• Lucid Dreaming - Dream Views




    Results 1 to 17 of 17
    Like Tree8Likes
    • 1 Post By ninja9578
    • 1 Post By kookyinc
    • 2 Post By cmind
    • 1 Post By kookyinc
    • 1 Post By kookyinc
    • 1 Post By kookyinc
    • 1 Post By cmind

    Thread: German government caught with unconstitutional surveillance viruses

    1. #1
      Banned
      Join Date
      Apr 2007
      Location
      Out Chasing Rabbits
      Posts
      15,193
      Likes
      935

      German government caught with unconstitutional surveillance viruses

      I private organization has analyzed several infected hard drives and analyzed the virus on it, which is a trojan horse that is sent out by the government. It was supposed to be used against suspected terrorists, but seems to have been used against lots of other people as well. It violates the German constitution and is poorly written and protected against. They said that anyone with sufficient hacking ability can hijack the virus and use it themselves to spy on people.

      The World from Berlin: Electronic Surveillance Scandal Hits Germany - SPIEGEL ONLINE - News - International
      tommo likes this.

    2. #2
      Moo nsi dem oons ide kookyinc's Avatar
      Join Date
      Jun 2010
      LD Count
      4
      Gender
      Location
      Moonside
      Posts
      529
      Likes
      118
      DJ Entries
      16
      Well, come on guys, it's not like privacy laws are that important, especially when compared to fighting terrorists.[/sarcasm]
      Supernova likes this.
      I don't usually think, therefore I mostly am not.
      Quote Originally Posted by abicus View Post
      You can not convince the one with faith who needs not look for fact that the facts "prove them wrong".
      Likewise, you cant teach some one who looks for facts to have faith in the absence of facts.

    3. #3
      Banned
      Join Date
      Dec 2010
      Gender
      Posts
      1,590
      Likes
      522
      If the government can steal your money at gunpoint, what's the problem with them invading your privacy?
      PhilosopherStoned and tommo like this.

    4. #4
      Moo nsi dem oons ide kookyinc's Avatar
      Join Date
      Jun 2010
      LD Count
      4
      Gender
      Location
      Moonside
      Posts
      529
      Likes
      118
      DJ Entries
      16
      Quote Originally Posted by cmind View Post
      If the government can steal your money at gunpoint, what's the problem with them invading your privacy?
      Everyone has a right to privacy. Taxes are what you pay as a fee for living in a country. An apartment dweller wouldn't let his landlord go through his safe.
      Omnis Dei likes this.
      I don't usually think, therefore I mostly am not.
      Quote Originally Posted by abicus View Post
      You can not convince the one with faith who needs not look for fact that the facts "prove them wrong".
      Likewise, you cant teach some one who looks for facts to have faith in the absence of facts.

    5. #5
      Banned
      Join Date
      Dec 2010
      Gender
      Posts
      1,590
      Likes
      522
      Quote Originally Posted by kookyinc View Post
      Everyone has a right to privacy. Taxes are what you pay as a fee for living in a country.
      So taxes pay for government services?

    6. #6
      Moo nsi dem oons ide kookyinc's Avatar
      Join Date
      Jun 2010
      LD Count
      4
      Gender
      Location
      Moonside
      Posts
      529
      Likes
      118
      DJ Entries
      16
      Quote Originally Posted by cmind View Post
      So taxes pay for government services?
      I would assume so. The money isn't being intercepted by a 3rd party, is it? Granted, not all government services are for the benefit of the population, but they are services in one way or another.
      I don't usually think, therefore I mostly am not.
      Quote Originally Posted by abicus View Post
      You can not convince the one with faith who needs not look for fact that the facts "prove them wrong".
      Likewise, you cant teach some one who looks for facts to have faith in the absence of facts.

    7. #7
      Banned
      Join Date
      Dec 2010
      Gender
      Posts
      1,590
      Likes
      522
      Quote Originally Posted by kookyinc View Post
      I would assume so.
      Services, like cable tv, or a waitress serving you food, etc.?

    8. #8
      Moo nsi dem oons ide kookyinc's Avatar
      Join Date
      Jun 2010
      LD Count
      4
      Gender
      Location
      Moonside
      Posts
      529
      Likes
      118
      DJ Entries
      16
      Quote Originally Posted by cmind View Post
      Services, like cable tv, or a waitress serving you food, etc.?
      Services like Social Security, the military, the police force (in the US, not sure about Canada), healthcare (in Canada, not so much in the US), the postal system, the FDA (in the US), education, welfare, etc. Services that are helpful to society.
      Darkmatters likes this.
      I don't usually think, therefore I mostly am not.
      Quote Originally Posted by abicus View Post
      You can not convince the one with faith who needs not look for fact that the facts "prove them wrong".
      Likewise, you cant teach some one who looks for facts to have faith in the absence of facts.

    9. #9
      Banned
      Join Date
      Dec 2010
      Gender
      Posts
      1,590
      Likes
      522
      Quote Originally Posted by kookyinc View Post
      Services like Social Security, the military, the police force (in the US, not sure about Canada), healthcare (in Canada, not so much in the US), the postal system, the FDA (in the US), education, welfare, etc. Services that are helpful to society.
      But we are talking about services, like how cable tv is a service, or waiting a table is a service? We're talking about services, right?

    10. #10
      Moo nsi dem oons ide kookyinc's Avatar
      Join Date
      Jun 2010
      LD Count
      4
      Gender
      Location
      Moonside
      Posts
      529
      Likes
      118
      DJ Entries
      16
      serv·ice, noun
      1. An act of helpful activity; help; aid: to do someone a service.
      2. The supplying or supplier of utilities or commodities, as water, electricity, or gas, required or demanded by the public.
      Sauce
      Darkmatters likes this.
      I don't usually think, therefore I mostly am not.
      Quote Originally Posted by abicus View Post
      You can not convince the one with faith who needs not look for fact that the facts "prove them wrong".
      Likewise, you cant teach some one who looks for facts to have faith in the absence of facts.

    11. #11
      Banned
      Join Date
      Dec 2010
      Gender
      Posts
      1,590
      Likes
      522
      Quote Originally Posted by kookyinc View Post
      serv·ice, noun
      1. An act of helpful activity; help; aid: to do someone a service.
      2. The supplying or supplier of utilities or commodities, as water, electricity, or gas, required or demanded by the public.
      Sauce
      Would you say that when a service is rendered, the customer is billed, and that it wouldn't make much sense for, say, a cable customer to pay for their cable service BEFORE they've received it?
      ThePreserver likes this.

    12. #12
      Oneironaut Achievements:
      Veteran First Class 5000 Hall Points
      ThePreserver's Avatar
      Join Date
      Feb 2010
      Gender
      Posts
      1,428
      Likes
      1047
      My electric and gas comes from a local Cooperative, not the government... And we pay AFTER we get it.

      Also... It's totally legal to do the things that Germany is doing in the US, now. Thanks, PATRIOT Act! You keep me feeling so "safe."

    13. #13
      Moo nsi dem oons ide kookyinc's Avatar
      Join Date
      Jun 2010
      LD Count
      4
      Gender
      Location
      Moonside
      Posts
      529
      Likes
      118
      DJ Entries
      16
      Quote Originally Posted by cmind View Post
      Would you say that when a service is rendered, the customer is billed, and that it wouldn't make much sense for, say, a cable customer to pay for their cable service BEFORE they've received it?
      I'm not exactly sure what you mean by that. Could you please rephrase?

      Quote Originally Posted by ThePreserver View Post
      My electric and gas comes from a local Cooperative, not the government... And we pay AFTER we get it.

      Also... It's totally legal to do the things that Germany is doing in the US, now. Thanks, PATRIOT Act! You keep me feeling so "safe."
      The PATRIOT ACT's legality is questionable at best. It violates the Constitution, so technically it is illegal, but the government seems to be turning a blind eye to that.
      I don't usually think, therefore I mostly am not.
      Quote Originally Posted by abicus View Post
      You can not convince the one with faith who needs not look for fact that the facts "prove them wrong".
      Likewise, you cant teach some one who looks for facts to have faith in the absence of facts.

    14. #14
      Oneironaut Achievements:
      Veteran First Class 5000 Hall Points
      ThePreserver's Avatar
      Join Date
      Feb 2010
      Gender
      Posts
      1,428
      Likes
      1047
      Quote Originally Posted by kookyinc View Post
      The PATRIOT ACT's legality is questionable at best. It violates the Constitution, so technically it is illegal, but the government seems to be turning a blind eye to that.
      I forgot. People who don't know me could misinterpret my sarcasm. My bad.

    15. #15
      Moo nsi dem oons ide kookyinc's Avatar
      Join Date
      Jun 2010
      LD Count
      4
      Gender
      Location
      Moonside
      Posts
      529
      Likes
      118
      DJ Entries
      16
      Quote Originally Posted by ThePreserver View Post
      I forgot. People who don't know me could misinterpret my sarcasm. My bad.
      I knew you were sarcastic about feeling "safe", but not about when you said it was legal. My mistake. Derp derp derp derp derp derp.
      I don't usually think, therefore I mostly am not.
      Quote Originally Posted by abicus View Post
      You can not convince the one with faith who needs not look for fact that the facts "prove them wrong".
      Likewise, you cant teach some one who looks for facts to have faith in the absence of facts.

    16. #16
      Banned
      Join Date
      Dec 2010
      Gender
      Posts
      1,590
      Likes
      522
      Quote Originally Posted by kookyinc View Post
      I'm not exactly sure what you mean by that. Could you please rephrase?
      .
      I'll give a better example. We all know how a grocery store works: you go in, you obtain the items you want, and then you pay for those items. Restaurant: same thing, you order your food, you eat the food you ordered, and then you pay. If the food delivered is wrong, you don't pay.

      It's not just food. When you get a haircut, you select the style, the barber performs the service, and if it's satisfactory you pay.

      When you buy a car, you test drive it, and if the test drive if to your liking, you pay.

      Are you seeing the pattern here? Choice, delivery, payment. Choice, delivery, payment. That's a service. Now, let me ask you again: does the government provide services?

    17. #17
      Moo nsi dem oons ide kookyinc's Avatar
      Join Date
      Jun 2010
      LD Count
      4
      Gender
      Location
      Moonside
      Posts
      529
      Likes
      118
      DJ Entries
      16
      Quote Originally Posted by cmind View Post
      I'll give a better example. We all know how a grocery store works: you go in, you obtain the items you want, and then you pay for those items. Restaurant: same thing, you order your food, you eat the food you ordered, and then you pay. If the food delivered is wrong, you don't pay.

      It's not just food. When you get a haircut, you select the style, the barber performs the service, and if it's satisfactory you pay.

      When you buy a car, you test drive it, and if the test drive if to your liking, you pay.

      Are you seeing the pattern here? Choice, delivery, payment. Choice, delivery, payment. That's a service. Now, let me ask you again: does the government provide services?
      I showed you the dictionary definition, it said nothing about when a payment is made for the services.

      And many businesses have a "pay first then get the service" model. Online orders, I pay for shipping before my items arrive. Many smaller restaurants make you pay before you get your food. When I go the the physician, I pay and then get seen by the doctor.
      I don't usually think, therefore I mostly am not.
      Quote Originally Posted by abicus View Post
      You can not convince the one with faith who needs not look for fact that the facts "prove them wrong".
      Likewise, you cant teach some one who looks for facts to have faith in the absence of facts.

    Similar Threads

    1. Have you ever been caught/caught (somebody) masturbating?
      By Marvo in forum Ask/Tell Me About
      Replies: 250
      Last Post: 08-30-2014, 10:38 PM
    2. Replies: 31
      Last Post: 03-19-2008, 04:12 AM

    Bookmarks

    Posting Permissions

    • You may not post new threads
    • You may not post replies
    • You may not post attachments
    • You may not edit your posts
    •