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    Thread: Nazrax' Workbook

    1. #26
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      Thanks for the pointer to the RRC (and to those classes in general). I often use the "where was I; what am I doing; where am I going" check, but I guess I don't think much about the "how am I affecting the world" part of it.

      One frustration (that's too strong a word, but I'm not sure what else to use) I've had is that, even after doing this on and off for 7 years now, I've never (as far as I know, not once) had RCs or dreamsign recognition show up in my dreams pre-lucidity. In many of my lucids, I've used various forms of RC to validate lucidity and/or stabilize, but I've never done an RC "just because" and been surprised by its outcome or recognized a dreamsign and said "Hey, that's a dreamsign!" I've tried RC alarms, sticky notes, marks on the back of my hand, and none of it has ever bled into my dreams.

      I've started going through Sivason's Dream Yoga class in the hopes that maybe it'll touch me deeply enough to pass through the wake/sleep barrier ... I'll also work on Sageus' RRC and trying for the "real self-reflection" he talks about.

      On a totally different topic, I was just noticing your signature and the link to the DV Podcast. I really enjoyed listening through the podcasts a while back, and I'm sad that they're dead. Have you run across any other such material from other sites that you've enjoyed?
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    2. #27
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      Let's talk more about RC's and dream signs when my mind is fresh in the morning. It can be done for sure. There may be other practices that fit you better perhaps.

      I wanted to respond to your last question since I did some reviews during the day of audio I have listened to. So besides listening to audio books and checking out youtube videos (including big names like Laberge) where I may primarily just listen, there are other podcasts. There are several interesting interviews found under "dreamspacedotmedia." There are also some good interviews on the Lucid Sage podcast (can listen on his website or via iTunes) including author Daniel Love who found a home here on DV. My signature also has a link to the audio section where Sensei and PercyLucid did a number audio classes. I may think of some more but there is a lot of material in what I mentioned. I think many of the podcasts here are worth a 2nd listen as well!

      Happy dreams!
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    3. #28
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      Quote Originally Posted by Nazrax View Post
      Thanks for the pointer to the RRC (and to those classes in general). I often use the "where was I; what am I doing; where am I going" check, but I guess I don't think much about the "how am I affecting the world" part of it.
      That never resonated with me, either, so I just ignore that part. What I do instead is feel very deeply in my being, and maybe say out loud, that "I....am HERE....NOW!". The point is you need to get that deep-in-your-guts feeling of the essence of yourself, being self-aware in the present moment. Be aware of your awareness!

      One frustration (that's too strong a word, but I'm not sure what else to use) I've had is that, even after doing this on and off for 7 years now, I've never (as far as I know, not once) had RCs or dreamsign recognition show up in my dreams pre-lucidity. In many of my lucids, I've used various forms of RC to validate lucidity and/or stabilize, but I've never done an RC "just because" and been surprised by its outcome or recognized a dreamsign and said "Hey, that's a dreamsign!" I've tried RC alarms, sticky notes, marks on the back of my hand, and none of it has ever bled into my dreams.
      That's because there are misconceptions about RCs. There is a popular camp that says "Do tons of RCs during the day, and you'll eventually start doing them by habit in your dreams and you'll get lucid." Except that it doesn't really seem to work that way. An RC does not create awareness, and RC can only be done *in response to* awareness (and or memory, and or a combination of awareness/reflection/memory, the boundary between these concepts is blurry at times!). An RC is just a tool: a tool to quickly help you to conclude if you are awake or dreaming. A better term for RC is "state test": you're testing your state: are you in the dream state or the waking state? It is a useful tool, to be sure, the dream state is characterized by an impaired access to memory and a sort of layer of fog on top of your awareness. Often times in a moment of budding lucidity, we're not sure what's going on or if we're awake or not, the RC [if practiced a lot in waking life in response to awareness] can be very helpful to flame the spark of lucidity into a full-blown lucid dream.

      So you have it right. First comes awareness, then comes (if you need it), the RC. So you've got it exactly right, no need for any frustration!

      I've started going through Sivason's Dream Yoga class in the hopes that maybe it'll touch me deeply enough to pass through the wake/sleep barrier ... I'll also work on Sageus' RRC and trying for the "real self-reflection" he talks about.
      There's a lot of great stuff in Sivason's class. There are some fabulous books on dream yoga that really get you thinking about awareness, mindfulness, and consciousness. "The Tibetan Yogas of Dream and Sleep" is the classic work on this topic, and recently Andrew Holecek published a book on dream yoga as well: "Dream Yoga: Illuminating Your Life Through Lucid Dreaming and the Tibetan Yogas of Sleep" I highly recommend both. They are certainly centered on the Tibetan Buddhist tradition in many ways, but you don't have to be a Buddhist to get a lot of amazing insight and practices to foster lucidity.
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      FryingMan's Unified Theory of Lucid Dreaming: Pay Attention, Reflect, Recall -- Both Day and Night[link]
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      "...develop stability in awareness and your dreams will change in extraordinary ways" -- TYoDaS

    4. #29
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      ^Exactly, thank you FM. So working on things like self awareness, dream sign awareness and doing RC's can help you be ready for those times (fairly frequent for me) when you have a short moment of lucidity. By being ready to do an RC, or by being very familiar with your dream signs, you can turn that spark of lucidity into a raging fire.

      Edit: I found a good post that describes some examples of the part of the RRC regarding "how am I affecting the world" that may give you an idea of how it may help self awareness:
      http://www.dreamviews.com/attaining-...ml#post2193957
      Last edited by fogelbise; 11-05-2016 at 12:25 AM. Reason: Add link
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    5. #30
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      I'll try to write up more tomorrow; today's the first day I've sat at my computer since Thursday, so it's been kind of crazy

      I did actually manage to have a very brief lucid Thursday night, so I'm keeping up the "streak" - my current plan is just to keep trying to build that awareness ... I wish there a nice formulaic "Do A, B, C and you'll become more aware," but that last link kind of dispels that idea ...

      I'm also focusing more on noting things that confuse or surprise me - I don't know if it's happening more in my dreams, or if I've just noticed it more, but I'm often confused inside the dreams themselves, and that's frequently what's gotten me lucid recently. Why is my boss doing this weird thing? Why aren't the lights working? How can the wave have stopped in mid-air? I'm actually starting to realize these things at the time, instead of hindsight, which is exciting.
      Last edited by Nazrax; 11-07-2016 at 10:44 PM.
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    6. #31
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      Quote Originally Posted by Nazrax View Post
      I'm also focusing more on noting things that confuse or surprise me - I don't know if it's happening more in my dreams, or if I've just noticed it more, but I'm often confused inside the dreams themselves, and that's frequently what's gotten me lucid recently. Why is my boss doing this weird thing? Why aren't the lights working? How can the wave have stopped in mid-air? I'm actually starting to realize these things at the time, instead of hindsight, which is exciting.
      Awesome! It feels really good to catch things like that. Congratulations on another LD!!
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    7. #32
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      But there is a simple set of steps to awareness! Pay attention, reflect, recall, again and again, over and over, aiming for all the time. It takes time to develop an always-on vigilance, so be patient, but practice it every chance you get.

      It's very good that you notice the feeling of your state of mind in dreams: focus on sensing that state of clarity vs confusion. My 2nd LD came from noticing one of those dream-like scenarios (I couldn't pick something up, cards kept falling through my fingers).

      In dream yoga the focus is building awareness in both the moment of experience, then followed by awareness in the moment of reaction to experience. But noticing things in hindsight works for LDs as well, I've had several LDa where I'm reflecting on something that just happened and realizing how weird it was. Weird? Odd? Dream! Work on establishing this train of thought.
      Last edited by FryingMan; 11-08-2016 at 08:56 AM.
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    8. #33
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      Last week, I took a break from night work - the competition was kind of crazy, and I don't want to burn out I'd been planning on diving back in this week, but insomnia's hit harder than it has for a long time. Ah, well, no rush.

      I'm still keeping up with daytime awareness work, and I actually did have a (very short, poor awareness/control) lucid a couple of days ago.
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    9. #34
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      And, another brief lucid last night! Things are going much better right now than they ever have before. Now I just need to keep it up and bring it all together, and have good sleep to make it matter ...
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    10. #35
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      Congrats!

      Yes keep up the great work, keep good records of what is working, and try to have fun while doing it!
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    11. #36
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      I'm continuing to have success with my awareness training / sleep yoga. I've got an app on my phone that buzzes occasionally, prompting me to do an RRC, and I try to do them throughout the day whenever I think about it - especially if something weird happens. I don't know how much "progress" I've made with sleep yoga, but I practice snippets of it throughout the day. Whatever the reason, I'm now having brief lucids late in my sleep cycle (seems to be around 5-6AM) a couple of times a week, which is pretty amazing (for me, anyway).

      Unfortunately, they're very low awareness (last night, I thought it was perfectly natural to interact with a DC of "my sister" even though I don't have one), tend to be low control, and are really short. I know it'll be a matter of time and practice - but I'm not sure what to practice (either day or night) to go from "This is a dream (but it may as well not be)" to "This is a dream (and it can be whatever I want it to be)."

      Also, my dream recall continues to be amazingly terrible, but I'm know it'll come back eventually.
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    12. #37
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      Quote Originally Posted by Nazrax View Post
      I know it'll be a matter of time and practice - but I'm not sure what to practice (either day or night) to go from "This is a dream (but it may as well not be)" to "This is a dream (and it can be whatever I want it to be)."
      Yes, time will help, but it is also very helpful to get into the right mindset through a "just got lucid ritual." You basically practice it during the day and during any WBTB's. It is quite easy to make it a fun practice. Look around you right now as you are reading this…imagine if you were dreaming right now - you'd be free to do whatever you want…to do so many different fun and exciting things. Really visualizing this should get you excited, at least a little bit. Now simulate that you are actually dreaming right now - you just realized it - and take a moment or two to slow down and really soak in all of the senses. Rubbing your hands is good for this. You can see, feel and hear your hands rubbing together. You can imagine the taste and smell of the smoke that could generate in a dream from the friction of your hands rubbing together…maybe you can even feel a flame growing. Next, say an affirmation or autosuggestion like "I have long lucid dreaming adventures!" (all of this is during your day practices, WBTB practices and also when you first become lucid). Now finally you think about your goals and then imagine setting off to complete them. If you do this enough, you can remember to do it when you become lucid.

      Congratulations on getting a couple of lucids per week! Very nice!
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      Got another one! It was short, but my awareness and control were both very good - I actually managed to make the sun rise! Unfortunately, I had a "poof" wakeup that I didn't have a chance to try to prevent, and it provided another opportunity to fail at DEILD. Do you have any tips for avoiding those?
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      Quote Originally Posted by Nazrax View Post
      Got another one! It was short, but my awareness and control were both very good - I actually managed to make the sun rise! Unfortunately, I had a "poof" wakeup that I didn't have a chance to try to prevent, and it provided another opportunity to fail at DEILD. Do you have any tips for avoiding those?
      Congratulations! Making the sunrise must have been awesome!

      So tips, yes…I would suggest to not name any negative occurrences. I'm concerned that doing so may make it more of a thing in your mind, something that you may come to expect. Naming positive things can be useful though. The most likely reasons for that situation are likely outside of your control, so I would just consider it something that may happen on rare occasions. Now dreams fading on you, where you have time to catch it: you may want to expect that you can bring the scene back, or if you prefer - expect that you are just transitioning to a new dream scene (with or without some time in an empty space - which I quite enjoy).
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      After going a week without another one, I decided it was time to step up my game. I'm still amazed at how well I did during the competition, so I've decided to start scoring myself every day using the competition's score sheet and see how I do on an ongoing basis. Last night, I got another lucid, and it was my best flight yet. Still no sensation of flying, but I know some of the dream yoga lessons deal with learning how to fake sensations, so I guess I need to start working on those ...
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      Congratulations! There is nothing like that yearning to get another lucid, to get us doing what we know we need to do in order to make it happen.

      If you remember to during the dream (or during any visualizations during the day) try to draw on real experiences that you've had, this can bring up those sensations in a dream. The feeling of the breeze against your body as you are flying would be similar to riding a bike fast, sticking you head or hand out of a moving car, or other similar experiences. I sometimes think of this specifically when I am driving (be careful though). The feeling of rising and diving in the air you may have experience on a roller coaster or during turbulence on an airplane or even taking off the runway.
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    17. #42
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      Got another one last night! I guess I've been slipping in my "daydream" practice - I didn't remember to do anything in it.

      I'll have to see if I can start building up a "library" of sensations to pull from - paying more attention in the real world so I can pull them out in my dreams.
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      Quote Originally Posted by Nazrax View Post
      Congratulations once again!

      I'll have to see if I can start building up a "library" of sensations to pull from - paying more attention in the real world so I can pull them out in my dreams.
      That's actually a great idea for several reasons off the top of my head: 1. awareness work 2. attention work 3. more thinking about dreams during the day 4. memory work (remembering to do this exercise)
      5. and of course you intention on increasing your sensations
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      Got another low level lucid last night., though I still managed to complete the task of the month (maybe - it's kind of on the line ...).

      I had to laugh after waking up - in the dream, I was looking around thinking "Wow, this looks just like reality!" when it's actually a complete fabrication. The thought probably arose from some of my recent awareness work - looking around and asking myself if everything is as I remember it being. Well, it looks like that doesn't actually help ...

      Do you have any advice for boosting awareness in a lucid?
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    20. #45
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      Quote Originally Posted by Nazrax View Post
      Do you have any advice for boosting awareness in a lucid?
      You can increase your odds of achieving high levels of awareness by putting as many pieces of the puzzle together as you can in the time leading up to your attempt. Pieces like day work with visualizations of a "just got lucid ritual," one of becoming lucid and taking a moment to remind yourself you are dreaming while rubbing your hands or the ground perhaps. Pieces like wbtb plus a technique like MILD including the above lucid ritual, or SSILD. And then there's self awareness (Sageous' style). When my self awareness feels strongest, my dreams and LDs typically are higher quality. Memory and reflection work are also important. You may not be able to have all of those items lined up every night and that's okay, perhaps your brain chemistry will give you the boost that you need that night. When most everything is in place, you will be rewarded!..sometimes you realize it only after the dream and sometimes you feel it as you are drifting off to sleep.

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      Sorry for the delay; when I'm on a long break, I don't tend to sit at my computer much ...

      Since you originally suggested the "just got lucid" ritual, I've been doing that, and it's helped me remember what I want to do. I guess the problem is that, even though I can look around and confidently say "This is all a dream, a creation of my own mind" it doesn't impact me at all. Even though I know perfectly well that it's not real, I still treat it as if it is.

      You say Sageous-style self awareness - are you talking about his RRCs or something else? Are you saying that increasing your daytime awareness "automatically" transfers into your dreams, or that you have an extra in-dream ritual you use to boost your awareness higher?

      I've continued having 2-3 lucids per week - and I've had two nights with two lucids A couple of nights ago, I actually managed to nail both a Basic and Advanced January TOTM - first time I've been able to get one ahead of time!
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      Yes, his RRCs. They're all pieces of the puzzle that increase your odds of boosted awareness in your LDs. My daytime awareness practice is constantly evolving as I find new personal ways to more quickly feel high levels of self awareness. I plan to try the quick self awareness daytime practice during an LD and expect it will boost awareness in the dream. The just got lucid ritual is the same in waking visualizations as in the dream state. And yes, I do mean that when your self awareness is really strong during the day, it has a good chance of affecting your dreams "automatically." I believe the more you achieve this heightened self awareness during the day the more automatically it will transfer to your dreams. I have noticed a correlation and I expect it to strengthen with consistent practice.

      For the situations where you still treat the dream as "real" you can try adding something to your just got lucid ritual like "I was just moments before lying in be falling (back) to sleep." If that doesn't have a strong enough effect, you can think lightly and briefly about your waking body being somewhere back there in bed. You just want to keep some attention on the dream while doing this. You can also test your memory for your full name, current address, or current date.

      Congratulations on the lucids and the 2 LD nights! And in the early TOTM success! I need to do that too so my wings don't get clipped.
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      I don't think I'm doing anything differently these days, but I haven't managed a lucid yet this year Ah well, I'm just going to keep working on awareness and trust that lucids will come back eventually ...
      [36] DILD [0] WILD [0] DEILD
      Goals:[*] Fly [ ] Swim and feel wet [ ] Throw a fireball
      My dream journal

    24. #49
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      FryingMan's Avatar
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      Well you managed wings at least! Yes, awareness, dream recall, reflection ("is this dreamlike?"), and intent. Working in the occasional WBTB can do wonders as well. Reading LD literature and meditating before bed are extremely effective also.
      Nazrax and fogelbise like this.
      FryingMan's Unified Theory of Lucid Dreaming: Pay Attention, Reflect, Recall -- Both Day and Night[link]
      FryingMan's Dream Recall Tips -- Awesome Links
      “No amount of security is worth the suffering of a mediocre life chained to a routine that has killed your dreams.”
      "...develop stability in awareness and your dreams will change in extraordinary ways" -- TYoDaS

    25. #50
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      Nazrax's Avatar
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      Last month was amazing - I probably had more lucids last month than I have in a typical year. It's just frustrating that I went from "I can't believe how well this is going" to "nothing" when nothing obvious changed.

      Along with my daytime practice - including some meditation; "daydreaming" what a dream is like, recognizing I'm dreaming, and practising what to do next; and awareness - I WBTB almost every night by means of a full glass of water before bed. I repeat my mantras, I think back over old LDs and recent NLDs, and I do RCs.

      I'm going to keep pushing. Last month's LDs were really encouraging, especially since I was finally able to get some good flights in, and that's helping me keep going now - but it's frustrating too
      [36] DILD [0] WILD [0] DEILD
      Goals:[*] Fly [ ] Swim and feel wet [ ] Throw a fireball
      My dream journal

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