Thread: Randoms up on your junk

What, no one has any thoughts on this, pro con or neutral? "You're a perv" or "hur hur, a hurr" are acceptable responses. Even if you're young and haven't done much dancing, do you think it's kind of gross or totally fine or what?

My own take is it's all good fun as long as people are on the same page, but there's plenty of room for misunderstanding or "assuming too much" and taking advantage. For instance, the last time I was at a dance bar, my buddy's birthday last year, toward the end of the night a girl who had seen me dancing with others assumed it would be okay to forcibly position me where she wanted me and hump my leg from behind while dragging her less-than-enthusiastic friend in front of me to make a sandwich. Awkward.

One negative or at least difficult aspect of loosening social/sexual attitudes is that in a group of a dozen people, you can have twenty different ideas of what is desirable or permissible, and when and how. In a more restrictive, traditional society, at least everyone knows what's expected of them (whether they can meet those expectations is another matter, of course).

I've never been to a dance club before, but it seems like that could be a really hit or miss thing. Personally, I wouldn't have a problem with it, but it seems like some people could easily be turned off by it.

Never been to a dance club...sounds like i should visit.

Originally Posted by grasshoppa

Never been to a dance club...sounds like i should visit.

heh, I find them pretty intolerable unless I drink A LOT. I really prefer happy hippie dancing to sexy dancing.

i tend to go to lounges, not typical dance clubs, which are very relaxed... but i wouldn't mind getting frotteured rotten by some hotties

Originally Posted by Taosaur

but quite a few college and post-grad-age ladies seem totally casual about dry-humping

yep. i also know there are some who wear silk panties or none at all for the purpose of having their clit stimulated most of the day. ha!

Originally Posted by Taosaur

One negative or at least difficult aspect of loosening social/sexual attitudes is that in a group of a dozen people, you can have twenty different ideas of what is desirable or permissible, and when and how.

this makes it fun!

Originally Posted by Taosaur

heh, I find them pretty intolerable unless I drink A LOT. .

That's like me, except with everything.

I went to a couple dances over the summer with my track team. We went to nationals for the 14-15 ad 16-17 ages groups. Dances aren't really my thing so I brought my rubik's cube along. It was kinda strange, as there was a big ball of humping teenagers and then there was me, off to the side, playing with a rubik's cube. The other dance (there were 2 dances, the second the night after the first) had even more people in a mating ball. At that one I just slept. I found the whole ordeal rather strange and somewhat embarrassing.

Originally Posted by Conkt

The other dance had even more people in a mating ball.

I love it. Girls are way more receptive to you when dancing haha

Sounds like I'm going dancing . . .

Not really my bag, man. It's just a bunch of people stuffed into a big, hot, sweaty, dry-humping mosh pit. Not really my idea of a good time...especially when the chicks would rather get off on each other than on me. If you took out all the guys, and made the women fairly attractive, and added some air conditioning, and if they were all attracted to me, bring it on.

(That is actually how I would prefer to die, I think. Probably won't happen, though. Darn.)

I miss slow songs and decent music at school dances, to be honest. Nowadays, it's always this loud, in-your-face kind of irritating rap or techno. God help you if you try to split someone off from the rest of the herd. Plus, I can never hear anyone, so "Do you want to dance?" and "Go away, pervert" kinda sound a lot alike. Maybe when I'm older...

Whenever I'm out I'm too busy being a bro and dropping jagerbombs and playing beer pong

Trashy.


That word about sums up my opinion of what your asking, Tao, since you
really, really wanted to know.

Originally Posted by Invader

Trashy.


That word about sums up my opinion of what your asking, Tao, since you
really, really wanted to know.

Nothing wrong with honesty Do you agree that it's becoming more widespread? If so, does that mean our culture is getting more "trashy?"

If I were betting, I'd guess this behavior has no corelation whatsoever to education level or income bracket.

Originally Posted by Taosaur

Nothing wrong with honesty Do you agree that it's becoming more widespread?

It didn't exist 50 years ago, not to this extent, so yes. If I label it trashy, and
it is indeed a part of the culture, then sure, it contributes to the culture's "trashiness".

Originally Posted by Taosaur

If I were betting, I'd guess this behavior has no corelation whatsoever to education level or income bracket.

No disagreement there. There are partygoers on every rung of the social
ladder. Except for the top one or two rungs, maybe.

Originally Posted by Invader

It didn't exist 50 years ago, not to this extent, so yes. If I label it trashy, and
it is indeed a part of the culture, then sure, it contributes to the culture's "trashiness".

I'm really interested in it as a microcosm of increasing sexual openness in our society, especially because it's an example that many non-prudes (such as myself) feel ambivalent about. It seems like a good sounding-board for where people's boundaries lie. Is it trashy to have sex outside of marriage? Outside a committed relationship? Frequent one night stands? Any one night stands? Friends with benefits? What about suggestive dancing without contact, or traditional slow dancing with full contact?

Has increased sexual permissiveness left our culture more free, more trashy, or both? Can we have one without the other, and if not, what is our priority?

I think there is a thread by hard_wired or idolfan about the increasingly sexualized status of our culture.

To be honest, I think it's a good thing over all. Minus the diseases. It brings humanity back to that archaic, tribal, time. Native and ancient cultures had orgies all the time. I don't think there was any reliable form of birth control (aside from pulling out) back then so often long term outcome were children. It kind of gave everyone a sense that every child was theirs which totally changes your perspective. You think for the benefit of the tribe, not just you and your immediate family. I think it was a time where people were closer together.

Kind of a tangent, but an interesting point I think. I still believe a lot of this behavior is trashy, but considering the above paragraph perhaps people are just trying to go back to those times in some way...subconsciously, unconsciously, super-consciously...

I'm not sure if humans were meant to be monogamous or not. With such a high rate of divorce it seems like having multiple open relationships (consecutively, or simultaneously) would probably improve relationships among couples, trios, quadros, pentros w/e...I think we need to get over this ego trip of marriage, the idea of being unified as a couple (or even worse, the idea that you in some sense own the person you are married to) and pursue the idea of unifying communities. Doesn't necessarily mean sexually, but I think that would help bring everyone together, or maybe I'm a dirty schmuck that wants to have a massive orgy.

Originally Posted by Taosaur

Has increased sexual permissiveness left our culture more free, more trashy, or both? Can we have one without the other, and if not, what is our priority?

Both, I'd say. There is another line that can be drawn here as well. I use the
term trashy as a generalization of some members of the society that I view
personally as being non-valuable. A description that will suffice for the time
being: Those who seek not but the most base physical pleasures and
indulgences (short term gratification), typically have no desire to educate
themselves or to engage in activity that require the remotest sense of
awareness. Imagine the pretty girl or guy at the club (whichever suits your
fancy), and the only interest they have in you is looks alone. They also
happen to be pretty stupid, almost willfully, have succeeded to live off of
someone else's money, and probably expects you to carry them financially if
they were to get involved with you. It happens. And I loath those types.

HOWEVER,

being that I made a generalization, my term "trashy" cannot be applied to
all of those whom express sexual freedom. The people that fall outside of the
term differ in many respects from those in the example I just gave. This is a
bit of a grey area for me.

I think I have to settle on the idea that the act itself is trashy, and that it
may contribute to one's overall "trashiness" but not define them. It is as if
the concept is ingrained in me. I guess that makes me something of a
traditionalist? Do I put more meaning into physical displays of affection?


As a final note, I can't say that I think the overall change is "wrong". The
action is mutual and no one is hurt by the action alone unless some other
factor is at play. Also, culture changes, life goes on.

Originally Posted by grasshoppa

I think there is a thread by hard_wired or idolfan about the increasingly sexualized status of our culture.

There's overlap, but definitely not a one-to-one relationship between permissiveness and licentiousness/objectification. A licentious culture will always take advantage of permissiveness, but a permissive culture need not be licentious. North America has a particularly odd blend of the two; having been more licentious than permissive through most of our history, our behavior is rather unbalanced now that we've "let the dogs out."

Responding to this as well...

Originally Posted by Invader

Both, I'd say. There is another line that can be drawn here as well. I use the term trashy as a generalization of some members of the society that I view personally as being non-valuable. A description that will suffice for the time being: Those who seek not but the most base physical pleasures and indulgences (short term gratification), typically have no desire to educate themselves or to engage in activity that require the remotest sense of awareness. Imagine the pretty girl or guy at the club (whichever suits your fancy), and the only interest they have in you is looks alone. They also happen to be pretty stupid, almost willfully, have succeeded to live off of someone else's money, and probably expects you to carry them financially if they were to get involved with you. It happens. And I loath those types.

...a lot of people have been taking this topic, I think, as referring to the hip-hop and/or meat-market "mating ball," but what I'm talking about in the OP isn't some girl doing a hand-plant while I ride the donkey, but a (usually) less ostentatious variety of bump-and-grind turning up at rock shows and rock/pop dance bars. The former I find no fun at all (see the example in post #2), whereas the latter is a nice sip of physical stimulation, ego gratification, and positive human contact.

The kind of situation you're describing, Invader, would definitely fall under the purview of the other thread: sexualization, fetishizing and objectification. In a situation where I'm going to be dancing, the scene is not about rubbing against the most superficially desirable sexual object. My impression is that others, like myself, are just looking for someone who will be fun to dance with. At a concert in particular, the one-on-one dancing is definitely secondary to the music and overall celebration.

Originally Posted by grasshoppa

To be honest, I think it's a good thing over all. Minus the diseases. It brings humanity back to that archaic, tribal, time. Native and ancient cultures had orgies all the time. I don't think there was any reliable form of birth control (aside from pulling out) back then so often long term outcome were children. It kind of gave everyone a sense that every child was theirs which totally changes your perspective. You think for the benefit of the tribe, not just you and your immediate family. I think it was a time where people were closer together.

Kind of a tangent, but an interesting point I think. I still believe a lot of this behavior is trashy, but considering the above paragraph perhaps people are just trying to go back to those times in some way...subconsciously, unconsciously, super-consciously...

I'm not sure if humans were meant to be monogamous or not. With such a high rate of divorce it seems like having multiple open relationships (consecutively, or simultaneously) would probably improve relationships among couples, trios, quadros, pentros w/e...I think we need to get over this ego trip of marriage, the idea of being unified as a couple (or even worse, the idea that you in some sense own the person you are married to) and pursue the idea of unifying communities. Doesn't necessarily mean sexually, but I think that would help bring everyone together, or maybe I'm a dirty schmuck that wants to have a massive orgy.

Heh, sounds a bit like the town I grew up in. Lifelong monogamy works just fine for some people, but I don't think those people are anywhere near a majority and there's a vast spectrum between monogamous marriage and village orgy.

Originally Posted by Invader

I think I have to settle on the idea that the act itself is trashy, and that it may contribute to one's overall "trashiness" but not define them. It is as if the concept is ingrained in me. I guess that makes me something of a traditionalist? Do I put more meaning into physical displays of affection?

I guess I just don't object to being a little trashy. I'm definitely an experimentalist, and tend to find all people of roughly equal value.

Originally Posted by Taosaur

The kind of situation you're describing, Invader, would definitely fall under the purview of the other thread: sexualization, fetishizing and objectification. In a situation where I'm going to be dancing, the scene is not about rubbing against the most superficially desirable sexual object. My impression is that others, like myself, are just looking for someone who will be fun to dance with. At a concert in particular, the one-on-one dancing is definitely secondary to the music and overall celebration.

Perhaps I misunderstood you. You had mentioned being sandwiched at one
point and described it as undesirable, but for the two girls? Anyways, a room
full of people, each with their idea of what is ok. In a club environment,
people are there often to hook up with someone. Maybe it's only like that out
here, but I'm not sure if it's the music/dancing by itself that comes first.

Originally Posted by Taosaur

I guess I just don't object to being a little trashy. I'm definitely an experimentalist, and tend to find all people of roughly equal value.

I don't disagree with your choice.
As per the equality thing, that's another thread.

Originally Posted by Invader

Perhaps I misunderstood you. You had mentioned being sandwiched at one point and described it as undesirable, but for the two girls? Anyways, a room full of people, each with their idea of what is ok. In a club environment, people are there often to hook up with someone. Maybe it's only like that out here, but I'm not sure if it's the music/dancing by itself that comes first.

Heh, you're kind of mashing together everything I said. "Club" means different things to different people--in my experience, the chachi-ness or meat-market factor of a dancing establishment is inversely proportional to the quality of the DJ. If there's good music and a cool setting, people do indeed show up just to have fun, drink and dance. The point of this thread, however, is that more girls seem to be into 'making contact' in scenes where most of the dancing is NOT clumsy fuck-pantomime. The site of the "sandwich" was about half-and-half, say chach-factor 6/10. It was a trendy, rock-themed dance bar, not a place I would normally go, but sandwich-girl was definitely over-the-top for that environment. Other women that night didn't start out riding me, but at some point a non-verbal negotiation takes place, "Are we going there? Yeah? Okay."

A concert is a different matter altogether--most of the live music I go see is jam bands, bluegrass, roots, and etc., where the crowd is very much there for the music and dancing, and a lot of the dancing is sort of communal and not even guy-girl. Even in that scene, I might pair off with 4-6 girls in a 3-4 hour show, and one or two will back it up and stick around a while.

Here's what I was really getting at in the OP: it's totally normal and casual. For more and more people, it's no different from shaking it any other way--it's just dancing.

Our entire culture is obsessed with sex.

I refuse to participate.

lol, you've obviously never been to a high school prom in the last couple of years.

That's all they are. One big, writhing, dry-humping mass. One of my teachers (a cooler, younger one) was talking to one of the girls about the prom, because he decided to stay home and watch football instead of chaperone. She said she was in the middle of the dry-humping mass... wearing a rosary.

I don't see anything wrong with it, or casual sex in general. Just be prepared for the consequences, and don't ask me to join in. Otherwise, it's each person's individual choice.

I'm 36 years old and I don't recall EVER going to a dance club.
From what I've read, I NEVER want to go to one either.
Humping is.... loathsomely grotesque to me. But that's probably a personal thing thanks to a perverted uncle I had as a kid. But he was mentally retarded.

To be surrounded by an entire room of people humping each other sounds like a special level of hell to me lol