Thread: Science says: Religion will be here forever!

Maybe religions will die out and some type of Deism will remain in it's place.

That would be best.

I hope that eventually we will evolve from our very subtle differences in religious views leaving only theists, agnostics, and athiests in the simplist forms.

Thats if the world doesn't end very soon, like many of the theists predict!

Also, a bit off topic but I want place a bet with some atheists, about the afterlife:
I'll bet any atheist a banana that the afterlife exists, and we can pay eachother then, or not! Sound good to you.

Yeah, except humans won't be around forever.

Originally Posted by Mark75

Yeah, except humans won't be around forever.

That's true. Religion will end. We win!

I'm onto you Mark75! No clones!

I can't help it. Sometimes I just divide and a whole new Mark forms.

Originally Posted by psychology student

Well, it more or less says that humans are genetically pre-disposed to have religious or supernatural tendencies, as these behaviours promote natural selection.

People have lots of genetically predisposed behaviors that we are able to overcome. So there is hope.

Like thumbsucking.

We need to get a religious thumb brace so every time somebody starts to preach or be religious they'll get shocked!

I really think that religion of some form or another will be around right until the planet goes cold.

The best I can hope for at this point is for people to remove religion from politics and shut up about crazy things that the bible says about the evils of being gay and all of that fun stuff.

But I think that something new will take the place of (for example) Christianity one day and that Christianity will be taught in schools as some fun class like Greek mythology is today. Okay I've said this exact same thing elsewhere, uhhh, must not repeat self.

What a POS argument.
The human brain (especially the male) is also inclined towards physical agression and violence. So this means we should just give up doing something about it all together.
Oh yeah, and religion has always been part of our culture, much like racism, slavery and witchcraft, so those are also perfectly fine.

And my brain is also inclined towards behaving in anti-social ways. DON'T BLAME ME, IT'S JUST MY BRAIN. I am naturally inclined to do this. I am the mere result of evolution and I can't ever take any responsibility.

Funny how usually they say "religion gives a good alternative to the deterministic world view of science", but when it comes to finding arguments, it is perfectly fine to go with the flow and say "well, this is just determined by evolution and my brain, I can't help it."

Originally Posted by psychology student

Well, it more or less says that humans are genetically pre-disposed to have religious or supernatural tendencies, as these behaviours promote natural selection.

Lol right, because superstition (jumping to conclusions...like for example...always believing a stick is a snake, so that if ever a snake looked like a stick you wouldn't die) helped to keep people alive, and thus ironically created false gods (for example zues/thor who controlled lightning/thunder which was created by jumping to the conclusion that the big roar/light was created by some big scary thing) It is going to stay and has a rightful place in society. Yeah that makes sense...wtf were the people who wrote this link thinking?

I wish I knew where I found it, but there is a video about superstition with an example of a bird in a room with a food dispenser. There is a button that is linked to give food if the bird pushes it. Bird figures it out and starts pushing it. Then the machine is changed to give food out at random, and the bird gets confused...then just by chance as the bird was looking over his shoulder the food came out...and then he did it again and the food came out again. So then the bird started looking over his shoulder all the time hoping for food.

Originally Posted by psychology student

Also, a bit off topic but I want place a bet with some atheists, about the afterlife:
I'll bet any atheist a banana that the afterlife exists, and we can pay each other then, or not! Sound good to you.

No atheist would ever take that bet, we gain nothing from it either way. If there is no afterlife, we get no banana, if there is then we get no banana. It's a lose lose situation and I want my banana damn it.

Originally Posted by Mes Tarrant

The best I can hope for at this point is for people to remove religion from politics and shut up about crazy things that the bible says about the evils of being gay and all of that fun stuff.

Right, isn't it funny how a part of the bible that they reject anyway has influence over them? What about shaving the sides of their heads? Or the ever popular owning a Canadian. I bet they don't adhere to that. Of course being gay, that's some immoral sin that they are allowed to use that portion of text to demean homosexuals.

Korittke said:
"What a POS argument.
The human brain (especially the male) is also inclined towards physical agression and violence. So this means we should just give up doing something about it all together.
Oh yeah, and religion has always been part of our culture, much like racism, slavery and witchcraft, so those are also perfectly fine".

Yes, there may be cynical things in our genes, but my argument didn't intend to propose that we shouldn't fight them. Moreover, you imply that religion is one of these things (racism, violence), I believe that it is not. It, well Christianity at least, leads to the helping of people.


And Sandform..... take the bet you have nothing to lose

Originally Posted by psychology student

And Sandform..... take the bet you have nothing to lose

But I have nothing to gain =P.

Oh well...I tell you what...instead of betting a banana, how about we change it to...you saying...

"Hey atheists, you owe me a banana if i'm right!"

Of course if you go to heaven and we go to Hell your screwed Pychstudent

I do not think religion will ever disappear completely. Even if it does for a short time it will be back. That is just the way people think.

Originally Posted by psychology student

I'll bet any atheist a banana that the afterlife exists, and we can pay eachother then, or not! Sound good to you.

justification and evidence now.

Originally Posted by psychology student

well Christianity at least, leads to the helping of people.

And the torture and slaughter of people. It's a mixed bag.

How does christianity lead to the slaughter and torture of people? Or are you talking about religion in general.

Originally Posted by psychology student

How does christianity lead to the slaughter and torture of people? Or are you talking about religion in general.

Umm, the crusades, the inquisition, witch burning. . .

Yes, the classics. I KNOW you know them psych student.

Now I guess you can lay the torture upon homosexuals by not allowing them to marry, on women for not allowing abortions of 70-cell blastocysts, etc.

I would be completely happy if religion turned to deism. Deism is a wonderful thing, because you can still believe in a god but you don't have any damn holy book to tell you how to live your life and to kill people who don't believe the holy book. Ken Miller is one of the coolest scientists out there and he's a deist.

Originally Posted by psychology student

How does christianity lead to the slaughter and torture of people?

I find it hard to believe that someone could be that ignorant of history.

Moonbeam, that's nothing but an argument from personal incredulity. I don't see any evidence to support this position, and, in fact, would take the statement you quoted as evidence to the contrary.

Originally Posted by Needcatscan

Now I guess you can lay the torture upon homosexuals by not allowing them to marry, on women for not allowing abortions of 70-cell blastocysts, etc.

I would be completely happy if religion turned to deism. Deism is a wonderful thing, because you can still believe in a god but you don't have any damn holy book to tell you how to live your life and to kill people who don't believe the holy book. Ken Miller is one of the coolest scientists out there and he's a deist.

I like the way you think!

We were talking in the present tense, with regard to violence and torture.
Personally, I don't like this "past" fixation, that is so prominent, like the crusades. So some guys decided to kill some other guys, supposedly in the name of Christianity, but in no way does the bible incite such acts. Therefore we can blame it on individual persons, not Christianity itself. Surely modern Christians cannot be blamed for something some other guys did hundreds of years ago. Modern Christianity is the thing to judge not archaic Christianity because they are evidently different. Don't you think it is unreasonable? It is the equivalent of me blaming modern young white Americans for the imposition of Jim Crow laws on black Americans, earlier this century. When the only affiliation between the two is a cultural tag; it is clearly unreasonable from my perspective.

Although, it was suggested that the anti-homosexuality and pro-life morals in Christianity equate to harsh treatment. Yes Christians disagree with homosexuality, but they don't blindly kill or beat them or orgainise witch hunts nor maliciously ostracise them; it is a fact that true Christians will try to help such individuals with their supposed problem. In the Western world, it is my belief that homophobia does not come from Christianity, but rather the general population. It was officially regarded as a psychological condition until late last century (1970's) in many western countries. I think that as Christians are those who are openly against homosexuality,they become a scapegoat paying the debts of homophobia which is ingrained in society.

Secondly, to the abortion question: Christians oppose abortion as they see it as immoral. Notwithstanding, it is seen by atheists and non christians as an inhibition of liberal freedoms, a inhibition of free choice. Clearly there is a point here, its their body, right; pro choice individuals, as an independent human beings should be able to do as they like, free from persecutive morality! Is this right, I think so.
And yet, by having an abortion, and killing that foetus, a potential human being, wouldn't one also be inhibiting liberal freedoms of that child whose potential life is being terminated, the same freedoms one claims by advocating abortion; it seems like hypocrisy to me.
It seems to me that here a morality exists beyond Christianity, one that approches criminal legality. Isn't it, what do you think?

In regard to abortion... people counter the arguments against abortion by saying things like, "Well then are we supposed to save every sperm and every egg because it's a potential human being?"

Originally Posted by psychology student

It is the equivalent of me blaming modern young white Americans for the imposition of Jim Crow laws on black Americans, earlier this century.

No one here was invoking their whiteness as a reason for why they do good things. If they were, this would be a reasonable response.

Not that it matters anyway. A true white person wouldn't support racism.

Originally Posted by psychology student

We were talking in the present tense, with regard to violence and torture.

There are places in the world where this still occurs due to religion; more so in Muslim but in Christian as well. There is a thread here about the sale of girls by their parents, as sanctioned by the bible--this is going on in the U.S. right now.

Originally Posted by psychology student

Personally, I don't like this "past" fixation,

There are definitely people right now that would like to bring back Old Testament law. If it can exist in the modern world in the Muslim form, why do you think it can't in the Christian? And why would we not judge religions on what they have caused to happen in the past? Their still using the same texts!

Originally Posted by psychology student

but in no way does the bible incite such acts.

You obviously haven't read the bible. People who really know the bible never make statements like that, because they know what's in it.

Originally Posted by psychology student

When the only affiliation between the two is a cultural tag; it is clearly unreasonable from my perspective.

This is not the only affiliation; there is the bible, see previous.

Originally Posted by psychology student

Yes Christians disagree with homosexuality, but they don't blindly kill or beat them or orgainise witch hunts nor maliciously ostracise them; i

Actually that does happen in some places, as sanctioned by the bible. "If there is a man who lies with a male as those who lie with a woman, both of them have committed a detestable act; they shall surely be put to death." Lev 20:13

Originally Posted by psychology student

it is a fact that true Christians will try to help such individuals with their supposed problem.

You don't speak for all people who call themselves "True Christians", and a lot of those "True Christians" wouldn't agree with you.