Why is the world going crazy?

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Originally Posted by Xaqaria

Your own link says that Jews hadn't had any control or even fought over the area since 61 B.C. when Rome took control over the area. What are you trying to prove with it? The Christians and the Muslims have fought over the area a great deal more. It looks like you just went and nabbed a link without even reading to see if it supported what you were trying to say.

I didn't say Jews had control. It was Muslim dominated, but Jews believed it was theirs and did push to live there, with resistance. But it is true that the fight over the land involved Christians more than Jews for a lot of the time and that the Jewish part of the push was pretty wimpy for a long time.

The point is that the "holy land" has been fought over since ancient times and Jews and Arabs, who have been mostly Muslims for many centuries, have been part of it the whole time, on whatever levels. And "ancient" does not inherently mean "B.C."

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xaqaria

Are you just having trouble admitting you are wrong? Islam didn't even exist during the 'ancient times' when Jews had control over the place they called Israel. How could Jews and Muslims be fighting when Muslims didn't exist? Like I've said 3 times now, Someone has been fighting over the land for thousands of years but it has only been Israeli's and Arabs for a relatively short amount of time.

Islam didn't exist during ancient times? That depends on your definition of "ancient". I never said Muslims were fighting Jews over the land when Jews had control long ago.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xaqaria

If you'll just take a look at your own source, Muslims captured the land in the 7th century (right around the time Mohamed created the religion) and then held it through different empires up until the 1900's, when the Zionist movement first began. That means that during the first 1300 years of their existence, Muslims did not fight Jews over the land in the West Bank. How exactly does that constitute "Jews and Muslims have been fighting over it since ancient times"?

Why are you so determined to split hairs? Weak fighting is still fighting. The prejudice, the exclusion, and the resulting rebellion existed. Again, the fight over the "holy land" has been going on since ancient times and Jews and Muslims have been significantly and often heavily involved in it. The fighting over the "holy land" is nothing new period, and it is nothing new for Jews and Muslims to be part of it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xaqaria

You live in Tennessee, right? I wonder how you might feel to find out that you actually live in the Cherokee Nation, even though it hasn't been that for almost 200 years. Imagine if it hadn't been the Cherokee Nation for more than 2000 years but someone was still trying to argue with you that it never was Tennessee in the first place. What would you tell them? Are you currently fighting the Cherokee's over the land?

I live in Mississippi, and I am part Cherokee. There are Cherokees that believe Cherokee land was stolen and should be returned to Cherokees, but that is extraordinarily fringe compared to the Jewish belief that the "holy land" belongs to Jews and has since God gave it to them, a belief that has existed on a very large scale since ancient times and acted on with violence on so many, many occasions. As far as I know, there has not been a single Cherokee who has had any kind of physical confrontation or exclusion from Mississippi based on heritage in my life time.

I was gonna say that Zionism is one of the major factors as to why the Israeli-Palestinean conflict exists today, but alas it's already been mentioned.

Instead, I'll just say that the world has always been crazy. Life is no ordinary thing, and some people in this unordinary existence make it extraunordinary.

Screw religion. Its the worst evil the human race has ever seen.

Religion is as good as anything else - in appropriate amounts. It's when religious fanatics fight with each other that it appears in a bad light.

The world isn't going crazy. You are. If people keep taking religion so seriously it's bound to continue being a problem to this species. Maybe some more blasphemy would help.

It's not religion itself, it's how people use it. Religion is no different from any institution, it can be used for both good and evil purposes. People suck.

I've often found a strange disturbance and at the same time comfort in realising that humanity has allways had trouble behaving.

Imagine living in Israël, being an Israëlite at the times of the Roman opression. Or an Israëlite at times of the babylonian opression and slavery. Or an African being abducted, shipped across continent and put to work as a slave...

The world of humans has allways been fucked up. Perhaps comparing these times to those I just mentioned, we might actually conclude that we're doing quite alot better these days. Not much though.