Printable View
I'm curious to see how people think about this. The idea is: if someone offered you a potion that would permanently put you into a coma, where you would continue dreaming (lucid) for the rest of your life, would you take it? In the dream you'd be able to do anything you can imagine. What kind of conditions would you consider before choosing?
Note: Your body would be preserved somehow, so that's not an issue.
I would be concerned for the mental welfare of anybody who opted for such a thing.
Certainly not, I have a (normal) life to live.
I can't imagine living without interaction with other people, other than the obvious reasons it's very important for personal growth too.
You could still interact with people, or at least your mind's image and perception of them.
And that's a trivial distinction for you?
No, because you'd always know that it's not real. But that's why I also asked what conditions would influence your decision. For example, if your memory was wiped when you took the potion, then you'd live on in a lucid dream, not knowing it isn't real. You'd be able to do anything you wanted, but you wouldn't understand why.
I might be down with some time limit. Go into a lucid coma for a year maybe? A month? It would be an interesting experiment.
Even in a month, you could dream out an entire life time ... then would you be the same person when you woke up?Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilosopherStoned
Virtual vacations for a limit time- definitely. It's been the subject of a lot of great stories.
But forever? For what purpose? Have I been brain damaged or severely handicapped? Is the world over-populated or out of resources so people place themselves into "body banks"? Have I simply experienced a great personal trauma and need time to heal? Has my body died but my mind been placed in some sort of virtual reality until a new body can be found?
Or how about, I'm simply living as I am today- struggling with emotional problems with my kids, spouse, religion etc... would I want a coma? Maybe for a week, just to get away from it all. Would I be the same person?
..... I don't know. I rarely have lucids as mostly a matter of choice. I like seeing what my subconscious mind has picked up and how it places things together in a jigsaw puzzle sort of fashion. I have incredibly intense dreams- dreams of flying, space travel, being other people, being nothingness, being a bug, a car, a spaceship, various animals etc. I do love my dreams :D
I think I would gladly go into a coma for "X" amount of time as an exercise into my creative mind. I could dream (as I have in the past) of being in "god-mode" and terraform planets and create various forms of life.
I wouldn't want to substitute dreams with reality though. I wouldn't want to dream of a perfect life because when I woke up life wouldn't be as I had dreamed which would make me crazy-depressed I think.
Very interesting thread...
yeah, doing something like that could be extremely mentally dangerous, if, say, you lived out an entire life and woke up to find that it's all not real (which I think has happened to some people)
Perhaps if one were seriously considering suicide, an idea like this might be nice, perhaps for a month, year, whatever, just to give them perspective on how there's too much beauty to quit.
Interesting idea.
it certainly not something I would want to do. in fact I have felt this state, and I for one dont like it I cant move, it feels like something is preventing me to move, a comatose state is not fun.
Now that I think about it, this same kind of thing happens in The Matrix. Cypher(sp?) agrees to help the machines in exchange for living in the matrix, permanently, with benefits.
EDIT:
You mean you wouldn't because of how it would feel to your body? But you'd be dreaming and unable to feel your real body any longer.Quote:
Originally Posted by Laura
I think some may fear that you, Vampyre, are severely depressed and longing for such a state.
I've not been keeping up with the forum as much as I would like, but I don't think you're asking because you want to escape depression but because you're simply creative and curious.
Yeah, I thought of the Matrix and Vanilla Sky when I posted what I did (and a few other movies lol).
I would be afraid to do something too long term because what if something went wrong and I became trapped in a nightmare?
As for depression... yeah, I've been there too, Laura and Trev. I teeter on that brink to this day. Sometimes it's easier just to sleep and let the world and your problems slip over you as a state of oblivion instead of burying you alive.
But what if you weren't depressed? If life was absolutely perfect, would you like such a potion? Even if only for a day, a week, a month?
It's actually a concept I thought of when thinking of the mentality of a villain in a story I intend to write.
My view is about the same as everyone else above. I would go for it if it wasn't permanent, but otherwise...not likely.
Just think of all the things you would love to do if you were conscious in a lucid state somehow. All the things that we love to do in lucid dreams open. It'd be really cool. Then I thought of a way to make that possible: a coma potion. It's a "no-pain; no-gain" scenario though. You'd have to sacrifice reality to have it.
I also concluded that it becomes totally different if the potion erases your memory, or some other means to make you think that it's real. Why is that different? Because how can you guarantee you haven't already made that decision and are living in a dream right now? :p
It's thinking about this that makes me curious about how other people think about it.
I think your mind would degenerate and you would eventually become a madman living inside your own head.
Maybe I would if there was something wrong with me that prevented me from living life to its fullest. i.e if I was paralyzed, or insane or something like that.
but If I had to choose, right now, between my current life and a perfect life? I would most definitely not.
But for maybe, a week or a month? Probably :)
This is just like Vanilla Sky. And I'll say what Tom Cruise said, "I want to live a real life." Now, that is to say I wouldn't want to do it permanently. I think if I ever became severaly handicapped, etc, maybe I would want to do it. If I were to do it to escape my own reality, I would make sure I didn't know I was dreaming.
I think it'd be incredible to do this for a short amount of time, and would definitely do so. The idea apeals to me very much.
No, that'd be what happens if you could never sleep again. Beside that, we already basically "live in our own heads."Quote:
Originally Posted by Black_Eagle
I think there needs to be a "Random Hypotheticals" section.
I wouldn't drink such a potion.
In dreams people aren't real and everything depends on your imagination. I'm sure that once the initial delight would wear off, you'd want to eat and sleep there, to perform all the functions you do in daily life. And you'd soon find out that it's impossible to a large extent and your imagination can only provide you with pale imitations.
Besides, DCs and things transform in dreams. It would be annoying to imagine yourself talking to your friends and suddenly see them transformed into hedgehogs. That would considerably impair making a version of reality out of dreams. No, I think permanent LDing would be boring like hell, it's too limiting when the only imput "reality" demands to exist is yours.
If you lived out an entire life inside your dream for even a day, then you would probably forget what real life is like.
tQuote:
Originally Posted by Vampyre
Yes, I hear what you are saying, but the sensation of it, when its happening, is not a good sensation, and I am a aware that there is something wrong.
and I try to fight the state, I am fully aware that I am fighting it, and have to tell myself that its o.k. its a lucid dream, but I wake up feeling weird, there was one time, when I was lying down, in the afternoon for a nap. I started to feel it come on. I sometimes feel like there is such a heavy weight on me, that I can not move, I try but I cant. In this state once, I remember trying to push my self off my couch, where I thought I was, I was convinced I was, and I was doing this in order to wake up from it, and in this state I remember thinking, well, if I fall off my couch it will be ok. because the drop to the floor was not far, and I knew I would not get that hurt, or at least I thought this, but when I finally awoke, I was not on my couch like I thought I was in my bedroom, on my bed, which is very high off the ground, and falling off of that would have certainly caused me some injury. strange. I have also expereinced lucid dreaming, with sound I hear sounds as well.T this has happened to me for a long time now, and find it so strange that people actually want to do this, I really do...I have been places in my lucid dreams, that are scary, and I wake up feeling so strange. The lucid dreams with sound are something else. there was one where two steam engines on tracks were coming from opposite directions, I remember clearly although it was some time ago, but this one sticks out, because these two steam engines were going toward each other and me watching right there, I knew they wouldl crash, but it was the sound of them, deafening to my ears thats how loud it was. horrible stuff.................but I can go on and on, because I have had many, and been in tunnels dark ones, with a distances that seem far far far away, but I see a light at the end of these tunnels, a faded very faded light, the way the sun would look perhaps if there were layers and layers of couds covering the sun, almost like a faint faint light, but I want to go there, but its far away, so far, but I can see it...there are always things at the end of these tunnels, once I saw as I tried to get closer, and closer to make out the things I think Im seeing, and one time as I got close enough all I could see was one eye, just staring back at me,one eye. I got frightened. but the best of any of these is flyingl.................
Funny how not a single person has mentioned the heartache of loved ones around them if they were to go into a coma for a permanent or even extended period of time.
Go connect with some humans, DVers.
what do you mean could you please help me understand what do you mean conect with humans. is this what you would like to do?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mes Tarrant
Is that what you would tell people that would go on a trip to mars or for that matter, spend a few months in a nuclear submarine? It would be a good experiment to do for an extended period of time. I don't see the heartache involved if they knew what was going to happen and when it was going to be over. They might miss you but thats something that people deal with. Given the fact that this is hypothetical to begin with, I think you're a little off base telling us to connect with people and assuming that we aren't already.
If the potion cleared your memory then it'd be just like real life because you wouldn't know it's a dream. You'd still act normally until you discovered the gifts of lucidity.Quote:
Originally Posted by Arutad
If someone wanted to be out permanently, then they obviously don't care about the real world. If it's only temporary, then it shouldn't be a problem. Kinda like a vacation or something.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mes Tarrant
I wouldn't like to do this - strange to say but after a while when lucid, I just want to sleep normally. It gets annoying when you're lucid and you string repeated lucid dreams one after another after continuous false awakenings, and after a while I feel I just want to sleep and not be in control of my dreams anymore - I worry this frustration might carry over into this state should it happen...
:shock:
Sounds like sleep paralysis.Quote:
Originally Posted by Laura
Lol Mes! Good observation.
If I knew someone who was going to go on any kind of *extended* trip without their family/loved ones, I would counsel against it. Sometimes new experiences must be sacrificed for the sake of those we care about.
But a week... a month... I think our loved ones could manage that sort of absence without much trouble :D
But you're right Mes. I never even considered my family/friends while considering this. Which opens up a whole new creative angle. The coma potions could be seen as a drug, maybe even facing a ban... makes me think of a movie (grrr, what was it called? Solvent Green or something, I think. Don't know why really.)
**Edit**
God bless Google :D
It's Soylent Green http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0070723/plotsummary
So what about travelling? Going to a university that is not close to the family?Quote:
Originally Posted by Zhaylin
What about accepting a job in another country? What about moving?
If you can only make decisions that have a dremendous effect on your own
life in dependency of all the people you love or that love you, you wouldn't
be really living your own life now, wouldn't you?
While I agree that taking a drug (or potion for that matter) to just simply
'escape' wouldn't be the right thing to do, especially (or mainly) because
of what you would do to others, but the same doesn't go for, quote, 'any kind
of extended trip', IMO.
And if I remember correctly, were you not considering leaving your loved
ones to escape, take an extended trip, as well? I mean no offense - and
I'm glad, if you have changed your mind, but I can't help but notice the
parallels.
Oh I've thought about MANY forms of extended trips :P But, when it comes right down to it, I weigh the pros and cons and couldn't.
It's the same with this scenario.
My last post was written as a parent and wife, not as a teen/young adult who must leave the nest and start their own life. Perhaps my choice of words was wrong when I included "any kind". I was thinking about the examples presented: a trip to space or in a sub- NOT going to work or college. But again, from a parents/spouses perspective, I still wouldn't encourage lengthy absences from ones family.
But yeah... I've been accused of being too passive and dependant but I call it maturity, compromising, empathy and loyalty :D
I don't think that's what Mes was getting at, least not considering she's been living in South Korea for a year now. Just people were quick to answer without consideration for loved ones, not that they shouldn't go away for an extended period of time.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zhaylin
My personal opinion is that your loved ones should be considered when making ANY decision. Taking a coma drug, moving to college, exploring Mars, whatever. It sounds like some of you wouldn't consider other people, and that's fine, that's just a difference in priorities that we have.
For you to better understand my POV, consider the following situation:
Mom: Please don't do [somethingsomething].
Kid: It's MY life. I can do whatever I want.
In this situation I would side with Mom, because YES, it's your life, but part of your life is considering other people when making decisions.
Anyway, I knew people would get a little upset at my comment. :D Don't mean to offend.
Edit: Adam, yep that's right! Thanks.
I concur.
http://ihasahotdog.files.wordpress.c...-you-leave.jpg
So does he.
If a person can suffer for his loved ones, can't it be the other way around?
Exactly, I'm amazed nobody is even considering it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mes Tarrant
That's why I said you'd have to have questionable mental health.
I think that I'm probably going to side with the kid here 9/10 times. It is the kids life and I don't see why it is seen as acceptable for selfish parents to consider their own wishes over that of their kids. Shouldn't it be the other way around? It's like the parents get to say, "I love you more than anything and I want you to be happy, so long as I get to continue to control your behaviour forever."Quote:
Originally Posted by Mes Tarrant
Ultimately, it depends on the parent. Some of them will be reasonable and realize that their kids will go off and live their own lives. Others will want to control forever. I see no reason why a kid that is cursed with the latter type of parent should have to have a less fulfilling life than one with the former.
BTW, I surely didn't take offense. I was just pointing out that saying that we lack connection to other humans because of an answer to a highly hypothetical question is a little silly, don't you think? Even if the question wasn't hypothetical, don't you think that the correct order would be to decide if you even wanted to do it to begin with before considering it's impact on your family?
^^ The issue isn't about parents with too much control. It's about people thinking of others as well as themselves. But that's not a distinction that everyone can make, and that's a big part of where the differences in opinion on the matter come from.
I also think that the reality or not of the situation doesn't matter. Besides, we reveal a lot of our morals and such from purely hypothetical situations. Isn't that their purpose?
^^The issue is sort of families that are too clingy. Some families would be all for it or some other trip, life change etc., that the person in question would find rewarding but that would separate them from the family. Others wouldn't. Why should somebody with the former be more free than someone with the latter? That to me seems to be the fundamental problem with thinking about families too much when making a decision like that. You owe it to your parents to live your life to the fullest. At least, thats what I'm going to tell my kids.
I think what Mes Tarrant was originally getting at was just how nobody explicitly stated their concern for others in their decision about the coma potion.Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilosopherStoned
That's right Vampyre.
I don't really want to go much further into that side debate. I get what your side of the argument, but.. I feel like we couldn't really understand one another fully unless we were both adults independent from our parents.
Well I am an adult. I'm 28. And I'm mostly independent of my parents other than the fact that I work on the family business right now. I do understand both sides as well. I just happen to disagree. It is the most interesting debate that's come out of the question though since most people agree that they wouldn't want to do it forever.
Oh you are! :) Well that's good... I've come to expect most DVers to be younger.
Okay then, I'll continue from your other post.
We disagree on a basic level that I don't think will change... IMO living your life to the fullest includes the people around you. Living your life doesn't have to be defined as just going off somewhere on your own (college, a trip, a coma). I think a part of our lives is being responsible for others.
I would never argue that listening to your mom when she begs you to not move away to college (for example) is a good idea. Obviously that would hinder your life as well as others' indirectly.
I started this train of thought in the first place because no one mentioned another living soul when considering conditions for taking a coma drug. Okay fine so some people said, "Well I'd only want to be in a coma for a month tops." That's great, but still a thought towards other people would be logical, IMO.
Even if there was a coma potion to do so, the fact still remains that none of it is real and there are probably limitations to consider.
Plus, though in a dream you can wish into reality anything you want in an instant, its much more satisfying to go through the process in real life and come out with that feeling of accomplishment. In a dream, its almost like your cheating by wishing things into existence, sure you could create the impression of progression, but at the end of the day it is always going to be an illusion.
Real waking life is much more satisfying and being able to share the human experience with others is literally a once in a lifetime opportunity. I'd rather have a part of the day when i dream and let it motivate my real life activities, almost like a teaser of what is to come in real life providing i put in the effort.
Though i love my dreams, they still remain dreams and i'd rather leave them to my dedicated sleeping hours :P
hm...For me, the best part about dreaming is telling others about it after waking up...kind of hard to do that when asleep for months at a time...hell, even after a few days the dreams would accumulate too much to be able to recall and tell them all. So no, I wouldn't take the potion.
That's why I included the question of what conditions you would consider. Think about it, you could do anything from this scenario. Like, let's say you want to see what it'd be like to live as a rock star for a while. You'd be able to experience it in a way that you can't in reality. Normally, you'd just dream about it, but this would be living it for a while.Quote:
Originally Posted by Adrenaline Junkie
I was kind of expecting people to make mention of it being cool to have extended dreams. I'm surprised it hasn't come up at all.