Various discouraging things I've run into while attempting to LD

Hi guys,
I've lurked around on these forums for a while so I thought it was about time for me to make an account and make a post myself. I've been interested in lucid dreaming for years and my actual attempts have been on and off. Recently starting a month or two ago I've decided to start putting time and effort back into lucid dreaming. I've got a dream journal, I RC regularly, my dream recall is pretty good and I've adjusted my sleep schedule to be more consistent. I've still however never achieved lucidity. There are some things I've noticed that probably contribute to my lack of success.
One is that I spent a good bit of time changing the method I was using. Now I've settled on WBTB + MILD (I've run into some problems here which I'll mention later) which seem like two that would work well with me. I attempted WILDing before many times but I can't bring myself to stay still long enough. Another problem is that I spend a lot of time in front of the computer. This for the most part is not something I can change, so I was wondering how big of an impact this should have on my lucid dreaming journey.
When attempting the WBTB and MILD I've been having trouble falling back to sleep after waking up, and I'm having trouble falling asleep while repeating my mnemonic. I find that when I lie in my bed and repeat a phrase to myself it becomes less convincing as time passes and eventually my mind wanders and I just fall asleep. When I'm determined not to let that happen I keep myself up trying to make sure the final thought I have before falling asleep is my mnemonic.

I think I covered all of the things I'm curious about, I find that it's hard not to get discouraged when attempting to lucid dream without results for this long. I hope someone can help, thanks.

Edit:
Forgot to add that I've also had trouble finding consistent dream signs. Sometimes something extremely bizarre will happen in a dream and when I wake up a record it I'll think to myself 'How was I not able to tell I was dreaming?'.

Hey Mag! It is natural for someone to feel discouraged after countless failed attempts, but with every failed attempt you get better and ever closer to that first LD. If you give up you probably won't have any LD's, but keep at it and you'll have one soon enough. That's the hardest part and after that it's all downhill so if you can make it there I promise you it will be worth it to keep trying.

As for the actual things discouraging you, it's good to settle in and try one method for a while so your body gets used to it and forms a routine, that is a key for LDing.

Sometimes it's unavoidable to spend countless hours in front of a screen, especially if it's part of your job, but as long as you have a period of an hour or so in natural lighting before you get ready for sleep that shouldn't affect anything.

If you can't fall back asleep after your WBTB try setting an alarm for an earlier REM period or if you are getting up and moving or eating, maybe just lay in bed and relax until you're ready to do your MILD so your body stays in "sleep mode"
When you're doing your MILD and repeating your mantra as you drift closer to sleep repeat your mantra less frequently only repeating it if a stray thought comes to mind. Let your self fall asleep, instead of fully concentrating on your mantra, keep it as a governing thought in the back of your mind as you fall asleep. The problem could also be with your mantra, make sure it is something you find truth in maybe something more general instead of something direct like "i am dreaming"

Don't concern yourself with finding a dream sign, that can take plenty of time, just keep journaling and re-read your entries while looking for any consistencies.

Good luck and don't quit, anyone can do it and you're almost there! Peace

Hello there Mag and welcome! I can perfectly relate to your problem because up until about a week and a half ago I had similar problems and naturally I got frustrated too but there's one thought that just brings me back on track: A lot of people can have lucid dreams, I am just as human as they are therefore I can achieve it too. It might take me longer than others but there is nothing stopping me from it but myself.

I personally don't find WBTBing (+ WILD) easy as I'm having a tough time getting my body to relax through and through. Most of my tries are foiled because either my mind falls asleep too fast or I give up after a good while of lying still and being no nearer to a dream then when I started. I still try this technique whenever I can though because eventually I want to master it.
The other path I chose was to practice was ADA and frequent reality checks which seems to finally have taken root after about 2 months. I find this rather pleasant to follow since it's something you just have to do every now and then and you don't get frustrated when you do it. Especially when you are in front of a computer screen it's an easy habit to get into. I myself made a desktop background that says "am i dreaming?" and whenever I look at it it reminds me to take a moment to take in my surroundings and start questioning reality. Other options are post-it's, or actual notification that pops up every so often.

Now, as I mentioned, 2 months later I've just had my 3rd DILD in 10 days last night. Though I don't exactly remember how or what triggered my first LD, the other 2, I clearly remember, were a product of suddenly questioning the oddities of my dreams. Last night for example I got into a car with my gf, drove around and parked somewhere and when I got out of the car I was standing barefoot in the rain, so I asked where my shoes are, already feeling suspicious but not being quite there yet, and I was told by a DC that I had taken them off and thrown them away. It clicked then and I became aware of my dream.

So the best advice I can give you as a newbie myself is to keep doing whatever it is you chose to do, if you want to WBTB and MILD then do that and keep doing it until eventually you succeed and don't allow yourself to get discouraged. I personally like that safety net of ADA, so when your WBTB fails you still have a chance of becoming lucid in another way.

Best of luck to you, and remember if I can do it, so can you :)

When you practice lucid dreaming it is very important that you feel confidence in yourself.
Take it as a fact that you are going to become lucid sometime in the future, maybe even tonight or in a couple weeks.
Get rid of any skeptical thoughts like "I don't know if I can make it..." and replace them with "I look forward to lucid dreaming, and I will achieve it".
This is true for any skills, actually - if you desire to learn something, then simply think to yourself "I will learn this, here I go!" and ignore any irrational doubts.

Also, make sure you have some concrete plans so you have something to look forward to.
A "lucid dream" shouldn't be a goal per se, instead your goal should be to wanna experience something in a dream, and associate that with being in a dream.

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When attempting the WBTB and MILD I've been having trouble falling back to sleep after waking up, and I'm having trouble falling asleep while repeating my mnemonic. I find that when I lie in my bed and repeat a phrase to myself it becomes less convincing as time passes and eventually my mind wanders and I just fall asleep. When I'm determined not to let that happen I keep myself up trying to make sure the final thought I have before falling asleep is my mnemonic.

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I think you might be trying too hard and being too active, which makes falling asleep impossible. If the mnemonic can't be the last thought you have while falling asleep, don't try too hard to fix that. It's better to fall asleep without the thought than not sleeping at all.

Quick note: don't give up, keep trying to figure out what works for you. I came off a 3+ week dry spell into 6 LDs in 12 days, a new personal frequency record.

Re: sleep. I also had middle-of-the-night insomnia when I started doing MILD/SSILD. Learning how to fall asleep in the middle of the night (where you're still tired and your body still needs more sleep, but your mind is active due to the LD technique you've been doing) is worthwhile spending some real attention on, since falling back asleep is key. You could also try MILD only during the day and before bed, and in the middle of the night doing only a quick journal and maybe setting intention but not MILD visualizations. Or doing MILD visualisations together with a relaxing technique. Don't stress about making the MILD happen right until falling asleep. In fact, don't "try to sleep," that's almost guaranteed to keep you awake. Just drift off into relaxation without any expectations, keeping body and mind quiet, and nature will take it's course and you'll sleep. There are lots of internet resources on getting to sleep (and check some of my posts on this I've written a lot about it in the last month or two).

Thanks for the responses everyone, these have been really helpful.

I highly recommend SSILD and ADA, they go nicely together and they are just that bit different from the rest, hopefully you should see some results soon.

Are you practicing the fundamentals? You have to enhance your self-awareness and memory. These are the base of LDing. I highly recommend Sageous's courses(they are WILD courses, but have allot of important info that are important for DILDing.
Good luck.
Note: when doing ADA, focus on yourself too, not just your surroundings. know that you exist, that you effect everything and everyone, and are effected by everything and everyone. Try like living the moment and considering your existence. This is called Reverse RC(or ADSA). I personally don't recommend ADA, only Reverce RC(ADSA) without focusing on your environment. ADA is still helpful, but RRC is better. Actually, ADA can backfire on you. Sageous explained all of this in his course. Again, I highly recommend it.

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Originally Posted by LouaiB

Are you practicing the fundamentals? You have to enhance your self-awareness and memory. These are the base of LDing. I highly recommend Sageous's courses(they are WILD courses, but have allot of important info that are important for DILDing.
Good luck.
Note: when doing ADA, focus on yourself too, not just your surroundings. know that you exist, that you effect everything and everyone, and are effected by everything and everyone. Try like living the moment and considering your existence. This is called Reverse RC(or ADSA). I personally don't recommend ADA, only Reverce RC(ADSA) without focusing on your environment. ADA is still helpful, but RRC is better. Actually, ADA can backfire on you. Sageous explained all of this in his course. Again, I highly recommend it.

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Yes, this is what I do: on my ADA/RC focus (location, objects, people), I always acknowledge the target (location, object, people) as being within/together with my presence.

Just some Tips from a fellow beginner(Only 4 LDs to the day) the way that I got my very first LD was I spent the days before just simply pondering the subject of LDing, I didn't pursue it but I simply laid out in my head "Ok, I want to have an LD and I know how to do it." type thing. I'm the kind of kid that questions everything he comes into contact with so I used the situational awareness I had to judge what was going on. It is different for everyone but I'm just laying out that you don't have to force it out of you, just let it come naturally at first.

It looks like you have put a lot of work in so far. Getting stuck a bit is normal, I was stuck for months without an experience when I started. Try to mix it up then - keep your dream journal going, start spending time practising all day awareness, perform regular reality checks and use a mantra in bed each night, again performing reality checks.