Why can't i see hypnogogia ?

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08-19-2011, 04:41 PM
Hussain

Why can't i see hypnogogia ?

Hi. Yesterday morning i tried WILDing with wbtb method. Neither was i able to induce a LD nor did i see any hypnogogia. But i did feel totally relaxed ( i.e physically). Does Hypnogogia necessarily precede a lucid dream during a wild attempt ? Could one have a lucid dream without hypnogogia during wild ? Also, during my current attempt ( usually all my attempts ) my mind was a bit noisy and tense. I understand that a quiet and calm mind is requisite for wilding. How do i keep my mind from being tense and having racing thoughts ?
08-19-2011, 05:15 PM
Enjyu

Hypnagogic hallucinations do not occur every time when you attempt a WILD. They happen often, bot not always.
08-19-2011, 05:17 PM
Avalanche

Some people see them, some don't. Some people can see them easily, some it takes time or it's harder.

One thing that counts is that it doesn't really matter if you can or can't. If you can WILD without them then it's fine. They are over praised anyway, a lucid dream is much better than any hypnogogia.
08-19-2011, 06:30 PM
cytotoxicT

I have only seen HI twice when WILDing. The majority of the time I just lay there until I feel vibrations. I wait like 15 seconds after that and sit up, open my eyes, RC, and I'm dreaming.

Yeah, controlling your train of thought is really what WILDing is about. To help focus my mind away from extraneous thoughts I sometimes concentrate on breathing, counting, or visualizing. For me, it works best to imagine myself walking around my house and touching everything. I focus on the visual and tactile sensations as vividly as possible. I think the more visual your focus is, the more likely you'll have HI.
08-19-2011, 06:38 PM
faceonmars

I think of hypnagogic images as the primordial ooze of dreams. If you are lucky enough to see those colorful blobs or geometric shapes, imagine them a an object... say, a blue cloud or such. This visualization can help induce sleep onset quickly and, therefore, increase one's chances at entering a non-REM dream lucid. If you are interested, I write about hypnagogia here
08-19-2011, 11:39 PM
Arch

Quote:

Originally Posted by faceonmars

I think of hypnagogic images as the primordial ooze of dreams. If you are lucky enough to see those colorful blobs or geometric shapes, imagine them a an object... say, a blue cloud or such. This visualization can help induce sleep onset quickly and, therefore, increase one's chances at entering a non-REM dream lucid. If you are interested, I write about hypnagogia here

I do see blue colours (and various other colours) on the back of my eyes, I wasn't aware that only some people can do it, I myself thought I was pretty bad a visulization.

I don't see images, so don't worry about it, some do some don't. You never know, it could be a plus as they could be distracting and break your cool.
08-20-2011, 09:03 AM
Hussain

Quote:

Originally Posted by cytotoxicT

I have only seen HI twice when WILDing. The majority of the time I just lay there until I feel vibrations. I wait like 15 seconds after that and sit up, open my eyes, RC, and I'm dreaming.

Where are vibrations usually perceived at ? The Third Eye ? Or is it you feel a buzz over your entire body ?
08-20-2011, 12:07 PM
fOrceez

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hussain

Where are vibrations usually perceived at ? The Third Eye ? Or is it you feel a buzz over your entire body ?

For me, it starts at a limb and then gradually increases over my entire body.
08-20-2011, 06:30 PM
cytotoxicT

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hussain

Where are vibrations usually perceived at ? The Third Eye ? Or is it you feel a buzz over your entire body ?

I will get this intense tingling sensation and the feeling of muscle contraction (although I am in SP) all over my body. It has a rapid onset and will last for like 10 seconds. It feels way different than the normal tingling/numbing sensation I get before this point. I usually wait for 2 rounds of vibrations, and then my normal feeling returns. I then sit up and am dreaming.

Occasionally I will feel other things like my body falling or rotating. The transition into SP is very strange and unique to everybody. Keep at it!
08-20-2011, 06:31 PM
Avalanche

"I then sit up and am dreaming."

Wait, wut? How did you get to there from laying awake in S.P.?
08-20-2011, 09:25 PM
cytotoxicT

Quote:

Originally Posted by Origami

"I then sit up and am dreaming."

Wait, wut? How did you get to there from laying awake in S.P.?

I dunno. I rarely ever get stuck awake in SP. Vibrations are a signal to me that once I move, it's my dream body. I have only actually been awake in SP twice where I tried to move but I was paralyzed. Usually I feel the vibrations and I can move, but its my dream body. I guess my REM stage starts right as SP hits.
08-20-2011, 09:33 PM
Avalanche

So you are able to move when you are having vibrations? That's what tells you you are able to separate?
08-21-2011, 05:55 AM
Hussain

How long before you attempt wild ? After 5-6 hours of sleep ?
08-21-2011, 11:20 AM
fOrceez

I have a question; so you don't see any images at all during your sp?
08-21-2011, 06:33 PM
cytotoxicT

Quote:

Originally Posted by Origami

So you are able to move when you are having vibrations? That's what tells you you are able to separate?

I have never actually tried moving DURING the vibrations. I wait for like 20 seconds after them before I try to RC. Otherwise I would be worried about stopping the WILD attempt too early. My guess is that I would be paralyzed during them anyway. But yes, they tell me that I'm able to separate.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hussain

How long before you attempt wild ? After 5-6 hours of sleep ?

At night, usually I will just try a WILD when I wake up randomly. Sometimes I will set an alarm for around that time. However, naps are my best WILD time by far. Whenever I nap, I doze off and re-awaken a bunch of times. I am constantly crossing the awake/asleep boundary. So I will wake up, roll over, and begin my mental exercises. This way it only takes me a few minutes to WILD (my main difficulty with normal WBTBs is how long it takes me to fall asleep). And if I fail, I will likely have another shot at it when I wake back up. I tend to LD in general way better during naps. I have a higher DILD and DEILD rate also.

Quote:

Originally Posted by fOrceez

I have a question; so you don't see any images at all during your sp?

I have rarely seen images or had auditory hallucinations. The times I have, they usually form dream scenes and become the opening environment to my dreams. 95% of the time I see nothing and my WILDs start in my bed, like an FA.....which can be annoying.
08-28-2011, 05:12 PM
Hussain

Instead of hypnogogia, can hallucinations be experienced in a different sense modality (e.g. Tactile Hallucinations - vibrations, a sense of falling downwards etc. ) ?. How many people here,during WILD attempts, experience some other hallucination except for hypnogogia ? Or maybe both ?
08-28-2011, 05:16 PM
Enjyu

I have never attempted a WILD before, but according to the Dreamviews article on hypnagogic hallucinations, hallucinations can be of any sense.
08-29-2011, 09:39 AM
fOrceez

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hussain

Instead of hypnogogia, can hallucinations be experienced in a different sense modality (e.g. Tactile Hallucinations - vibrations, a sense of falling downwards etc. ) ?. How many people here,during WILD attempts, experience some other hallucination except for hypnogogia ? Or maybe both ?

I've experience both. HH mostly being sounds
08-29-2011, 09:44 AM
Mancon

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hussain

Instead of hypnogogia, can hallucinations be experienced in a different sense modality (e.g. Tactile Hallucinations - vibrations, a sense of falling downwards etc. ) ?.

Yes, vibrations are common when people go into SP.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hussain

How many people here,during WILD attempts, experience some other hallucination except for hypnogogia ? Or maybe both ?

I don't know exactly how many people, but I can tell you I have experienced both. The first time I tried to WILD I could hear and see frogs all over my room. It was a weird experience.
08-29-2011, 09:48 AM
lawilahd

To tell you the truth, when I first learned about WILD's, I was extremely excited about having one and I would lie in wait for over an hour on occasion seeing hypnagogic imagery in the form of geometrical shapes etc. but no sleep paralysis and no vibrations or transition phase into an actual WILD. I was much too focused on seeing the hypnagogic shapes colors etc. that I was never able to have a WILD because of it. It was only until I let go of wanting to see the hallucinations and I actually fell asleep while maintaining concsciousness, that i actually experienced my first WILD. Even with my most recent WILD, hypnagogic images in the form of shapes and colors were the least of my intention, I don't even see any unless I try to focus on them which always led to the restlessness and failed WILD attempts. I forgot the name of the poster, but someone put out a guide on WILD and said that you actually do have to fall asleep..physically.

to answer your question, yes it is possible to have a WILD without HI, my most recent and most vivid one started with me seeing no HI, only vibrations and ringing noises, and all of a sudden I was in a LD.
08-29-2011, 09:52 AM
Mancon

Quote:

Originally Posted by lawilahd

To tell you the truth, when I first learned about WILD's, I was extremely excited about having one and I would lie in wait for over an hour on occasion seeing hypnagogic imagery in the form of geometrical shapes etc. but no sleep paralysis and no vibrations or transition phase into an actual WILD. I was much too focused on seeing the hypnagogic shapes colors etc. that I was never able to have a WILD because of it.

Yes, you want to let the HH pass, and don't focus too hard on it.
08-30-2011, 10:57 AM
Hussain

I figure from this thread, not all people get to see hypnogogia. All my wild attempts have been a failure because i had this misconception that hypnogogia is must for WILD. Maybe i should go a different way.
08-30-2011, 11:30 AM
fOrceez

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hussain

I figure from this thread, not all people get to see hypnogogia. All my wild attempts have been a failure because i had this misconception that hypnogogia is must for WILD. Maybe i should go a different way.

When i WILD, i focus on the sound of my tinnitus (the ringing in your ears) but the trick is how much awareness you put into it.
12-20-2011, 10:54 AM
Hussain

Quote:

Originally Posted by lawilahd

I forgot the name of the poster, but someone put out a guide on WILD and said that you actually do have to fall asleep..physically.

Could be BillyBobs WILD tutorial.
12-20-2011, 10:42 PM
cmind

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hussain

Hi. Yesterday morning i tried WILDing with wbtb method. Neither was i able to induce a LD nor did i see any hypnogogia. But i did feel totally relaxed ( i.e physically). Does Hypnogogia necessarily precede a lucid dream during a wild attempt ? Could one have a lucid dream without hypnogogia during wild ? Also, during my current attempt ( usually all my attempts ) my mind was a bit noisy and tense. I understand that a quiet and calm mind is requisite for wilding. How do i keep my mind from being tense and having racing thoughts ?

It's simple -- you weren't in SP. It's a good thing...You should be worried if you're seeing hallucinations without being asleep.