Forcefeeding Children In Mauritania

So I saw Taboo last night and this pissed me off the most! It's one thing if an adult wants to gorge themselves to death, but it's another story to shove food down a child's throat despite that they are crying and insisting that their stomach hurts - to threaten to beat the child if they don't continue eating - to forcefeed them their own vomit heartlessly

Mauritania is a most depressing mirror. I think an international movement should sweep in and take these poor abused children away from this place.

http://www.marieclaire.com/world-rep...-in-mauritania

http://africaaction.typepad.com/justafrica/health/

Some sources will lie and say that this practice is dead. But show Taboo showed recent and revealing footage. :?

I really hate the arrogance prevalent in the Western World. Their culture is different, it is to us abhorrent but there are practices equally as abhorrent in a huge number of countries. In India old men have young wives who jump on their funeral pyre. It is not the job of "international movements" to rampage around the world stealing children from people whose cultures we deem to be immoral. Morality is not so absolute that you can judge the rest of the world by your own rigid sense of morality and then act upon it. That's my take on it. I think these people's cultures and traditions should be allowed to evolve and develop over time.

I am not criticizing their right to view big as beautiful. I am criticizing how they have treated and ABUSED their children. Some children have already died from choking on their own vomit. For the record, the more intelligent Mauritanians already deem it as child abuse. This child abuse is real.

I'm sorry, but respecting another culture versus the abuse of a child? Get real! That childs life and health and safety is more important than ANY culture.

I don't think you understand my point. Practices as "immoral" as this one are going on all around the world, in tribes and villages all around the "developing world". What do you suggest? That we civilized folk rampage around the globe telling people how they should conduct their lives? Human sacrifice is a big part of human history. There have always been traditions that according to our modern, Western standards are immoral. Such is life is it not? What do you believe we should do? More global policing but on a more personal level?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by imran_p

I don't think you understand my point. Practices as "immoral" as this one are going on all around the world, in tribes and villages all around the "developing world". What do you suggest? That we civilized folk rampage around the globe telling people how they should conduct their lives? Human sacrifice is a big part of human history. There have always been traditions that according to our modern, Western standards are immoral. Such is life is it not? What do you believe we should do? More global policing but on a more personal level?

---

The reason why I made this thread is to spread awareness. Awareness is the first step. The average american just says "Yes there's suffering all around the world but what can I do about it, nothing". It's an apathetic let's turn a blind eye attitude. The first step to conquering apathy is learning. We can't remain ignorant about what's going on in the world.

Mauritanians have argued back that what they practice on their kids isn't any different than us 'forcing' children to starve or become anorexic and bolimic. That's why I called Mauritania a mirror.

I wasn't offering a global policy of action, it's was me expressing my anger. I wouldn't give a damn of someone did take those children away from their heartless parents who only care about forcing their children to fit some contrived ideal :cheeky:

Obviously, a thread on some random forum isn't global policy. It does however serve as a platform for awareness. But the more people are aware, there more there is international action, on any and all levels. For one, there are already mauritanian girls undergoing this abuse who were dreaming of having careers. They were dreaming of having careers because of international influence. This abuse however is so their parents can marry them away as early as 14, stealing their opportunity to stay in school and learn and choose their own life.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by imran_p

I really hate the arrogance prevalent in the Western World. Their culture is different, it is to us abhorrent but there are practices equally as abhorrent in a huge number of countries. In India old men have young wives who jump on their funeral pyre. It is not the job of "international movements" to rampage around the world stealing children from people whose cultures we deem to be immoral. Morality is not so absolute that you can judge the rest of the world by your own rigid sense of morality and then act upon it. That's my take on it. I think these people's cultures and traditions should be allowed to evolve and develop over time.

---

Well my take is that there are univeral right and wrongs. Nations are allowed to practive whatever traditions or rituals they want, but inhumane treatment is always wrong. Morals do vary according to belief systems, such as christian morality regarding homosexuality, but there are certain morals that remain constant in almost every culture. They are the universal morals that we as humans know instinctively, such as it is wrong to kill an innocent person. You can't use the fact that they are a different culture as an excuse for poor ethical treatment of people. Just because Afghanistan is a different culture, doesn't mean it is right for them to oppress women. Don't you see what that line of thinking can lead to? With that philosophy, you can justify almost any human rights violation in history.

Not so long ago we in the West were burning women who we randomly decided were witches. How about slavery? I am a big believer in natural, internal change. Those practices are no longer adhered to. Some would argue we have an altogether different form of slavery, but the point remains, America, and its people developed over time. Their cultures will do the same.

You mean like the act that many people consider genital mutilation, that involves ritually cutting off skin around your penis? Which in the west is generally considered an acceptable practice if you are male, though the female version is considered a gross crime. It can also lead to death in few cases.

Any way, forcing someone to eat until their stomach explodes is obviously a horrible thing. They don't even have the high calorie candy and junk food over there, so trying to get that many calories from like milk and stuff is crazy. I would agree that it is clearly child abuse.

imran, assuming the article is correct, their culture has regressed over time due to an military coup two years ago.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by imran_p

Not so long ago we in the West were burning women who we randomly decided were witches. How about slavery? I am a big believer in natural, internal change. Those practices are no longer adhered to. Some would argue we have an altogether different form of slavery, but the point remains, America, and its people developed over time. Their cultures will do the same.

---

That isn't true at all. Some of these practices have been around for hundreds or even upwards of a thousand years, nothing says they will "develop" out of it. And if they do, how long will that take? How many years of unethical practices do those people have to endure? When will the African continent become fully developed? You may argue that with technological advancement comes more enlightened cultures, but many technically advanced cultures have kept their traditional practices which are considered unethical to "westerners." They identify with these practices as a part of their heritage and they keep these traditions in spite of industrial advancement and protest from western countries.

The western world doesn't make the rules, the rules are natural. So this isn't western cultures policing the world and pushing their beliefs on people.

Come on this is nonsense. tell me of all these natural rules? There are no natural laws involving circumcision, or ritual beatings, or slavery. None. Cultures make their own morals and rules, of course they do, if these rules were natural why would there be such a huge diversity throughout the world in terms of morals and ethics? I'm not saying I agree with it, to me it's disgusting to force feed a child. Just as disgusting as brainwashing a child into believing certain falsehoods that restrict and devalue life.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by imran_p

I don't think you understand my point. Practices as "immoral" as this one are going on all around the world, in tribes and villages all around the "developing world". What do you suggest? That we civilized folk rampage around the globe telling people how they should conduct their lives? Human sacrifice is a big part of human history. There have always been traditions that according to our modern, Western standards are immoral. Such is life is it not? What do you believe we should do? More global policing but on a more personal level?

---

You don't have to force someone to accept your views in order to show them. Even a complete moral relativist can accept the fact that it is okay to show other people what you believe is good and then let them decide for themselves. Spreading information is not "rampaging around the world".

You say that their culture will develop over time as if they just left the bronze age or something. Their culture has been developing for thousands of years, and this is how far they have gotten. How much more time are we going to give them before we start making an effort to spread our ideas of basic human rights to these places? Be sure to realize that I am not talking about military intervention, I am talking about the spread of information. Not only that, how much time are we going to give ourselves before we start wising up to our own morals and stop doing business with people who do things that we see as despicable?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alric

You mean like the act that many people consider genital mutilation, that involves ritually cutting off skin around your penis? Which in the west is generally considered an acceptable practice if you are male, though the female version is considered a gross crime. It can also lead to death in few cases.

---

Actually, female circumsicion is not just cutting off a little skin, it is cutting off the clitoris, which would be about the same as cutting off the head of a man's penis. The purpose is to keep women from enjoying sex, whereas male circumcision is mostly done for hygenic reasons.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by imran_p

Come on this is nonsense. tell me of all these natural rules? There are no natural laws involving circumcision, or ritual beatings, or slavery. None. Cultures make their own morals and rules, of course they do, if these rules were natural why would there be such a huge diversity throughout the world in terms of morals and ethics? I'm not saying I agree with it, to me it's disgusting to force feed a child. Just as disgusting as brainwashing a child into believing certain falsehoods that restrict and devalue life.

---

Morality evolved just as every other aspect of our personalities evolved. Living in a small tribe 100,000 years ago, you had to follow these rules or you could be ostracized. Examples of these rules are killing/injuring an innocent person, lieing, cheating, stealing, and basically anything that deliberately wrongs another person. The really grotesque rituals that we see in cultures are a somewhat recent development in human history. They are usually found in larger scale societies and are fueled by some type of religious dogma. The fear of the divine will cause humans to do nasty things to each other, such as human sacrifice or burning witches at the stake. That is the force which causes humans to ignore the fact that they are breaking the rules and doing cruel things. You would be hard pressed to find one of these rituals that didn't have religious origins. So various religions cause societies to make exceptions for some of these rules, but almost all humans naturally agree on this universal set of rules because they evolved naturally. If you're human, you have a sense of this natural morality.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Xaqaria

male circumcision is mostly done for hygenic reasons.

---

This is a myth. there is nothing unhygenic about a foreskin. It is a remnant from superstitious religious ritual. But it IS amazing how widespread this practice is. All over the world, even the Aborigines in Australia do it and have done it forever, and they were very isolated from the rest of the world. It's curious. Actually, the aborigines go to quite an extreme and cut down the length of their penis to the urethra so they can't even urinate properly! Very bizarre. i don't even know how they have sex! But I try not to think about that.

Spreading awareness is good. It's not like I want all the cultures to fade away and the whole world to become one monoculture with a McDonald's in every town, but I would like human rights to be applied to every person regardless of their culture. And I would like everyone to be able to choose to not take part in a cultural practice that is harmful to the individual. I bet if you asked anybody if you could cut their foreskin off they would say no. And if they are saying that their stomach hurts and they can't eat another bite or it'll kill them, it would be a crime not to respect that, regardless of culture. People should not be victimized by their culture.

Some may say that we are privileged enough to complain, but if not us, then who?

I think that if these people are going to have a culture to be big people and want their children to do the same, why not give them a way to do this by having some fast food chain start a business over there. I am being serious. I know our country is about being fit, but they live their lives trying to be fat. If we were to just move fast food there, it would not only generate money for whatever company did it, but the children would not have to be tortured in order to make them fat(and they would get a new toy each meal).