Lucid dreaming feels like nothing to me. Astral Projection is the real biggy.

I've learned how to astral project by accident. I can induce REM sleep just 2mins if I wanted to. I can altar my sleep patens. I can leave my physical body. I can wake up at 4 O'clock in the morning without issues. I can drift of to bed in 5mins only feeling a little tiered. I can have full blown psychedelic experiences. I can feel absolutely huge, then feel tiny. I can have closed eye hallucinations, and open eyed. I can do all this through methods of Astral projection.

Anyone who has tried Astral projection or succeeded will tell you how overwhelming and beautiful it can be. There is a energy that flows through your body which I have learned to make on demand.

This thread will tell you my methods of blowing your mind. You would’ve thought that you’ve taken DMT or some Shiz like that. Well, these methods may not work for you or they might but you haven't tried enough.

Music method:
Find a really catchy dance song like DJ splash – flying high. Listen to it for a long time, so you remember it and its always on your mind. Remember it. Now when you go to bed get really relaxed and relax. In 5mins, once really relaxed look in the back of you head and start playing the song in your mind. Play it for a few minuets, then start playing it in your mind extremely fast. This sends your mind into a spin and you start to become engulfed by the music and thoughts. At one point the music just played without thinking about it, as if It came from heaven.

Rope method:
Less hallucination but more OBE. Get a ribbon and attach it to the ceiling over your bed so you can grab it. Close your eyes and relax, play with the ribbon, remember where it is. Now lay back for 5mins. Look back into your eyes and keep a clear mind. You will soon feel a different consciousness, this is a kind of trance. Not like a psychedelic ones like in the music method. Now in the trance state imagine your self reaching out for the ribbon. Imaging that you can climb it. You should start to altar consciousness. Scary for some, completely overwhelming sensations of huge and small feeling erupt stirring your mind. You are still conscious. After a few minuets you can see and have the psychedelic feeling. Open eyed visuals now. I sometimes feel that my whole body is being sucked into a black whirl pool into another realm, the astral plane. Which looks like real life but just so different. It is a crazy place.


These methods make the following physical effects:
-heart pumps like mad, almost hurts on rope method.
Eyes and eyebrow muscles spaz like a b!tch in both methods more on The music method.
Breathing heavily, sometimes through mouth.
Makes you really tired and a re-born feeling really strange

Overall I think that the music method is that best way to start as if you are mentally not ready than Rope method can scare you sh!tless. So I’d start with the music method which was how I first developed my technique.

IF you practise a lot you can sometimes walk the astral plane, makes dreaming look like nothing. Feelings past that of an Orgasm, way past. Its another dimension, literally.

hey

can you please provide more detail?

when you close your eyes and relax what do you do to keep your mind quite? or what process do you follow as soon as you close your eyes? i seem to spend too much time trying to keep my mind quite then i just give up.

what is your attention on when your eyes are closed, what do you think? do you just roll your eyes up a bit, and watch the images under your eye? or do you pay attention to your breath?

im really stuck on this point:panic::panic:

For the music method, you can allow ideas to form in your mind. But concentrate on the music going really fast in your mind. Also you might want to try different sleeping positions. Sometimes it only works in one place
For the Rope method alow yourself to relax you soon start to go in a very light kind of trance. At this point concentrate on grabbing the ribbon.

Music method allows you to create more hallucenagenic feelings, of complete overwelming. But with rope method I can have these feeling of twisting realality in parralel with real life

I don't want to come across as a hater or something, and I really appreciate the post, but astral projection is practically a WILD induced from waking life instead of with a WBTB. It is the same thing as LD. The difference is that with AP you usually don't need to stabilize. If you make your LD's fully vivid it is really the same thing.

I knew someone was going to refere to WILD. I have successfully done WILD many times a few years back. It is very simular, but it is LD in a different life.
If you have been able to speak to ancestors e.g grandparents that have past away, which I have. It is basicly as if you are trying to do a WILD, but you are branching off
into astral projection. How you say astral projection is, is that it is the experiences you get before WILD. Those hallucinations, even though fairly potent are nothing that of an end result astral projection.
I tried so hard one night when I went back to my physical body I felt like my heart was going to fail. A really sharp pain in the heart.

Overall:
The hallucinations before WILD and Astral project are vivid but nothing in comparrison to Astral projection.
WILD can be cool but Astral projection has enabled me to speak to my ancestors.
Just think of the energy that flows around your body before WILD times 20.

How I Astral project the end result is way past the feeling before WILD.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dagnet

I knew someone was going to refere to WILD. I have successfully done WILD many times a few years back. It is very simular, but it is LD in a different life.
If you have been able to speak to ancestors e.g grandparents that have past away, which I have. It is basicly as if you are trying to do a WILD, but you are branching off
into astral projection. How you say astral projection is, is that it is the experiences you get before WILD. Those hallucinations, even though fairly potent are nothing that of an end result astral projection.
I tried so hard one night when I went back to my physical body I felt like my heart was going to fail. A really sharp pain in the heart.

Overall:
The hallucinations before WILD and Astral project are vivid but nothing in comparrison to Astral projection.
WILD can be cool but Astral projection has enabled me to speak to my ancestors.
Just think of the energy that flows around your body before WILD times 20.

How I Astral project the end result is way past the feeling before WILD.

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So, if I'm getting this right, WILD is something that comes before AP, and AP is really the next step? Sounds interesting. When I get more frequent with LD's, I'll make sure to focus on APing out of the LD. Thx :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Spyguy

So, if I'm getting this right, WILD is something that comes before AP, and AP is really the next step? Sounds interesting. When I get more frequent with LD's, I'll make sure to focus on APing out of the LD. Thx :)

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Well, In my opinion. LD can't really be more real in dreaming sense than a proper AP. I can walk the floors of house, all places there, I can speak to the loved ones that used to live there.
You know those feeling you get before you try to WILD. Well, once you are at that stage, concentrate on grabbing the ribbon, imagin that you are climbing it. Now with enough practise (this is where WILD hallucinations are now not that impressive) you feel
your existance rip and your "soul" starts to tunnel out from your heart. You start to see out of your Astral body's eyes. You continue imagin to climb the rope. And next thing you know it, you feel that 20x stronger energy come upon you. You start to climb the ribon
this is when your Astral projecting. Well it doesnt end there, you might need to do this multiple times. You start to walk on the floors of your house, you feel weightless. Don't over do it or you can break conection immediatly and you in a Sleep paralitic state. If you
are, don't be alarmed, just stay calm and go back to sleep. Astral Projection is really tiring, I need to drink a lot, around 500ml of water. Well sinse you do the activity before you go to bed you can just drift back to sleep.

Thank you for posting your methods for astral projection. It is definitely something I'm going to try.

One question though: for someone who hasn't a lot of experience with lucid dreaming, would you recommend trying astral projection? Would it be easier for me to get use to lucid dreaming first?

Well, I recon it is safe physically, but mentally it can be very scary. I would say that you could try WILD (wake initiated lucid dreaming) first. The hallucinations before WILD are overwelming but make you ready.
I'd suggest doing the Music method as the rope method can scare you to death, as with some people get scared by the hallucinations before WILD, the rope method has a much quicker onset.
The music method is easyest to start doing WILD or Astral projection, and the onset to AP is much slower, but during the hallucinations before WILD and a successfull Astral walk is way more overwelming
than the hallucinations before WILD.

All in All:
You should start doing WILD as it can prepare you for AP. The hallucinations before WILD is this energy feeling (I shall not say wierd as I'm used to it but can be wierd for you) accompanied with stronge visuals.

Sorry for the "really relaxed and relax" and other bad things like that :D lol

Sorry but as someone who pursued AP at some point out of curiosity, LD >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> AP. It ain't better, it depends on the person and how they do stuff.

And after reading all the thread, your AP could be easily called/dismissed/exchanged/etc for an intense WILD, you are just trying to justify the intensity by changing the name.

Moved to Beyond Dreaming.

I disagree. I can be having a lucid dream and know that I am having a lucid dream but because I have stabilised it so thoroughly it seems so incredibly real that I have to do a reality check just to make sure that it is a dream and not real life.

Whaatttt!!! Lucid dreaming is nothing to you? I mean what is lucid dreaming short of a dream come true? Basically it is just like real life, just about the same graphics, the same senses, except you can fly, materialize things, metamorphosis, shared dreaming, have sex, create a kingdom, create a fantasy, create a world, get free stuff, run around naked, become a woman, become an animal, etc.

And secondly, it is hard to prove that astral projection is real, basically it has been theorized that it is a form of dreaming.

I talk to my dead father all the time, in lucid and non-lucid. Not to say that what you're experiencing isn't a genuine AP (depends on whether you believe in that kind of thing), but there really isn't much that conclusively proves that it was AP. I've had some 'you just feel it' type of incredible lucid dreams (and non lucid as well), but I don't see how 'just feeling' that it's an AP can make anyone certain that it was actually an AP. That's just my two cents, though.

For people wondering how lucid dreaming is nothing to me is becuase the spiritual side of astral projection.
I will probably use it to help me cope with my parents death when it comes, as I can communicate with my lost loved ones,
I've successfully spoken to my grandparents.
Lucid dreaming is very fun, but Astral projection seems to be more important. From someone who has taken DMT I can say that
AP is quite simular but far far less visual than DMT, but AP has a very rigdid narrative.

Pursue it mate, it can be really educating. Try using the Rope method it seems to be the most effective
way of going out of your body.

Yes it does go besides the laws of physics. Picture your astral body as an invisible robot that you control with a remote. The robot has a camara to let you see around, it also has some
nice technology that alows you to communicate with lost ones.

The fact is, Astral projection there are no reality checks needed, it definatly isnt a dream.
I am working to find the "mind book" that can be ultimatly achieved through astral projection
aparently it is a book that you can read in the astral plane with all your memories.

*Merged your last three posts* Please use the 'edit' button, to add onto your previous posts, instead of multiple-posting.

The mind book you are referring to is your subconscious mind, and yes, many people believe you can tap into it and access all of your - even repressed memories. In a scientific context, it's what hypnotists and psychotherapists intend to get in touch with, during sessions (though the idea of it being 'a book' is likely just old lore). In a more metaphysical context, it also called the 'Akashic Records', which is not only supposed to hold your own subconscious memories, but the data on all of the information in the universe. I've read about it, and much of astral projection, though I admittedly haven't 'pursued' it to the fullest degree.

But, again, if you believe in astral projection, and that is your thing, then more power to you. Personally, I don't yet believe that astral projection is anything more than a testament to the mind's ability to create an intense, transcendent experience - which 'just feels' like you're leaving your body - as well as its ability to trick ourselves into holding onto such faith that the experiences actually entail visiting other people and places in space/time.

This is just my personal opinion, though, like I said. I'm open to the possibility of such things as Astral Projection, but from all I've seen, read and experienced, I'm not convinced.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dagnet

I am working to find the "mind book" that can be ultimatly achieved through astral projection
aparently it is a book that you can read in the astral plane with all your memories.

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(Unless you discredit LaBerge and others) that's your tacit memory. Your brain stores all the information it encounters (unconsciously, of course), and according to LaBerge it can be accessed during the dream state, particularly during lucid dreams.

Ok, for all who say that this is lucid dreaming, the most obvious counter aguments I can say is:
- I can hallucinate with open eyes before I astral walk
- when I astral walk I am in the same place where I wake into the astral realm
- I can see my body in the bed

What I can do is definatly not dreaming.
Sensations in Astral projection are far that beyond dreaming and that of
the sensations before an attempt to WILD.

And Like I said, I havn't yet been able to find the book of my momories, I plan to
do so using my method as different objects are in the astral realm/plane.
I have a lot of books in my house and book shelves. I think I will look there (in the astral realm ofcource).

I do think Astral projection is a form of dreaming as dreaming is initiated by DMT being released.
I think that Astral projection is a way of controlling the release of DMT in the brain through methods.
Also, the narrative values of Astral walking is far greater than that of dreaming.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dagnet

Ok, for all who say that this is lucid dreaming, the most obvious counter aguments I can say is:
- I can hallucinate with open eyes before I astral walk
- when I astral walk I am in the same place where I wake into the astral realm
- I can see my body in the bed

What I can do is definatly not dreaming.
Sensations in Astral projection are far that beyond dreaming and that of
the sensations before an attempt to WILD.

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I read your whole thread, Dagnet, and I kept having the same thought: Aren't you really talking about OBE's here? Isn't an OBE the one where you wander about your house, etc? Just curious.

Also, as yet another LD'er who's had many a conversation with dead relatives in my LD's, has had many a transcendental experience grounded in LD's, and have certainly had more than enough hypnagogic experiences (aka, I am assuming, your hallucinations) during WILD entries into LD's, I think you might be selling the LD experience a bit short. Indeed, I have experienced pretty much everything you describe in this thread, and more, and all of it was based on dreaming and LD's. I wonder if you are perhaps enjoying an advanced level of LD'ing, and have chosen to call it AP? That's okay, I suppose, but you might consider not consciously leaving LD'ing as a tool behind you, as it might ultimately damage your ability to do what you're calling AP.

Also, kudos to you on your posted methods... I especially like the music method!

Why are you calling it Astral walk, Because you're confusing people saying it's something else other than Astral travel or Astral Projection. It's simply called Astral Travel or Astral Projection.
Astral walking makes it sound like it's not part of Astral travel/Projection as if it's simply something else like Lucid dreaming.

How can you call it astral walk if you can fly when you leave your body and go to other galaxies and meet other sentient beings.

^^ Which is why I was wondering if we were really talking about OBE's here...

Q&A:
I call it astral walking, sorry if it is not used or I portray it the wronge way on this forum, as it generally sounds like what I've done.
I walk in on what seems to be another dimention so I call it the astral plane.

Also, the astral projection which I describe could be OBE. I have to admit, I'm not to sure about what AP really is about :P what I can do fits the bill on AP, rather than
OBE and WILD.

Now time for me to do some balanced arguments, for the first time I will now tell you the dream I had a long long time ago, when I had the period of bad bad nightmares:

Background:
I was around 6 or 7 when I had periods of always have a nightmares. Everyday then for a month I would go to sleep and have an extreme vivid nightmare.

Dream itself:
I woke up to what seamed normal, waking up to go to the toilet. I noticed the walls to the bathroom where furry and breathing and pulsating.

Further more, I have an argument,
I can tell you they are white in real life and are not like a fluffy breathing red carpet wall thingy with yellow dots!
Well, I go to the bathroom and I open the door, there was no toilet, just an empty bathroom.
I exit the bathroom and Intense deep snoring starts to drone on. I used to get this a lot in nightmares, I've learned that the snores are dreaming so I could effectively lucid from hearing them, anyway.
I go to my parents room, being scared, I opened the door to there room and the bed was 2D, wierd. The bed covers where stiff like ply-wood. I saw their faces wide open looking straight ahead, their
face was deformed and blistered. I swear, if they looked at me I would've had a heart attack.
I walked towards my room, the snoring in the back round becomes much harder and much quicker in pase, I felt scared, but alienated is a better word.
walking became much more difficult along with the increasing snoring. I return to the bed and then wake up, still feeling slightly alienated.

The point of this dream can counter argument that I say stuff about how I say astral travel is different to dreaming, I still feel that way but I must be
open minded to the truth.

Just thinking about my old nightmares draws me back to a funny sounding nightmare which wasnt in the dream.

In real life:
I was looking on facebook - bored. I stumble accross a person who looked like a retard in the photo, becuase they were drunk.
I laughed at it, but I wouldn't that night. I dreamed that the retard haunted me.

The dream:
I was walking back from school and find a pound coin on the floor. I turn around and I see this retard girl sitting down screeming, her head revolving at the same time - she had no irisis.
I went to my house totaly freaked out. I turn the computer on, and play pinball. It was fine at first, then I see the retard on one of the thingys bobbing around in the game. I can't remember much more,


Anyway that was irelivent but when I start describing my dreams to others I like to carry on, it makes me remember more dreams.

I do have to admit the begining post was not well structured, sometimes things can be really difficult to describe when most words dont explain it.

Having issues with photobucket im new to it too...
bare with me.

http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/...lowdiagram.png

There we go, there it is.

Music one is really strange, it isn't a known method and is hard to get mastered. I think I made it up, as the rope method isn't mine but I recon the music method is fairly unique to me, apoligies if someone has done it before. I astral walk way quicker with rope than music methods, and the music is too hard to comprehend, I always get a headache afterwards, I've only done it successfully twice.

I must add, I never get sleep paralysis while doing so, I have had sleep paralysis from doing WILD. I can break the conection instantly with AP if I need to, or its becoming too much and tiring.


Also, a successfull music method trip, I'd say is neither astral walking or dreaming, its another place in the mind where music are your eyes, however I can't write in detail as it is extremly hard
and I can only successfully achieve it through the use of a psychoactive plant "Coleus Blumei" which I can write a whole thread/essay on.
Without the plant I reach the same place as rope method though more tired and heart hurting, However: the music method is a great way to get into the hypnotic state quickly in order needed for me to WILD and AP.

Furthermore, I can't astral walk completly every night, it's way too tiring, I can achieve seeing through astral body's eyes, probably every night. I must be calm that day and go to bed at an optimum time, for me is 11:30 combined with feeling sleepy
but not too tired to achieve the best trip I can make, which is contacting my acestors.

Just one more quick clarification: WILD is a technique used to get to LD's, AP's and OBE's. Though using it can be pretty exciting sometimes, try to remember that it is only a means and not an end.

I must try to do some WILD, havn't dont so for a few months. I'll try tonight if I can using music method, rope is only for AP.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dagnet

I must try to do some WILD, havn't dont so for a few months. I'll try tonight if I can using music method, rope is only for AP.

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Just one more quick clarification(again): WILD is a technique used to get to LD's, AP's and OBE's. Though using it can be pretty exciting sometimes, try to remember that it is only a means and not an end in itself.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dagnet

Dream itself:
I woke up to what seamed normal, waking up to go to the toilet. I noticed the walls to the bathroom where furry and breathing and pulsating.

Further more, I have an argument,
I can tell you they are white in real life and are not like a fluffy breathing red carpet wall thingy with yellow dots!
Well, I go to the bathroom and I open the door, there was no toilet, just an empty bathroom.
I exit the bathroom and Intense deep snoring starts to drone on. I used to get this a lot in nightmares, I've learned that the snores are dreaming so I could effectively lucid from hearing them, anyway.
I go to my parents room, being scared, I opened the door to there room and the bed was 2D, wierd. The bed covers where stiff like ply-wood. I saw their faces wide open looking straight ahead, their
face was deformed and blistered. I swear, if they looked at me I would've had a heart attack.
I walked towards my room, the snoring in the back round becomes much harder and much quicker in pase, I felt scared, but alienated is a better word.
walking became much more difficult along with the increasing snoring. I return to the bed and then wake up, still feeling slightly alienated.

The point of this dream can counter argument that I say stuff about how I say astral travel is different to dreaming, I still feel that way but I must be
open minded to the truth.

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This sounds like a standard, slightly lucid nightmare. I've had plenty of similar dreams, as a kid, and they are part of the reason that I got into lucid dreaming. In fact, I used to have a recurring one, where I would be walking back from the bathroom and, just before I reached my bed, the entire room would flip upside down. I would actually feel the gravity shift and everything, and it would cause me to cover my eyes and ears because it was terrifyingly real. Yes, dreams - especially at that age, but even now, at 30 - can be that intense, and seem that otherworldly. Places change and objects move from where they might be in waking life. This is your mind's interpretation of normal, everyday concepts, when you are visualizing them in a sort of superposition (that is to say; thoughts and impulses get mixed and scrambled around, and you often view them in dreams as strange or 'alternate' versions of other things - giving the appearance of being in an 'alternate reality').

The snoring that you heard in the background was likely your own. I've often heard myself snoring in dreams - lucid or otherwise - and it sometimes wakes me up. Lol.

But no, none of this really heavily implies that you are in another physical dimension. To me, it's really just proof of how amazing the dreamscape can be. Like you said, though, it depends on what you believe. :wink:

Quote:

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- I can hallucinate with open eyes before I astral walk
- when I astral walk I am in the same place where I wake into the astral realm
- I can see my body in the bed

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This is your argument right? I can hallucinate with open eyes before I lucid dream, I wake on the same place I went to sleep and can also see my body, all of these were done in lucid dreams, so now what? I can't argue against your personal experience or beliefs, however using the logic you are using, it is lucid dreaming simply because I have done it.

Everything else you describe ins't half as intense as the SP experiences I hear from a member here, so yeah, just because you have done it and don't hear it often it doesn't means it is special.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Hukif

This is your argument right? I can hallucinate with open eyes before I lucid dream, I wake on the same place I went to sleep and can also see my body, all of these were done in lucid dreams, so now what? I can't argue against your personal experience or beliefs, however using the logic you are using, it is lucid dreaming simply because I have done it.

Everything else you describe ins't half as intense as the SP experiences I hear from a member here, so yeah, just because you have done it and don't hear it often it doesn't means it is special.

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Try to go down the AP route which I described in the flow diagram.


PS: The music method I don't think is AP or LD when used with the psychoactive plant. It is really strange by that music replaces the visuals in AP or LD.
also, who is this member I wish to speak to him

I have tried AP before, not as you describe it but have done it, the how you arrive isn't important, it is that you arrive. And even so, LD >>>>>> AP for me.
And snoop, his SP is so freaking amazing, I envied it for a good while, now I don't. Though my demon/monster/spirit/shadow hallucination was easy to annoy.

I must try to take 5-HTP or Melatonin tablets, if it allows me to AP better than I may prove
to myself that I can release melatonin on demand.
5-HTP is basicly serotonin which gets turned in Melatonin.

I do have to admit. The feeling of breathing in water in a dream can be wonderful, though
AP is more spiritual.

Anyone tried my music method yet? or the Rope method?

Also, funny thing today I AP'd in class was about to go about (open eyed visuals) then
my teacher aprouched me and thought I was on drugs and took me to head teacher lol.
I was really bored and lights were off while we watched a doccumentary, the lights went on.
The headteacher said,"what have you been taking. Cannabis?"
I said "No, I was astral projecting."
Headteacher had a WTF face. Another benifit to AP lol, made my day haha

ima try it in a couple hours with umm saltcube method as a backup

Do you have to be tired to try this because trying to WILD while wide awake is near impossible.

yeah I can AP while awake just needs to be dark
I dont think I could go past the open eyed visual stage though...

Being tired deffinatley helps, I was tired that day anyway.

And at what time of the night do you/should you try these?

Nice methods man :).For me LDs seemed to be something really interesting , but one day i accidentally astral projected and now i'm all about that..I can sometimes go there like 10 times every night, though i find it hard not to wake up .. it takes me just a little thought about waking up and i wake up..Astral is such an amazing thing..
My method is:
Randomly wake up in the night(usually i wake up a lot during the night) roll over or do something , slowly exhale and try to feel like i'm floating and by the time i exhale everything i start feeling extreme vibrations like my body's is being torn apart or hear some music.Then i just roll over(or just wait till "something" lifts me up to the ceiling and literally drop me to the astral plane :D) ..