Thread: The Dangers of Anti-Depressant Drugs. Big Pharma

I'm on Zoloft and Clonipin for General Anxiety Disorder. Meaning I get severe anxiety for no reason at all. First AD I took was Celexa, that made me really tired, switched to Zoloft which has had no mental effect except I don't need to take my clonipin nearly as much. So, I'm not taking them for depression, but I also can say that for me, there are no side effects other then helping with my anxiety.

Originally Posted by Darkmatters

Majestic, it sounds like you've never actually had clinical depression. It's nothing like just being really sad.

Trust me bro they are the same thing.

Originally Posted by Majestic

Trust me bro they are the same thing.

I tend to agree with that. In my experience, depression is just sadness that lasts so long that you stop recognizing it as such. Ultimately, the cure for depression is to identify the toxic aspects of your life, be it drugs, situations, or people, and eliminating them.

Sounds like both of you either suffered from mild depression or dysthymia, not major depressive disorder. Something similar to what you just said happens to be right on the wiki page for dysthymia, "[...] Most people with dysthymia can't tell for sure when they first became depressed." The major difference between the two is that dysthymia is a form of mild depression that lasts for years, where as clinical depression (major depressive disorder) is far more severe but more short lived. The dysthymia wiki article mentions anti-depressants used for treatment, but makes no mention of a theorized imbalance in dopamine, serotonin, or norepinephrine. The major depressive disorder page does, however.

If what you two were describing weren't enough evidence for me to speculate that neither of you has experienced clinical depression, the idea that its just a time in your life when you are very sad is a dead give-away. It goes far deeper than that. The one thing I thought both of you would have at least mentioned was hopelessness, if nothing else.

Maybe it was more particular to me when I was depressed, but the magnitude and depth with which the hopelessness ran is like nothing I've experienced, ever. There was never an escape from anything, there was nothing you could do to change it. I believed with my whole heart that I was stuck in whatever situations I was in at the time, for the rest of my life. I would never get better because I was a terrible person who didn't deserve shit. I thought everyone around me hated me, even if they said something or did something nice I would find some way, via mental gymnastics, to convince myself that they hated me. Why would they do something nice for me? They probably just want to use me, I mean that's the only reason anyone ever liked me for my whole life. Why would they ever like me for me? There's nothing to like.

What was worse was I developed anti-social tendencies that isolated me, making my situation worse thus bolstering the idea that I wasn't and never would be shit. Especially the idea that the only reason anyone ever liked me was because they wanted to use me for something. Kindness was such a foreign idea that it immediately caused me to wonder why they did it. "Because they could use me," was the only answer I could ever come up with because that was what I was worth. I was good at doing one or two things and other people wanted to benefit from it. I wasn't just "sad" about something that happened in my life. I had more intense hate for myself than I would ever consider hating other people, and nothing precipitated it at all (ex. driving a car, getting in a car wreck, and as a result your best friend is dead).

Originally Posted by snoop

Maybe it was more particular to me when I was depressed, but the magnitude and depth with which the hopelessness ran is like nothing I've experienced, ever. There was never an escape from anything, there was nothing you could do to change it. I believed with my whole heart that I was stuck in whatever situations I was in at the time, for the rest of my life. I would never get better because I was a terrible person who didn't deserve shit. I thought everyone around me hated me, even if they said something or did something nice I would find some way, via mental gymnastics, to convince myself that they hated me. Why would they do something nice for me? They probably just want to use me, I mean that's the only reason anyone ever liked me for my whole life. Why would they ever like me for me? There's nothing to like.

What was worse was I developed anti-social tendencies that isolated me, making my situation worse thus bolstering the idea that I wasn't and never would be shit. Especially the idea that the only reason anyone ever liked me was because they wanted to use me for something. Kindness was such a foreign idea that it immediately caused me to wonder why they did it. "Because they could use me," was the only answer I could ever come up with because that was what I was worth. I was good at doing one or two things and other people wanted to benefit from it. I wasn't just "sad" about something that happened in my life. I had more intense hate for myself than I would ever consider hating other people, and nothing precipitated it at all (ex. driving a car, getting in a car wreck, and as a result your best friend is dead).

Yeah I had all that. I got over it once I stopped the drugs.

Drugs can induce depression themselves if you aren't taking the right dosage. Or if you're talking about recreational drug usage, that can do that too. I hadn't ever used drugs during that time of my life, it was before I ever tried. Mind explaining what I do if I don't have drugs to stop using so I can get my life back together then? See, there's a pretty simple solution if it's drugs that are causing the depression, but if you've got nothing like that going on then it isn't as simple as "I've got to quit using man," and then you're all better.

Originally Posted by snoop

Drugs can induce depression themselves if you aren't taking the right dosage. Or if you're talking about recreational drug usage, that can do that too. I hadn't ever used drugs during that time of my life, it was before I ever tried. Mind explaining what I do if I don't have drugs to stop using so I can get my life back together then? See, there's a pretty simple solution if it's drugs that are causing the depression, but if you've got nothing like that going on then it isn't as simple as "I've got to quit using man," and then you're all better.

I have two things to say to that: First, most people are addicted to several drugs, but they don't know it because the addiction is socially accepted. Caffeine addiction. Alcohol addiction. Codeine addiction (Tylenol). Also, a lack of something as simple as regular exercise can have a huge effect on mood.

Second, I know from experience that depression can alter memories in subtle ways. The depressed person might believe that they've always felt this way, even when they haven't. Unless you keep an actual journal or something equally as concrete, you don't really know what your emotional state was a month before you first started the meds, versus a month after. Even the meds themselves can alter memory. This isn't SSRI-specific, but I can tell you that there was about a 4 month period when I was addicted to doctor-prescribed (prescribed dosage) benzos, and that entire 4 month period of my life was basically wiped from memory until about a year later when I finally got those memories back. Now, this is just an anecdote, but it demonstrates that drugs can alter your memory, especially something as ephemeral as remembered emotional states.

So bottom line: I don't believe you when you say you felt like shit when you weren't taking drugs.

Originally Posted by cmind

Haha, ok. Meanwhile, I'm living the good life drug-free and you're still suffering. I'm fine with that.

Interesting that you assert I'm still suffering. I've argued with people who are immature and ignorant long before I ever got depressed. Why are you so adamant and argumentative (like a rebellious 14 year old) on this thread if you're not suffering? I'm using the same logic for you.

Originally Posted by Majestic

You'll be alright Deery.

I don't mean to offend or attack anyone taking meds. I was just stating how their are other ways to treat depression without having to take medication from a doctor.

Uh huh. I noticed how you edited out that you can't believe people can be so emotionally and mentally weak because they continue to take meds. For the record, I used to be very anti-Big Pharma and tried quitting my medication at least twice. I even tried to ramp off slowly, but the results were not successful. I'm sure that meds don't work for everyone and that it doesn't have to be the only solution, but my mom is able to have and keep a job without undue anxiety, when she hasn't been able to have one in over 20 years, because of her medication. She's not even afraid of traveling and vacations anymore. Her life has clearly improved, and I don't think that calling her weak because she chose this method (the only method that's ever worked for her) is wise. She's been told things like that before, and she's had to fight against that. Still, I'm considering getting off my meds again, and this time I'd ramp off much more slowly and cautiously... I just don't appreciate being insulted. That's not how you win people over to your side, acting like you're smarter and better than everyone else, and they're already losers.

To answer your question, yea I've been depressed before...deeply, I was suicidal before, I've been in situations that would scare most people on this website. I know what people are depressed are going through. But it passes once you start paying more attention and being awake , rather than having to deal with side effects from medication that is worse than what it's supposed to be curing. It's not like this for everyone, but some people actually die from taking legal medication. This isn't fear mongering..this is just facts.

How many times have you seen television ads about someone dying from a legal medication and to call the number on the screen to sue the company.

Like I said depression ( no matter how deep ) is just an emotional state, and is usually a resistance to your current circumstances.

Fair enough.

Exactly, which goes back to me saying you can change your own brain chemistry..no need for a doctor to do it for you. If your depressed, exercise releases endorphins much like an Anti-Depressant pill, breathing exercises, meditation, playing a musical instruments, running. Sometimes It's just as simple as stop being lazy and awake.

Yep, lazy. More insults and superior posturing.

Originally Posted by cmind

I have two things to say to that: First, most people are addicted to several drugs, but they don't know it because the addiction is socially accepted. Caffeine addiction. Alcohol addiction. Codeine addiction (Tylenol). Also, a lack of something as simple as regular exercise can have a huge effect on mood.

Second, I know from experience that depression can alter memories in subtle ways. The depressed person might believe that they've always felt this way, even when they haven't. Unless you keep an actual journal or something equally as concrete, you don't really know what your emotional state was a month before you first started the meds, versus a month after. Even the meds themselves can alter memory. This isn't SSRI-specific, but I can tell you that there was about a 4 month period when I was addicted to doctor-prescribed (prescribed dosage) benzos, and that entire 4 month period of my life was basically wiped from memory until about a year later when I finally got those memories back. Now, this is just an anecdote, but it demonstrates that drugs can alter your memory, especially something as ephemeral as remembered emotional states.

Intelligence Quotient tests, Journals and Psychological analysis records of emotions and feelings before and after medications by a professional licensed Psychologist.

I have all of these things on record and I have absolutely no evidence that the anti-depressants that I was taking made me lose any part of my memory. There is evidence however that they have made a significant improvements to my life in terms of concentration, happiness and emotional stability.

By the way: Benzos? Why on earth would you agree to taking that? It seems like doctor is trying to kill you. That drug is seriously dangerous and the adverse effects are ridiculous like you mentioned: amnesia, memory loss, decrease in cognitive function, the list goes on.

Originally Posted by Majestic

That's the whole point I'm trying to make, anything that gives you withdrawals like that isn't good. That's like a doctor prescribing your crack or heroin.

Yea your high is good, but what happens when you miss a dose? If a crack addict suddenly stops smoking, he's going to have some serious problems. Just doesn't seem good to be doped up like that constantly. But it's all good to get high as long as the drug is legal...but people look down upon dope junkies and potheads

I mean Jesus, brain zaps?..from something a doctor gives you. That sounds so painful and excruciating....

This is the thing. But instead of calling it addictive, they say it is a dependency.

I got those brain zaps too. I've talked about this quite a bit on here when the topic comes up.

They're bloody horrible drugs with common side effects. They actually have been proven to not help depression or anxiety or anything at all. Except there is some indication that it may help for SEVERELY depressed people, as in they can't get out of bed or do anything at all. And even then it only helps a bit.


On the other hand, there are drugs like Ketamine which can cure everything that SSRI's are supposed to, instantly. And you only have to take one dose every couple of months at the most.

But why would they prescribe that? Big Pharma can't make much money off one pill, once a month doses.

I just wish Alex Jones didn't say this about anti-depressants. Because it's actually true but now it looks like bullshit crazy talk.

EDIT:

Wopps, I see there is a couple more pages I missed. And I see some others have already mentioned Ketamine.

Originally Posted by Darkmatters

Hey, I'm very curious about this - I've heard anti-depressants described as disassociatives (is that right?) - in spite of their obvious terrible effects, do they cause a similar disassociation from reality as psychoactive drugs, meaning could there be some benefit in terms of ego-death from using them?

You may have heard this from me. It wasn't that they were like a dissociative. But they did make me dissociated.
I assume it is completely different to psychedelics or dissociative drugs like DXM or Ketamine.
I just felt like I was in a dream. That is really the best way to describe it. And it wasn't an immediate effect of the drug.
It just happened occasionally. And many others have reported this. Depersonalisation/Derealisation Disorder is the name for it.

So I wouldn't call them dissociatives. It's probably a side-effect which not everyone gets. I also did not get any long term benefit from
the ego-death feeling, like one would with psychedelics for example. Like I can't recreate that feeling and learned nothing from it except that it felt good and made me very calm lol

I don't think it's the way to live your entire life though. But it would be good for a little while, like if there was a drug that could do that for a few hours.

Thanks for stepping out of the shadows and speaking Tommo!! I gotta google what a dissociative is now.

Originally Posted by cmind

I have two things to say to that: First, most people are addicted to several drugs, but they don't know it because the addiction is socially accepted. Caffeine addiction. Alcohol addiction. Codeine addiction (Tylenol). Also, a lack of something as simple as regular exercise can have a huge effect on mood.

Second, I know from experience that depression can alter memories in subtle ways. The depressed person might believe that they've always felt this way, even when they haven't. Unless you keep an actual journal or something equally as concrete, you don't really know what your emotional state was a month before you first started the meds, versus a month after. Even the meds themselves can alter memory. This isn't SSRI-specific, but I can tell you that there was about a 4 month period when I was addicted to doctor-prescribed (prescribed dosage) benzos, and that entire 4 month period of my life was basically wiped from memory until about a year later when I finally got those memories back. Now, this is just an anecdote, but it demonstrates that drugs can alter your memory, especially something as ephemeral as remembered emotional states.

So bottom line: I don't believe you when you say you felt like shit when you weren't taking drugs.

The statement "drugs can alter your memory" is terribly broad. Yes, I'd have to agree with this statement, who wouldn't? Of course some drugs can alter your memory or cause amnesia. Funny, a group of drugs known as benzodiazepines are notorious for such a thing. I'm just going to say right now that, if all you were on were benzos, then it is not fair for you to make a judgment on anti-depressants. That's like comparing apples to oranges. Yes they're both fruit, but they aren't the same thing. It isn't hard to make a comparison when being purposefully broad. Chemicals are chemicals man, chemicals can kill you! Better not breathe, eat, or continue to live or the chemicals will do it for you.

From wiki, "Benzodiazepines enhance the effect of the neurotransmitter gamma-aminobutyric acid (GABA), which results in sedative, hypnotic (sleep-inducing), anxiolytic (anti-anxiety), anticonvulsant, muscle relaxant and amnesic action." From wiki on anti-depressants, " Drugs including the monoamine oxidase inhibitors (MAOIs), tricyclic antidepressants (TCAs), tetracyclic antidepressants (TeCAs), selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors (SSRIs), and serotonin-norepinephrine reuptake inhibitors (SNRIs) are most commonly associated with the term."

These drugs have entirely different modes of action. What makes you think they're all the same? Benzodiazepines work with GABA neurotransmitters, like alcohol. Anti-depressants mainly deal with serotonin, dopamine, and norepinepherine. Some anti-depressants, like Wellbutrin or Stratterra, are used to treat ADHD because it reduces impulsiveness, improves concentration and memory, and stabilizes emotions (ADHD and depression are correlated, to a degree). So tell me, how is a drug that improves concentration going to alter my memory or cause me to lose my memory altogether? One last quote from wiki on the antidepressant page, "Other medications that are not usually called antidepressants, including antipsychotics in low doses[3] and benzodiazepines,[4] may be used to manage depression, although benzodiazepines cause a physical dependence to form. Stopping benzodiazepine treatment abruptly can cause unpleasant withdrawal symptoms." It specifically mentioned benzos as having negative effects and causing physical dependence, but none others because everything right now is speculative. Benzos are known to have terrible effects. Look man, I'm sorry your doctor gave you benzos to treat depression, but you can't act as if benzodiazepines are the type of drug that you talk about when casually using the term "anti-depressant drug." You're making a purely speculative statement that, if action were taken on its behalf, would ruin the quality of life for many and destroy the opportunity for others.

Also, thanks, I appreciate that you know everything about me and my life and that I most likely didn't feel like shit at all. Just so you know, I have never been prescribed anti-depressants to treat depression. I started taking Wellbutrin XL a year and a half after overcoming depression as a medication to take in conjunction with (at the time) Vyvanse to treat ADD. My memory was never altered by a drug while depressed, maybe just by depression. Considering that "drugs can alter your memories", I don't think I believe you when you say you felt like shit on them or even before you started taking them. I mean, you were actually on a drug known for causing anterograde amnesia. Why, if you don't believe me (let's still assume that I was being treated for depression with Wellbutrin, as you seemed to have wrongfully believed was the case) because I was taking a drug that improves concentration, should anyone believe you and your anecdote when you couldn't even remember what happened the entire time you were on them?

Originally Posted by snoop

It specifically mentioned benzos as having negative effects and causing physical dependence, but none others because everything right now is speculative.

LOLWUT?

General side effects are mostly present during the first 1–4 weeks while the body adapts to the drug (with the exception of sexual side effects, which tend to occur later in treatment). In fact, it often takes 6–8 weeks for the drug to begin reaching its full potential (the slow onset is considered a downside to treatment with SSRIs). Almost all SSRIs are known to cause one or more of these symptoms:

• anhedonia
• apathy
• nausea/vomiting
• drowsiness or somnolence
• headache
• bruxism
• tinnitus
• extremely vivid or strange dreams (not bad if you know about it, obviously)
  
• dizziness
• fatigue
• mydriasis (pupil dilation)
• urinary retention
• changes in appetite
• insomnia and/or changes in sleep
• weight loss/gain (measured by a change in body weight of 7 pounds)
• increased risk of bone fractures and injuries
• changes in sexual behaviour (see the next section)
• increased feelings of depression and anxiety (which may sometimes provoke panic attacks)
• tremors (and other symptoms of Parkinsonism in vulnerable elderly patients)[18]
• autonomic dysfunction including orthostatic hypotension, increased or reduced sweating
• akathisia
• renal impairment
• suicidal ideation (thoughts of suicide)
• photosensitivity[19]
• Paresthesia
• Syndrome of inappropriate antidiuretic hormone hypersecretion

Mania or hypomania is a possible side effect. Users with some type of bipolar disorder are at a much higher risk, however SSRI-induced mania in patients previously diagnosed with unipolar depression can trigger a bipolar diagnosis.

Benzos

The most common side-effects of benzodiazepines are related to their sedating and muscle-relaxing action. - Which I wouldn't call a side-effect, since that's basically what you want lol

They include drowsiness
dizziness
decreased alertness and concentration.

Lack of coordination may result in falls and injuries, in particular, in the elderly.

Another result is impairment of driving skills and increased likelihood of road traffic accidents. - This is just personal opinion (although a logical one) but I don't agree with this.
If someone has anxiety, they're going to be a much worse driver than when they are calm.
As long as the dose isn't too high, and is just enough to take the anxiety away, I think they would be a better driver. The studies on driving ability do not use people who have anxiety.

Decreased libido and erection problems are a common side effect. - Same again, anxiety causes decreased libido and therefore erection problems. Having no anxiety should help.

Depression and disinhibition.
Hypotension and suppressed breathing may be encountered with intravenous use.
Less common side effects include nausea and changes in appetite, blurred vision, confusion, euphoria (not a bad thing, obviously), depersonalization and nightmares. Cases of liver toxicity have been described but are very rare.

Even with the non-bad side-effects and the ones I don't agree with, even if we include them, SSRI's are still clearly more dangerous by far and the side-effects are more common.

I never said they weren't dangerous, I was merely pointing out to cmind that they aren't the same drugs and the effects that he dealt with specifically are well known of benzodiazepines. For instance, I've heard many people refer to klonopin as "forget-a-lot-a-pin." He was claiming that all anti-depressants (or at least that's what he made it sound like) cause memory loss/distortion based off of his experience with benzos. They aren't the same thing. One important thing you left out is withdrawal effects. Benzos have terrible withdraw effects. If you simply abuse enough of it in a night you can be incredibly sick for the next 2 days (personal experience). Obviously anyone using these drugs for therapeutic value wouldn't abuse them like that, but after having it built up in your system for weeks, months, or even years I can only imagine what you would go through.

This is all I could find on SSRI or really any anti-depressant withdrawal:
Antidepressant withdrawal symptoms:
Anxiety, agitation
Depression, mood swings
Flu-like symptoms
Irritability and aggression
Insomnia, nightmares
Nausea and vomiting
Dizziness, loss of coordination
Stomach cramping and pain
Electric shock sensations (brain zap)
Tremor, muscle spasms

Wellbutrin specifically I can attest to taking 300mg (I will admit that this was terrible, the reason why I switched back to 150mg, made life hell) and then just stopping altogether after 3 months. I had no withdrawal symptoms for about a week, and with most people suddenly stopping a Wellbutrin regimen they feel out of energy and lethargic (other withdrawal effects have been reported but aren't near as common), but I guess since I've got ADD or for whatever reason, I was bouncing off the walls. A lot of people at school commented that it looked like I had a lot of pent-up energy. After another day of that but less intense, I was completely back to normal.

What I found on benzodiazepine withrawal:
Benzodiazepine withdrawal is similar to alcohol withdrawal syndrome and barbiturate withdrawal syndrome[1] and can in severe cases provoke life threatening withdrawal symptoms such as seizures.[2] Severe and life threatening symptoms are mostly limited to abrupt or over-rapid dosage reduction from high doses.[3] A protracted withdrawal syndrome may develop in a proportion of individuals with symptoms such as anxiety, irritability, insomnia and sensory disturbances. In a small number of people it can be severe and resemble serious psychiatric and medical conditions such as schizophrenia and seizure disorders.[4] A serious side effect of benzodiazepine withdrawal is suicide.[5]

The following symptoms may emerge during gradual dosage reduction [of Benzodiazpeines] but can usually be reduced in intensity or eliminated altogether by reducing the rate of reduction:
Anxiety, possible terror and panic attacks[17][36]
Agitation and restlessness[17]
Hypochondriasis[17]
Dilated pupils[4]
Impaired concentration[36]
Nightmares[37]
Insomnia[37]
Muscular spasms, cramps or fasciculations[38]
Electric shock sensations[3][39]
Blurred vision[17]
Dizziness[17]
Dry mouth[17]
Aches and pains[17]
Hearing impairment[17]
Taste and smell disturbances[17]
Chest pain[17]
Flu like symptoms[17]
Impaired memory and concentration[17]
Increased sensitivity to touch[40]
Increased sensitivity to sound[17]
Sounds louder than usual[40]
Objects moving[40]
Increased urinary frequency[17]
Numbness and tingling[17]
Hot and cold flushes[17]
Headache[36]
Rebound REM sleep[41]
Stiffness[17]
Fatigue and weakness[17]
Hyperosmia[42]
Restless legs syndrome[11]
Metallic taste[42]
Photophobia[42]
Paranoia[42]
Hypnagogia-hallucinations[6]
Nausea and vomiting[37]
Elevation in blood pressure[43]
Tachycardia[44]
Hypertension[45]
Postural hypotension[37]
Depression (can be severe),[46] possible suicidal ideation
Tremor[47][48]
Perspiration[36]
Loss of appetite and weight loss[49]
Dysphoria[50][51]
Depersonalization[52][53]
Derealisation (Feelings of unreality)[40]
Obsessive compulsive disorder[54][55]
Tinnitus[56]
Paraesthesia[40][42][53]
Visual disturbances[53]
Mood swings[17]
Indecision[17]
Gastrointestinal problems (Irritable bowel syndrome)[57][58][59]

An abrupt or over-rapid discontinuation of benzodiazepines may result in a more serious and very unpleasant withdrawal syndrome that may additionally result in:
Convulsions, which may result in death[60][61]
Catatonia, which may result in death[62][63][64]
Coma[65] (rare)
Suicide[5][66][67]
Attempted suicide[53]
Suicidal ideation[68]
Self harm[53]
Hyperthermia[37]
Delusions[69]
Homicide ideations[70]
Urges to shout, throw, break things or to harm someone[17]
Violence[71]
Post Traumatic Stress Disorder[11]
Organic brain syndrome[72]
Psychosis[73][74]
Confusion[35]
Mania[75][76]
Neuroleptic malignant syndrome like event[77][78] (rare)
Delirium tremens[79][80][81

Yeah, totally sounds like benzodizepines are the safer drug to take to me!

I guess this was lost on snoop, but my benzo experience was merely an example to prove the point. In fact, SSRIs have caused memory distortions, not amnesia, but certainly massive distortions in the emotions attached to memories. This is something that you will experience soon enough.

Also, you are only talking about abusing them snoop.
Barely any of those you listed occur if you take benzo's correctly.
And if you withdraw slowly, very slowly, you will not experience many of the side-effects, if any.

You can't list withdrawal side effects as showing the drug to be harmful, if the withdrawal side effects are only from abrupt titration of dosages.

tommo, for the record, I think that both SSRIs and benzos are extremely bad drugs to be taking.

Originally Posted by tommo

LOLWUT?

General side effects are mostly present during the first 1–4 weeks while the body adapts to the drug (with the exception of sexual side effects, which tend to occur later in treatment). In fact, it often takes 6–8 weeks for the drug to begin reaching its full potential (the slow onset is considered a downside to treatment with SSRIs). Almost all SSRIs are known to cause one or more of these symptoms:

• anhedonia
• apathy
• nausea/vomiting
• drowsiness or somnolence
• headache
• bruxism
• tinnitus
• extremely vivid or strange dreams
• dizziness
• fatigue
• mydriasis (pupil dilation)
• urinary retention
• changes in appetite
• insomnia and/or changes in sleep
• weight loss/gain (measured by a change in body weight of 7 pounds)
• increased risk of bone fractures and injuries
• changes in sexual behaviour (see the next section)
• tremors (and other symptoms of Parkinsonism in vulnerable elderly patients)[18]
• autonomic dysfunction including orthostatic hypotension, increased or reduced sweating
• akathisia
• renal impairment
• suicidal ideation (thoughts of suicide)
• photosensitivity[19]
• Paresthesia
• Syndrome of inappropriate antidiuretic hormone hypersecretion

Mania or hypomania is a possible side effect. Users with some type of bipolar disorder are at a much higher risk, however SSRI-induced mania in patients previously diagnosed with unipolar depression can trigger a bipolar diagnosis.

Best side effect ever.

Sorry couldn't help myself.

Originally Posted by cmind

tommo, for the record, I think that both SSRIs and benzos are extremely bad drugs to be taking.

I gathered that.

I think benzos really are okay as long as you don't abuse them. Many people seem to.
I took them for a year or 2 every day and never went over a 1mg dose.

Some people I know who took them recreationally took 12mg a night or more.

I was baffled as to how someone could do that and not think they would fuck themselves over. They obviously had absolutely no idea of the threshold dose. And obviously ended up not remembering a single thing from the night.

I have a friend on benzos, he says they send him into incredible mood swings where he feels suicidal dread if he misses a dose. Does not sound fun.

Ideation of strange thoughts such as suicide are more common than you think with patients trying to get off anti-depressants. However, an interesting thing happens where people become more likely in general to act out impulses they normally would have nothing to do with. For instance one guy who stopped taking his meds kidnapped and sexually assaulted a 3 year old girl before killing her and eating her body. He was probably already fucked up yes, but it could be argued his weird innate desires would not have manifested so severely and without restraint unless he had been on the anti-depressants. I believe the drug was prozac.

Originally Posted by Omnis Dei

I have a friend on benzos, he says they send him into incredible mood swings where he feels suicidal dread if he misses a dose. Does not sound fun.

Ideation of strange thoughts such as suicide are more common than you think with patients trying to get off anti-depressants. However, an interesting thing happens where people become more likely in general to act out impulses they normally would have nothing to do with. For instance one guy who stopped taking his meds kidnapped and sexually assaulted a 3 year old girl before killing her and eating her body. He was probably already fucked up yes, but it could be argued his weird innate desires would not have manifested so severely and without restraint unless he had been on the anti-depressants. I believe the drug was prozac.

"It could be argued"? More like, it's a fucking certainty. Also, all of the school and college shootings in the US over the past 20 years were committed by SSRI users. Every single one.

Except the ones that weren't. But I guess when two things show a slight link that's all you need to filter it into your preconceived notions. Nevermind that the factor tying kids to both meds and shootings may be the same, rather than one causing the other.

but you know, that's just "science"

Originally Posted by Omnis Dei

Ideation of strange thoughts such as suicide are more common than you think with patients trying to get off anti-depressants. However, an interesting thing happens where people become more likely in general to act out impulses they normally would have nothing to do with. For instance one guy who stopped taking his meds kidnapped and sexually assaulted a 3 year old girl before killing her and eating her body. He was probably already fucked up yes, but it could be argued his weird innate desires would not have manifested so severely and without restraint unless he had been on the anti-depressants. I believe the drug was prozac.

I've read about this. I believe the explanation for this is that anti-depressants generally start combating the apathy often caused by depression before it actually brings about an improvement in the mood. It basically enables you to get off your arse and do something, and some people then make bad choices.

Originally Posted by khh

I've read about this. I believe the explanation for this is that anti-depressants generally start combating the apathy often caused by depression before it actually brings about an improvement in the mood. It basically enables you to get off your arse and do something, and some people then make bad choices.

Right, and SSRIs should not go to people who have ideation like this. Proper therapeutic assessment is key. Any kind of creepy ideation you can find is a sign the person may not be fit for SSRIs. I wouldn't take them, I get all sorts of crazy thoughts.