Thread: Vegetarian-Vegan-meat eaters discussion

I don't think it's something you have to hide in a closet over; you should be proud of it.

I've gone back and forth, Gastone. Morally I want to be a vegetarian but physically I want to eat meat. I was a vegetarian for a long time and a vegan wanna-be but I always failed with cheese and eggs. Then I decided to add back fish to my diet for the protein for weight lifting. Where I live now I have access to humanely farmed chicken, turkey, beef, and pork so I started eating them all again. Then I started feeling guilty about the beef and pork so I quit them. Now I haven't gotten any turkey or chicken for a while either, so I'm back to cage-free eggs and sardines. I gave up the cheese (mostly) a while back. (I would eat shrimp, scallops, etc. except for that stuff is grown in like sewage water in Asia somewhere, so it grosses me out.)

It's easy for some people. I wish my morals were as strong as my appetites. Good luck.

Originally Posted by Moonbeam

I don't think it's something you have to hide in a closet over; you should be proud of it.

I agree Mooney

I've gone back and forth, Gastone. Morally I want to be a vegetarian but physically I want to eat meat.

That is almost opposite my wife. She views the use of meat as most meat eaters but simply finds it physically repulsive to eat flesh. When you put it that way it does sound a bit nasty.

It's easy for some people. I wish my morals were as strong as my appetites. Good luck.

I'm sure you would have not said it if you did not think so but......... You feel it strong enough to be a moral issue?
Bring on the ED ha ha!

I was vegan for about four years, vegetarian about six. I held off going veg a long time, mainly not to impose on my friends, and because I didn't know what I'd eat. Eventually, I had three experiences in a row of being sickened by meat dishes, so I bought a good veg cookbook with nutritional info and basic prep for a wide variety of veggies, grains and beans. I was thinking it might be a gradual transition, but after some reading I was confident that I need not eat meat again. The book I got was Laurel's Kitchen, but really I just hit the used book store and grabbed the best one I saw.

Be well.

Moonbeam, I eat pretty much the same way now, but I don't worry about it or view meat-eating as a moral issue. Animal welfare is a moral issue, yes, and refraining from meat can serve as a statement on the practices that bring it to your table, but unless you kill the animal, order its death, or it is explicitly killed for you, there's no moral dimension to eating its flesh. There is a positive moral aspect to refraining from meat with the intent of releasing lives from suffering or untimely death, but no moral taint in meat-eating per se.

Going veggie is easy!

I've been a vegetarian for about 25 years. It wasn't very easy back when I started. There were very few restaurants that even knew what one was talking about back then. Prepared foods were horrible!

Nowadays, it's a breeze in the U.S., depending on where you live. Some parts of the South are probably still difficult. Other countries vary, of course.

I used to view eating meat as a moral issue, but then I "snapped out of it".. we are omnivores by nature, and that is a fact. Just because we are more conscious (or what have you) than other animals doesn't mean we should feel guilty about eating things that the average human's body was made to require. But, these are my views, and as long as no one thinks I'm a murderer for eating meat, then I don't care whatsoever about other people's choice of diet!

There are several people, though, who really benefit from removing meat from their diet. Whatever suits an individual's needs is the way to go.

If any of you are vegetarian, especially vegan, please eat carefully - you still need the correct vitamins, especially iron for women.

BTW, could someone explain to me why some people are vegan? I don't really understand that lifestyle choice..

Originally Posted by Mes Tarrant

BTW, could someone explain to me why some people are vegan? I don't really understand that lifestyle choice..

Well, from a compassion or animal rights standpoint, animals raised only for their by-products are subject to less regulation and more mistreatment than those raised for meat. From a health standpoint, eggs and dairy can have an unbalancing effect even in a vegetarian diet, delivering aminos at the cost of clogged arteries, increased body fat and possibly immuno-suppression. When I dropped them from my diet, my energy level picked up considerably within a couple weeks. For most vegans, those are the main concerns: animal cruelty and personal health. The environmental concerns are identical to meat: poor use of cropland and foul emissions.

From a culinary and aesthetic perspective, the flavors and textures of dairy are coarse and overpowering, slicking and numbing the palate. Vegetable-based cuisine offers more nuance and endless variety, and leaves one feeling enlivened rather than weighted down.

do vegetarians eat eggs? I assume not

Anyway if your a vegan, don't you have to take quite a few tablets seeing as how some amino acids have to come from meat( or dairy i believe, i think vegetarians that still eat cheese are ok).

Originally Posted by cuddleyperson

do vegetarians eat eggs? I assume not

Yes, they do (or most do). Vegans shun all animal products. Vegetarians shun animal flesh, but often eat eggs and dairy.

Originally Posted by cuddleyperson

do vegetarians eat eggs? I assume not

Vegans don't eat eggs, otherwise the definition of vegetarian allows for eggs. Eggs that you buy in a store have never been fertilized, so it's more like buying cheese or something than it is like buying meat.

If you're going vegan or vegetarian make sure you have a good daily vitamin or else you'll get really bad bruising, muscle fatigue, or even blood clots.

I've been a vegetarian for about 2-3 years now. I became one immediatly after I saw what people did to animals. I have a twin sister that became one about the same time I did. The rest of my family aren't vegetarians and my grandmother always mess with us about it. One time my grandmother was making a steak and she said "Look I got the big piece of the cow" then started laughing. Since she started living with my family, she keeps alot of meat in the fridge. She eats the nasty stuff like pig ears, cows tongue, and other meats in general. Does meat stink to any of you? It smells disgusting, like rotting trash that's been in the rain. I try and convince the rest of my family but they think it's hard. Its really easy though but I think they're just scared to do it because they wouldn't be able to eat the foods they like. They don't understand that there are many substitutes they can eat instead. Im pretty much half vegan because I don't eat dairy products unless its mixed in other food(like milk in ice cream or eggs in a cake).

I could probably switch to vegetarian if I wanted too... I only eat meat about once a week or so. Depending on the week, that is.

Originally Posted by Taosaur

Moonbeam, I eat pretty much the same way now, but I don't worry about it or view meat-eating as a moral issue. Animal welfare is a moral issue, yes, and refraining from meat can serve as a statement on the practices that bring it to your table, but unless you kill the animal, order its death, or it is explicitly killed for you, there's no moral dimension to eating its flesh. There is a positive moral aspect to refraining from meat with the intent of releasing lives from suffering or untimely death, but no moral taint in meat-eating per se.

Well, if you buy the meat, you are contributing to the animals death and mistreatment; there's no way around it. (I'm sure you know the seven ways a Buddhist can violate being a vegetarian--I got them out of a book a Hare Krishna gave me at the airport one time, and buying the meat was one of them.) I don't think I'm getting some kind of bad karma or anything, if that's what you mean.

I am against cruelty, not necessarily killing. Factory farming is totally out for that reason, obviously. Hunting would be the best option, but it's not really practical, and somebody else has to do it for me. The compromise of the small farm was OK, sort of, til I went there and visited--then I felt a little less good about it; he shouldn't have taken me out in the field to meet the cows. I think there is something so perverse about people who raise animals (and treat them well), then kill them as soon as they are big enough to eat; it's just such a repulsive way to live, I think, I couldn't do that, so I feel bad about contributing to it. So I'm back to fish (should that bother me?--it's more like hunting, but they are killing all the fish too), since the freezers are empty now. I forgot about my whey supplement, another animal product I eat. (Organic, free-range, etc. but it's basically the same dilemma as the eggs; it's not ideal either.)

Mes, people are vegans when they don't think humans should exploit animals for any reason. Like I said I don't have the strength of my convictions. Or the digestive system to tolerate the massive amounts of intestine-swelling food that I would have to eat if I was a vegan. Sometimes I get to thinking about it and wonder if I should try again. They do have a lot more things out now that makes it easier, like skysaw said.

Like so many things in life, you just compromise and try to do the least harm, I guess, as much as your own conscience allows you to get away and still be able to live with yourself. I heard a show on the radio today about how capitalism is going to cause the environment to be completely destroyed by the end of this century, as I'm driving home in my non-environmentally responsible vehicle, and I have to wonder about a lot of things that I do.

Thanks for ruining my day, Gastone.

Originally Posted by Moonbeam

I think there is something so perverse about people who raise animals (and treat them well), then kill them as soon as they are big enough to eat; it's just such a repulsive way to live, I think, I couldn't do that

I know what you mean about that. I would get emotionally attached to every animal I was responsible for, but then again that's why people like me aren't farmers.

I definitely am against any sort of unnecessary animal cruelty. At the same time, I personally don't feel like we have some sort of responsibility to completely stop using animals for food. A hungry lion wouldn't spare you or me, after all. Nothing seems to be inherently evil about this.

Originally Posted by Mes Tarrant

A hungry lion wouldn't spare you or me, after all. Nothing seems to be inherently evil about this.

No, but that's not how it is; we are not hunter-gatherers anymore, and if we are exploiting animals by raising them for a purpose, we have a responsibility to them.

Originally Posted by ninja9578

If you're going vegan or vegetarian make sure you have a good daily vitamin or else you'll get really bad bruising, muscle fatigue, or even blood clots.

Okay I hate to jack this thread, but I recently became a vegetarian.

What kind of vitamins should I be taking? o.o

Originally Posted by Xox

Okay I hate to jack this thread, but I recently became a vegetarian.

What kind of vitamins should I be taking? o.o

I would stay on the diet for a couple of months and then check with a doc to see if you are deficient in anything. Of course you could go and check with a doc and come up with a nutrition plan right away.. .. but to me it seems easier to wait a little bit.. ?

Since you are a woman, make sure to get enough IRON. Most women are iron deficient anyway. I eat meat, but even I take daily iron supplements. But you might not be deficient, so a blood test is the best thing to do.

In general, a daily general multivitamin should do the trick if you are otherwise on top of your game.

Yeah, lack of iron is what will cause bruising and bleeding, lack of protien will cause muscle problems. I'd find one that is high in both.

Originally Posted by ninja9578

If you're going vegan or vegetarian make sure you have a good daily vitamin or else you'll get really bad bruising, muscle fatigue, or even blood clots.

And your arms will fall off, and you will grow six shapely breasts on your back (this message brought to you by the Beef Council).

FYI, while I've known vegetarians and vegans who downed elaborate cocktails of vitamins and herbal boosters and power shakes while running a half marathon twice a week, I just ate a varied diet of mostly fresh, whole foods, paying attention to my cravings, and I generally ran rings around my omnivore friends. I occasionally took b12, that's about it.

If you try to live on tofu and pasta, you might have problems, just as if you tried to live on nothing but pig. As long as you keep a balanced diet, though, veggie or otherwise, you'll be fine. Vegetarians have been around a lot longer than multivitamins.

The only thing you really miss out on is Protein and Iron. Peanut butter and beans (not mixed together) are good sources of Protein, and I'm not sure what has Iron in it...

Sturdy, dark greens like spinach are good for iron, as are beets, though most grains and beans have some iron. As for protein, the key is variety, with grains and legumes as the foundation. Tempeh is still a staple for me--it's a firm soya cake fermented for a strong, nutty flavor, great for stews and stir-fry. Grains of all sorts are easy with a rice cooker--I'll often do two parts rice to one part amaranth or quinoa(flavorful grains with a good protein profile).

Originally Posted by Taosaur

If you try to live on tofu and pasta, you might have problems, just as if you tried to live on nothing but pig. As long as you keep a balanced diet, though, veggie or otherwise, you'll be fine.

Precisely!

Too many vegetarians that I know personally think vegetarianism consists of munching on lettuce and carrots.

In the same vein, too many meat eaters (or college students in general, really) eat nothing but pepperoni pizza and burgers.

Few people actually know what the heck to do about food, especially in the first few years after moving out of their parents' house.

Vegetarians have been around a lot longer than multivitamins.

^Indeed

If you do want supplements however, eat a superfood complex; synthetic vitamins are only 30% effective at best, at worst they may even be harmful. I use it twice per week because my diet consists largely of potatoes and rice. I have been veg for 8 years and no problems. I never go to the doctor's for anything.

Anyway I hope no one takes personal experiences too seriously, what with all this "I never had any problems, I'm doing fine, I'm this, that..." Everyone is different with different needs, mmkay?