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    1. #26
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      Psoinik,

      We can try to 'share a dream' my way, if you're interested. We won't both be asleep at the same time. I don't think its even necessary for you to choose to do this chronologically ahead of my dream, for reasons I'll try to explain in a separate thread. Ask a question that you're deeply interested in, emotionally and morally. Then one or both of us will dream something that we would not have been able to dream ourselves, that is possible because of the presence of the other person's mind, and the intersection of their aim with ours, blessed by providence. This experiment isn't very 'repeatable' with a particular person because its hard to do more than once without running out of questions we can find answers to. But I've had enough experiences like this with enough different people that I have some confidence it will work. I haven't been dreaming lucidly for the last four years, since moving to my present city. But have had a couple of experiences of this type since then, without trying, so I don't think the ability has abandoned me. The reason for using a philosophical question is the subject has to be of interest for the semi-transcendent part of ourselves that's capable of doing this sort of thing. Questions like "what will be the winning lottery number" just don't turn the crank. I guess to some extent that's specific to my personality also. It works even if your motive or interest is a bit different than mine, as long as there's a way for our thoughts connect metaphorically.

      I don't think faith is necessary, skepticism is OK. We only need enough openness that the possibility isn't shut off. If one person is afraid of the experience, or opposed to it, that can be unpleasant though. Each person has a lot of control over how much of their mind is exposed to the other person: that's determined by the nature of the question and what its psychologically connected to. (I have no idea how that works, but it does.) The experience of one's mind not being entirely private may still be a bit freaky though, because it is a lot more direct and personal than speech or writing, at least how I experience it. I think that everyone experiences this at least a little bit through the normal course of living, but without much understanding of what they're feeling.

      Another reason I like philosophical/spiritual questions is it raises the subject to a higher, impersonal plane, so to speak, which helps avoid other psychological complications.
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    2. #27
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      I'm open to experimentation. And I have no problem about being open, nor I have anything to be embarrassed off. There are some things I could be uncomfortable off in physical world, but when I'm in the state needed for LD or OBE it loses importance. A few times I shared my consciousness with beings while out of body, which may or may not be real life person(I tried for shared OBEs too... and that person didn't remember anything) and there was nothing in me against that while doing that. And also nothing after I got back to physical world.
      The only thing which may come against successful experience is to remember I had to do it. You see, it took me a while to create triggers- when I see specific persons I'm more likely to remember to start experiment. Otherwise I'm exploring my dream or astral or other surrounding with singular focus- in that singular focus nothing what I wanted to do comes up to my mind.

    3. #28
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      Psionik,

      I never try to remember to do anything while dreaming, during the day I just make note of what I'm interested in, then leave the rest to my subconscious.

      So here's my last night experience. After sleeping for a couple of hours there was a brief power outage, and I had to get up and turn an alarm off. I went back to sleep, and a few hours later I dreamed about the 'kitchen' at a friend's workplace. The kitchen was a rectangular room full of various large appliances, mostly antique, including at least one gas stove, and some machine for working bread dough. Also, in the dream was the 'kitchen' in my workplace, which contained similar appliances.

      I'm pretty sure the kitchen represents the idea space in the person's mind. So the meaning here is that the other person has approximately the same set of scientific and quasi-Buddhist ideas and mental attachments that I have, and maybe some similar life memories.

      The remainder of the dream was suggestive of chemistry lab work, except scaled up by a factor of a billion. So, for instance, instead of molecules attracted to each other by electrostatic forces, cloned invertebrates are heated and mixed around and in wash-machine like instruments, then deposited on a surface where they squirm around and attach to each other, forming larger invertebrates. In the dream I expressed a moral reservation about doing that kind of work with living organisms. Besides representing molecules, the organisms have a metaphorical correspondence to thoughts.

      That's it. After I got up and left for work this morning, clocks and local stoplights were still offline from the power outage.

      There's no new insight in this dream that I recognize, and nothing stands out as being the type of symbol that would have a clear connection to another person's dream. Awareness of identity was not very strong, so if there's any connection to another person in the dream, you or anyone else, I don't know them better now than I did beforehand. If there was any kind of shared dream experience, that's my end of it though. I mentioned the power outage in case it had a symbolic connection to your or another person's dream, for me those kinds of events are as likely to connect that way as other images in a dream. The 'friend' who's 'kitchen' I dreamed about was a Danish American man I know, but I don't think the dream had anything to do with him, he was a symbol, filling a generic 'quasi-Buddhist scientific friend' role.

      That's the extent of the dream

    4. #29
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      I was in the interplanetary space, beyond the Neptune.... point of consciousness. There was big ship in front of me, a first interstellar colony ship. It was of dull grey colour. I saw it from behind, its cavernous nozzles were in front of me. Then I saw a small window opened in upper right side of my field of view. The captain, a young woman which looked like my oldest daughter, told something, then that window closed and those nozzles filled with pale blue plasma. And the ship accelerated away from me. I was hovering there for some time, I didn't have any need to do anything else. After some time I lost consciousness.
      Last edited by Psionik; 01-27-2018 at 12:50 AM.

    5. #30
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      Well, that seems to have nothing to do with my dream, and it doesn’t ring any other bells either. So I guess we can put a check mark in the negative category.

    6. #31
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      Well, that seems to have nothing to do with my dream, and it doesn’t ring any other bells either. So I guess we can put a check mark in the negative category.

    7. #32
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      Furthermore, if I were going to try to come up with two dreams that were completely uncorrelated, I don't think I could do better than that.

      My dream seemed to be about two minds that are similar enough that there might not be a lot of interesting thoughts that could come out of the synergy of them. But your 'Into The Void' (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xx6IwshTL6M) dream is so different from anything that I'd dream that I have no idea how to interpret it. Is this about children leaving home?

      My oldest child is in high school. The personalities of my two oldest children are quite different from mine, and I don't have an expectation that we'll be friends when they're adults. There doesn't seem to be a lot of common ground of values or interest. Can only do the best job I can as a parent then send them on their way.

    8. #33
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      I'm not sure about your interpretation. Newer was into that. I was completely neutral there. Observer only. No emotions. Nevertheless, I had many dreams and OBEs where I was in the space without any spacesuit, often without clothes... and many times only as point of consciousness with 360 degree view angle. It was more like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3UOZvwWn_Mo I never was into Black Sabat kind of music.

      Intelligence is most precious thing in universe. Planets are able to be craddle of intelligence, but if that intelligence doesn't manage to leave planet soon enough, planet will choke intelligent life to extinction. - From another OBE where I observed earth from the surface of the Moon I think. I meditated there on some kind of darker rock, naked, surrounded by blue violet sparkling aura. It was something like afflatus, I didn't saw the man who told me. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xPMpm_eCKM Nice interpretation how I can look in many OBEs... and also LDs ... even the mind state. Totally neutral. I saw this movie a few years ago, and I was surprised by this interpretation.

      Today dream is more sketchy. Again I was a point of consciousness. Observer only. There was a large field which belonged to some company. That company was going broke, slowly, but they didn't know that yet. Somebody who thought that that field is vacant sowed there some leguminous plants which weren't even edible to humans- it was meant for animals.
      That company went broke in a few months- and all the people lost everything, even theirs clothes.All those people men and women ended in a bush. They made provisional clothes out of palm leaves(even if there were no such leaves anywhere there). Then they went out of that bush... and they met other large group of women and men- which looked like campers on vacation. Those campers looked on that broke group and grouped close together- they feared that bankrupt group. They feared that bankrupt group will sack their things. But bankrupt group went around and through their group and all of them went in direction to their forgotten field. As they went some of their older members had some problems with health. Younger members healed them with light shining out of their hands. But there was debate what was the nature of the illness. Some thought that it was muscle cramps, other that it was failing kidneys, or digestion problems from hunger. Nevertheless they cured older members. Bankrupted group arrived to their last property. They found that it was planted by non edible plants. Some of them speculated about eating it. Some were annoyed that their field wasn't bare.But group didn't stay there they left and went and went... Till they come to large body of water. They took the large Luxury looking ship and sailed away. On the way they met small boat which was trying to run. An anchor was shot into this small boat and it was first penetrated completely and then some members bankrupt group pulled that small boat out of the water as it was skewered by that anchor and placed it on upper boar of that ship. The small boat was empty. wood only, no people there , nor it was anything that wood. No engine. But when it was running from the ship it was as if it had engine...
      Last edited by Psionik; 01-27-2018 at 01:41 PM.

    9. #34
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      I just noticed another thing. I had a very similar or "Shared dream". go to april 4 2017 on the dream blog calendar. Read my entry and Mortal Trinity, we both had a dream of walking through a mall when a rock band materialized out of nowhere.
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    10. #35
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      Two sketchy dreams
      1. I was playing with youngest daughter. I'm half bald in RL and I don't care about that at all. Instead I keep my rest of my hair about 0.5cm long. In that dream I pulled hand full of that short hair and made them about 3/4 of meter long. My daughter laughed. Then I started to make different hairstyles out of that hair... It was funny and my daughter liked it very much.
      2. There was disease and people were quarantined on one place. I was in military and I had to bomb those people with cure - that disease was very dangerous and contagious therefore it wasn't possible to come close without catching it. I took the bomb with my hands and flew. But it killed a number of people. When I returned, one of scientists told me that I took wrong bomb- I took 100kg bomb and there was no cure in it. Instead I had to take 1000kg barrel like bomb. I was contemplating how would I manage to lift with that bomb. 100kg was already more then I believed I could take, but 1000kg? Fortunately for me, it looked like it weights nothing. The second bombing was successful and those people were saved.

      Edit1.
      I'm not sure how this can lead into confirmation of shared dreams. In my opinion, such experiment needs to be controlled:
      1. I need to be in at least LD, if not OBE.
      2. I expect, that I need to know person I want communicate with.
      3. I need to do it purposely...
      4. That person would ideally cooperate- try to do the same in LD too. If that person is only dreaming, I would need to induce lucidity in that person to make him/her remember.
      5. If I don't do it purposely, then at least other party has to try it, otherwise connection establishment is unlikely.

      Edit2
      Possibly shared dream place http://www.dreamviews.com/blogs/psio...nd-urth-70731/ But I wouldn't be so sure that there was really shared elements. But nothing I made (explosion) was registered.

      Then there was an OBE where I met with my brother (He can project to astral too, I taught him myself) about year before I started a dream journal here.
      10.4.2013.
      I floated out of my body, and found myself in the same room I was in RL. My physical body was black in near blackness of my surrounding. Otherwise the whole house was empty. I felt pull to my friend and I started to fly were the pull tug me. On my way there is house my brother build. It wasn't habitable at that time yet. I Found him in front of his house and landed. I asked him whether he knows that he is out of body. He didn't answer at that question. We chatted for some time. At the end of conversation I told him that I'm flying to next village to visit friend, that I feel, that something interesting is happening there. He asked me why I don't leave her be, that she isn't my wife and it looks like I like her too much. I told him that I like her much but as really dear friend. He couldn't understand that. I told him that I can't lie while in astral and I really must fly fast. I leaved him with words that he should try to remember our meeting. I flew fast to friends village. On the village border I rammed into dark barrier... a force field. I tried again and again to penetrate that barrier but I wasn't able to before I was pulled back into body.
      A few weeks later I told my brother of that experience and he told me that he met me there, but he didn't remember our talk.

      One of possible precognition http://www.dreamviews.com/blogs/psio...-flying-59936/ I had a few tens of the through my life, but they aren't written down.
      Last edited by Psionik; 01-28-2018 at 06:53 PM.

    11. #36
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      A flaw in my intentional 'dream telepathy' approach, is the power that drives it is the potential for sharing a desired insight. But since you were going to tell me your dream anyway whether there was a 'shared' experience or not, it doesn't answer that desire. We could attempt to hold the insight-desire hostage by the second person refusing to communicate their dream unless there's a clear match, but that seems wrong.

      For me, being actively lucid or astrally projecting would be counter-productive. I don't know how to share a dream, I have to be passive and let it happen, I can't make it happen.

      Here are some of my thoughts about space travel, since that was your dream.

      The idea of space travel is obviously to a large degree an extension of historical experiences of crossing oceans. That's why we talk of 'space ships', which in science fiction movies typically have a 'bridge', and commonly there are space battles and space pirates and stuff. I think however that this metaphor fails to grasp how far away the stars really are. The ratio between the width of the Atlantic Ocean to the width of the English Channel is about 200. The ratio between the distance to the nearest interesting star system and the distance to the moon is about 20,000,000. It is a very different kind of problem. A step like a moon base isn't in my opinion a meaningful step towards interstellar travel.

      If our survival depends on leaving earth, that implies either we'll be surviving indefinitely in space, or going to another habitable planet. If surviving in space, or on other barren rocks, then there's no point in leaving the solar system. And we have no business going to other habitable planets if we don't have our moral act together well enough to survive here. Also, if we can't survive on 'spaceship earth', I don't see how our chances on a much, much smaller 'generation ship' would be better.

      If it is possible to visit other faraway planets, I think it is done by some method other than crossing space in a physical body. In any case, I think back-of-the-envelope calculations of energy and mass show that its not practical with a reaction drive. I think it would be much more plausible to transmit some kind of information about ourselves that embeds itself in the local ecology and unpacks itself over time. I feel like that's how we got to the earth actually, though I can't justify that statement beyond the feeling.

      I also feel there are mental barriers that mostly prevent us from extending our thoughts to other worlds, a fence of sorts.

      I've had one lucid dream that I recall that took place on another world. It was a remarkable experience, but it also felt wrong somehow. Rightly or wrongly, the dream of space travel feels to me like a mistake.

      This is a side issue, but most people who dream of mars colonization or terraforming don't seem to realize that mars is only twice the diameter of the moon. It would be a billion times easier to live at the south pole, but nobody wants to move there either.

      As another side issue, the international space station is almost completely useless for research, but that understanding is suppressed because its not good for budgets. Its horribly noisy as a microgravity environment for instance, as was pointed out to me when I used to work at NASA.

      Anyway, I don't care about convincing anyone of any of this, I'm just stating it because my whole premise on dream sharing was that we'd dream things where there was an opportunity to share thoughts that we don't already have in common, and space travel was your topic.
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    12. #37
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      Quote Originally Posted by shadowofwind View Post
      we have no business going to other habitable planets if we don't have our moral act together well enough to survive here.
      "Having no Business" is not the same as Won't. It's never stopped anyone before (I mean across the space of our oceans, in the wooden ships of course) and it never will. Shouldn't never seems to stand in the way of Can or Shall. But I do agree that it's very unlikely we'll ever establish any kind of habitable space in - well, space. I mean that's viable for colonists to live in long term.
      Last edited by Darkmatters; 01-28-2018 at 10:26 PM.

    13. #38
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      I see it different.
      Moon base, and moon itself is good source of material outside of large gravity well the earth has. It is much cheaper to send material from it. Vacuum is good for metal production. There were experiments.

      ISS is not so bad as you depict it. yess it is noisy... but not so much as MIR was Many experiments are run there. Research which couldn't be done otherwise. But- Spacestation needs simulated gravity for long therm habitation without health deterioration. Maybe 0.5g would be enough, maybe even full 1g. But we need vacuum furnaces running in zero G to obtain special alloys. Also special materials like carbon nanotubes or new types of monocrystals would benefit from zeroG manufacturing. I have no full knowledge about all the hundreds and thousands experiments done there.

      About Mars- you are using the same arguments as I use, when I'm discussing mars colonization with fanatics. They don't see energy requirements, environmental hazards and long distance problems. Mars can't be effectively terraformed. It lacks many essential things. People would need to live there similarly as people on the Moon. The best place would be in caves. But on the moon, there is a little more energy than on Earth, while on Mars there is less solar energy on equator then on Earths poles. I'm sure, that given time, a few thousands or even millions people would live on Mars. But it wouldn't be anything major. They will need nuclear or thermonuclear plants for energy generation.

      Asteroids are better choice. Material is in near zero gravity. Colonies would be located not on asteroids but near them. Solar energy is usable, thin metal mirror concentrators will make them usable. Mark Twain told once: “Behold, the fool saith, "Put not all thine eggs in the one basket" - which is but a matter of saying, "Scatter your money and your attention"; but the wise man saith, "Pull all your eggs in the one basket and - WATCH THAT BASKET." But I'm not so sure- Earth may be endangered by something we couldn't avert. It is better if we had many space colonies- rotating mobile habitats thorough solar system. Such stations could be made supernova proof. materials are abundant in solar system so it isn't problem to make radiation shielding for that event.

      I too visited extrasolar systems a few times using OBE(astral projection). Even observed strange life on one of them. It didn't felt wrong though. It was simply different. Star was orange, plants had blackish "leaves" which looked like lobes. There wasn't intelligent life, but there was something somewhat similar to green apes.

      Interstellar travel with chemical rocket engines is foolish thought You are right with that. But there is a way. Inertial nuclear fusion engines are basically possible now. Only heavy and therefore expensive to build. With such engines we could achieve efficiently speed up to 0.2c. But 0.05-0.1c is enough for interstellar travel if large space habitat was sent. Generational ship would arrive after decades, or hundreds of years and set colony in other star system. Proxima Centauri would be good enough for colony even if there was no habitable planet. All they would need is asteroid field. That would further minimize potential extinction event for human race.

      Lets all this leave in this discussion and concentrate on shared dreaming. That dream was looking like some kind of historic event, or documentary of one.
      I got a very short OBE where I managed to visit next room before I was disturbed by daughter. It looked as reality, but there is no confirmation of realism possible. I could hear everything what happened there. My mind would then fill up what was happening there.
      Last edited by Psionik; 01-28-2018 at 10:38 PM.
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    14. #39
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      Why do you think your OBE to another planet was "real"? And why do you suppose you can't you get information from other people when you OBE? It seems you have trouble with that, or else you wouldn't doubt shared dreaming, since it would amount to the same thing, even if the other person were awake. It seems like the difficulty in personal interaction must say something about the nature of the OBE experiences. Like maybe you're really "there" in some extra-sensory sense, but not in a literal, temporal sense. In other words, maybe you see the persistent objects, and feel a kind of average of how the place feels, but some of the specific things are filled in by your imagination.

      I guess you know about the reactionless drive that bounces light around in a cone.

      Here are some of my dreams and intuitions having to do with other worlds....

      I experienced myself being an animal that doesn't exist on the earth. It only lasted a few seconds, but the feeling of identity was very strong, and it felt very much like "me". Usually in a dream I have some sense of being someone else. I'm not saying this experience was "real", I'm sure that in some sense it was some kind of projection.

      I feel like my body is wrong, that I should have two spinal columns, one on either side of my body, and that the hemisphere's of my brain should be less tightly integrated. I feel an emotional loss in relation to this, as if the missing nerve structure has been torn out of me. I realize this sounds insane, and maybe it is delusional, I don't know, that's just what I experience. I do see advantages to the human design, it forces some things to be more unified psychologically, which makes some kinds of personal progress easier. But it also feels foreign.

      Like I said, I feel that there is a mental barrier to telepathy with intelligent beings in other worlds. I feel this while awake. I don't know if its them or us but it feels intentional. Again, this could be fanciful, but that's what I feel.

      I feel that human spirits in general are to some extent invasive from somewhere else, and only partially native to this world. They psychically encouraged the primate direction of development, pushed themselves into it, and took it over. In this context, our world feels to me like one room in a very large building.

      I feel our solar system also has a life spirit that is in some sense distinct from the more grounded spirit of the sun and which came from somewhere else. That 'life spirit' chose this sun as appropriate for its needs, and exists in a kind of embrace with it. I don't know exactly what the relationship would be between this spirit and people. This kind of intuition is one reason I don't worry about things like life-extinguishing asteroids. I don't think that sort of thing is random chance, in which case running away from it won't save you anyway.

      I dreamed of being on another planet that has a dry, somewhat cool climate. The feeling of the place was very distinct, very lucid. In this sequence of dreams, there were three different scenes involving long metallic cylinders which contain man-eating worm-like monsters. It is highly unusual for me to dream about the same symbol more than once. I see metaphorical tie-ins both with heroin addiction and also with Elon Musk's vision of Mars colonization, but I don't really understand the connections. Most of my dreams I understand to a fair extent I think, this one sticks out as one that doesn't make much sense.

      As I have written elsewhere, I feel there are parallel worlds related to ours, and I think I even have a little more basis to think that than just wild imagination, but I really don't understand this. These are not the parallel worlds of sci-fi that share a history with ours. I think that if we understood this, then we'd understand all the other stuff and premonitions and stuff too, its all part of the same thing. The reason I bring this up, is if we're talking about 'alien worlds', I think that thinking of them as being far away across space isn't always the best way to think about it.
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    15. #40
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      I don't know how real OBEs are. I only feel them real unlike lucid dreams that are just dreams with lucid mind. Feeling is not enough though. And all the comparison between OBE and physical world showed me too low connection... I'm not sure there is reality in OBE. Well I had a few OBEs (mainly to astral), where even if details were off, the core was right, even if removed by years from happening(precognition). I don't expect OBEs to be the picture of physical reality, but I have enough small clues to believe that it might have some kind of connection to real world.

      Reactionless drives- like EMDrive? I follow works of Eagleworks group and enthusiasts https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/in...pic=42978.2960. So far it looks like that it isn't real thing. I discussed a few times with some experimenters and they too are disillusioned, but they are trying to refine their experiments. Chinese group which reported wery high thrust has removed their report - it was false signal- heated surface of drum made air flow around it and that airflow pushed torsional scales. Experiments in vacuum showed marked worsening of the thrust. What thrust remained may be effect of not good enough vacuum. And Shawyer - it is enough to hear what he says, to tell, that he is a charlatan- his explanations are laughable from physical point of view. I'm not physicist. But I know enough basics and when one start to speak about top speed of EMDrive and how it will have thrust in thousands newtons while in "rest" while thrust is nearing to zero at about 35km/s speeds... At least many experimenters aren't so stupid.

      Interesting dreams. I never had something like that. Man eating worms on other planet? Man never visited other planet We only managed to visit our moon. So, how it is that it was man eating? I would expect different biochemistry... so we and they would be reciprocally inedible.

      Now your thoughts of parallel worlds has more merit. I had a few OBE's where I visited parallel universes. Other me were somewhat different, I had different occupation there, different wifes, houses build... and it was also sometimes time-shifted. A few times I had also OBEs where it looked like I see a mix of parallel universes at once. Things were blurred in that OBE. The lighter and easily movable objects were very diffuse. The more massive objects the more solid they looked.

      Today's dreams- again they were sketchy.
      1. I was looking for new workplace. I was offered one, and I was walking through city to find where it was located, but I didn't find it. Nothing interesting in that dream.
      2. I was going home by bus, but I forgot to get out at my village. Instead I got out at next one. I met there a woman(I'm not exactly sure who it was). Brown eyes, curly brown hair, about 175cm height... She was very attractive to me. I tried to talk to her but the talk was embarrassingly stammering. She showed interest first, but after a while I felt as if we are forcing the talk too much, so I parted with words, that we will meet at another time. It was better to remove my presence than to lose possible new friendship. Somehow I see this dream as warning. Am I too oppressive mentally? It certainly felt that way in that dream.
      3. A problem solving dream. Yesterday my old smartphone went crazy again(I wanted to buy new one a year and half ago, but I managed to circumvent software-hardware problems at the time and I didn't buy new one.). So I restarted it before going sleep but it looked like light sensor functions badly- the screen was very bright. In this dream I "repaired" that phone by restarting it under a lamp. The idea was, that display was too bright, because the restart was made in darkness and sensor wasn't calibrated at restart somehow. This morning, I did what I did in that dream and smartphone functions correctly again..
      Last edited by Psionik; 01-29-2018 at 10:41 PM.

    16. #41
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      Todays dream
      I was in some kind of artificial structure with one man. There was somebody going after us, and we were trying to avoid to be caught. The structure was very, very large. Three dimensional. There was something like small platforms made out of solid hologram hanging in endless void- we were jumping from one platform to another... till we came to a wall. There were large opened doors into small cabin in front of us. We jumped about 2-3 meters void between last platform and cabin... and those doors closed, and cabin started to move faster and faster. I thought that it was a trap to catch us. From walls and ceilings a small sharp bluish flames sprung and the cabin started to fill up with white smoke. Shortly after that we fainted.
      When I came to myself, I was together with my companion in a car... The surroundings looked like after war. Quite desolate. There were signs that humans are trying to repair that place, to clean the ruble and so on. The car looked more like wreck than usable vehicle... I started to doze out as we drove away... My companion asked the driver whether we didn't make some crime to be in that place. Driver told him, that what is crime and what is not depends on my will, that I'm creating the rules. That I can change rules whenever I want. When we got to the destination I wanted to go out of that car but doors didn't respond to my hand manipulations. I used my strength and those doors crumbled in my hands like they were made of paper.
      Last edited by Psionik; 01-30-2018 at 02:40 PM.

    17. #42
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      Todays dream
      I was a soldier. I was part of military exercise... Well if that was what I think it was. I was in a tank. One man tank. On the opposite side of the training ground there was other man in a tank. There was signal and we rolled out to find each other and to try to disable adversary. I wanted to confuse my opponent so I started to roll on the side of training ground. I drove that tank for quite a long. After a long time I lost tank... I was walking for some reason and I was carrying a shell from my tank. When I thought that I was confusing my opponent for long enough I started to seek for him. And I found him... For some reason, maybe the same as why my tank vanished, his tank transformed to something resembling an excavator. It had tracks, large glass cabin and instead of dipper it had an gun barrel. When I came closer I saw that my opponent fell asleep. I aimed the shell I was carrying on my opponent vehicle and said: Bam! But nothing happened. Then I got an idea... I inserted the shell into the gun barrel from outside Then I patted it a little and said again: Bam! And dark clouds of smoke began to fill the cabin. My opponent awoke and started to cast invectives toward myself in some very rough russian dialect. I didn't understand much...

    18. #43
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      Todays dreams.
      1.Yesterday my daughter talked about some game with zombies and then about fear to do LDs because she fears that she would meet them in that dream... Naturally I dreamed about it
      I was flying on small helicopter about 20m above ground. The nature was really nice and without any signs of damage... humans were extinct and I was last one... Bellow me a small group of zombies ran trying to get me. They ran on the ground and whenever there was a tree they climbed up and jumped trying to get into my helicopter. They were in very late state of decomposition... they had almost no skin, meat was black and oily, worms were eating them... and god, they reeked of foul smell. After some time I reached vicinity of my parents house where I had my base. I landed. Zombies were by me in short time. I wasn't surprised nor I was in fear. One by one, I grabbed zombies heads by one hand and plunged them into ground so only their feet were above ground. I thought that they were good as fertilizer.
      2. I was on the bicycle trip with my family. I rode my recumbent bike and smallest daughter was sitting behind my seat.IMG_7384_cra.jpg As you see there is no place for that, but somehow it was possible in my dream. I stopped by old house which looked uninhabited, because I really, but really needed to pee. I went behind the house and did so. But when I was returning I found that that house changed and it wasn't uninhabited anymore. And there was also a fence. I closed the small gate behind me and my wife started to tell me, that that small gate needs to be shortened because it can't close well. I looked on it... I told my wife, that contrary to what she thinks it should be lengthened more than shortened, because it could barely stay closed- a little shorter and it wouldn't stay closed. At that some older woman came out of house, confused. I told her what I have done, and that we really need to go. I sat on my bicycle and started to ride away. I had problems to keep balance. When I looked on my daughter she was leaning to one side then another... That was the reason I couldn't hold my balance. I also found that I'm holding about 40cm long thick corroded steel rod from that small gate. I stopped and took that rod back to old woman. She looked at me in confusion and asked me what she has to do with it. I explained her that it is probably from small gate. I wasn't able to find the place, from which that rod could be from.
      3. I mixed some kind of drink in my laboratory... and then I drank it! I felt as if I got stronger from it. I could jump for 10-15 meters distance with easy. I was running-jumping on street, heading to city. Once in the city a pair of men started to follow me. I ran from them and they lost me. I was running-jumping on the bank of river and I saw that there is young woman with short black hair running-jumping too, only she was jumping only short distances compared to me. She jumped to my trajectory and unable to dodge her fast, I jumped higher and landed in front of her on my back. with my legs and hands up to the sky. Funny position. We apologized to each other- it was awkward moment. Then there was jump in time and I was working with that woman . We were inside large white, glossy sphere, maybe 20meters in diameter. There was a walkway to center of that sphere ending with small circular platform (somewhat similar to this from movie X-Men 881e9519707461.562deefac8827.jpg). On that platform stood a white about 1m tall rectangular column. Above it an curved hologram screen was shining in bluish colors. That woman took a blue shining memory card and downloaded some information.

    19. #44
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      double post... Something is wrong with dreamwievs.com, it happens all the time here.
      Last edited by Psionik; 02-01-2018 at 10:09 AM.

    20. #45
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      The site checks for identical posts and removes them automatically. But if you edit one of the duplicates they are no longer identical and both remain. So the trick is to scroll up and check if theres a double before you edit your post. If there is, just refresh the page and it should be gone

      Edit: I haven't been reading your whole experiment, any signs of success? I am very interested in finding a partner to attempt something like this myself in the future, but I want to get really good at WILD first.
      Last edited by LighrkVader; 02-01-2018 at 10:47 AM.
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      Half of the time we're gone and we don't know where...

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      This experiment was suggested by Shadowofwind... I don't know how high is possibility of shared dream using this way. It looks to be very unreliable method. Man of Shred for example describes shared dreams in a way I like- it looks very repeatable and both or more participants have very, very similar experiences. The thing is, I tried and I failed to have such similarities.
      If I manage shared dreams it would prove at least telepathy through dreams... Or even better, if I manage to pull someone into astral while projecting(OBE) and share my experiences, it would go a long way into personal proof of reality of existence out of body. No success yet.

    22. #47
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      Psionik, I notice in your dreams (at least from the ones you've posted here) it seems like you dream a lot of military scenarios - direct attack against an opponent with weapons, or courageous space exploration to find new frontiers. This suggests that you might not like to expose your vulnerability. But it's precisely through experiencing our own vulnerability honestly that we gain strength. Hiding it behind armor plating is a form of mask - to hide your own humanity that you're afraid can get hurt otherwise. But true courage is the courage to walk without the armor on. To trust that other people won't attack you as long as you don't attack them, and to treat them with empathy and kindness rather than suspicion and antagonism.

      It sounds to me like this is how you want to approach shared dreaming. As something to be attacked, or like a military campaign almost. It seems like you don't trust the inner self - the subconscious - to do its quiet work in the background, but rather you want to go in directly with pure force.

      I now have a funny image of somebody opening up to share their inner world with you and you storming in in some kind of tank with guns blazing to leave them a smoking ruin.


      EDIT: I've had a thought about it. I suppose some people are just aggressive, and they will be that way in the dream world just as in waking life. Maybe they need to find the right kind of partner, just as they do in waking life - it wouldn't work for an aggressive soul to try to be friends with a gentle soul. So they need to find the right kind of person - maybe another aggressive person who loves to wage warfare on the dream plane, or as happens so often in life, maybe a co-dependent person who grew up with an aggressive parent and that's the kind of life they're used to. Just trying to make sense of it all.

      Another thought - after posting that 1st edit. I suppose it's also possible for a person to be friendly or gentle in waking life but to be aggressive subconsciously, the subconscious often has a very different personality.
      Last edited by Darkmatters; 02-01-2018 at 03:02 PM.
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      Oh god... I'm not sure about your interpretation... It is like... what I ingrained into my OBEs and LDs is bleeding over into normal dreams. Because I found that emotions are not good (Fear coupled with imagination leads to not very nice experiences) when I want stable experience. So, I trained to be as emotionless and in as observational state as possible. It doesn't leave space for fear... Well nearly no space for fear because I have yet to see to be in state completely without any doubt. But I have high enough control over myself that I could overcome possible inconveniences nearly every time.

      It is not the way I dream though. It is as if... One can say that I'm like rock there. Rock feeling and observing the waves... But I'm no warrior. Rather, I don't let circumstances to control myself without my consent. I open myself and feel into characters there, into surroundings. I feel many things which I use to orient myself... If I feel bad intentions it may end bad, if source of those intentions tries to do harm. That army exercise dream was a comedy. Zombie dream- I was completely emotionally flat. zombies were not really there for me. They were more like soulless automatons which I needed to stop. It was like if you are looking on boring movie. Space exploration- that was as if I looked on documentary film. No emotions there... It isn't hiding emotions when there are no emotions.
      From dreams I presented here the dream 2. from 29.1.2018 as very emotional. I felt that woman very attractive and my emotions were those of pure love... nonphysical one. It was very strong. If I felt something like that in LD it is probable that I would destabilize it. Not to mention OBE, where emotions need to be controlled even more.

      Thank you for your comemnt.
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      Ok, well I'm glad you didn't just blast me for saying that!

      I realize that people are complex, and the things we write on a message board are very simple, so there's no way to understand a person in their full depth from what they write here. But I would suggest that maybe your controlling of emotions is blocking connectedness? Have you ever watched any Jordan Peterson videos? As a clinical psychologist he says that to deal with fear you don't suppress it or try to make it go away - instead you learn to feel the fear but go ahead and do what you need to do anyway, in spite of the fear. While staying open and receptive to emotion or feeling. Attempts to suppress or deny it are counter-productive. He recommends learning to face and deal with your fears - for instance if a person is afraid of spiders they should put their hand in a glass box with a lot of spiders and let them crawl on him. At first it's terrifying, but you just keep doing it, only needs to be for a few seconds at a time. But do it again and again, and you'll learn to deal with the fear rather than suppress it. When you suppress it it seals away some of your energy with it, energy that you need to live a good life. As you learn to face and deal with your Shadow elements, (your fears and things that you don't want to deal with) you release more and more of the locked-away energy. But if you suppress the fear, you keep locking away more and more little pieces of it.

      It's possible this is already what you're doing - in fact your approach might be similar to Stoicism, which teaches how to deal properly with emotions. In the end I suppose only you know the answer to that. I just wanted to make sure you understand the problems connected with suppressing, in case that's what you're doing. And I also wanted to say that shared dreaming might not be so much associated with being out of body literally, but with connection to other people, which requires an openness and comfort with anxiety or emotions.
      Last edited by Darkmatters; 02-01-2018 at 03:22 PM.
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      There is also language barrier I experience, I have problems to express myself clearly... I think. It is hard enough to explain those states of consciousness in mother language

      To explain my experiences better- I found, that if I'm in emotional balance- it isn't blockage of emotions, it is their dissolving, nullification, understanding... it is many things but not suppression... I found myself to be more sensitive to outside inputs but at the same time relaxed, unattached, analytical... It certainly functions in real life. I can feel into feelings of others, into situations and analyze them unattached... therefore adding as little of my own content as possible. Lucid dreams are very sensitive as I said. But in OBE to astral dimension it is much worse. Imagination can ruin whole experience and let it slip into lucid dream. I trained OBE for about 33 years now. I explored what was needed to stabilize them, to have them as clean as possible. And, there is something coming to my mind now -> One can't hear whispers in loud polyphonic orchestra, isn't it so? If I have to receive information from outside of my mind, then I want as low noise of receiver as possible.

      My way is to understand my fears and dissolve them. When I was about 6-8 years I feared darkness. It was oppressive and I didn't like that. But one day I said myself that enough is enough. I needed to get rid of illogical feelings. I wanted to be very logical at that times(and no there was no StarTrek available in my country so I didn't have any Spock idol ) What I did was, I went to places where I felt the largest fear with lamp. I extinguished light and waited in darkness. I felt into it. When I thought that something scary is going to get me, I lighted the lamp. Of course, no snakes, no ghosts, no skulls or skeletons(those things I feared most), nothing was there, so I extinguished the light again and waited... and I did this for some time on different places. The fear parted myself this way. Now, when I'm in lower astral it could be quite scary, but I'm there guarding my emotions by observation and dissolution, navigating through darkness through seemingly dangerous surrounding which I find only interesting if I find something new. It wasn't always this way. But I needed to solve problem and this was similar problem as in real life fears. Now fear is negative emotion, but I found that also positive ones could be a hindrance of understanding. So I did the similar thing as with fear with other emotions. Now, I know myself enough, I know my emotions and I learned how to have them quiet, in balance. The life is much more quiet his way. Things come and go. Nothing is there for forever. "While I'm standing still, I prefer the stillness here... "- that is why I like OBE... mainly to higher dimensions. The stillness, the quiet existence. Where mild feelings substitute thoughts... where applied will can be only very fine, so fine, that it can be compared to disinterests in real life and yet it causes large disturbances there.

      I'm not well versed in philosophy, so stoicism or I'm not sure what other thing you found in me is not what I followed. I followed only my observations and experiences. I tried to test things other people experienced... but I'm unable to use emotions well in OBE, since they destabilize the experience every time.

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