Confusing RC fail - why did this happen

Just interested in some feedback/ideas in regards to a dream I had this morning.

I woke up to my first alarm at 5am and was really tired after sleeping late so fell back asleep between my alarms, knowing that I had to get up soon. I think because I knew this I fell in a really light sleep which on the one hand, perhaps, made it far more likely for me to be able to do a RC, but on the other hand resulted in me not taking my RC seriously (as my brain thought I was actually awake since such a short time before I had awoken and part of me was listening out for the next alarm). Anyway this is what happened:

I wake up in the dream and it is early morning, light but still a bit dark (corresponding with real time). I go to the bathroom to get ready - I flick the light switch and enter the room...the room is still dark. I go back and flick the light switch again and re-enter...still dark. I do it again. Still dark. I do this like 5-6x. Then D comes into the room and I say "i'm having trouble getting the light on" we look at each other and then have the same thought I should be checking my hands I bring my hands up to my face and the same time he grabs them and brings them up to my face for me. I examine my fingers but they look normal (usually I see more fingers straight away) I count them anyway but I come up with a funny number 6 or something. I concentrate and count again and keep coming up with numbers like 7 or 9 on one hand. I am really confused trying to figure how how my hand looks normal but when I count them I keep coming up with more. It's like my eyes are playing tricks on me. I either give up and keep getting ready or I actually wake up then realising it's now 5:20 am (and I know/can sense what the time is before even looking at the clock)

Thoughts/comments?
Why was my brain/dream doing tricks on me? Was it because I was already half awake and not taking myself seriously? how can I avoid that in the future? It seems that the fine line between being awake and asleep and awake in the dream could be helpful but it's very rare to find myself in this state...still is this progress?
:S

I don't believe your brain wasn't doing tricks on you. It's just trying to make sense of the world as it always is.

It sounds like you were taking yourself seriously. What you lacked was confidence in the result of the RC. Experience helps with this but sometimes you need to change your RC to something different if you continue to lack confidence in it.

Any pre-lucid dream like this is progress.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by dolphin

I don't believe your brain wasn't doing tricks on you. It's just trying to make sense of the world as it always is.

It sounds like you were taking yourself seriously. What you lacked was confidence in the result of the RC. Experience helps with this but sometimes you need to change your RC to something different if you continue to lack confidence in it.

Any pre-lucid dream like this is progress.

---

Thanks Dolphin I am happy to hear that it is progress :)
Ah confidence, perhaps when I strengthen that in other areas of my life it will also be strengthened in my lucid dream practices. I have open-mindedness, proof by experience and determination, but confidence is still up and down.

About what I use for RC, would you recommend sticking with the same one for a while (like I have been using the hand counting and palm push for a long time) and then trying another new one for a while, or alternating what I use on a daily or every few day basis?

Could possibly just had dreamed where you kept checking your hands and weren't 'actually' doing RC's just dreaming about doing them. However, if that weren't the case then you probably never once said to yourself, 'I am dreaming' or similar so you didn't obtain full control. RC's do fail at times, you may have to try more than one to get them to actually work. I want to say that I have been having this same dream all my life where I go into my bedroom and flip on the light but it doesn't come on. I panic and always wake up shortly thereafter. Never do I last long enough or become lucid. Strange that light switches usually don't work in dreams.

Hey there,
i would recommend to have atleast two RC at the same time because it may always happen that one is inconclusive and when you practice 2 at daytime the possibility is higher that in your dream you would do the second RC to confirm because you are already suspicious.
a good routine would be in waking "wha wait what? am i dreaming? *examine your hand* --> looks normal. No i must be dreaming! *do a nosepinch or try to put your finger thru your palm and BELIEVE that it will work BECAUSE YOU ARE Dreaming* maybe even look at a digital clock or look around in your room to see if something is different"

and i dont see no mindtricks there. you where dreaming the light didnt work and your hand had more fingers. that is THE example for some working RC´s^^ you just couldnt believe the outcome. i know this. i sometimes do a nosepinch and i can breath partially thru my nose and sometimes the conclusion is not: Oh yea it works i am Dreaming but: hm maybe i dont close my nose tight enough or hm that seems odd that i cant close my nose completely in waking.... and NLD continues...

my advice is: Remember this dream very good! visualize it often for some days and always tell yourself: When i am not sure that i am dreaming I AM DREAMING! when a lightswitch doesnt work I AM DREAMING, when i see more than 5 fingers (repeatedly :rolllaugh:) I AM DREAMING! Visualize how you get lucid.
see this as a lesson. you can learn from it and when this will happen again in one of your next dreams you will be like: wait that happened before and you get more aware and lucid.

and yea its more likely to get lucid between alarms because you are inbetween wake and dream and you are more aware (thats the reason micro wbtbs and wbtbs in general are so magic xD) nevertheless you were dreaming and could have been lucid.

I don't have much experience but I agree that one RC is not enough. Lately I had LD where I realize that I may be in dream so I started to look around. I checked my camera and everything was displayed correctly, I even took a photo with flash and checked that it was in gallery. Then I turned on the light few times and it also worked normally. I looked at my hands - I had gloves but it wasn't that irrational. I asked my mother who was there if this is a dream and she told me that I'm talking rubbish. Then I tried to levitate, I could and finally this was a proof for me. So just try more of them next time if you'll be able. I can also add that this LD was between alarms in the morning as yours.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LiLeila

I don't have much experience but I agree that one RC is not enough. Lately I had LD where I realize that I may be in dream so I started to look around. I checked my camera and everything was displayed correctly, I even took a photo with flash and checked that it was in gallery. Then I turned on the light few times and it also worked normally. I looked at my hands - I had gloves but it wasn't that irrational. I asked my mother who was there if this is a dream and she told me that I'm talking rubbish. Then I tried to levitate, I could and finally this was a proof for me. So just try more of them next time if you'll be able. I can also add that this LD was between alarms in the morning as yours.

---

THAT i call stubborn! I know that i am dreaming damnit where is the proof :lol:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RelaxAndDream

THAT i call stubborn! I know that i am dreaming damnit where is the proof :lol:

---

I wanted to jump through the window (to fly) then so I really needed that proof before I might be dead :D However I read that suicide is good RC for some people xd I don't recomended tho.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by chase

Could possibly just had dreamed where you kept checking your hands and weren't 'actually' doing RC's just dreaming about doing them. However, if that weren't the case then you probably never once said to yourself, 'I am dreaming' or similar so you didn't obtain full control. RC's do fail at times, you may have to try more than one to get them to actually work. I want to say that I have been having this same dream all my life where I go into my bedroom and flip on the light but it doesn't come on. I panic and always wake up shortly thereafter. Never do I last long enough or become lucid. Strange that light switches usually don't work in dreams.

---

Yes I admit I have had dreams before where I am just dreaming about doing them because they become too habitual. Lately I have been trying to take a lot more time with my RC's including sensing how my body is feeling, and checking if I remember what I was just doing before or what I am about to do. I have had a few almost lucids where I realise I don't know what happened just a few moments ago...so hoping this will pay off eventually :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RelaxAndDream

my advice is: Remember this dream very good! visualize it often for some days and always tell yourself: When i am not sure that i am dreaming I AM DREAMING! when a lightswitch doesnt work I AM DREAMING, when i see more than 5 fingers (repeatedly :rolllaugh:) I AM DREAMING! Visualize how you get lucid.
see this as a lesson. you can learn from it and when this will happen again in one of your next dreams you will be like: wait that happened before and you get more aware and lucid.

.

---

Thank you kindly for your detailed message and for the advice, I am going to try this :D

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LiLeila

I don't have much experience but I agree that one RC is not enough. Lately I had LD where I realize that I may be in dream so I started to look around. I checked my camera and everything was displayed correctly, I even took a photo with flash and checked that it was in gallery. Then I turned on the light few times and it also worked normally. I looked at my hands - I had gloves but it wasn't that irrational. I asked my mother who was there if this is a dream and she told me that I'm talking rubbish. Then I tried to levitate, I could and finally this was a proof for me. So just try more of them next time if you'll be able. I can also add that this LD was between alarms in the morning as yours.

---

OOh that is a good example of how stubborn dreams/awareness can be for sure!!


Couldn't figure out how to have multiple quotes in one message but just saw the "+ icon now :oops:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LiLeila

I wanted to jump through the window (to fly) then so I really needed that proof before I might be dead :D However I read that suicide is good RC for some people xd I don't recomended tho.

---

Hehe i know exactly what you are talking about ^^ at the beginning i had the same thing. standing in front of my window and " yea i am pretty sure i am dreaming but just like that jump out of the window? and what if i dont dream? that would be bad...." 5 RC later: put every plant by side and open the window and jump out xD now i am more like " yea i am dreaming i am pretty sure: jump/phase thru the closed window xD

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by midnightfire

Thank you kindly for your detailed message and for the advice, I am going to try this :D

---

no problem. that approach is legit equally for NLD where untypical things happen. i had a time where i used often my phone in NLD and everytime something was odd. display not working or i coudlnd write and so on. i collected this experiences and said the next time my phone makes funny stuff i will realize that i dream and some days later i got lucid because of that cue.
most of your dreams are little teachers^^ therefore it is so important to appreciate the NLD and work on your recall so you have a lot of material to learn from and to know your dreamworld

I have seen in some Laberge instruction where he says at the end of the routine of looking and questioning and RC'ing and determining it's a dream and playing it out( as RelaxAndDream shows really well above:)
to say " next time I am dreaming I recognise I am dreaming"...

I spose it's another take on saying stuff like " next time I see a red car or a Wolf of whatever, I realise I am dreaming"

which do you guys say at the end ? :alien:... Or maybe a bit of both could be useful

Quote:

---

to say " next time I am dreaming I recognize I am dreaming"...

---

that mantra i never ever understand how it should work... it has no anchor... you subconsciously would need to know that you are dreaming so it may work. for me this was illogical^^

but yea i think it is a type of prospective memory. you internalize that occurrence and have it in your back of your had so the next time it happens you remember that something was odd about it

i do this a lot in between wakenings during the night. some dreams are just "boring" and nothing special but some scream to get lucid and those i pick and just play with them and visualize them with the intention to get lucid next time. i dont say things like "the next time...when i see this i get lucid." i just think about it and think "yea that was a moment where you could get lucid". its more a sort of reflection than an active " i try to do something with effort"

So :) you play around with the visualisation on the spot in the moment more than anything ...building intention and memory and awareness of you and yourdream - do you feel this is more of anchor because we are very directly connection to our wishes ...makes sense ...is this how you do your day work too?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by midnightfire

Thanks Dolphin I am happy to hear that it is progress :)
About what I use for RC, would you recommend sticking with the same one for a while (like I have been using the hand counting and palm push for a long time) and then trying another new one for a while, or alternating what I use on a daily or every few day basis?

---

I would recommend sticking with the same one for a while and then trying a new one for a while if you need to.

Heya all,

As far as I know, reality checks fail sometimes. It happens. Sometimes our mind just plays tricks on us in dreams. One failed reality check doesn't mean much in itself, if you ask me. Though if one repeatedly fails, you may consider switching. That said, for me, the single most effective RC (by far) has always been to try and read something several times: words or numbers (a digital clock, an ad, a number plate, etc).

In waking life, we are constantly surrounded by words and numbers, so there's always something to read. Yet in dreams, being able to read something and make sense of it, let alone reading the same thing two or three times (looking away after each time) and having it stay the same has been extremely uncommon for me (which is why it makes such an effective RC).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Patience108

I have seen in some Laberge instruction where he says at the end of the routine of looking and questioning and RC'ing and determining it's a dream and playing it out( as RelaxAndDream shows really well above:)
to say " next time I am dreaming I recognise I am dreaming"...

I spose it's another take on saying stuff like " next time I see a red car or a Wolf of whatever, I realise I am dreaming"

which do you guys say at the end ? :alien:... Or maybe a bit of both could be useful

---

At the end of a reality check, I'll look around my surroundings and ask myself, if this was a dream, how would I go about following my dream goal and what would I do? Say for example if I wanted to fly, and I'm in a building, I'd ask myself: if this was a dream, how would I exit to building to go fly. Or if my dream goal was to bring a dream character in the dream, I'd wonder if I'd try to conjure him/her, use a door trick, go to a place, etc. This for me has the added advantage of building my intent to dream and to follow the dream goal, while pushing me to be more aware of my surroundings and in the moment at the same time.

Just my 2 cents,

-Redrivertears-

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Patience108

I have seen in some Laberge instruction where he says at the end of the routine of looking and questioning and RC'ing and determining it's a dream and playing it out( as RelaxAndDream shows really well above:)
to say " next time I am dreaming I recognise I am dreaming"...

I spose it's another take on saying stuff like " next time I see a red car or a Wolf of whatever, I realise I am dreaming"

which do you guys say at the end ? :alien:... Or maybe a bit of both could be useful

---

I actually always say that after WBTB as I have read Laberge's book. It's how I had my first Lucid dream, going back to sleep, visualising my last dream and saying that mantra "the next time I'm dreaming I will recognise that I'm dreaming". This is MILD.
A lot of the time I can't remember the last dream that I had however, so I just do the mantra and I have never really been successful with that. I'm currently reading a book on memory and it talks about some guy who had an amazing super memory and he used visualisations for everything, so there is a strong connection between visualisation and memory it seems - so perhaps the mantra needs to be used with a strong visualisation of a dream.

Very interesting Midnghtfire - how memory is sharpened with visualisation creates interesting undertones in your original discussion on RC's :)

Because I guess when doing a RC it's never just that is it ? As your op suggests ; there is always more to "it" or else it fails -....In order to make a RC most useful/valuable/genuine it needs to end up in our memory so that it can go forward as a genuine piece of day residue ....just thinking out loud:)