enough is enough: Help me nail WBTB/DILD

hey all....my question is this:

I always read about people who have a routine like this:

wake up 5/6 hours
do "X"
go to sleep
Lucid Dream.

for some people, "X" is a self-affirmation procedure...some people use reading about dreams as part "X"....others do entirely unrelated things...

Basically, Im begging for those of who you use any WBTB (but non-wild) method....to describe your WBTB procedure in as much depth as possible so I can try to create my own simple induction method.

One night...I got up...spent 20 minutes walking from my bed to my door and reality checking (proper checks, not lazy ones). I thought this would incubate a scenario. Then I relaxed on my bed and used self-affirmations. Went to sleep....and nothing. I thought it was fool proof....maybe I should repeat it...

But if anyone could please share their WBTB procedures It would be a great help for me (and maybe other people with similar lack of success)

(btw...I could MILD...but I've only succeeded by having a 45minute WBTB and that leaves me really tired)

I have the same problem as you. I tried for about a week or two each night, then stopped for a few nights. Then I had an LD lol

I set my alarm for about 4.30am (I go to bed usually around 11-11.30), when I wake up I get up and go to the bathroom. I then come back to bed, lie down, do a reality check, tell myself outloud that I will remember my dreams and that I will realise i'm dreaming a few times, do another reality check and then go back to sleep.

WBTB doesn't work for me if Im up for very long, because I get too awake.

hmm..thanks crimsonwolf...that really seems "too" simple. How many times is a "few times" btw....like less than 10?

any other replies would be appreciated

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CrimsonWolf

I set my alarm for about 4.30am (I go to bed usually around 11-11.30), when I wake up I get up and go to the bathroom. I then come back to bed, lie down, do a reality check, tell myself outloud that I will remember my dreams and that I will realise i'm dreaming a few times, do another reality check and then go back to sleep.

WBTB doesn't work for me if Im up for very long, because I get too awake.

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I do almost the same thing Crimson. I make sure I still have the 'sleep feel' over my eyes. If I stay up for even 10 whole minutes, I'll be wide awake and have to start the whole process over again. I'm not sure but it seems if you take a smaller amount of time, 2-4mins after you wake up (BIO then right back 2 sleep after RCs) you can not only go to sleep faster, but enter REM faster.

Repetition is key. I got nowhere in the first week of WBTB, and then WHAM! Lucid dream. And then nothing. And nothing. And nothing. And nothing. And then LUCID! And nothing. And nothing. And nothing. And nothing. And nothing. And then LUCID! And then LUCID! And nothing...

WBTB will not produce immediate results. You must let your mind acclimate to the idea before lucid dreams come. This varies from person to person. Also, it's not as if one success guarantees success in the following nights. It should follow the normal model of learning. Your mind will learn, forget, remember, forget, remember more, learn, forget, remember, forget less, etc. Slow and steady wins the lucidity.

hmm, thanks everyone for the tips...

And Abraa, I like the advice about "slowly and steady wins the lucidity" :D

That would explain why I had such a crap MILD rate.....but maybe I need to practice repition.

I make my WBTB a little differently. It consists of Two or three short awakenings per night.

I go to sleep maybe at 10p.m. As I am falling into sleep, I tell myself. Dreams are coming, I will wake up at the end of dream. I do it till i fall asleep. I set my alarm clock to 2:30 or so. I know, I will not have a dream. But this is only a start. Then as i wake myself up. I just stand up from bed. Or just sit down. It really depends on what condition I am. Then i repeat myself. I will have vivid dream, vividness comes. Or something, what should evoke vividness. Then i fall asleep second time. {It happens that i have lucid dream in this part of process}. Then i set my alarm clock to 4:00 am. {two hours later}. Usually I wake up with superb recall. and now is the time for WBTB. I can remember two or three dreams. Feel saturated with dreams. So it should work. Now i usually write my dreams down and when i lie in bed i tell myself. Be aware, something is wrong, remember. This is what i do to induce lucid dream. The process is incremental and builds up awareness overtime. The best time to do lucid dreaming task is, when you feel dreamy. Its usually, when you have good recall. {And thats why I love Recall forum the most}.

What do you think?

Try not to be awake for too long, the longer you are awake for the longer it takes you to sleep and believe it or not there is a long period between consciously knowing what you are thinking, these could be the affirmations that you are going to LD or it could be MILD etc.

Try only being up for say 5-7 minutes, because the quicker you go back to sleep the shorter the period your mind is awake for without you consciously thinking what you want to..

Hope that makes sense?

Adam.

hmmm, thank you to everyone...

I like the "something is wrong" adraw...thats a unique approach...I may try some of that..

and Adam, yeah that makes...mostly lol. could you further explain/reword this though please?

"believe it or not there is a long period between consciously knowing what you are thinking, these could be the affirmations that you are going to LD or it could be MILD etc."

also Adam...do you have a personal WBTB method that you use this with?

thanks all

Before I go to bed I try not to eat or drink anything and I go to the toilet so I don't need to get up in the middle of the night, then as I'm going to sleep (for the first time) then I tell myself that I will wake up at some time between 3.30 and 5.00, depending on when I go to sleep and when the sun rises (I usually have to wake up while it's still dark). When I wake up I might shift around a bit to get comfortable and then simply focus all my attention on having a lucid dream (I don't actually verbally repeat it in my mind, I just sort of focus on it) and I fall asleep while doing so. A lucid dream usually follows
I suck at instructing so just ask if you need me to clarify anything

One nights attempt is almost always going to fail no matter how effective the technique. With DILD's more than anything else, you have to train habitual responses into your subconcious. This can take weeks or even months of regular activity to accomplish.

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Originally Posted by james_jlc

hmmm, thank you to everyone...

I like the "something is wrong" adraw...thats a unique approach...I may try some of that..

and Adam, yeah that makes...mostly lol. could you further explain/reword this though please?

"believe it or not there is a long period between consciously knowing what you are thinking, these could be the affirmations that you are going to LD or it could be MILD etc."

also Adam...do you have a personal WBTB method that you use this with?

thanks all

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Well you know how when you go to bed, you think about what you want to do - you might recite affirmations to yourself that you will lucid dream, and you think to yourself if it is the last thing on my mind when I go to sleep then it should be on my mind when I dream. Well what I mean is do you ever lie there in bed, thinking about lucid dreaming, but then your mind wanders off, and you didn't notice? This is what I mean - often if we are tired but don't go straight to sleep our minds wander from what we want to think, to what the mind wants you to think.

So my technique focuses on being awake for a short time period 5-7 minutes to allow you to fall asleep fast enough, with lucid dreaming and WILD still very much on your mind :)

I do have a technique, (http://www.dreamviews.com/community/...ad.php?t=42110) however I am currently writing up a new one, which works a lot better, and is more fun to try based on the sensations from doing it, will let you know when I have finished.

Adam :)

for my WBTB, I'm usually only up for about 10-15 minutes otherwise I wont be able to fall back asleep for a long time. I get up, write down the dream I had just had in my DJ (which is the most important thing for me. I had never been successful at WBTB until I began doing that) then I get up and either go to the bathroom or get a drink or do something simple like that that only takes a moment, then go back to sleep. and of course, throughout the time that I'm awake, I RC as much as I feel is neccassary. (which ends up being every 30 seconds or so) Then as I'm falling back asleep I kind of rehearse what my lucid dream will be like, just to kind of give me a taste of it and keep my mind interested in the topic of LDing. Even if I stop thinking about LDing and fall asleep it still works for me. hope that helps a bit:)

I just have one quick question to the WBTB. People generaly sleep 5 hours, get up, do some stuff, go back to sleep and have lucid dreams (if you are lucky/skilled). But how long do you sleep after you lay down for the second time? When you say 7-8 hours of sleep is needed on a regular basis for lucid dreaming, that only leave about 2-2.5 hours of sleep after you get up, maybe even less.
I mean, the longer you sleep, the greater the chance, that is obvious, but how long do people here, who manage to have lucids on a regular basis, sleep after they go to bed the second time? I ask this because I usually have to get up at 6.30, and I seldom manage to get to sleep before 1130. So this gives me about 2 hours or less for lucid dreaming after I have woken myself up and went back to bed.

well...if all goes to plan harrystamper...you could go to sleep the 2nd time...for as long as you like (5 minutes even!). However...the longer you sleep after (till the 8 hour mark), gives you a greater chance of experiencing an entire REM period.

open to correction

And after the 8 hour mark, do the REM periods continue to extend as long as you can manage to stay asleep?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by harrystamper

I just have one quick question to the WBTB. People generaly sleep 5 hours, get up, do some stuff, go back to sleep and have lucid dreams (if you are lucky/skilled). But how long do you sleep after you lay down for the second time? When you say 7-8 hours of sleep is needed on a regular basis for lucid dreaming, that only leave about 2-2.5 hours of sleep after you get up, maybe even less.
I mean, the longer you sleep, the greater the chance, that is obvious, but how long do people here, who manage to have lucids on a regular basis, sleep after they go to bed the second time? I ask this because I usually have to get up at 6.30, and I seldom manage to get to sleep before 1130. So this gives me about 2 hours or less for lucid dreaming after I have woken myself up and went back to bed.

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I guess in a way you are right, bu to be honest, if you are going to LD it would have been soon after you go back to sleep. At least in my experience that is when it happens. You could try to WILD though for instant lucid dreams?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by harrystamper

And after the 8 hour mark, do the REM periods continue to extend as long as you can manage to stay asleep?

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Pretty much after 5 hours our REM sleep gets longer and longer.

Ah, I see. Why didnt I realise that. Ofcourse you are suposed to fall more or less directly into a LD:bang: What ever you get later on in the night/morning is a bonus. But the technique aims at hitting the REM period directly.

This raises my hopes for Lucid dreaming though, now I can practise with more confidence every night. :banana:

Tnx for the great reply Adam

I think, so long as you were not up for too long, you can focus entirely on a WILD and it will happen before you even know it, so be sure to RC.

err....but I think once we pass the 8 and a bit hour mark....we no longer experience REM? the entire cycle like starts again.......don't remember...

ok...now for my new questions

I tried a WBTB technique last night...a hybrid of some ideas I found here. In my opinion it sounds good:

Wake up 5-6 hours.
right up my DJ
do 3/4 affirmations + reality checks
bathroom
a few more affirmations + reality checks.
back to bed in under 10 mins from waking...

took me a damn hour and a bit to get back to sleep...by which point my focus had been lost.

I NEED SOME TIPS on getting to sleep without ENTIRELY wandering off my goal of Lucid Dreaming!!!!!!! (and fast!)

Please, I know im close to cracking my own method!

Thanks all, hope someone can help!

*bump*

Im asking for help on getting to sleep after a WBTB

because it takes me over an hour to get to sleep...unless I forget about lucidity which means I dont Lucid Dream.

Anyone willing to share this part of the technique?