has enyone ever tired that? did it work? what do u think?
I used to practise that but i had no discuss-worth results.
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has enyone ever tired that? did it work? what do u think?
I used to practise that but i had no discuss-worth results.
actually i have tried some telekinesis a while back. it took a while but after about maybe a week i was able 2 move a psi wheel fairly well.
So u actually did it. Can u tell me more about how did u practise and what did u do pls ?
well first i did a decent amount of meditation first 2 get in a relaxed state. then i got the psi wheel out (which was made of crappy materials lol i aint that rich) and placed my hands above it and used all of my will 2 try 2 move it. and after a while it started moving but u hav 2 stay concentrated
well.. i tried telekinesis also.. :)
it took about 15mins to move psi-wheel... and now i can move it quite fast for some time..
lucky it took me like a week 2 get it 2 go fast
its only psi-wheel...
i cant move even a pen..or a ball to roll..
i tried to snuff candle flame punching it from a distance..well i did it with the same energy i move psi-wheel... so it has something in common... i read few websites...and i have a "maybe" that its ki/chi/psi/ prana... energy.. maybe yes, maybe no..it doesnt really matter :) back to the theme..
im pretty good with chi cuz i do karate maybe i should try 2 use chi in psi stuff...
A few days ago i sat at the computer and out of nowhere a coke can beisde me almost tipped off where it was, nothing pushing it at all....i cannot explain it but i know what i saw and know nothing did anything to move it. It was moving like about to tip off, maybe it was me.:lol:
I quess my problem would be concentration... what do u think about when u try to focus, do u maybe repeat some words or imagining any picture ?
i can telekensis
meditation helps 2 increase concentration by a lot. try thatQuote:
Originally Posted by NoFear
can you? could u tell me what are your achievements? would be great :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark75
mr. coffee - whats your way to meditate ? there are many which one works the best for u ?
I think he meant something along the lines of "atheism because banana". A joke.Quote:
Originally Posted by NoFear
Shame on your, Mark, shame for joking about the ambitionless children trying to realise their fantasies for no real reason whilst distributing false wisdom amongst countless online societies of equally weak, non-goal-oriented individuals.
if you want to move psi-wheel, with the mind, then i have no suggestion ( psychokinesis )Quote:
Originally Posted by NoFear
then you can try to imagine, but im not sure how many months you must imagine to get it working. Believing, imagining, knowing that you rotate psi-wheel, or push some pencils.. im not sure..
if you want to move psi-wheel with some kind of energy ( name it anyway you want ) then you have to feel that energy, then you can use it ( push objects )
if you cant feel the energy, how can you use it..
Ok... thanks alot - Merlock... propose to close and now know what i can't talk about... ;/
Just doing my job, sir. =3Quote:
Originally Posted by Merlock
well i just sit in a nice quiet place and concentrate on completely clearing my mind and thinking of nothing. its really peaceful :)Quote:
Originally Posted by NoFear
:shock::shock::shock:
Wow you're all talking about psi wheels so naturally, I would have said it was impossible! But then again that's what I thought about OBEs and they turned out to be real... telekenisis just seems too amazing it's like, I haven't even dreamt of that. Do you recon anybody can do this?
well.. i said i can move psi-wheel easily.. it doesnt need for me to do meditation before it..or anything.. but, i guess you dont care :)
Good luck breaking the laws of physics.
Oh dont tell me that law is the only thing u see :P In the past people had their 'rights' too but there were still things beyond those, so do u think our society reached the highest level of knowegle ?
I quote from the Beyond Dreaming section description:
So, aye, while I'm pointing out the various flaws in the reasons and methods shown by the topic starter and various contributers, your comment, Photolysis, is out of place.Quote:
Here OBEs, dream precognition, sharing dreams, and other freaky paranormal things can be discussed. Note that this particular forum is ONLY for members who BELIEVE in the aforementioned topics.
Sorry; the philosophical discussion on the "soul" drew me in here, should have remembered that the rules are different in this subforum.
But honestly, if people seriously believe they can move objects with their minds, that's grounds for being diagnosed with a mental illness. Similarly with telepathy (which is what dream sharing would involve which is why it would be impossible).
Whilst I'm on the topic, I'm sure the OBE sensation is very real, but surely anyone on this site would realise, so are dreams and hallicunations!
Anyway, I've said my piece; as you were people of this forum.
In my opinion, which may be a bit stereotypical, there are things in the world we dont know about... i believe u cant argue about that. So, i think mr. coffee's signature talks for itself, it says: "If the world should blow itself up, the last audible voice would be that of an expert saying it can't be done."
Sorry but exports hold that the world can blow up.Quote:
Originally Posted by NoFear
Furthermore, improbability ought to not be your basis for fundamental endeavours.
Example 1; it is highly improbable and implausble that you will have a goat for a baby. From your logic, we would say that that means you could still have a goat for a baby.
Example 2; it is highy improbable and I do not know who you are. Thus, from your line of logic, I can conclude that you are my mother or, even better, I can use this to reinforce the idea of solipsism (ie. you do not even exist at all but are just the figment of my life).
Example 3; "There are many things we do not understand". My car is about to explode and my child is in it burning to death. Therefore, I ought to not be worried because there is a chance that my child might be impervious to fire.
Do you see where this logic is irrational?
What do you think...?
~
lets talk about telekinesis.. :)
I think u overreact...
I actually cant argue with you as i would like to because i cant speak english good enough, nevertheless i can say u missunderstood me. U say "From your logic, we would say that that means you could still have a goat for a baby." well, no - my logic doesnt say that EVERYTHING is possible and that we DONT KNOW ANYTHING. I just mentioned that there is still some unsolved stuff. Nowadays world seems not to have any mysteries to hide from the human science... is that for sure ? I didnt say that if u dont know anything about me i could be ur brother... but if u really want to go that way, ask people who found their family members after many years... oh, and dont u complain that is a senseless example. I just had to adjust it to yours.
whatever.. from big words..no truth can be said.. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by NoFear
I understand your frustration - sorry if I am being overwhelming or rude. I really do just want to have a nice discussion.Quote:
Originally Posted by NoFear
I think what I have a problem with is saying "there are many things we do not understand" implies that there are things that exist that we do not know about. It presumes that these things exist and that we ought to find evidence for them or believe in them. Whereas, I would say that I have yet to see real evidence for it, especially since it defies all physical logic.
However, it is very interesting to entertain the idea. Especially in dreams. On many occasions I have entertained telekinesis in dreams. However, my question is why do you want to be able to do telekinesis? Because you are lazy? Because of the power?
I think it is a residual effect of the male desire for power (how many females do you see wanting to be able to have supernatural powers? sure a few, but not nearly as many as male).
Its just that telekinesis is very implausible whereas something like telepathy may actually have a plausibility factor considering the advancement of technology.
What do you think...?
~
Well, here u finally introduced facts i must agree with. First of them is the men's desire for power - unquestionable. I also have a kinda answer for you. Dont u be mad, because a solution im about to introduce may be a bit controversial.
U said "It presumes that these things exist and that we ought to find evidence for them or believe in them. Whereas, I would say that I have yet to see real evidence for it, especially since it defies all physical logic." and that would be right. I know we all got used to the world we see and its hard to 'think outside the box', and im not trying to say i know more than any of us. I probably dont. But the point is U dont have to loor far to find 'things that exist and we ought to find evidence for them or believe in them'. I mean look at god. The situation is not clear... there are many religions, people believe in many thing, some of them even have evidences u wanted. But here u go - your example of a thing which doesnt really have to exist, though people believe, or find evidences if they want so.
dont be lazy ! any evidence can be denied as fake...Quote:
Originally Posted by O'nus
do it yourself.. lol :roll:
i dont neeed to believe i can walk.. i walk.
i dont need to believe that telekinesis is a nice ability, and it works.. i can do it
what should i say more? that i should drop the fact that i can easily move psi-wheel and go to search for some evidence? <- sounds weird right?
so go do yourself..then there is no need to discuss if its fake, if its unbelievable, no need to talk philosophies that its nature law breaking, or any other "useless" crap.
I encourage everyone who enjoys to tell its fake..do it on your own :)
I personally can't do TK, I didn't even try, but I intend to as soon
as I'm good enough in other skills that I think would make TK practice
easier.
But you guys ready to try it should start with these articles.
They have very good info on the subject, plus most of the articles have
lots of tips and techniques.
http://psipog.net/cat-psychokinesis.html
There is no evidence for God. If there were inarguable evidence for God, then it would be a fact that God exists rather than a belief.Quote:
Originally Posted by NoFear
Furthermore, if everyone in the world believed in a flying spaghetti monster in space, does that necessarily mean that there actually is a flying spaghetti monster in space? No. That is illogical.
You are right. This is the very definition of scientific fact; falsifiability. Unless something can be proven wrong by some case, it is an irrational thought.Quote:
Originally Posted by roguext22
You say telekinesis exists because of the "many things we do not understand" but then, what can I do to prove you wrong that telekinesis does not exist? Is there anything I can say to prove that telekinesis exists?
Furthermore, let us both assume that it actually does not exist; how can I disprove something if I cannot even work with it in the first place because it does not exist? Can you disprove that syzysyfg exists? No, because you have no idea what that is. But hey, I am willing to argue that it does exist just because you cannot prove that it does not.
If you can do it, then record it and show us; become famous. Or is there going to be some excuse or reason why you cannot?Quote:
i dont neeed to believe i can walk.. i walk.
i dont need to believe that telekinesis is a nice ability, and it works.. i can do it
Perhaps you will rest a pen on a small object so even the slightest gust of
wind can move it..?
If you can really move an object, record you and the object in the same frame and let us see movement. Then I will believe you. Otherwise, the laws of physics show that telekinesis is a fundamental impossibility simply by the laws of thermodynamics and the transference of kinetic energy.
I have tried it on my own and it simply does not work.Quote:
what should i say more? that i should drop the fact that i can easily move psi-wheel and go to search for some evidence? <- sounds weird right?
so go do yourself..then there is no need to discuss if its fake, if its unbelievable, no need to talk philosophies that its nature law breaking, or any other "useless" crap.
I encourage everyone who enjoys to tell its fake..do it on your own
Here is something that many people think is telekinesis but is not:
- Take a long piece of string (or a necklace) and hold it infront of you.
- Make sure there is a medallion or something you think is 'magical' or and 'embodiement channel for energy'
- Concentrate on the medallion
- It will eventually start to move
Unfortunately, this is the result of you holding the string that is attached to the medallion and you are truthfully always moving and causing residuall transference of energy to the medallion via the necklace/string.
~
this is your question....and you answer it yourself..Quote:
Originally Posted by O'nus
and then you also write so much useless things, that i dont even understand what you want to say, to prove..Quote:
Originally Posted by O'nus
Do it yourself.. you talk like a caveman.Even then you see a video, you say its a fake..dont forget, people see such things in real..and they dont believe..they say, i dont believe my eyes, this is a trick, a fake..
so no evidence can make them believe if they are so stuborn and blind..
only doing it by yourself you can be sure it works...
And such cavemans who denied ki..or telekinesis, or oobe, or telepathy or anything else... somehow they are very sure they are right...and those people who work on those things are very very wrong, big fakes.
Doesnt it look very very not smart then some teenager or some any other man who never was interested, and never did anything in such hobbie, thinks he is right, and that specialist, who was training himself in such things is denied so fastly..
I did not answer myself. I asked you what can you prove you wrong; you avoided my question.Quote:
Originally Posted by roguext22
The idea is to record it and show how other people can do it themselves.Quote:
Do it yourself.. you talk like a caveman.Even then you see a video, you say its a fake..dont forget, people see such things in real..and they dont believe..they say, i dont believe my eyes, this is a trick, a fake..
so no evidence can make them believe if they are so stuborn and blind..
only doing it by yourself you can be sure it works...
Would you say that you do not believe in chopping wood if I record how to do it and show you how? No, of course not - because I have shown you and recorded how to chop wood.
No one can tell anyone else how to do telekinesis, or demonstrate how, because, as far as I can tell, it is complete nonsense perpetuated by fantasial thinking.
If you can demonstrate or explain to me how I can do it myself to prove this wrong; I am more than willing to follow along.
Of course if I were to say you are wrong and stupd right away, I would be the rude one.Quote:
Doesnt it look very very not smart then some teenager or some any other man who never was interested, and never did anything in such hobbie, thinks he is right, and that specialist, who was training himself in such things is denied so fastly..
However, I am asking what can prove you wrong about telekinesis or how I can do it myself. Even better would simply be a demonstration on your part.
~
Ok, it not a big deal to assume, that the flying spaghetti monster can make ur wishes come true :) DOES IT MAKE IT A GOD ? Let me tell u I personally dont believe in god, anyway not the one that christians and priests have created(explanation does not belong to this thread). Anyway, one thing is for sure - we cant approve or deny existane of TK, for there are no evidences either for or contra which would be good enough. We are stucked between "I believe" and "I don't believe"... But take a look around ya - how would that world look like without it? One can say 'we are now fuckin powerfull... we can easily blow up our whole damn planet with a few red buttons'.. but - DOES IT MAKE US GODS?Quote:
Originally Posted by O'nus
O'nus, follow the link I posted above and there you should find a lot of techniques and tips on how to practice Telekinesis.
onus.. there are many videos in youtube.. You can choose to
1. believe its true, and give it a try
2. say maybe, and try it yourself, someday..
3. say no and ignore it.
telekinesis
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MJk5_ixnqIU
some ki http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J9adW_jzbhs
i hope you will get inspired
I'd just like to add that you guys are waisting your time arguing. Now wheres the link to learn this stuff?
thank you very much
(im extremly intersted in moving a psi wheel.. if you got any other link specificly to this.. please pm me.. ro post)
Uhm..?Quote:
But anyway, the "how" or "why" telekinesis works does not affect your practice in any way. I just think that it might help you to understand my method and therefore get a good basis to start with.
He says this but then the very next thing is...
This is just ignorant.Quote:
Let's start with the most simple. I don't think it's a big secret and probably every physics teacher will confirm that we all are made of the same stuff: atoms. And all atoms are made of energy. They only differ from each other in size. So basically everything around us and we ourselves are pure energy. You can imagine the whole universe as a lake of energy and yourself as a drop of water in it. But how can you distinguish where that drop starts and where it ends? You are right. You can't. Separation is just an illusion. The computer in front of you is a part of your own energy field as well as you are a part of its energy field. You don't end at your skin. And this leads us to the conclusion that you are one with all the things around you
You are not connected because we share the same substance. This is like saying youa re made of diamonds because you are mostly carbon and so are diamonds; it is just wrong.
Your energy is transferred with direct contact, not intangible contact. (Which is an oxymoron)
More hillarious, he then follows to say..
Oh okay, we are all one but now we are separated?Quote:
In many cases it's very useful to think about objects as separate things.
This is just completely wrong; he obviously knows nothign about a stochastic system as it does not function on intangible means because that is impossible. I doubt he even knows what the word stochastic is!Quote:
You can find a math book about the Chaos Theory. The Chaos Theory says that no matter how small the cause may be, it will affect the whole system, the whole universe. Imagine a butterfly flying somewhere over India. The theory says that even this small movement may and does influence in a very small way the weather in United States. No matter what you do and how small and unimportant your actual actions are, they do change the whole universe. No matter how small the mental process in your head might seem, it does alter, in one way or another, the paper on pin in front of you.
Since the premises was not only contradictory, but nonsense, I am not going to continue reading the steps that follow for an illogical premise.
roguext22:
The first video:
- It is simple, I have tried it without concentration or anything and I was able to put out my candle. No telekinetic intent at all. I just focused on pushing air forward and it worked. Perhaps if there was no movement at all it would be more impressive.
The second video:
- I believe in ki as it is a fundamental use of your bodies natural energy. I practice martial arts in the form of aikido. This is nothing fantasial or the sort here, it is simply the focus of the body.
~
here we can see... clearly.. you practice martial arts and say this video is nothing fantasial.. well i can say it is really very much impressive..Quote:
Originally Posted by O'nus
if i would be a bit dumber i would name it as fake..
well.. i move psi-wheel nicely.. :) others who never tried it can say its fake.. but really its energy that moves the wheel..nothing fantasial also :)
so.. i will be waiting for you guys to hear your sucess, what can you move using telekinesis.. :)
Why is it a waste?Quote:
Originally Posted by TripleX223
If you are asking me to stop questioning and inquiring, I will.
In contrast, consider this video on spoon bending:
http://www.skepticforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=64&t=8954
~
my opinion is that you look transgender :D
also it is weird, why you didnt said your own opinion first..
this video is sure best what can show its not fake..
Carôusoul - thats it, great video... of course one can still make up contrarguments, but thats is hard to beat. thaknz a lot!
I am surprised you have not encountered this phenomenon before. It is quite well known:Quote:
Originally Posted by roguext22
Link.
By the way, believing something is true before you try it is called 'bias' and will give you faulty results.
ABRA learns telekinesis through breeding with a male parent that has learned telekinesis and is in the "humanshape" egg group. Telekinesis lowers the accuracy of the opponent by one stage, and is easily outclassed by Double Team (raising evasiveness) because the opponent cannot erase double team's effects by switching out (telekinesis cancels out when your opponent switches pokemon).
Uri Geller, Carlos-whatshisname, it's all easily duplicable. I can move a psi-wheel easily through deep breathing meditation. I can bend spoons, but of course I must hold them to transfer the energy. I can punch a flame out through psychic powers, but please disregard the air that I'm displacing.
Here's the deal. Sure, we can all have these 'psychic powers.' But if you can move a psi wheel, and not a pen, who really gives a crap?
Quote:
Originally Posted by roguext22
learn english.
Amen to that. :|Quote:
Originally Posted by Abra
Look people, consciousness can already change the physical world in hugely dramatic ways. It does this by interacting with our neurons and sending impulses to the muscles in our limbs. It's a wonderful miracle that such an organ should come to be, but fantasizing like a bunch of egotistic adolescents about something which is not only impossible but hugely unimpressive by comparison anyway (gg you can spin bits of paper) simply shows a total ignorance of the true wonder of the universe.
((Im having trouble making a psi wheel... i make it.. and atach it to a needle.. which is in an eraser.. but the psi wheel wont spin when i flick it.. it goes down to the end of the needle...))
This had me honestly so I did some research.Quote:
Originally Posted by Carôusoul
Allegedly, this is the authors explanation:
The author also frequents this forum:Quote:
The second video used this same principle, but in a more sophisticated fashion. The surface of the table is hollow, with two separate air channels going to two different pin holes. Two tubes could "plug in" to each hole on the hollowed legs, which were hidden by thin layer of laminate that could pop on and off. This is why you can't see the bottoms of the two front legs on the video when the wheel is spinning. From there, a person off camera was blowing into a tube that was connected to this hole (under the table) which cause the wheel to spin.
http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com
He makes constant use of scientific and physics to create demonstrations as such (using things like infra-red lasers and conduction). He seems to like to taunt peopel on there as they are usually much easier than we think.
His name on that forum is Jjbreen
Very well done, but in conclusion, a ploy.
~
Shocking!Quote:
Originally Posted by O'nus
im pretty sure that wasnt a ploy. that was just the idea of some guy with waaaay 2 much free time that spent hours of his life trying 2 disprove a video 2 meet his selfish biased needs. i mean its not that hard 2 move a psi wheel but most peepol cant even come close 2 doing it. so those peepol try 2 make everyone else think it cant be done. it can be done, ive done it myself. if u dont believe in this stuff stop posting about it. thank you :)Quote:
Originally Posted by O'nus
If we didn't have any O'nus's in the world, we'd all be dead already. Just listen to what he says and try not to hurt yourself.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carôusoul
I don't believe anything they put on youtube for this subject.
Im havin an impression that not a long time and you will post explanation abut lasers, geo-physics, termal energy, aliens activity, floor heating or bananas hanging from a ceiling, whereas even TK would be easier to explain.... even with physics laws
... oook... where the hell can u see any tube ? oh... im sorry im sure he drilled his own floor and put it there, and then, when he put the table on the floor mirco-robots connect it with that tube... There is always a way to explain something, people would be fuckin sick if they wouldnt know how something works. Anyway thankz for the nice theory.Quote:
The second video used this same principle, but in a more sophisticated fashion. The surface of the table is hollow, with two separate air channels going to two different pin holes. Two tubes could "plug in" to each hole on the hollowed legs, which were hidden by thin layer of laminate that could pop on and off. This is why you can't see the bottoms of the two front legs on the video when the wheel is spinning. From there, a person off camera was blowing into a tube that was connected to this hole (under the table) which cause the wheel to spin.
And the last one thing if u really believe it please do it home that way and send me some clips.
I'm not one to critizize. I find TK impossible, and still beleive. I just want to add that the creator of the video with the glass gar, and magnets did admit to using a tube. He spoke about this on a youtube formum, and said it was a very good video, so he used it to try to convice people. I think the video is tremoundous, but if it's possible to learn the real thing, i for one would like to.
I see, sometimes even i find it impossible, but what would or lives look like without a small amount of uncertainty and curiosity...
Exactly :)
(I checked those sites and found no tutorial for a psi wheel movment.. or psi ball)
(im only interested in the wheel)? limk?
here's the article for the psiwheel: http://psipog.net/art-nis-tk-training-manual.html
I gave you the site and his name where he said it. He constantly states that it is him and his links follow through.Quote:
Originally Posted by mr.coffee
Because it is phyically impossible; and operates on circular reasoning.Quote:
i mean its not that hard 2 move a psi wheel but most peepol cant
even come close 2 doing it. so those peepol try 2 make everyone else think it cant be done.
I respect that; I will leave this be after this post unless others inquire to me further.Quote:
it can be done, ive done it myself. if u dont believe in this stuff stop posting about it. thank you
First, there are explanations about lasers, geo-physics, etc. Why did you mention those? This guy admitted to using difficult things in order to create an amazing display. I am not speculating; he admitted it!Quote:
Originally Posted by NoFear
Second, TK defies physics laws. Simply review the laws of thermodynamics and you will see for yourself, unless you want me to post them for you.
Before saying anything; he admitted to doing this! This is not speculation,Quote:
... oook... where the hell can u see any tube ? oh... im sorry im sure he drilled his own floor and put it there, and then, when he put the table on the floor mirco-robots connect it with that tube... There is always a way to explain something, people would be fuckin sick if they wouldnt know how something works. Anyway thankz for the nice theory.
And the last one thing if u really believe it please do it home that way and send me some clips.
he admitted it himself!
Otherwise, great use of the straw-man argument
Firstly, he did not say he drilled into the ground, please read it again.
Furthermore, he wanted to make it seem good, why the hell would he make the tube obvious? Notice why the 360 view is a bit contrived?
Micro-robots..? Now who's being desparate to formulate an argument?
You're completely ignoring the fact that it was from the author and that he admitted it was a ploy.
Why would I re-enact this? It was clever. First, telekinesis is impossible by contemporary standards. Second, I am not wasting my time to prove it is false to someone who obviously cannot be proven wrong.
You think that I am being stubborn, but me let me ask you guys this, what can prove you wrong? So far, nothing, which is just the samething I can say about this pink elephant I am seeing in my room.
There is a grand amount of uncertainty, simply review chaos theory. I do not think you give life enough credit and are desperately trying to invent new things. Take a venture out to a museum or read up on what physics can actually offer and you will see that life as truly amazing already.Quote:
Originally Posted by noFear
~
O'nus, with all your visible discussions in the Philosophy section, Extended Discussion and all such, I thought you'd be less narrow-minded than resorting to saying things like, "there is not something "more" out there".
Just because you don't know how to achieve something, and just because there are those that go about "discovering" said things instead of finding facts, learning from those that hold knowledge instead of speculation and doing things right, doesn't mean there is nothing "more".
Surely you'll agree with this quote?
LaBerge quoted that within "Exploring the World of Lucid Dreaming" and it goes for all things, not just lucid dreaming and related subjects. No need to be narrow-minded but no need to be naive and think that wishful thinking will bring about results of any kind either.Quote:
You must never believe in a credulous way anything that you are told. You must not disbelieve it either, for that would be foolish. The only method to adopt is to accept as a possibility the things that you are told, then to set about finding out the way to prove these things for yourself.
I really do not understand where this keeps coming from, but everytime I personally discuss with someone, they immediately change the accusation. Let me explain:Quote:
Originally Posted by Merlock
- I asked for methods on how to commit psychic abilities and telekinesis because, if it can be shown and demonstrated, I am more than willing to accept and believe it.
- I received a contradictory and hypocritical manual. It was full of oxymorons (ie. "we are all one but separate") which could not elaborate there subtext (ie. if we are all one but separate, what is our existance and how does tk work then?). Furthermore, the text is a lie (ie "we can direct energy into objects without touching them.... we do not need to explain why" *manual follows to try and explain why*).
- I admitted to being stumped by the video Carousoul posted, but the author admitted that it was fake.
I do believe there is more out there, but it always seems to be used in the context of reaching beyond its own context. Just like when someone says, "Well, it doesn't matter..." or "Well, you never know..." they do not explain or speculate anything, they just blatantly say that with no further elaboration or rationality - just an appeal to human curiousity which is, quitnessentially, the culprit of this naivity.
If someone can show how the laws of thermodynamics can allow for telekinesis, then I am interested. The idea is that it has to be falsifiable, right? That includes the laws of thermodynamics; so please, dear God, prove them wrong! I am willing to listen and read!
I have not tried to acheive anything yet. I did one experiment with the candle and I did it with the intent of not using any energy but manipulating air (ie. pushing my hand hard and stopping 2 feet away from my candle; it went out. But I did it with the intent of just moving air forward).Quote:
Just because you don't know how to achieve something, and just because there are those that go about "discovering" said things instead of finding facts, learning from those that hold knowledge instead of speculation and doing things right, doesn't mean there is nothing "more".
I think it may be possible, but not plausible. Do you see where I am coming from?
Precisely.Quote:
Surely you'll agree with this quote?
You must never believe in a credulous way anything that you are told. You must not disbelieve it either, for that would be foolish. The only method to adopt is to accept as a possibility the things that you are told, then to set about finding out the way to prove these things for yourself.
What I am saying is that many people involved in these experiments are completely bias and commiting to a self-fulfilling prophecy or confirmation bias.
Let me show how:
- Guy sits infront of candle
- Waves hands about
- Moves hand towards candle and blows it out
- MAGIC!
- I sit infront of candle
- Move hand forward to move air forward
- Candle goes out
- Not magic, just air, and no bias.
If there can be shown an experiment that is not subject to circular reasoning, then I really do honestly want to read it. Telekinesis would be cool! But I am not going to believe a liar just because I want to believe in it, would you?
Exactly!Quote:
LaBerge quoted that within "Exploring the World of Lucid Dreaming" and it goes for all things, not just lucid dreaming and related subjects. No need to be narrow-minded but no need to be naive and think that wishful thinking will bring about results of any kind either.
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Well, I wasn't accusing you of holding the topic in this thread as false. I was merely saying that you shouldn't make sweeping statements. Because "there is nothing "more" out there" is just that -- it's a wide deduction, not "Telekinesis doesn't exist because you are trying to move objects with wishful thinking while the world is constructive and requires processes to achieve anything".
But maybe I'm too attached to words and whatnot being a writer and such. Still, no accusations here, just saying that I generally avoid wide, all-encompassing deductions.
You are right. I realize the mistake in my rhetoric as I was holding these thoughts in mind and did not express them resulting in an incorrect phrase. I could see why that would anger you, sorry about that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Merlock
I do give room for something "more" out there. It is just that I hate it when people say, "there is something 'more' out there" but then that is all they offer as though the mere implication is proof enough to awe you. I like the idea of telekinesis and pyrokinesis, etc. but I think simply implying it or appealing to human curiousity is not enough.
It is like me saying, "Oh come on, try this drug.. you never know what will happen." Can you see the resemblance I am getting to..?
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Possibly you're all right :) Anyway, it was very interesting to argue about TK with u guys, who are lucid-dreamers and sometimes oobe believers, which things most of people usually find as bullshit. So, untill u want to say anything else, thanks alot for your time.
Ps. I haven't had any 'strong' ld so far, but i still believe :) and luckily u cant say it's not true :P
You're right; I have brought up the lucid dream controversy before and it has a very aporetic conclusion. Either way, I still enjoy it, whatever it may be.Quote:
Originally Posted by NoFear
I was originally just appealing to the argument for what telekinesis could exist (being the great many things we do not know, etc.). That was all, honestly. It digressed from there.
Anyways, back to telekinesis discussion!
I can tell you that I enjoy using telekinesis in my dreams! Have any of you ever seen the movie Dark City? I feel I have re-enacted some of the scenes numerous times to some great enjoyment to.
As for conscious life telekinesis, I have yet to really see it besides some pretty good magicians and some well done videos on the internet. (Questionable, of course, but fun to watch either way).
Edit:
I am glad you have experienced it.Quote:
Ps. I haven't had any 'strong' ld so far, but i still believe and luckily u cant say it's not true
And you're right; I can't prove it false or true, lol. Maybe you'd be interested in looking at the various lucid dreaming controversy threads? Unless, of course, you don't want a headache. :P
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lol :lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by Abra
I just got this - I love you, lol.
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Hahaha.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark75
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoFear
It would be boring as f***!!!! Of course i would love to know the answer to everything before i die, because who the hell knows what happens after but living life by things you know would be boring, always knowing the answer, rather then take a chance on what you don't know, and not know the answer or lies ahead. People call that ignorance but i call that wanting to believe in something that you have no idea exists, just your thought. Some people get by on just believing in something that may not be true, they wanna believe in it because they wanna believe it's true even if they die knowing it's not, it's how they lived their life not knowing the unknown, rather then knowing the known.
Here's an online psi experiment. Last time I posted this link, even the skeptics who tried it out were able obtain interesting results the majority of the time. And then it was convieniently forgotten about in the discussion.
http://www.fourmilab.ch/rpkp/experiments/bellcurve/
It's actually a retrokenisis experiment, trying to influence a set of random numbers which have already been predetermined.
You pick left or right and try to move the bar in that direction. There was talk last time that there might be something fishy about the program, that it might make it go in the direction you choose at the start. If anyone suspects that might be the case, then simply choose one direction, and try to make it go in the other direction.
I usually make it deep into the next screen the majority of the time.
It's certainally a misleading experiment, because getting as far up one extreme of a bell curve as I just did suggests such extreme improbability that it would virtually never happen. It went in the opposite direction that I 'wanted' it to go though.
Mine went the way i wanted it to go. I just wish i could turn a psi wheel. Or atleast make one. Every time i make on i attach it to a thumb tac, and it still touches the ground. Or i try to put it into a needle, and it touches the ground. How did u guys make your wheels?
if its 2 big just make it out of smaller paper. and i use a toothpick 2 balance it on because its a little bigger
I use standard small office note paper (like these coloured ones) and fold it, then put it on a kinda drawing pin with a plastic head (u know what i mean a coloured head u can grab). If it touches a desk u just make i flatter a bit.
Honestly, have you not read what's been said on the earlier pages?
You are deluding yourself. The relative difference between turning a precisely balanced piece of light paper on a pin and moving a pen, coin or other such small item of little weight is negligible. If you were moving the psi wheel with your wishful thinking, you would just as easily move a pen or a coin, an item lying on a flat surface without balance or rotation.
Once again, the relative difference between the psi wheel and small objects is negligible. As much as this is the section to discuss such topics, I'm sure it's not a section to discuss illusions. So perhaps you would rather discuss energy manipulation? The process behind "telekinesis".
The world is constructive. Anything and everything requires a process to be achieved. Wishful thinking is not a process, except perhaps one that alters fate -- a very rough and vague concept in itself that doesn't yield immediate physical results like that. (I'm alluding to the Law of Attraction and similar ideas.)
Or haven't u read 2 posts before mine ? I only answered the question ok ?
I was addressing the previous several posts, not just yours.
I'm just saying that this very thread is about a delusion.
Well, I dare saying even a delusion can be discussed
nahh.. merlock is right.. its just a paper...
we are all so lazy lazy..some of us are too lazy to spin psi-wheel...but it needs practise to move bigger objects.. and we are so lazy..
I have watched a psi wheel move while under a bowl. I did not try telekinesis or anything; I just left it under a bowl on my desk for an evening and eventually it started moving. It may have had something to do with my laundry machine, but it started moving.
Coincidentally, I had no intent of energy focus, ki, or anything. It just simply happened.
Maybe I short record this while it is spinning and say, "Look, I am not even looking at it. Now I am picking my nose - and yet it is still spinning."
The problem is sometimes these results are real but the human is adding a false conclusion. Try and work backwards;
- Think of what can prove your telekinesis wrong or false. Once you have figured that out, you have a very powerful step to also proving thermodynamics false (because all scientific fact is falsifiable).
- If you cannot think of a way to prove your method false, then you are using circular reasoning.
What do you think...?
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Really, if telekinesis is real, how come the only videos on youtube are of people staring at pieces of paper in a bowl? If that's the most impressive thing that anybody can do with telekinesis then who gives a shit anyway?
Exactly.Quote:
Originally Posted by Xei
This is why I keep saying I want to see a psi-tire experiment. Not some flimsy piece of paper.
Crank out the jedi-shite.
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This argument is going nowhere. You can't say that someone you have never met before in your life is deluding themselves.Quote:
Originally Posted by Merlock
A few weeks ago I ran across some really impressive videos on YouTube. I looked up the person who submitted it and found about five other videos of his, all of which demonstrated some amazing skill. Of course, anything can be faked. The only reason I'm not extremely skeptical of this guy's videos is because I've seen equally impressive things in real-time.Quote:
Originally Posted by O'nus
But anyways, here is the link to his profile: http://www.youtube.com/user/godspeed09
I can. Because if it wasn't a delusion, I wouldn't know of it and it wouldn't be discussed in public like this. Real power, real valuable knowledge, real wisdom...they are not spread publically and freely. People that hold such things are not bent on the concept of mass media.Quote:
Originally Posted by wer
It works in a simple manner: a person needs power to achieve a goal, that person finds knowledge of how to gain that power, that person trains and practises skills necessary, and finally attains the needed power, skill, etc. This is all done alone or within a secluded circle of likeminded people for aid in the endeavour. People don't share their power or wisdom publically because they have no need to.
Hence, the logical deduction: this is a delusion.
And the reason behind it: because it is public knowledge.
Ok in this very case we cant say it's real but there are other proofs i guess ^^
So by that logic, lucid dreaming is a delusion by the virtue of this site.Quote:
Originally Posted by Merlock
No, because lucid dreaming doesn't give you the power to utterly crush someone against their will, making any modern weaponry and technology useless in the face of magical intervention.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Cusp