Thread: Science kills religion.

I believe religion may die out, but I do not think spirituality and the like will.... I think many spiritual beliefs about consciousness will be confirmed by science...

I hope religion dies out, one day. However I have no problem with spirituality surviving. Religion is just sick and controls people. Spirituality, on the other hand, largely comes from inside yourself and not some cardboard Ritz cracker you eat at church.

science already tried it

still alive!


spirituality will give the final blow

Brain science can give spirituality a run for their money.

I haven't seen any brain science give spirituality a run for its money?

not even the studies behind NDE

spirituality does NOT separate the physical from the spiritual. its all interconnected. just because science says "we've discovered a chemical reaction that does x". that is not an argument against a spiritual understanding.

"Christian mythology" will eventually be studied in schools. It will be viewed the way we view the ancient Greek paganism with Zeus and the gang. It was the big religion of ancient Greece, but now we call it "Greek mythology" without it coming across as offensive.

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

"Christian mythology" will eventually be studied in schools. It will be viewed the way we view the ancient Greek paganism with Zeus and the gang. It was the big religion of ancient Greece, but now we call it "Greek mythology" without it coming across as offensive.

Nice, I hadn't thought of that yet. :]

If trends continue, religion may die out completely, yes.

Personally I find this a very good thing. The universe is still incredibly mysterious when you attempt to study it rationally; all religious superstitions do is belittle it.

However, trends may not continue. I think it's likely that this civilisation will be completely destroyed in a few centuries or so. Then we will look back on Christianity as some kind of crazy cult of the oil age, whilst succumbing to entirely new strains of mysticism ourselves; exactly like how we look back upon the ancient Greeks today whilst believing Christianity.

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

"Christian mythology" will eventually be studied in schools. It will be viewed the way we view the ancient Greek paganism with Zeus and the gang. It was the big religion of ancient Greece, but now we call it "Greek mythology" without it coming across as offensive.

Took the words right out of my mouth. Good observation Universal.

I did have one politically correct teacher that always referred to as the Greek religion. But maybe she believed in Zeus!

honestly, would it be so wrong to learn about all religions at high school level? Religion is such a huge cornerstone of mankind and has propelled how our culture has developed since it's been with us. I also hate the christian white male lectures on foreign religions. Always making them appear as retarded as possible and never going into how deep other religions are

They're not deep. They're primitive superstitions. If they all shone light on some kind of mystical truth, then they wouldn't all contradict each other. It has indeed been a cornerstone of our culture, but then so has war.

Originally Posted by juroara

I did have one politically correct teacher that always referred to as the Greek religion. But maybe she believed in Zeus!

honestly, would it be so wrong to learn about all religions at high school level? Religion is such a huge cornerstone of mankind and has propelled how our culture has developed since it's been with us. I also hate the christian white male lectures on foreign religions. Always making them appear as retarded as possible and never going into how deep other religions are

Yes. Because separation between church and state is mandated by the constitution. Also, it would be really, really annoying for someone like me who doesn't give a shit about religion. Learning about ancient cultures and their belief system is one thing, but having a class devoted to the study of religions is something I can't stomach. Plus in-depth knowledge of religions is completely, absolutely useless in the long run. So there would be no point.

Originally Posted by Black_Eagle

Plus in-depth knowledge of religions is completely, absolutely useless in the long run. So there would be no point.

I'm an atheist. I hate religion. I'm all for seperation of church and state. But this has to be the dumbest and most ignorant thing I've read here, and that's saying something.

Religion is part of the history of humankind, whether you like it or not. Theology has its place in society as part of our history, something we can look at, learn from, and study. Our history is an important part of our advancement as a race, and religion is part of that history whether you like it or not.

You ignore religion and pretend like it didn't ever exist, you've just erased a pivotal portion of humanity. Congratulations.

Originally Posted by ExoByte

I'm an atheist. I hate religion. I'm all for seperation of church and state. But this has to be the dumbest and most ignorant thing I've read here, and that's saying something.

Religion is part of the history of humankind, whether you like it or not. Theology has its place in society as part of our history, something we can look at, learn from, and study. Our history is an important part of our advancement as a race, and religion is part of that history whether you like it or not.

You ignore religion and pretend like it didn't ever exist, you've just erased a pivotal portion of humanity. Congratulations.

Let me clarify. I considered this and that's why I put the in-depth. I figured general knowledge of religion is in fact a historical part of mankind and fulfills the role you've outlined above, but I can't see how intricate knowledge of religious rituals and practices could be useful in someone's life.

Edit: I also should have stated "religious practices" instead of just stating "religion" by itself. Having a class in highschool would most likely teach students about religious practices seeing as the history of religion is already taught in history classes. All in all, I agree with your post, I just should have phrased that better.

Originally Posted by juroara

I haven't seen any brain science give spirituality a run for its money?

not even the studies behind NDE

spirituality does NOT separate the physical from the spiritual. its all interconnected. just because science says "we've discovered a chemical reaction that does x". that is not an argument against a spiritual understanding.

Atleast with brain science there is an answer to some of those questions, whereas spirituality does not have any except meditating and thinking what you see is really dead people in heaven.

not even the studies behind NDE

Yes it does....you ever hear of those neruo experts talk about why you feel calm, why you have a sensation of moving, why there is a bright light, etc? go watch that Pam Reynolds story, then listen to the person discrediting Pams expierience in being real.

edit- Actually i am not sure if you will be able to find it...it was part of the BBC documentary that was taken off their site.

Originally Posted by LucidFlanders

Atleast with brain science there is an answer to some of those questions, whereas spirituality does not have any except meditating and thinking what you see is really dead people in heaven.



Yes it does....you ever hear of those neruo experts talk about why you feel calm, why you have a sensation of moving, why there is a bright light, etc? go watch that Pam Reynolds story, then listen to the person discrediting Pams expierience in being real.

edit- Actually i am not sure if you will be able to find it...it was part of the BBC documentary that was taken off their site.

you dont understand


you separate the physical from the spiritual

spiritual people however, do not

there is a physical reason for everything you experience in the brain, AND a spiritual side to the physical realm. the two are not separate, but interrelated. there is no science that has gone against spirituality. on the contrary.

theres no point in going in deph here

what needs to be understood is spirituality becomes a point of view, a way of viewing reality, not a set of standardized beliefs

Originally Posted by Black_Eagle

Yes. Because separation between church and state is mandated by the constitution. Also, it would be really, really annoying for someone like me who doesn't give a shit about religion. Learning about ancient cultures and their belief system is one thing, but having a class devoted to the study of religions is something I can't stomach. Plus in-depth knowledge of religions is completely, absolutely useless in the long run. So there would be no point.

what does separation of church and state have anything to do with learning about religion at school?

we already learn about religion at school every time we learn about different cultures

how is learning about different religions any more useless than learning about past and extinct cultures? religion still has a historical value, and is a necessary cornerstone in light of how cultures have developed. you can't understand one without the other

if you hate religion so much you are offended learning about it, thats your problem. And seriously, A SAD PROBLEM. Get over it!

I enjoyed learning about the egyptians, the mayans, and the greeks! It would have been nicer however, to learn about these cultures from the most unbiased point of view, not tainted by the white christian. For example.....greek mythology. Clearly white man christian terminology!

Can you imagine how different high school would be, if all students knew about all major religions. Do you realize what an impact that would be on the bible belt? There is nothing illegal about schools teaching religion. But according to the american as I understand it, it has to be unbiased. And teach them all. Even agnosticm, atheisticm. TEACH THEM ALL.

Wouldnt that be best? To learn the truth on how diverse religion actually is? Wouldn't a few bubbles burst?

Do you know how many christians out there, that think hindus are pagans?

Religion is already an elective in a lot of schools across the western world. Forcing it on people as part of the curriculum means we're taking time away from WORTHWHILE subjects to focus on 'fairytales of the world'.

No thanks. Keep it in chuch and in the history classes. It doesnt need a subject of its own. There's already enough pointless subjects taught in the current curriculum without needing to add more. At least at my high school, Physical Education needs a complete overhaul. Needs to be less "here's a ball, go kick it/throw it/catch it" and more on structuring your diet, understanding Energy In vs Energy Out and what that means for weight gain/loss. And at the very least some weights training, for boys and girls.

Originally Posted by juroara

what does separation of church and state have anything to do with learning about religion at school?

we already learn about religion at school every time we learn about different cultures

how is learning about different religions any more useless than learning about past and extinct cultures? religion still has a historical value, and is a necessary cornerstone in light of how cultures have developed. you can't understand one without the other

if you hate religion so much you are offended learning about it, thats your problem. And seriously, A SAD PROBLEM. Get over it!

I enjoyed learning about the egyptians, the mayans, and the greeks! It would have been nicer however, to learn about these cultures from the most unbiased point of view, not tainted by the white christian. For example.....greek mythology. Clearly white man christian terminology!

Can you imagine how different high school would be, if all students knew about all major religions. Do you realize what an impact that would be on the bible belt? There is nothing illegal about schools teaching religion. But according to the american as I understand it, it has to be unbiased. And teach them all. Even agnosticm, atheisticm. TEACH THEM ALL.

Wouldnt that be best? To learn the truth on how diverse religion actually is? Wouldn't a few bubbles burst?

Do you know how many christians out there, that think hindus are pagans?

Please read my revised response instigated by Exo.

If you're talking about histories of religions and vaguely what they believe in, then you should know that they already teach that in highschool. I do know about major religions, I also know about other religions that weren't quite so great. I know of Christianity and quite a few of its sects, Judaism, Islam and its sects, Confucianism, Taoism, Buddhism (which is my favorite by far), Greek polytheism, Roman polytheism, Egyptian polytheism, Norse polytheism, Hinduism, and vaguely about the Native American beliefs (which includes all peoples native to the Americas before the white man came). All of this has been taught to me in public school. I find quite a bit of it interesting.

if you hate religion so much you are offended learning about it, thats your problem. And seriously, A SAD PROBLEM. Get over it!

I've taught myself about the Druids, Mormonism, Scientology, Satanism, and expanded my knowledge of Buddhism in my spare time. You know, the stuff I was interested in hearing about that they didn't talk about so much in school.

I assumed you already knew they taught about religion in schools so long as it ties into history/geography and that you were for teaching about religion's more intricate practices. That, I would argue with you, IS useless.

And why do you say the term "Greek Mythology" is White man Christian terminology? Personally, I look at nearly all of religion as mythology.

Originally Posted by Alextanium

Religion is already an elective in a lot of schools across the western world. Forcing it on people as part of the curriculum means we're taking time away from WORTHWHILE subjects to focus on 'fairytales of the world'.

No thanks. Keep it in chuch and in the history classes. It doesnt need a subject of its own.

Really? What exactly is involved in the curriculum of these electives?

I like being the instigator.

At least in Australia, it's always either an elective or a mandatory subject in religiously motived privately funded high schools (anything named St-Whatever), and always relating to the religion of the school. So mostly all catholics.

To the best of my understanding, they only teach about the Catholic faith. Not the other 2500 sects of Christianity or Islam, Buddism or anything else.

I have a non-religious friend that went to a religious school, and he took Religion as an elective out of pure curiosity. He says it actually turned him more AWAY from religion after taking the class.

In Tennessee it was against the policy for religion to be in our schools. It couldn't be taught, teachers couldn't speak about it.

Of course you can learn about some religions through studying history, but that's just part of history.

I believe it's ok for a school to talk about religion as long as it's linked to history, say the Salem Witch Trials. Or how people came to America to escape prosecution. But, religion wasn't talked about a lot in those types of things. Maybe you covered it just a tad, but went on to more relevant things about the study.

I wouldn't want religion taught in schools though, like teaching kids about Christianity, or Hinduism, or Buddhism, or any of that. Religion isn't going to get you anywhere after school. Unless you plan on taking a job that deals with religion.

Originally Posted by juroara

you dont understand


you separate the physical from the spiritual

spiritual people however, do not

there is a physical reason for everything you experience in the brain, AND a spiritual side to the physical realm. the two are not separate, but interrelated. there is no science that has gone against spirituality. on the contrary.

theres no point in going in deph here

what needs to be understood is spirituality becomes a point of view, a way of viewing reality, not a set of standardized beliefs

Found it

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s25L1...eature=related

Check from 7:33 untill the end and few seconds of part 3.

That is an answer for you.

Originally Posted by Black_Eagle

I assumed you already knew they taught about religion in schools so long as it ties into history/geography and that you were for teaching about religion's more intricate practices.

a good half of the religions you mentioned, I never learned about in school