Thread: Is ignorance of the senses bliss?

Yes, ignorance is bliss. The prime example for me is that when I was a kid I would play games like Doom 2 or Duke 3d and think they were amazing, immersive experiences, but nowadays it's very difficult for me to go back and enjoy them because of the lack of decent graphics, compared to more recent titles.

Originally Posted by Taosaur

The question comes up online, too, with regard to audio and video quality of different media, and the sound or display on different devices. I'm no connoisseur in those areas--I have some minimum standards and I'm vaguely aware of how much I don't know, but I'm still often astounded by how completely oblivious people are to tinny sound output or lousy video encoding.

So, they're deriving more enjoyment from that piece of media that I found substandard, right? It seems obvious that there are more things that will satisfy the non-connoisseur. The question, then, is can the connoisseur derive a satisfaction beyond the non-connoisseur's capacity for enjoyment from experiences that meet or exceed their standards?

Not necessarily, because, while that layperson is getting their kicks out of the low quality video/audio - and you may not be - you still may have had more experiences in that higher quality video/audio, than the other person has. So you are still going to have your joyful experiences. They may be a little more infrequent, as you said, but that is only if you become one of the aficionados who forget about the charm of lesser-quality things. (I like to call then 'snobs.') I do like finer things, but I'm not a very picky person, when it comes right down to it. Appreciating the finer things, and thinking of anything less as truly 'inferior' or not worth our time, are two different things. Just because you know the quality of a prime cut of steak doesn't mean you can't enjoy a quarter-pounder with cheese, on occasion.

When you allow yourself to at least appreciate the entire spectrum of a thing, I think you tend to enjoy the greatest parts of it even more.

Originally Posted by cmind

Yes, ignorance is bliss. The prime example for me is that when I was a kid I would play games like Doom 2 or Duke 3d and think they were amazing, immersive experiences, but nowadays it's very difficult for me to go back and enjoy them because of the lack of decent graphics, compared to more recent titles.

But I wouldn't really call what you felt back then 'ignorance.' Games like that were the best they could be, at the time, so it's not like you were really 'missing out' on anything - or even that you were ignorant of anything. They were the most immersive experiences we had at the time. I don't think your not wanting to take a step back means that anyone else wouldn't feel the same way that you do, had they had a chance to switch from playing the older games to something new.

agh my brain hurts.. How do you guys talk like dat?

Originally Posted by lilthugdollaz

agh my brain hurts.. How do you guys talk like dat?

Why did you PM me this:

Originally Posted by lilthugdollaz

agh my brain hurts.. How do you guys talk like dat?

dem boyz be readin' dem books, yo
-----
I bet it's Xei, Jeff, or PhilosopherStoned.

Originally Posted by Seroquel

Why did you PM me this:...

To use yo suspicion to get a list of top debaters boi. u late on that assignment, play ur role.

That's like asking someone if it would be blissful to go back in the womb. Sure it would be easier to just float around and not have to do shit, but you won't fit and you can't reconnect that placenta and other strangely specific metaphors.

Well they do say men spend the 1st 9 months coming out and the rest of their lives trying to get back in...

LMFAO darkmatters.

Um, yeah pretty much what O said. It depends on whether the person is able to still appreciate crappy quality. Refine their senses instead of bombarding them with more.

I used to listen to crap quality audio and wouldn't even notice because I just listened to the songs, instead of the crackling or dullness or lack of strong bass or whatever. When I got Sennheiser headphones and good quality music, I find it very hard to listen to audio that isn't good quality, even slight vibrating noises like when the base gets too strong, like my headphones have started to do recently and I'm pissed off about. Although if I just immerse myself in it, instead of expecting it to immerse me, I don't even notice it again.

Originally Posted by Darkmatters

Well they do say men spend the 1st 9 months coming out and the rest of their lives trying to get back in...

And there we have it. The explanation of Darkmatter's love life.

Originally Posted by tommo

LMFAO darkmatters.

Um, yeah pretty much what O said. It depends on whether the person is able to still appreciate crappy quality. Refine their senses instead of bombarding them with more.

I used to listen to crap quality audio and wouldn't even notice because I just listened to the songs, instead of the crackling or dullness or lack of strong bass or whatever. When I got Sennheiser headphones and good quality music, I find it very hard to listen to audio that isn't good quality, even slight vibrating noises like when the base gets too strong, like my headphones have started to do recently and I'm pissed off about. Although if I just immerse myself in it, instead of expecting it to immerse me, I don't even notice it again.

Refining judgment is good, right? It makes you a better critic, more sociable, more cosmopolitan, seemingly more evolved. But it also makes life appear a lot less fun. The more people refine their judgments, the duller and less enthusiastic they seem about anything. This only happens because they end their assessment of life at their judgments about it. They get this sophomoric notion that they have life figured out and they stop listening. Worse yet, they believe these judgments they have about life are actually them.

Originally Posted by Seroquel

And there we have it. The explanation of Darkmatter's love life.

Originally Posted by Oneironaut

But I wouldn't really call what you felt back then 'ignorance.' Games like that were the best they could be, at the time, so it's not like you were really 'missing out' on anything - or even that you were ignorant of anything. They were the most immersive experiences we had at the time. I don't think your not wanting to take a step back means that anyone else wouldn't feel the same way that you do, had they had a chance to switch from playing the older games to something new.

This doesn't really deal with the point: the experience itself wasn't objectively good, yet it seemed like it at the time; if he'd never played any modern games he'd still like it just as much. Which really seems to justify Taosaur.

I think perhaps there is a way out though: if we include 'novelty' as an enjoyable part of the experience, then you don't ever stop being an aficionado. We can say there are two aspects to games: firstly are the aspects of artistry, such as the imagery, sound, and specific gameplay. These do not change over time, although they are arguably very rare; but I can name a few old games that are still really enjoyable. Then there is novelty. Discovering new things is an enjoyable aspect that is also objective; it doesn't change over time, although by definition the specific subject matter will have to. So, your tastes don't actually change; you're not necessarily becoming 'more refined', and not enjoying previous pleasures as a result.

Part of it is the excitement of always riding the wave of technological development. Being on the cutting edge. Th newest and best. OMG - it's HD!!

Video games have increased realism in graphics at the cost of simple but exciting gameplay. I can go back and dig on some Joust or Frogger in a totally different way.

And all this cutting-edge digital technology really is still a cut below it's analog counterpart. Both video and audio. Both lack the warmth and range of analog. No digital camera can capture the dynamic range of values that film can, for still photos or movies.

But they're cheaper and easier and lend themselves to the internet age and digital technology that is so prevalent, so we sacrifice the sheer quality of old world analog technology for the slightly lackluster (in comparison) digital counterparts. At least the difference is slight enough that many people can't even tell.

Well speaking of games, some games with poor graphics can still be very fun, if they have an interesting game style, or story. I don't think having a refined taste hurts, because overall games been improving a great deal and even if you take some of the ton of free games online, that don't hold a candle to the graphics of the big games like WOW, they still have great game play and are better than the average games years ago.

Also when talking about food, good food shouldn't be seen the same as expensive food. If you thought about it I am sure you could spice up a lot of every day food with little expense. It just takes a little skill and knowledge of cooking and stuff. There is no reason you should have to go without good food or drinks.

When I think about it, I think about that guy from bizarre foods, who travels around eating strange and unusual foods. I think if you are willing to put yourself out there and explore a little you will find nice surprises that fulfill your refined tastes, and so you never really have to go without. As for it being really better or not, I think the answer is obviously yes, it is better to be an aficionado. If you think about it, people who are living in ignorance probably enjoy the stuff but they probably never enjoy it to the extent you do. If a person never ate anything good in their life, they are probably not looking forward to dinner.

I find that developing refined tastes is a great exercise in mindfulness and provides ample opportunity for practicing being happy with what you get.

I love good food. I make killer food and get really into it. What I don't allow myself to do is get confused and believe that I am too good to eat a simple peanut butter sandwich or spam chili on rice (it's a hawaii thing) if that's what's being offered. Learning to eat food that you don't completely enjoy is wonderful. Bland food is good too because you have to really exercise your taste buds to go in and get the flavor out. Eating food that you really don't like is best of all because it provides good exercise in being happy and enjoying life anyways.

I highly recommend developing and engaging with the senses. Be grateful for the pleasing sensations and the displeasing sensations.

Originally Posted by lilthugdollaz

agh my brain hurts.. How do you guys talk like dat?

Best to think for yourself! :-)

PS at Seroquel , You do not understand or have the decency to keep PRIVATE messages, PRIVATE? That is just rude and incorrect, and you can bet your but, that I will never send a PM to you. Not much harm done here as I wouldn't have felt compelled to anyways, but dude Pm's are supposed to be private. It is the reason they are called private. Duh?

Originally Posted by Seroquel

Why did you PM me this:

It is not cool to post PRIVATE messages. Copish?

can we just ban mayflow's IP now? Seriously mods. What are you doing?

And it's Capiche, not copish.

[QUOTE=tommo;1771855]can we just ban mayflow's IP now? Seriously mods. What are you doing?

And it's Capiche, not copish.

So you think that it is justifiable to post what people PM you publically? Then what would be the point of PM'ing and where would be any trust?

It depends on what the PM is. That one was obviously not a very personal or in any way private matter.

I agree with tommo. The world isn't black and white--principles are a good thing, but not every situation deserves to be dealt with in the same manner because the circumstances are never the same. I find his post perfectly acceptable too. Your judgment and criticism of his actions are probably fallen on deaf ears as you are neither his mother nor an authority figure and this is the internet.

Now I've gone and ruined my own point, haven't I?

Originally Posted by Seroquel

Why did you PM me this:

$10 say it's you.