Getting stuck in attempts to WILD

Hey y'all - I was hoping someone here could give some insight in my attempts to WILD and why I am getting stuck. A few questions, please. :)

First of all - what is the reason that people wake up in the middle of the night to do this? Is there any reason I shouldn't do this right as I'm going to sleep for the night?

Anyway, for the past three nights, I've been going through the relaxation, counting, repeatedly telling myself "I am dreaming..." After a while, I find my body goes into sleep paralysis - and somehow, as soon as I come to the realization I've reached SP, my relaxation disappears and I can't get it back again, I'm just stuck there for a long time until I eventually open my eyes and shake it off and just go to sleep normally because it starts to feel uncomfortable not moving for so long. Am I just giving up too soon? Or is there a technique I can use at that point that will help me out?

Also, I'm a bit confused as to what the HI are supposed to be like - I've been noticing that I have kind of flashing, visual "thoughts" as I'm trying to induce WILD - yesterday, kept having flashes of different articles of clothes - but they're really more like thoughts than actually being able to see these with my eyes closed. Are these HI? Or just my mind thinking of random things...

Any and all help is appreciated!

You get up in the middle of the night because that's when your REM periods are up and going (a significant majority of people find it extremely hard to WILD while going to sleep although it is possible and some find it easier to do before sleeping than after 6 hrs)

The reason you've been getting into SP but no further is probably because your mind isn't going into REM (the necessary state for dreaming) the reason its not doing this is because normally it has to go through a few other stages before that (which takes awhile) and since your being conscious isn't actually affecting anything, (your just along for the ride) you would have to sit there for awhile to get into REM

HI is many things for many people, it can be vivid imagery or dots (or can start as dots and turn into imagery) or if you like me you might not get HI at all (until like 30 seconds before your in the dream, then you see it forming around you sometimes)

hope that solved all your problems :P

Your first question is related to your main problem. Yes, it is indeed extremely difficult, if not impossible, to have a WILD when you're going to bed for the first time. This has to do with the fact that at that point, it'll take about 90 minutes until you reach your first REM-stage of sleep. Since this is the only stage of sleep in which you dream, you have to get the chance to enter it quickly after falling asleep. This is why people do it in the morning. At that point most of your deep (or delta) sleep is through and you'll be having more REM-sleep. It is therefore much easier to have a WILD at that point.
You can't dream without REM-sleep and so you can't WILD when you aren't in REM-sleep. SP and HI are both reported to be possible experiences, which makes sense as they are things you experience before the dream kicks in. The (Waking Initiated) Lucid Dream itself however, will not come until you've conciously gone through a black period of deep sleep and go into REM-sleep. This is no problem when that process will take a couple of minutes or seconds, but it will be when it takes 1½ hour.

As for your question on HI. You'll know what it looks like when you experience it. It can come in actual shapes representing things, or just abstract forms consisting of light. It's really not that important to be able to recognize them. The only thing really need to know is that they're there, so that you don't get startled or carried away when you see them, but instead stay calm and keep feeling like you were.

Hope that helped, sorry for the long post. I tend to use a lot of words in order to explain things the best I can. >.>


Edit: Zomg, BillyBob beat me to answering the questions. All that typing for nothing. Oh well

**holds up a sign that reads: "let all see that I posted it first"**

:P good advice umby :D

Although most dreaming occurs during REM, I understand that dreams can also occur in NREM. I've had quite a few LDs early in the night, including a couple of WILDs, during the first sleep session. Although I'm not an expert on WILDs, it seems to me that the critical event in WILD is the appearance of HI, which occurs as one falls asleep (before NREM).

Thanks all for your input. I'll try to WILD tonight again, but set my alarm... 6 hours after I go to bed is ideal? We'll see if that makes the difference!

I'll post with the results :)

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Originally posted by ZenVortex
Although most dreaming occurs during REM, I understand that dreams can also occur in NREM. *I've had quite a few LDs early in the night, including a couple of WILDs, during the first sleep session. *Although I'm not an expert on WILDs, it seems to me that the critical event in WILD is the appearance of HI, which occurs as one falls asleep (before NREM).

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Though it's true there are things called "non-REM dreams", these are hardly like normal dreams and you can't reliably try to induce these like you can with normal dreams. These dreams are more like thoughts than they are like actual simulation of reality. Why and when they occur, I don't know.

like I said it is possible for some people to easily WILD before bed but nearly impossible for others (some peoples REM starts sooner)

but most everyones early REM dreams are short and really just all around f*cked up (very abstract and illogical) [note the use of the word "most" everyones, don't flame me if you claim to have perfect LDs from WILDing right from the time you go to bed ;) ]

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Originally posted by Umbrella


Though it's true there are things called "non-REM dreams", these are hardly like normal dreams and you can't reliably try to induce these like you can with normal dreams. These dreams are more like thoughts than they are like actual simulation of reality. Why and when they occur, I don't know.

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Non-REM dreams account for the majority of my LDs. Most of them are short, though, but if I get myself lucid enough to increase the lucidity in my dream, I can keep the dream going for as long as I can (which isn't much, since I panic most of the time).
Yea, these kind of dreams don't come along very often, but when they do come, they come very easy for me. They're not bad, either.

Quote:

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Originally posted by computernerd90

Non-REM dreams account for the majority of my LDs. Most of them are short, though, but if I get myself lucid enough to increase the lucidity in my dream, I can keep the dream going for as long as I can (which isn't much, since I panic most of the time).
Yea, these kind of dreams don't come along very often, but when they do come, they come very easy for me. They're not bad, either.

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And how do you know?

I think I might be having those NREM dreams too but not recognizing them as such... But I do have "thought dreams" early in the cycle when I'm first going to sleep. They might be just images, but might also have plots and be a bit longer too... Not nearly as vivid, they really seem like they're in my head, as opposed to me being inside of them. I'm not sure, but I couldn't really imagine getting lucid inside of them.

Did attempt to lucid last night, but had some insomnia which is unusual for me. However, it's about a million degrees in my bedroom the past few days, and on top of it, noisy outside my apartment. Will try again.