I don't desire any superiority, you can keep it for yourself.
That only confirm my statement, thank you!Quote:
BTW: If you understood what ego really was, then you would understand why I would be delighted if mine had the power of a supernove
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^^ You know, I think it's funny that over my years here the only people who accuse me of the things you did (based only on a "like," BTW; I barely posted on this thread) are always the ones who either just insulted someone else or attempted to establish themselves as our Better.
It's a shame that you can't comprehend terms like "ego," and the real energy encassed in them, but what can we do?
Take care, Michael, and I hope that one day you actually attain the wisdom and experience that might permit you to speak to others the way you currently do.
Now, all my apologies for abetting Michaels's rupture of this thread; maybe we can fix it by reposting MoonageDaydream?:
^^Pathetic:X
You know, I’m tempted to join whenever there’s a call to start one of these, but until I have a sleep environment that’s even half-decent and no other areas of life immediately demanding my attention, I feel like it would just be an exercise in frustration.
For what it’s worth, I’ve had both lucid and non-lucid dreams that I believed were shared at the time, some of them with other members of Dreamviews. I don’t post those in my journal, though – or if I do, I leave out the names. It would be incredible if they really were shared, but it also has the potential to be massively awkward when nobody was trying for it.
Maybe it comes from being a creative artist as well as a person interested in more esoteric areas of consciousness, but for me, a good deal of the appeal of shared dreaming is the idea of getting to know people with different ways of looking at things and getting to see in perhaps the most dramatic way possible just how their perspectives are different from mine. The differences are at least as interesting as the commonalities – and if this thread is any indication, there certainly seem to be a variety of differences in this group.
And so I’m not planning to join in – this time. But I do encourage those who are participating not to take their own perceptions too seriously – first and foremost, because you’re unlikely to be able to find any instances of shared dreaming without being able to identify your own cognitive and imaginative styles as they manifest in your dreams and appreciate those of other dreamers as they manifest in theirs. I say this as a Buddhist who spent last night’s dream getting briefed by the goddess Athena alongside a group of satyrs, albeit ones who were indistinguishable from regular guys. But in any case, it’s useful to be able to separate the style and substance – and taking your own perspectives with a grain of salt also goes a long way towards getting along with others.
^^ Thank you for posting something productive and positive. I also apologize to Psionik, I should have used more restraint and respect in my earlier post.
It's been exciting so far. I don't know how much I'm allowed to share, but last night was awesome. Another group member found me in his lucid dream, and what he reported just blew my mind. This coming after another group member's amazing report. Also, we're sharing each others' HI Audio (basically, what I've been describing in the trance state). All I can say is that it seems to me that there is overlap between our own subconscious material, and .. well.. the subconscious of other people. Can't wait to see what else happens.
MoonageDaydream i dont feel insulted by these arguments. I just find them a bit shallow. Because due to nature of these experiences it is hard to judge the reality of them. When I m out of body or during LD i dont do anything what would i find of questionable nature. The conscience is much stronger when out of body, than in this state of mind.
Also to judge ones experience is very easy. Here. When i think about my experiences i can judge them, but not there. When I'm over there it is a bit different me, given the changed consciousness. I can doubt reality of them here. But I can't doubt it there. Because there i feel more real and substantial than here.
It is completely unlike to LD. In LD i know sharply, that I am not in real but in imaginary environment.
No problem for me.
Still, I believe that shared OBE has better chance to exist than shared dream. I had a few experiences that could rate as weak evidences.
In one I have met my brother whom I taught how to do OBE. He confirmed meeting, still his version was a bit different from what I observed.
In second I have met with my soulmate(I didn't write that experience in DJ) which she didn't confirm, but the described environment we were in and which was known to her and unknown to me.
In third I have met with other girl-friend at college- she was in real world but I was with her in astral and described what she did in the real world. (I'm not sure whether this could be shared experience since it somehow expects both person to met over in astral)
There were also some premonitions I experienced months to years before they happened.
I consider all these experiences as weak proofs. For something solid I require repeatability.
Did you experience something similar? In LD or OBE?
That's what we're experiencing as well. When he sought me out lucidly, he described what was going on for me, basically my dream. He discovered what RC method I use as well, without knowing - although I failed to become lucid in his dream. Now, I didn't have that dream to my knowledge (although that night I didn't remember my dreams, as I was resetting my schedule, and had to get up early). Still, the information he brought was relevant to my life, and he could not have known. It blew my mind. He definitely tapped into something there.
I'm getting the impression that with all of this stuff (dreaming, HI, OBE, LD), it's not usually an exact shared experience. Although that has been known to happen, as you know. But, we are looking at some shared information being passed around. This may not seem like much to you or others, but to me, this is nothing short of amazing.
It amazes me too. I have tried many times to pull close people into astral(soulmate, wife, daughters, brother these people are closest to me. I didn't try that with my mother yet, but I would try to pull her to visit my few years dead father if possible- but I need to know if I can- I will know that intuitively when the time comes), and seemingly I was successful a few times. Only seemingly. You see, I have found that if I push enough energy into sleep zombie of person, then the person may become awake. But I don't heave positive proof of that in real world. Basically what happens is, when I fill the sleep zombie with energy it can wake up and stop to behave erratically. It is possible to communicate with that person then and it reacts and acts normally. But afterwards the person doesn't know anything. The meeting with brother might be successful because he too was out of body on his own power. He isn't that experienced though. His interest lies in area which (in my opinion) lays dangerously close to lucid dreaming. He uses imagination too much because he likes to do things... he likes action. My own experiences from past taught me that that way is not what leads higher... When I think about it now, it is maybe the cause why he isn't doing OBE much. There was time in past when I was thinking about why do I continue training. That it is lost energy. For naught. But I have found better way: There is no end goal. There is only the walk, the travel. I need to teach myself to travel further. To stay longer. That way is my goal. And thanks to it, the goal is there- unreachable and reachable at the same time. Damn... I'm again philosophising. This is what my wife finds very boring on me. I start to speak what my inner feeling whispers... and I don't know where to end.
I don't find your philosophizing boring, although I might not always agree with you. Keep in mind that your brother may not be seeking the same thing you are (to go 'higher'). And he may be on a different path than you.
That is interesting what you say about waking people up in ld/astral.
Yes his path may be different. Without reaching to spiritual path. He doesn't train(he said that) and travels only seldom.If I did the same I would say waste of potential. But maybe, I'm wasting the time when I could sleep. The life could be simpler.
In LD it doesn't feel to work. I mean, the sleeping zombies are much less frequent, the imagination isn't that checked... When the imagination is rampant, how can I have controlled experiment? I mean it is all imagination... I started to try LD only to try shared experiences. But it didn't satisfy my expectations. I try it from time to time still.
Another thing. I want to add that what you've been describing is very a self-focused kind of skill. Nothing wrong with that, it's a path of knowledge to be sure, but it's only one path. Another spiritual path, one I respect more, is living your life for compassion. To help others; to make a difference in their lives. And growing on that path may have absolutely nothing to do with astral projection. I don't know if this is the case with your brother, I just want to give you another perspective.
We should probably steer back to shared dreaming.
I don't know. When you are working your way it is not communal work. What you don't do yourself you don't reach. Is this selfocused? Like when you are learning in school? Would you say your children: look I learned the poem for you, you don't need to learn it anymore? Or I made your math homework you don't need to do it yourself! No! Nobody will lay your path for you. You need to work on it all alone in this case. If there is life after death then nothing we do physical will prepare us for that. Only inner spiritual growth.
I can't stop to think that you have somehow wrong impression. I do all this when everybody is sleeping. So it is my own time I spent. I normally go to sleep at midnight and I need to get up at 6. It is close to impossible to find time because I have to go to work, then to be with 4 children and my wife too needs my help. From those 6 hours of sleeping time I take 1-3 hours for training (deep relaxation and concentration is not exhausting for me, it relaxes body and mind too). Is this what you call selfocused existence? I call it life of parent.
I asked brother an hour ago when we were together about this- he stopped to work on this entirely. He had one spontaneous lucid dream this year and that is all. I don't call this spiritual path. Nor I would admonish him for abandoning the way. But if I did the same I wouldn't reach to the stars (so to say), all the years ago. I wouldn't be part of this forum since I would have nothing to share with you guys.
So I was finally able to get lucid last night, and visited 2 of my dream group members.
All I can say, upon sharing results with each other, is...
Oh my God. Oh my God. Oh my God!
So a week ago one of the members had a HI visual of me, and she described my appearance accurately. That was cool. Also tapped into some other things about me, things she could not have known.
Last night I went and visited her. I described the dream to her, including what she looked like. I've never seen a picture of her. My astonishment when today she told me what she looks like. Even the pink highlights I saw in my dream. Everything was a match. Amazing. And the dream content made sense with what was going on with her the day before.
This is so amazing. I can't wait, now, for us to both be lucid at the same time.
Just wanted to report that we had some major hits last night. I was able to get lucid, visited one of the dream sharing group members. She reported having a non lucid dream of me last night, with some overlapping details! :) Additionally, amazing hits on some of the other details in my lucid dream to her waking life. Stuff I had no idea about, details I thought were irrelevant... Then she goes and tells me stuff happening with her, and then the details make complete sense! I hadn't even shared those details with her yet, when she told me. There is definitely information being passed around in the dream state!
This is so much fun.
So last night 3 of us intended on meeting up lucidly. So, I failed at my WBTB (slept right through it), but one of the others did manage to get lucid. He visited me in the dream, and reported his dream upon waking. The other member failed to get lucid like me, but she had a non lucid dream with almost the exact same storyline (different setting) as him. I also had a non lucid dream featuring both of them, with different setting, similar conversations/plot.
I found that very interesting.
I'm curious, did you all go to sleep around the same time or different times? My only experience with shared dreaming is when someone I'm close to, who isn't a lucid dreamer, told me of a dream that matched a dream I had exactly. The only thing is I had experienced my dream at an earlier date and not told anyone about it. I wonder if time is a factor in shared dreaming and if it is possible to send messages to someone in the past or future this way.
Whatever the case, I look forward to seeing updates.
I'm glad you're enjoying the updates. I'm wasn't sure if this was something only I'm fascinated with, but I will keep updating :)
We all had the dreams last night, but we are in different time zones, so I think it happened within a few hours of each other. Not at the same time. Great question.