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    Thread: LA Cop-Turned-Cop-Killer, Dorner

    1. #1
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      LA Cop-Turned-Cop-Killer, Dorner

      http://www.guardian....grievance-judge



      Officer Dorner reported that his training officer kicked a downed, mentally ill homeless man multiple times after tazing him (the tazer was used after the man threw a punch at the cop) and got fired for it. Then he snapped and has been hunting down other cops. He definitely deserves to go to prison, for killing a few innocent people. But the fact that the LAPD continues to deny and hide the rampant police brutality that goes on is disgusting.

      An interesting comment from that link:
      So basically, LAPD had a good cop who was trying to do his job well, and they turned him into a killer by firing him for doing the right thing by trying to actually "protect and serve" the people, and firing him in such a way that future employment in LE would be damn near impossible..

      On top of that, you have a bunch of trigger happy cops that have already injured 3 completely innocent people [in a botched attempt to capture Dorner] by firing into one truck, that might have looked like Dorner's truck, and injuring 2 women, who were obviously not black men. Then yesterday, you had two cops ram and total another truck, that was the wrong make and color, and this is the best part, a couple days after they had confirmed they found Dormer's truck freshly burned up, and again a barrage of bullets fired at a a white man, who again, was obviously not black.

      You know that after the investigation, they will have to come back and say his firing was justified, or they will have to act on the trigger happy cops. Even if they do learn the truth, it is too later for there to be any sort of positive outcome.

      I would like to think it is an isolated case, but the police culture of lies and cover ups is endemic and can be found in every police department.

    2. #2
      Xei
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      Fortunately I can see a very good reason you don't need to care about this kind of thing.


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      We have a culture of corruption within our police forces up here in Canada as well. This forum also has plenty of Americans who may not be aware of this little slice of current events, and it could be of relevance to them. .-.
      Last edited by GavinGill; 02-13-2013 at 03:13 AM.
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      Xei
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      And they go around shooting civilians without fear of recrimination?

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      Quote Originally Posted by Xei View Post
      Fortunately I can see a very good reason you don't need to care about this kind of thing.


      I don't understand what you mean by this? Do you mean that because he is in another country he shouldn't care?

      Police have always been ready and willing to use excessive force, while at the same time doing what they can to make sure as many cops as possible get away with doing so. I can say one thing with absolute certainty, if a cop ever started beating me relentlessly for no good reason I see it as my right to defend myself. That badge and uniform mean nothing to me at that point and I will make sure he remembers my face.
      Last edited by PlanesWalker; 02-13-2013 at 03:33 AM.
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    6. #6
      Xei
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      Quote Originally Posted by PlanesWalker View Post
      I don't understand what you mean by this? Do you mean that because he is in another country he shouldn't care?
      Yep. You're a voter; you have a voice in your country, he doesn't. And it affects you directly.

      Do you seriously take an interest in corruption in other countries? China? Russia? Africa? When was the last time you read something about them?

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      Quote Originally Posted by Xei View Post
      And they go around shooting civilians without fear of recrimination?
      Sexual assaults by male officers on female officers, cops killing people in car crashes then going home and getting plastered so then they can say it was a result of drunken driving, etc. Cops get slaps on the wrist over here as well. Granted, I don't know of many policing departments in my neck of the woods that are nearly as corrupt as the LAPD or NYPD, but that's besides the point.

      Quote Originally Posted by Xei View Post
      Yep. You're a voter; you have a voice in your country, he doesn't.
      Posting here let's a few Americans know what's going on, so then they can use the information to... do whatever they wish. There's nothing wrong with sharing information. Especially since Canadian and American policies are inevitably intertwined, we share and borrow ideas from each other all the time. The more informed Americans are about what's going on in their country, the more likely it is that they'll demand change. And we'll soon catch wind and start looking at similar policies. Just like how the legalization of marijuana in Washington and Colorado has led to major talks of legalization in our provinces, police reform in the States will lead to police reform in Canada (and vice versa).

      Quote Originally Posted by Xei View Post
      Do you seriously take an interest in corruption in other countries?
      Yessir. Canada and America in particular. I don't actively search these things up online daily, but I like to keep an eye out.
      Last edited by GavinGill; 02-13-2013 at 07:39 AM.
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      This ended in a disgusting and scary way.

      Allegedly, Dorner had tried to escape the cabin, was pushed back inside by officers, then it was set fire by police (this is confirmable). At no point did they attempt to arrest him and give him a trial. At no point did they 100%, without a shadow of a doubt confirm his murders in the first place, which is what trials are for. Instead, a cop who tried to expose a police department who is well known for police brutality was fired from his job for lying, hunted down like a dog, then burned to death.

      If he did murder people, that isn't something I could ever condone, but the police also murdered at least 2 people that I know of in their pursuit of him without any attempt to confirm that it was their suspect.
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      ^ ... wow.

      This better spark some proper discussion in regards to the way LAPD handle things...

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      Dorner's accusations were basically that LAPD were overly aggressive, brutal, incompetent and dishonest.

      During their manhunt for Dorner LAPD officers shot up at least two civilian vehicles, injuring two women who were delivering newspapers. This means that they were not trying to arrest Dorner. They were not under fire. They never even saw his face. They never even saw his face.
      I believe the LAPD are overly aggressive, brutal, and incompetent.

      When they finally tracked down Dorner, they did not attempt to arrest him. They did not try to communicate with him. They burned him alive. They burned him alive.
      I believe the LAPD are overly aggressive, brutal, and incompetent.

      The spokeswoman for the LAPD stated that the fire was most likely set by smoke grenades.
      However, commands were shouted over the radio to burn the cabin down, by lighting gas on fire.
      I believe the LAPD are dishonest.

      This entire situation is infuriating, and absolutely unacceptable.
      Last edited by sloth; 02-13-2013 at 06:35 PM.
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      Quote Originally Posted by GavinGill View Post
      ^ ... wow.

      This better spark some proper discussion in regards to the way LAPD handle things...
      Or how other police handle things.
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      This thread will become a debate about gun control in 3...2...1...
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      Quote Originally Posted by cmind View Post
      This thread will become a debate about gun control in 3...2...1...
      There is a thread about such a debate.
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      Quote Originally Posted by Xei View Post
      Yep. You're a voter; you have a voice in your country, he doesn't. And it affects you directly.

      Do you seriously take an interest in corruption in other countries? China? Russia? Africa? When was the last time you read something about them?
      Thats funny because I know a couple of journals that went beyond that.

      "If so, she [the President of Brazil] should fire Mr Mantega [Finance Minister of Brazil], whose over-optimistic forecasts have lost investors’ confidence, and appoint a new team capable of regaining the trust of business."

      The Economist

      Also:

      First they came for the socialists,
      and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a socialist.

      Then they came for the trade unionists,
      and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a trade unionist.

      Then they came for the Jews,
      and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Jew.

      Then they came for me,
      and there was no one left to speak for me.

      Martin Niemöller

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      Quote Originally Posted by cmind View Post
      This thread will become a debate about gun control in 3...2...1...
      This isn't a gun control issue, though. This was the legal murder of a man who was never proven guilty by the police. I mean I can pull out a cache of stories and videos of cops doing this exact kind of thing, it just so happened this guy fought first.

      The issue comes in is that the police system is horribly corrupt in a country where we have private prison systems. My home state has a 1 in 86 incarceration rate. Louisiana is the prison capital of the world, boasting a higher rate than China, which is a police state.

      The problem with the police is the worst offenders are the lower level guys. In my town (in Louisiana), becoming a cop was pretty easy, save a few physical tests. You had no aptitude that a high school education couldn't prove. That left people who were rejected from other paths to pursue a career as a cop in a relatively crime-free city. Why work dangerous jobs, when you can become a cop for decent pay? Worst still, as a cop, you gain power. That's where you get the cops who are too heavy handed.

      Chris Dorner had tried to buck that system, and got fired for it. He was a Navy Reservist too, so he was a person of service. I am thinking that losing his job due to trying to do his job appropriately and correctly broke him.
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      May the LAPD waste to shriveled dust just like their tiny cocks.

      (Also please do not take the bait of the psychic vampires trying to ruin this thread. This is an important issue and requires more maturity than they're willing to grow into right now)

      Everything works out in the end, sometimes even badly.


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      I want to know how their investigation into why they were shooting at civilians is going.
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      I got sent off from my 3 jobs as a Security guard only because
      1- I snitched my supervisor doing very disrespectful things towards her own co-workers like spreading rumors to clients about us being not good in our jobs when we actually do it 100x better than her, i snitched to management, and the highest of all the CEO! They all listened but later on ignored and kept doing it until i got laid off because i wanted to move to another location, but ceo said if i can't handle her then i won't be able to work. ahaha gimme a break!

      2- from another job continuingly report a faulty door that needs to be fixed in order to keep the office building safe, but maintainence kept delaying or ignoring this fact and sent me off only because i was doing my job.

      3rd job i actually didn't know why i got sent off and was placed many accusations that never happened.....

      now i got an interview for another security job only because that's what i do best and the boss found my resume interesting because of my near 4 year experience. Let's see how it goes..........tomorrow.

      So i won't be surprised that good cops are getting fired for stupid things, i think personally law enforcement of any kind wants to be corrupted so they kick all the good ones off. Jobs such as these don't listen to good workers they make the corrupted look like a browner (which means better than anyone). So basically there isn't anymore good cops out there now, so to speak, if there is, chances are they won't last because law enforcement don't want good abiding workers like how they were trained to, i know it's fucked out there now.
      Last edited by hathor28; 02-13-2013 at 11:51 PM.
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      It sounds like he did a Serpico. And yet predictably Fox News is treating him like a crazy terrorist:

      http://www.foxnews.com/on-air/fox-fr...ylist_id=86912

      So weird the way they liken his 'manifesto' to scripture - nothing about it sounded scriptural, from what they said it sounded like a pretty straightforward expose on police corruption. They also report that his cabin "caught fire".
      Last edited by Darkmatters; 02-13-2013 at 11:41 PM.
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      There are parts of his manifesto that sound a bit off. This I admit. However, the compulsion to compare it with scripture just so that they can justify why people would support Dorner is just silly. People support(ed) him for the same reason they support other things that they feel strongly about. Some people have more extreme variations of moral standards. We aren't all going to agree.
      I was already tired of Fox news. They aren't even clever in disguising it.
      Dorner sure as hell did make his point. It's just sad that the press is so one-sided about it. I didn't hear anything on CNN or Fox news about the trucks that were shot up by the police.
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      Quote Originally Posted by Tiresias View Post
      This isn't a gun control issue, though. This was the legal murder of a man who was never proven guilty by the police. I mean I can pull out a cache of stories and videos of cops doing this exact kind of thing, it just so happened this guy fought first.

      The issue comes in is that the police system is horribly corrupt in a country where we have private prison systems. My home state has a 1 in 86 incarceration rate. Louisiana is the prison capital of the world, boasting a higher rate than China, which is a police state.

      The problem with the police is the worst offenders are the lower level guys. In my town (in Louisiana), becoming a cop was pretty easy, save a few physical tests. You had no aptitude that a high school education couldn't prove. That left people who were rejected from other paths to pursue a career as a cop in a relatively crime-free city. Why work dangerous jobs, when you can become a cop for decent pay? Worst still, as a cop, you gain power. That's where you get the cops who are too heavy handed.

      Chris Dorner had tried to buck that system, and got fired for it. He was a Navy Reservist too, so he was a person of service. I am thinking that losing his job due to trying to do his job appropriately and correctly broke him.
      When are people going to stop acting surprised by this kind of stuff? I've known practically all my life (I'm not that old) that the US is a fascist/imperial state. For me, the US government has always been the "enemy" (not in the sense that I would actually do anything about it, I don't even live there). But most Americans still act like the US government *can* be virtuous if only you elected the right politicians. It's bizarre.
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      Most of you already know I'm sure, but for those who don't, there was a movie made starring Al Pacino in the 70's based on the real life story of Frank Serpico:

      Serpico is a 1973 American crime film directed by Sidney Lumet and starring Al Pacino. Waldo Salt and Norman Wexler wrote the screenplay, adapting Peter Maas' biography of NYPD officer Frank Serpico, who went undercover to expose corruption in the force.

      Based on the non-fiction book by Peter Maas, the film covers twelve years (from 1960 to June 15, 1972) in the life of Frank Serpico, an NYPD officer who wants to do the best he can as a policeman. Working as a uniformed patrolman, Serpico succeeds in every assignment. He moves on to plainclothes assignments, where he slowly discovers a hidden world of illicit activities among his own colleagues. After witnessing cops use drugs, committing violence, taking paybacks and other forms of police corruption, Serpico decides to expose what he's seen, but he is harassed and threatened. The struggle leads to infighting within the police force, problems in his personal relationships, and life-threatening situations. Finally, after being shot in the face during a drug bust on February 3, 1971, he testifies before the Knapp Commission, a government inquiry into NYPD police corruption between 1970 and 1972. After receiving a New York City Police Department Medal of Honor and a disability pension, Serpico resigned from the force and moved to Switzerland.
      From Wikipedia

      In a scene near the end his own partners knowingly sent him into a dangerous situation unarmed (I think it was the apartment of violent drug dealers, something similar) and not one of them drew a weapon to protect him when he got shot.

      Here's Frank Serpico in his 70's watching and discussing the movie:


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      Dorner did have a legitimate reason to be upset with the LAPD and the actions that were perpetuated by so many of his former fellow officers. However, should the police chief's daughter have paid the price for her father's mistakes? She's dead, so is another cop...

      While we will take notice of his actions and the implications of his words, thanks to constant media coverage, the people he killed in his anger did not deserve to die to get that attention.

      The police who hunted him down were wrong to shoot at innocent people in an attempt to capture Dorner. The media coverage makes that plain to see. Unfortunately Dorner was also wrong in choosing this path to bring light to the problem.

      I am glad the issues with the LAPD are exposed...but I still believe he could have figured out a better way to do it. Now he is also dead.

      While he was holed up in that cabin there was a firefight that included bullets going both directions. That never ends well, no matter what the issue is or who is being shot at by the police. When Dorner started this he knew it would end with his life being taken, most likely in a firefight. I would bet he knew he was cornered and there was no way out.

      I pose the following questions to the general "you"...

      If you were a cop, even a good cop, do you think you could have talked him out of the cabin without him shooting? Could you get him out of that situation in a way that kept him alive/safe?

      How would you react if you knew a man skilled with weapons, obviously fueled by painful emotions and anger and already a murderer, was on the loose and well-armed, possibly threatening innocent civilians? Would you find it in yourself to offer a compassionate ear and a helpful hand as the bullets started flying or would you return fire?


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      Were they fresh out of teargas and flashbangs that day?

      I don't mean to be a smartass, and I do agree with all of your points except maybe the last one. Since when is it police procedure to pin someone down with gunfire inside a cabin and light it on fire?

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      Quote Originally Posted by cmind View Post
      When are people going to stop acting surprised by this kind of stuff? I've known practically all my life (I'm not that old) that the US is a fascist/imperial state. For me, the US government has always been the "enemy" (not in the sense that I would actually do anything about it, I don't even live there). But most Americans still act like the US government *can* be virtuous if only you elected the right politicians. It's bizarre.
      Canada is becoming a fascist as well, didn't you notice? Surprised that this is coming from a Canadian, like me.
      Ya i worry about southern border but i also worry of my own, at least talk about how we are becoming more like Americans in the politics region and many of us are protesting for such betrayal just like americans are for their own.
      Speak up man.
      Last edited by hathor28; 02-14-2013 at 02:06 AM.

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