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    Alyzarin

    Exploring Nature, and the Dream-like Qualities of THC

    by , 04-20-2012 at 04:43 PM (859 Views)
    Lately I've been thinking a lot about how activating or deactivating various receptors in the brain brings us closer to the dream state, and what that implies for using hallucinogens in respect to various dream phenomena like signs and guides, understanding the way dreams work on a more basic level, and beliefs like shared dreaming. To study this relationship and see if I can come to any conclusions, I've decided to use side note DJ entries to track any experiences I have which enter the hallucinogenic realm, no matter how small.

    Exploring Nature, and the Dream-like Qualities of THC [Trip Report]
    Cannabis
    Date: April 19th, 2012

    Dose:
    T+0:00: 1/2 bowl, smoked, Cannabis
    T~1:30: 1/2 joint, smoked, Cannabis

    After getting a few errands done for the day, K and I decided to go walking through a forest and smoke some weed since we hadn't done so in a long time. I went to pick him up and we smoked a small bowl before leaving his apartment, and then I drove us back to my house. I was already really high and could tell that the weed was pretty strong! My tolerance is not insanely high at this time either, but K's is and he was pretty stoned as well. We waited at my house for about half an hour and watched TV, then went walking around the park near here.

    We picked a small opening in the side of the forest next to a big clearing and smoked the first half of the joint there. It's a pretty nice spot, but we decided to go somewhere more secluded and deeper into the forest for the other half. On the walk to the next area I was starting to become fairly stimulated but also dissociated, and I was beginning to ramble about whatever was on my mind, though I can't remember what those things were now. We stopped half way down a dense path and finished the joint, and then we kept following it as far as it went. My thoughts were starting to feel very associative and I went on a long rant about the difference in perception and stereotypes of the old and modern drug cultures.

    When I finally ran out of thoughts I noticed that colors were becoming highly saturated. Everywhere I looked I was noticing patterns of leaves and things among the plant life, and my mind was connecting incorrect meaning to various shapes. For example, many trees suddenly looked like they were gigantic flames, and others that had long, slender leaves with pronged tips suddenly looked to me as if they were covered in snowflakes. What's interesting to me is that now, after my long break and my other drug experiences, I can come back to these weed experiences that normally die down a bit once tolerance sets in and look at them through enlightened eyes. This euphoric energy, analytical nature, color saturation, and psychedelic image association... it's all very reminiscent of my experiences with dopaminergic psychedelics. Is this the potential of THC's cannabinoid receptor-induced phenethylamine release? It certainly has the same feel as a phenethylamine psychedelic. In this case, the psychedelic effects would be coming mostly from the D2 receptor, which causes effects similar to NMDA receptor antagonists, among other things. This mechanism is the same that causes OBEs and is likely very important in dreams, and I wonder if that's where the associative thinking comes from - the same way that dreams are built off of our internal schemata and expectations, only whereas with dreams we have only the blackness behind our eyes to work with, instead here my schemata are applied to reality and my mind attempts to make sense (dream sense, anyway) of my surroundings.

    Anyway, we returned to the small forest opening by the clearing where we had smoked originally, only this time I noticed a path that lead out behind where we were originally sitting and was amazed at what I saw. There were three stone benches where we were, cut in sort of a way that looks like if you were to divide a circle up into four even sections and then remove one of them. Behind, and juts a bit to the right, of the now middle section, there was a path made in the ground that led down a tiny hill and into a densely covered forest area. However, in the center of this, where the path directly led, there was just a, not huge but not small, patch of grass with no trees, and so the area itself looked like it had a large opening where you could see the sky, surrounding by a ring of tree tops. The patch was also just a very slight hill, and surrounding it on the edges of the circle was a constant low level of water. All of this was a few feet below all of the ground around it, enough to where it'd be difficult to get back out of this ditch if that path weren't there. The very first thing I thought when I saw all of this was "Holy crap, we're at a boss area!" I turned to K and started explaining. The clearing was the world map we had passed through to reach this tiny opening in the forest, and this is where the final space before the cutscene was. K even pointed out that the three benches with the two spaces in between them made perfectly for a save point and an item shop. Then, following the path would take you down into the ditch, and then the path would be closed off by rocks caving it in, or the trees moving to block it, or whatever fits the plot. You'd then be stuck in this tiny arena to fight the boss in, and they'd be situated on the hill whereas the ring of water on the edge of the map would be where you'd find things like rings in a Sonic the Hedgehog game or pots in a Legend of Zelda game. The forest scenery was definitely fit enough to support this epic battle, as it all had a very intense feel to it, even compared to the rest of the forest we'd been in. After a while the illusion became too much, and we left because we were tripping out.

    On the walk back I mostly noticed more associative imagery. The trip dwindled a bit after that, and I was merely extremely stoned for the rest of the day. I was also feeling a bit sick by the end of it (as I had been for the past few days as well), so I knocked out after dropping K off and coming back home. All I can really say about this experience is that it was a fun reminder of what a psychedelic state of mind is like. It's nice being able to observe these mental processes from an outsider's view this time, and to be able to compare it to phenomena in the dream state. I will certainly be remembering this one for future reference.
    sinoblak and Wolfwood like this.

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    Updated 04-30-2012 at 02:29 AM by 50803

    Categories
    memorable , side notes

    Comments

    1. Wolfwood's Avatar
      Apparently Phenethylamine is rapidly broken down, unless a MAOI is present.....but also seems that THC and alcohol can either reduce its metabolization or increase sensitivity to its effects. Any idea?
      Alyzarin likes this.
    2. Alyzarin's Avatar
      Yeah, phenethylamine is rapidly metabolized preferably by MAO enzymes, and a little bit by SSAO. If you take it orally without a MAO inhibitor or something else that can alter its metabolism, it's going to be destroyed in your gut before it can have any effect. Another popular way in a growing subset of users is to supplement it with an aldehyde dehydrogenase inhibitor and good amounts of choline or L-lysine, and no MAO inhibitor. This was, the phenethylamine will be metabolized into an aldehyde by MAO, and since its metabolism won't go any further than that (due to the ALDHI) it will combine with free dimethylamine (formed from choline) or piperidine (formed from L-lysine) in the intestines. The dimethylamine form is part of its normal metabolism and will cause a pure euphoric feeling mainly through activating D2 and releasing dopamine and norepinephrine. The piperidine analogue is considerably longer lasting and a bit more psychedelic feeling. They both can last pretty long with this method, though. I haven't tried it yet personally, but it's been pretty well-investigated now.

      Lots of drugs release phenethylamine that's already in the brain though, and that can float around for a while depending on what caused its release. Phenethylamine causes basically all of the psychedelic effects of weed, at least with tolerance. (Without tolerance there is some dissociative stuff going on, too.) The reason alcohol doesn't get quite as psychedelic is likely for the same reason as L-theanine - the sedation blocks the stimulation. I can definitely feel the D2 activation in high doses of alcohol, though. I can recognize it pretty well. You can also feel it in high doses of stimulants and LSD, and regular doses of phenethylamine psychedelics and salvia, among other things. It's a pretty interesting subject.
      Wolfwood likes this.
    3. Wolfwood's Avatar
      Now you're forcing me to ask: do you have qualifications in biochemistry or anything? You've got mad theoretical knowledge of it.....and what's more, it extends heavily into experiential knowledge. You are the experimenter and the experiment in one.

      I have a rudimentary understanding of physiology from biological and clinical psychology...as far as classes of drugs affect one's physiology. But specific chemicals, or the pharmacology and metabolism of said chemicals, nu uh. You are very interesting.

      It's interesting you note that its psychedelic effects are similar to weed.......that may explain its correlation with incidences of schizophrenia too. With me, there was an instinctive, irresistible feeling of anxiety on weed, which I'm sure wasn't caused by alterations of perception n awareness, but actually accompanied these alterations in perception n awareness. I don't scare easily from knowing why I am in a particular state....the anxiety was just there. Does phenethylamine have this underlying 'mood changing' effect too?
      Alyzarin likes this.
    4. Alyzarin's Avatar
      Nah, it's all just from researching stuff in my free time. But thank you. I'm thinking about going down that path in college.

      There is an increasing amount of drug users attempting to figure all of this stuff out for the purpose of maximizing the potential of legal herbs and supplements. Using a similar method to phenethylamine, L-tryptophan has been successfully used to recreate the effects of DMT through metabolism. (Like, literally by being metabolized into DMT.) The more we know about pharmacology and metabolism the more we can tweak these drug experiences to be exactly the way we want them to be. It's a very exciting field of research.

      Phenethylamine does cause anxiety in high doses, as does I believe anything that activates D2. (Salvia is an excellent example.) However, it is possible (though difficult without practice) to dissociate yourself from the anxiety caused by D2 and just allow it to happen without worry, effectively eliminating it. That's how you get through the really intense trips without fear, you really have to treat D2 (dopaminergic) psychedelics just like the classical 5-HT2A (serotonergic) ones. But in addition, it wouldn't surprise me if you're getting anxiety from the low-tolerance dissociative effects as well. Until you smoke weed on a regular basis you're likely to get these dissociative effects, which are caused by a release of dynorphins. They're a type of endorphin, but they activate the kappa-opioid receptor rather than mu- or delta-opioid. They cause analgesia in low doses and dysphoria in high doses. If you became a frequent smoker those feelings of intense anxiety would likely disappear, but you'd probably still be tripping from the phenethylamine. Personally, I think you're pretty lucky. I mean, I do like being able to smoke weed all the time without being too fucked up, but I would really love to be able to trip that hard off of it. D2 is a very special receptor.