I voted no. |
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Yes!
No!
I don't know!
This poll is not bound to any religion and is absolutely anonymous, unless you want to say it loud and clear! I always wanted to make such a poll on pure lucid dreaming forum to see what pure lucid dreamers think about this matter. I see that we have around fifty active members, please vote with your heart. |
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I voted no. |
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I voted yes. |
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I voted "Yes!", but at my present level of understanding I still don't know exactly what a "soul" is. |
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Last edited by Voldmer; 11-30-2020 at 09:17 PM.
So ... is this the real universe, or is it just a preliminary study?
So, I will backtrack on my post. I researched a little bit more and soul-theorists don't think the Split Brain experiment is a problem for the soul. Just like I believe the universal soul can be co-conscious simultaneously in all conscious entities, soul theorists also believe the divinely assigned soul is dependent upon the brain and if the brain is split, the soul unit will simply be co-conscious simultaneously in both hemispheres, separate in each parallel awareness, yet, one. |
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Last edited by Occipitalred; 12-01-2020 at 02:45 AM.
For me, consciousness is the always-on* ability to perceive. Imagination creates the stuff which consciousness perceives. In my view, in the permanent absence of imagination, consciousness could perceive nothing apart from its own existence, and the existence of willpower. |
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So ... is this the real universe, or is it just a preliminary study?
What are your thoughts on the difference between awareness and consciousness if there is one? people can increase their level of awareness, for example by practicing mindfulness meditation. And likewise people can be unaware, for example someone making fun of a person when their back is turned, or an unexpected event because they lacked awareness. I think our consciousness is always present and perhaps always remains the same type or quality of consciousness amongst all humans it seems, just the level of awareness varies moment to moment. So if someone is unconscious, it's more a misuse of the word in that they are still conscious just un-aware or the awareness is focused on something else at the time (in sleeping it would be focused on deep sleep in a sort of rest/recovery mode or on the dream experience). The awareness is further increased if one becomes lucid whilst dreaming. Or, do you think they are completely interchange-able words and increasing awareness is exactly the same thing as increasing consciousness? |
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I guess this easily becomes a matter of labels, rather than a matter of deeper differences, but as far as I am concerned, awareness is the act of perceiving, whereas consciousness is someone engaged in the act of perceiving. In other words, consciousness is awareness + someone who is aware. Or, to put it into yet other words, awareness has no "I", whereas consciousness very much does have an "I". |
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So ... is this the real universe, or is it just a preliminary study?
First thing first, Thanks to everyone who participated in this poll and also thanks to ones who didn't. I somehow expected the end result, but there are some good twists, seven people besides me said Yes, which was unexpected in a good way, one is uncertain but he have time to change his opinion and it seems he is open to suggestions, one said No but from what I had read, he is on the path. Also the members who didn't vote even after I said the poll is fully anonymous are the real voter's of No. From around fifty active members, ten positive and forty negative is a result in the border of expectation for a Lucid Dreaming forum. After all a Lucid Dreaming forum is based around the idea of non-spirituality, aka everything we experience after we fall asleep is just a dream. Let's say for the ones who didn't vote, the hope will die last^^ |
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I will not discuss the split brain theory, because I think the brain doesn't contain the soul, so with scalpel you can't split the soul and is gross, it remainds of Dr. Mengele human experiments. If you want you can check this thread, it seems splitting the brain is an old theory. |
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Last edited by michael79; 12-04-2020 at 10:31 PM. Reason: spelling
Oh no. *Facepalm* you didn't just re-quote that infamous and contentious line which 50% agree with and 50% disagree ? |
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No, I didn't! |
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Last edited by michael79; 12-04-2020 at 10:32 PM. Reason: spelling
Oh, there's really no reason to assume the answer of those who didn't participate in any direction. It would be much more accurate to say 80% of those who replied to your poll claim a belief in a soul. Since there was no definition for a soul, there might be some discrepancy there. Also, we might wonder how representative those who voted are of the wider lucid dreaming community. 11 is a small number. But I really wouldn't conclude that 20% of Dreamviews believe in a soul from your poll! It's probably the majority, rather! |
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In my question I didn't define any absolute meaning to Soul, so if they really believe in soul, they should have voted and explain what soul is for them, but they didn't! |
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Great post. When I saw that, I thought the same thing. You can't conclude anything about the people that didn't vote. They may have not voted for many reasons. To do so would be a bias. |
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Though I agree with Occipitalred that dreaming is a virtual spiritual experience, and I believe that there is enormous potential for exploring spirituality in LD's, I think I also might understand Michael's point. I think it isn't so much that the online LD'ing community isn't agreeable to spirituality as much as it that almost all they want to discuss is technique -- they want to know how to get lucid, and give little thought (so far) to what to do with that lucidity once they attain it. And techniques by their nature are decidedly non-spiritual. "Beyond Dreaming" will always become a subtopic in that world. |
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Last edited by Sageous; 12-05-2020 at 05:55 PM.
Yes, agreed. |
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Last edited by Occipitalred; 12-05-2020 at 10:47 PM.
My bluff actually worked pretty well, even perfect, more people came, thanks. That actually exceeds my expectations, as I didn't predict that Sageous will come, he even voted Yes, that actually is pretty useful addition for driving this thread. I left the question without a definition, because I thought everyone will be happy, as I expected different opinions on the matter, did I get it wrong? |
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Last edited by michael79; 12-06-2020 at 04:44 AM.
This really has been a terrific thread. |
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"If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants."
I am more than I think am, I can become much more than that even
Lately I've been struggling with words, which has been one of the reasons I kept myself from saying anything in here, but it has been very interesting to read everyone's comments on this topic. |
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Last edited by DarkestDarkness; 12-06-2020 at 05:46 PM. Reason: grammar
Check out the Tasks of the Season - Autumn 2022
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Singled out from some of my favourite quotes from Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri: "Risks of [Planet] flowering: considerable. But rewards of godhood: who can measure? - Usurper Judaa'Maar: Courage: to question."
I like the fence as well sometimes, that grey area between the black and white where it is neutral and balance can be found. |
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Last edited by Eonnn; 12-07-2020 at 03:50 PM.
No I don't believe I have a soul, but I think you just worded it wrong. I believe I am soul/awareness that very temporarily has a physical body as a tool to function in a physical reality. And quite frankly, I'm not a fan of the physical, I never have been. I've always felt like an alien in a world I don't belong. But I know that at some point in my existence I'll be happy I went through the physical experience, and in the long run will have benefitted from it. |
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Last edited by Caradon; 12-09-2020 at 05:06 AM.
Yes, I do believe I have a soul. the soul is considered the incorporeal essence of a person and is said to be immortal and transcendent of material existence. |
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