they not only surpassed us technologically, but were able to figure out an efficient and quick way of travelling over the vast distances of space. And yet, when they got here, instead of colonizing the planet for themselves, they decided to play god and then bugger off. Hmm, entirely plausible. [/sarcasm]

Whilst I don't doubt the existence of life elsewhere, maybe even the possibility of intelligent life, however, considering how huge and vast the universe is, just to go to the nearest star would be a fucking miracle for us (if we not only manage to gather enough fuel to power the craft's systems, but also have a population of people survive the long, lonely journey as well). Unless you have the empirical evidence to suggest otherwise, I think I can be completely sceptical of the OP's and your claims.

Originally Posted by Pensive Patrick

That's a completely illlogical statement. You can't say that something is possible, but not true. That doesn't make sense! How do you know if it's true or not? Were you able to witness the entierity of human evolution to see if there were aliens involved at any point?

Empirical evidence disagrees. The work that scientists have done to verify evolution over a hundred years or so, show that evolution itself is an effective deterministic system, not requiring any external influences apart from the environment itself. There is no need for additional statements like "Aliens did it" or "Goddidit".

Originally Posted by bluefinger

Countless stars out there, depending on the location within a galaxy, the type of the star, any planets the star system has, if any are in the habitable zone, etc. All of this scattered across vast distances of space. Secondly, look at how long it took for intelligent life to emerge here on Earth. For another planet elsewhere to go through the same process and have intelligent life evolve more or less in the same time frame as us, and to progress to the point they not only surpassed us technologically, but were able to figure out an efficient and quick way of travelling over the vast distances of space. And yet, when they got here, instead of colonizing the planet for themselves, they decided to play god and then bugger off. Hmm, entirely plausible. [/sarcasm]

You're being very human centred here. Not all planets came in to being at the same time. You're really just making educated guesses. That's not enough basis for an assumption. And don't say that I'm assuming aliens have come into contact with us - I'm not. I'm just saying its plausible.

Whilst I don't doubt the existence of life elsewhere, maybe even the possibility of intelligent life, however, considering how huge and vast the universe is, just to go to the nearest star would be a fucking miracle for us (if we not only manage to gather enough fuel to power the craft's systems, but also have a population of people survive the long, lonely journey as well). Unless you have the empirical evidence to suggest otherwise, I think I can be completely sceptical of the OP's and your claims.

Again, you're focusing on humans. For us it would take a while. What if the aliens have been around for longer. Or interdimensional beings? I know, it sounds silly even to myself, but our knowledge is so limited we HAVE to accept there are other possibilities that defy our current logic!

Empirical evidence disagrees. The work that scientists have done to verify evolution over a hundred years or so, show that evolution itself is an effective deterministic system, not requiring any external influences apart from the environment itself. There is no need for additional statements like "Aliens did it" or "Goddidit".

I didn't mean that aliens were involved in evolution. I just meant contacted us at some point, in some way. And again, I'm not saying they did. I'm saying it should be considered.

Originally Posted by Pensive Patrick

You're being very human centred here. Not all planets came in to being at the same time. You're really just making educated guesses. That's not enough basis for an assumption. And don't say that I'm assuming aliens have come into contact with us - I'm not. I'm just saying its plausible.

Hence the whole playing god thing. Also, emphasis on educated with the guessing. If you actually understand the implications of the distances involved just for travelling around in our own solar system, once you start looking at the distances between the closest stars to us, travelling around in space will not be an easy feat, even for a much more technologically advanced civilisation. My assumptions are based upon reality, not romanticism, and therefore aren't something to be simply shrugged off without an effective counterargument. And for saying something is plausible is still making the assumption for such a case, especially when there is no evidence or even a decent statistical probability to show otherwise.

Originally Posted by Pensive Patrick

Again, you're focusing on humans. For us it would take a while. What if the aliens have been around for longer. Or interdimensional beings? I know, it sounds silly even to myself, but our knowledge is so limited we HAVE to accept there are other possibilities that defy our current logic!

Oh... fucking... dear. You have no idea how absurd that comes across... what next? Lizard people? Also, you have little understanding of what logic means, if you really believe that.

Originally Posted by Pensive Patrick

I didn't mean that aliens were involved in evolution. I just meant contacted us at some point, in some way. And again, I'm not saying they did. I'm saying it should be considered.

Just like the FSM touched us all with his noodly appendage at some point, in some way.

That's a completely illlogical statement. You can't say that something is possible, but not true. That doesn't make sense! How do you know if it's true or not?

Oh dear, I didn't find any anticancer after all. So I was right, and what I said was completely true.

I'll now go on to say aliens didn't create us. And that is equally true.

That's a completely illlogical statement. You can't say that something is possible, but not true. That doesn't make sense! How do you know if it's true or not?

Because you can say that something is not possible, thus making it not true, thus evening the scale out:

False - Possible - True

I would agree that this is entirely possible. There's really no way of knowing what happened, or how we got here. That's the big mystery of life. It's a question everyone wants to know.

To the people who disagree, I would like to say that I respect your opinions, but lets not be so certain that we rule something out. That would be reacting in fear, hence why most people deny things that are unexplainable. I really cannot comprehend the close mindedness of people in general. There would be no room for growth if everyone was closed off. Therefore, we should embrace possibilities.

I sit back and read these forums all the time, and just laugh at all the arguments between two people who just know their opinions are absolutely right. It's pretty logical to think that if you don't have all the evidence to conclude something, then the possibilities are still open.

Now 911 conspiracy = totally possible
aliens genetically creating humans = possible

Originally Posted by Wattage

I would agree that this is entirely possible. There's really no way of knowing what happened, or how we got here. That's the big mystery of life. It's a question everyone wants to know.

To the people who disagree, I would like to say that I respect your opinions, but lets not be so certain that we rule something out. That would be reacting in fear, hence why most people deny things that are unexplainable. I really cannot comprehend the close mindedness of people in general. There would be no room for growth if everyone was closed off. Therefore, we should embrace possibilities.

I sit back and read these forums all the time, and just laugh at all the arguments between two people who just know their opinions are absolutely right. It's pretty logical to think that if you don't have all the evidence to conclude something, then the possibilities are still open.

Now 911 conspiracy = totally possible
aliens genetically creating humans = possible

Umm... it's called logic and reasoning. If you look at the distances of space between just the nearest star, any thing coming over to us isn't gonna just go "Oh HAI THAR!" or "Let's drop off some genetic material here and bugger off, shall we?". Also, we have a pretty conclusive fossil record, genetics, taxonomy, and everything that suggests we evolved through natural means via common descent. There is nothing to suggest we were genetically engineered (if so, it was a pretty poor job).

First of all, If alien civilisations existed within a reasonable distance of our solar system (nearby star system), then SETI would have detected them by now. And let's say there was one (at least in the vicinity of our star system). First, they'd have to detect our planet and then come over. After expending a huge amount of resources and energy to get here, all they do is engineer some humans and bugger off? Even if they were only interested in contact, why would they contact a species which wasn't even nearly as technologically advanced as theirs? If we've only been transmitting radio signals for about 100 or so years, only stars within 100 lightyears would have received the first radio signals by now. So if we've only just become technologically advanced enough to be detected, only the nearest star systems would be aware of us.

Considering the distances involved, it is highly unlikely such a civilisation would risk travelling through deep space in order to just to establish a new species or simply say "HAI" when for the latter, they can simply transmit some signals back.

Also, 9/11 conspiracy... one word, Logistics. Learn it and understand why it becomes implausible.

I love reading these forums and seeing people who don't have much knowledge about a particular subject, such as biology or space travel, seem to say that we don't have enough knowledge to make educated guesses.

Xei has provided a perfectly good argument as to why this thread makes an invalid point.
Any argument saying "but it is possible, because we don't have all of the knowledge" is a load of crap. It's you who doesn't have the knowledge or understanding of these subjects, and that's what makes it easy for you to discount them.
Read up on space travel.
Read up on evolution.
Read up on abiogenesis.
After doing this, you might like to come back and continue the debate.

Why such belittlement?
Educated guesses are just that, guesses. Which can be false.

I know you are just itching to say it's possible. Sure, it may not be plausible, but possible.

Originally Posted by Wattage

Why such belittlement?

Because you apparently don't understand the things you're talking about, or are in agreeance with those who don't for unknown reasons.

Such closed mindedness and bitterness saddens me. Humanity is not a race worthy of life if we take ourselves this seriously.

Originally Posted by Pensive Patrick

Such closed mindedness and bitterness saddens me. Humanity is not a race worthy of life if we take ourselves this seriously.

Actually, I am more than welcome to be proven wrong, if you can come up with the argument and evidence to show how my educated guesses are incorrect. But if you can't provide the goods, then I shall continue to be 'close-minded' (read, sceptical/critical).

Originally Posted by bluefinger

Actually, I am more than welcome to be proven wrong, if you can come up with the argument and evidence to show how my educated guesses are incorrect. But if you can't provide the goods, then I shall continue to be 'close-minded' (read, sceptical/critical).

Just because evidence isn't available doesn't mean it's not true. That's all I'm trying to say.

Originally Posted by bluefinger

'close-minded' (read, sceptical/critical).

Lulz at the implicit insult.

Originally Posted by psychology student

Lulz at the implicit insult.

Yay! Someone gets my humour!

Originally Posted by Pensive Patrick

Just because evidence isn't available doesn't mean it's not true. That's all I'm trying to say.

"Just because there's no evidence for the FSM does not mean the FSM doesn't exist. That's all I'm trying to say"

There. Fixed.

Originally Posted by bluefinger

"Just because there's no evidence for the FSM does not mean the FSM doesn't exist. That's all I'm trying to say"

There. Fixed.

Yah... your point being?

Originally Posted by Pensive Patrick

Yah... your point being?

You can't prove the possibility of something through lack of evidence, otherwise, you can justify a whole bunch of shit with the same reasoning. The argument does not stick.