Killing Dream Characters

My theory on Dream Characters is that they are actually autonomous, or even self aware, entities living in the subconscious realm, able to "clothe" themselves as different characters, but remaining basically the same. Some are friendly, some indifferent and some are actually hostile.
When I have encountered belligerent characters during past lucid dreams, I have sometimes stared them down to make them stop their hostile acts or make them go away. But a few nights ago, while in a particularly lucid dream, I confronted a nasty character that was right in my face, so to speak. I decided to kill him, not just in the dream, but completely absorb the energy it contained to destroy it permanently.
I grabbed his head and stared into his angry eyes so he couldn't look away and break eye contact, forcibly shouting something like "die!" or words to that effect. It was very intense, and in a few seconds, he seemed to "explode" in a bright flash, followed immediately by a strange type of light maze, as if the remnants of this entity was being reabsorbed by my subconscious mind.
A woman then appeared in a square frame, seeming to speak to me, but not making a sound. I had no interpretation for that part.
I awoke feeling refreshed and quite good about myself. I believed I had actually destroyed a dream entity for good, and somehow absorbed its energy.
Has anyone had similar experiences? This was very unusual for me, considering that my dreams are almost always bizarre anyway.

That sounds amazing, and its something I'll definitely try once I get more control of my dreams and once I get the balls to look an angry DC character in the eyes and destroy him by the force of will alone. Congrats

I believe that all the DCs are your subconscious, you believe you destroyed him for good, it probably happened, or if you forget about something in a dream, it doesn't exist unless you think about it again. Believe what you want though.

Raetin
Your reply was a little cryptic. I hope I don't ever get locked up with you, but if I do, I'll certainly look you dead in the eyes.
Anyway, DCs may indeed be part of my subconscious, but that doesn't mean they aren't self aware. They must certainly feed off my brain and exist within it, but like multiple personalities, they could be separate entities with lives of their own, couldn't they? And just like Eve White, in the Three Faces of Eve, I believe they can be destroyed.

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Originally Posted by MissAnana

Raetin
Your reply was a little cryptic. I hope I don't ever get locked up with you, but if I do, I'll certainly look you dead in the eyes.
Anyway, DCs may indeed be part of my subconscious, but that doesn't mean they aren't self aware. They must certainly feed off my brain and exist within it, but like multiple personalities, they could be separate entities with lives of their own, couldn't they? And just like Eve White, in the Three Faces of Eve, I believe they can be destroyed.

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Lol, if you can see my eyes.

We all have our opinions and I find it hard to change someones mind in these forums. Everything is like an illusion in a dream, when you say something in a dream, you think how the DC will react and probably will react like that. Their not aware, they just seem to be. Separate entities that go into your dreams.... don't really know much about that. I don't know about Eve White either, sorry.

That sounds pretty interesting. But personally I would never be able to kill a DC, even though I believe they're just something my mind came up with, and not entities or something more than day residue.

I've used this method to absorb and destroy dark/fear-based creatures. Ghosts and monsters and such. It's quite effective in the short-term, though I wouldn't go so far as to claim that they were independent entities. I was just trying to avoid a nightmare.

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Originally Posted by Puffin

But personally I would never be able to kill a DC

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Hah, I can't imagine. Honestly, I can't seem to stop myself from killing DCs. I should post in the Dream Interpretation section sometime, let the wannabe pop psychologists go at it. :P

Samael;
You used the method of staring into DC eyes to "kill" them? Did you see an explosion of bright light, or a kind of animated maze or pattern of light afterward? I'd love to hear more about the method and after effects of the "killing".
By the way, I'm not some bloodthirsty guy going around murdering innocent dream characters for fun. The one I destroyed was asking for it.

It's funny; I just had another one last night.

Not exactly. With creatures, I'll absorb all their dark energy. This involves telekinetically forcing a black, smoke-like substance from the creature, and then pulling it into my body. With DCs that are supposed to have "souls", I shake the energy loose by pushing a wave of clear, blue-tinged energy into the chest of the victim, then pulling the soul free as the energy latches around it. And I'll absorb the soul, too.

Like I said, I don't think DCs are entities on their own, but this does seem to work in the short term, when an enemy DC is hassling me. I use the dark energy version more often than stealing souls, though.

I was kind of hoping to discover a universal method of killing DCs that would be the same for everyone, but it seems that it's like dreams themselves, that the method is different for each individual. It seems to be more symbolic than absolute. Oh well, that in itself is a discovery. Or maybe Samael is just pulling my leg.

Why would you want to kill any DC? They represent a part of you, and maybe you should try to understand them rather than kill them. I am not sure, but maybe you have been playing too many video games where you kill people, and that seems like the "thing to do". I was reading a few posts here from "kids" who encounter all kinds of hostile DC's, and I'm guessing that the reason they encounter them, is because of the video games, and the feeling that they give you ....sort of makes you subconsciously want to "kill anything that moves". I like video games as much as the next person, but I think if you play them too much and if they are a big part of your life...then they also become a big part of your subconscious activities. The real world is more fun I think...and less antagonistic.

So if a DC is repeatably kept stabbing you, would you let him?? Video Games I don't think are the reason, just being able to kill someone without actually killing someone might be it. Killing someone in a dream is no different from thinking of killing someone in your mind, except the vividness, in my opinion. Though I don't kill any of my DCs unless they mean me harm.

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Originally Posted by MissAnana

Or maybe Samael is just pulling my leg.

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Cross my heart. :D

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Originally Posted by Amalgam

Why would you want to kill any DC? They represent a part of you, and maybe you should try to understand them rather than kill them. I am not sure, but maybe you have been playing too many video games where you kill people, and that seems like the "thing to do".

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Hence the absorption method. By absorbing their energy, you're symbolically reintegrating the DC into yourself, and accepting it as a part of who you are. Also, because they're trying to kill me. Obviously.

As for the video game comparison, I really don't see the similarity. Lucid dreaming is much cheaper than buying games.

Seriously, though? I spend maybe thirty hours on video gaming in a year. Somehow, I don't think that's where my violent dreams are coming from. Here's an idea: some of us have vivid, horribly realistic nightmares, and fighting back is the only way to stop them from happening. I've found a solution that works, so I'll pass on being lectured for it. See:

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Originally Posted by Raetin

So if a DC is repeatably kept stabbing you, would you let him??

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/rant

Also, DCs are not only the human shaped ones, but everything within dreams that seems alive, so not that hard to kill them in lucids, for those who say they wouldn't bring themselves to.

Here's my two pennies.

Everything that is in your dream is a part of you. Maybe they are an autonomous part of you, but they are still part of you. You can't kill them, not literally. You can make them stop being independent (Which, honestly, if they're sentient beings, may as well be killing. I sort of feel bad for killing my DCs now.) but you can't physically kill them. Unless you like, damage your brain. That makes me wonder if it's possible to consciously will your brain damaged, now... Hrm.

Anyways, back on topic.

As I said, your DCs may or may not be actual, independent, autonomous, sentient beings. Even if they are, however, they're going to "die" as soon as the dream ends or you ignore them in your dream, anyways. So killing them is just taking seconds or minutes off of their (very) temporal lives.

Of course, the same could be said about killing human beings. We only live for, what, 80 years about? So what's wrong with killing us early?

Hmm, such a moral dilemma. Well, maybe I can think of it in this way. I created them, I can destroy them. But what about mothers and fathers and their children, then?

My, my. Who would have ever thought dreams would be this hard to deal with.

Maybe I should just think of it as making myself whole again. But then what about a singularity? I am very anti-singularity. Should I perhaps give my DCs a choice as to whether they want to remerge with me, the main mind?

Wait a minute, why do I presume I'm the main mind? What if I'm just experiencing the sentience of one dream character? Kind of like, how do we say which "person" in a DID case is the REAL person, and which ones we should work to get rid of? Is there even a main mind? What if I am just another part, and when I wake up all the parts reform into the whole?

And no, for your information, I am not intoxicated in any way, shape, or form right now.

Sure, maybe I can activate super-powers and fly and shoot ice out of my hands, but what's to keep the other DCs from doing the same? What if another DC realizes he's just a part of my mind in a dream, and ergo can do whatever he wishes in this world? Would he be able to over-power "me" using dream powers? Maybe two parts of the mind realizing they are dreaming at the same time causes some sort of paradox and destroys the dream? I mean, CAN two lucid dreamers of the same mind exist in the same dream? After all, it's theorized that a single mind can separate into two entities. What if the mind separates into two entities during a dream? Which one would have true control over the dream? Would it be like two omnipotent gods in the same world? But how can two omnipotent beings exist simultaneously?

All so very confusing. I should test this out in a dream. See if I can't separate myself into two beings. I mean, which one would I "take over"? Would I take over either one? Would my current consciousness cease to exist, and would I have simply made two clones of myself with my memories and personality? Maybe I shouldn't try that. I might end up consciousness-dead. I mean, I would wake up, but it wouldn't be me. It would just be somebody with the same memories and personality as me, but it wouldn't be me. My consciousness would be gone.

So scary, so exciting.

Very lively and interesting discussion! How about looking at it this way. It has to do with point of view. The center of consciousness, looking out at other beings around it. The dreamer is the point of view of the dream. The other DCs in your dream do not have this point of view, so they cannot be you, kill you or harm you in any way. Having had years of yoga and meditation experience, I believe this to be true.
It is true that other people IRL also have their own POV, just as DCs probably do, but I don't think a POV can separate into two. In other words, you cannot be two separate beings in a dream, because then you would see the dream from two points of view, which you obviously don't.
Therefore, DCs are not you or part of you, but may be some type of mental beings created by the brain, just as multiple personalities are created by the brain. They are a kind of mental energy, and as such, can be merged back into the brain/mind/self, and you're probably correct, cannot really be killed or destroyed in the sense of killing an actual person.
This it taking a more metaphysical approach, rather than just assuming that DCs are manufactured by the sleeping brain or something left over from waking life. Anyway, why are some DCs so hostile in the first place? Trying to deliver some "message" to the dreamer? Maybe they're trying to tell you to confront your problems and not run away from them?
As Mr. Spock would probably say... "fascinating!"

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Originally Posted by MissAnana

My theory on Dream Characters is that they are actually autonomous, or even self aware, entities living in the subconscious realm, able to "clothe" themselves as different characters, but remaining basically the same. Some are friendly, some indifferent and some are actually hostile.

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Thats probably related to your trail of thought or just random occurrence. Usually, depending which way the dream goes dictates how DCs will respond.

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I grabbed his head and stared into his angry eyes so he couldn't look away and break eye contact, forcibly shouting something like "die!" or words to that effect. It was very intense, and in a few seconds, he seemed to "explode" in a bright flash, followed immediately by a strange type of light maze, as if the remnants of this entity was being reabsorbed by my subconscious mind.

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Well, so? You wanted to absorb his energy, and using dream control, thats what happened. If you expect it to work it will.

I don't see what your getting at? You focused on staring at the DC with muted all other dream aspects and had you paying full attention to a character. Since you broke the storyline, the DC stopped what they were doing and just stood there. Its not hard to achieve this, you just have to realize you are asleep, then stand still and just stare at any character or just listen, and the whole dreamworld can virtually come to a hault, even moreso if your intention is to stop an aspect of the dream from doing something, i.e, being hostile. And then you decide to take their energy.. well, good job. Your dream control worked and the dream simulated it. Not sure what you are trying to get at, while it may be there are entities in the dream world, we ca safely say DCs are not of an independent form, and if they are their consciousness must not be very much.

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Originally Posted by MissAnana

It is true that other people IRL also have their own POV, just as DCs probably do, but I don't think a POV can separate into two. In other words, you cannot be two separate beings in a dream, because then you would see the dream from two points of view, which you obviously don't.

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I've had a dream where I experienced two separate points of view simultaneously. Thinking about it makes my head hurt. There are things that the waking mind was not meant to comprehend...

I'll still try, though. :P

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Originally Posted by Samael

I've had a dream where I experienced two separate points of view simultaneously. Thinking about it makes my head hurt. There are things that the waking mind was not meant to comprehend...

I'll still try, though. :P

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Woah, that sounds awesome, what does seeing in two point of views look like?

It's not split screen or anything, lol. It's more like when you're daydreaming in real life with your eyes open. You can still see everything that's going on around you, but your focus is on the images playing inside your head.

Kind of similar to reading, actually.

Well i havent had two points of view IN a dream but I have had two points of view WHILE dreaming. I was awake and I had my eyes open but i was dreaming at the same time. I could see with both my dream eyes and my real eyes. The images were put with one on top of the other and depending on my focus I either saw my walls as transparent with solid dream world around me or the dream world a transparent projection onto my walls.

I think what you're describing is still really only one point of view, because, although you're seeing two interlaced or overlapping scenes, the "you" that is seeing them is still only one "you". To be split into two points of view would require you to have two "selves", or to be in two places at the same time. I don't think that's possible for one self. It would have to be two separate selves.
I could be wrong, but I can't even imagine being two POVs, any more than I can imagine being able to see the back of my head without a mirror.

But that is exactly what it felt like. Being in two places at once. I knew that only the body laying in my bed was real but I had full senses of the other body. I just described the visual part of it but it went so much deeper than that. Like I could feel myself laying on my back on my bed but i could also feel the wind on my back because in the dream I was outside. I could move both bodies independatly of the other. I wasnt really in two places at once but it felt like I was

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Originally Posted by MissAnana

the "you" that is seeing them is still only one "you". To be split into two points of view would require you to have two "selves", or to be in two places at the same time.

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Haha, I think you underestimate the ingenuity of the human mind, because that's exactly what I'm describing. Two overlapping scenes, in which two separate characters with two entirely separate backstories interact. This must be what going mad feels like. :cheeky:

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Originally Posted by MissAnana

I could be wrong, but I can't even imagine being two POVs, any more than I can imagine being able to see the back of my head without a mirror.

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Then you lack imagination.

I cant imagine being in two places at once either but I have felt it. Though i know it wasnt real and I will likely never experience it again

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Originally Posted by Samael

Then you lack imagination.

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I'll say, third person view is simple in lucids. :P

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Originally Posted by Loaf

I'll say, third person view is simple in lucids. :P

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Sometimes I feel like I'm watching a short movie of myself.

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Originally Posted by Puffin

But personally I would never be able to kill a DC

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What's funny is that in my normal dreams, I'm usually extremely violent (if my environment is also violent). I've killed off loads of dream figures in normal dreams, and it's quite common for them to try to kill me as well.

However, in my lucid dreams, I'm not normally like that. Sometimes if I become lucid while someone is trying to kill me, I'll use a mental power I call "Override" and kill or otherwise incapacitate them, or just render them harmless. But, there was this one time - in a lucid dream - where I grabbed two F16 fighter jets out of midair using telekinesis and smashed them together (and thereby killing the pilots). After I realized what I'd done, I started crying uncontrollably and I couldn't believe what I'd just done. "They were just doing their jobs," is what I said to myself. The more I am in control of myself and my intentions, the less violent I become.

I will start by saying this. Whatever you believe your dreams to be is what they are. I personally believe that dreams are manifestations of other realities, and that makes everything and everyone in them singular entities. I believe in infinite possibilities and an infinite number of dimensions or realities, which I believe is why we are able to take control and do or even make others to whatever we want. Because that is just one possible scenerio. I have killed others in a dream, but only when they were attacking me or in some way threatening something I hold dear. In one instance, there was a woman intruder upstairs in a house that I lived in. She appeared at the top of the stairs and I knew that she intended to harm me or someone else in the house. She started coming at me, but I met her midway up the stairs and and engaged her in combat. It was a very close quarters combat and soon turned to grappling. Then I grabbed her and we both fell over the railing to the bottom, where I locked her neck in my arms and twisted violently breaking her neck (Which took a great deal more strength than I anticipated it would). It was a very disturbing dream for me, but in this dream I held the same values I do in waking life. I have no quarrel killing or attempting to kill if in defense of myself or something I care about. It seems to me if this figure meant you harm, real or not, destruction is not the worst thing you could have done. Besides, if you believe that all beings are one entity experiencing life subjectively, and I do, then you're really only killing a part of yourself anyway. And when you consider that you felt great upon waking, that says to me that it was a part of you that was unneeded, indeed even unwanted.

People often say "if you kill a DC you kill part of yourself". Since DCs regularly respawn and reappear, I don't think I care so much. Besides, probably wouldn't hurt to lose the bumbling idiotic side of myself... :P

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Besides, probably wouldn't hurt to lose the bumbling idiotic side of myself...

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I could stand to lose the creepy stalker side, apparently. :P

Aw heck, lets all just kill anything we see in dreams!

lol Right?

Could you repeat that, I was just reincarnating corpses so I could kill them.

Excellent! Reincarnation in place of resurrection makes for more corpses!

Granted, there are fewer opportunities for zombie jokes. Decisions, decisions.