Another one of those "don't remember posts...

Hi all,

New to the forum and just re-started my lucid dreaming journey. I have searched this topic before and saw that someone else had the same issue back in 2007 but I'll create my own whining thread!

Usually, I don't remember much of my dreams. When I tried to get lucid about 10 years ago (succeeded two times!) I found that the more I wrote in my dream journal, the more I would remember every night.

This time around, it's the opposite. Been keeping a dream journal for a week now and for each night I remembered less and less, until the last two nights where I have remembered literally nothing. Usually I would still wake up with feelings from dreams. Now, absolutely nothing.

I know I'm being impatient after only a week, but this is already making me start losing interest, get the feeling of "what's the point?" when I do my dream checks.

Anyway, why I mentioned the post from 2007 is that it mentioned something quite fantastic that I also experience; while I don't remember much of my dreams, what I do remember etches itself into my memory. I can look back into my dream journal and vividly remember scenes from the dreams, even more clearly than actual memories!

So, I'm going to go to bed now and try to get a bit more sleep than I usually do, hoping for some vidid dreams tonight!

I would try not journaling! Also, give it some more time. You might keep the journal near your bedside, and write down any dreams that you think are funny or interesting. One week is not very long, though . . . .

Also, if the reality checks are annoying you, you may be doing too many. Try just RCing when you come across something odd (like seeing the word "dream" written down, or having someone talk to you about lucid dreaming, or seeing someone you haven't seen in a while) and when you go to bed suggest to yourself that you'll probably at least notice a few strange things tonight. It doesn't need to be a stressful, "what's the point?" enterprise. That will actually kill it. Make it fun. If there are other things you would like to do, unrelated to LDing (taking walks, going to the gym, etc.) do those things and don't stress out about whether or not you're asleep. The nice thing about lucid dreaming is that if you put in the consistent effort, week after week, that will begin to build in your subconscious. You'll have a lucid dream.

why not improve your chances. before you go to bed take 100mg of 5HTP (for clarity and focus) to increase serotonin in your brain this way you will also likely wake up in the night, then take 50mg of B6 (for recall) and some Melatonin (for vividness), I find this combination especially on weekend nights makes me remember loads of dreams and increase vividness. Start with some Melatonin and increase it until you get very vivid memorable dreams :) (don't take the B6 and 5HTP at the same time) if you wake up many times in the night just add some more melatonin the stuff has a very short half life

As you said, one week is hardly enough time to make the kind of statements you're making.

I always feel very two sided about dream journaling. I feel that sometimes people give more importance to writing the dream than actually remembering the dream. Try to not write your dreams imediately for instance, see if that helps. I know this sounds ridiculous to some people, but maybe if you first really try to juice out the detail of the dream in your head without focusing on text and only then try to write it it may help. Maybe even just write a few details you remember as you wake up, but keep the dream in mind and try to remember more afterwards.

Also, don't feel the need to try too often or hard. As ThreeCat stated, most of the exercices that help you reach lucidity in a dream are NOT meant to be routines more than they are meant to be routine breakers. They should be points throughout your day when you really say "alright, lets REALLY think about this." Don't feel the need to reach lucidity fast. I know it sounds tempting, but I would really take it slowly. Don't break the routine breakers by making them routine just because you think you'll have more lucids if you do a RC every 30 minutes, that'll only hurt you, especially in the long run.

Again, one week is not a very long time, and in my amateur opinion you should hardly be worried.

Hi, thanks all for the advice!
Regarding melatonin, I have actually been thinking about using that again, it gives me really vivid dreams! However, it's not sold over the counter here so I'll have to order it online.

It's weird but the best dream sessions I have is if I wake up and then fall back to sleep again, sleep an hour, wake up, write everything down and then sleep for an hour more. Will start dreaming almost instantly and have quite interesting dreams. Of course, this only works for me in the weekend...

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Originally Posted by MikaelK

melatonin, I have actually been thinking about using that again, it gives me really vivid dreams! However, it's not sold over the counter here so I'll have to order it online.

It's weird but the best dream sessions I have is if I wake up and then fall back to sleep again, sleep an hour, wake up, write everything down and then sleep for an hour more. Will start dreaming almost instantly and have quite interesting dreams. Of course, this only works for me in the weekend...

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yes I trained myself to wake after every dream tho I don't always do this anymore. I found the best meletonin (when I had peak lucids) was to take more slow acting every time I woke up. (I wish I could take the stuff as a continuous intravenous drip of 6mg per hour he he :), would be a bit difficult to fall asleep I think) now I only have fast acting stuff. When I take quite a bit, I find I hallucinate when I close my eyes, its like a vivid dream but I'm fully awake and can not control anything (usually, once I did control one of my hallucinogenic hands but only for a second), I am fully aware of my real body, but I see the vision, unless I try to move or open my eyes, then it ends instantly and when it resumes it will be a different vision entirely.

Lately I have taken ludicrous amounts of Melatoin only to find I sleep very lightly and some dreams seem more like streams of thought, tho I have just awoken from a dream of being at a busy fast food place that was quite vivid, one of my dream signs is finding lots of coins, in this case I was trying to pay with them, as I counted and piled them they seemed to deform a bit but I didn't really notice. One of my dream goals is to flip coins and land them on edge, (land three coins as 'snowman' tho I didn't have any nickles in this dream, and land other ridiculous and impossible outcomes like pyramid, and flip zero coins but land a big solid gold one on edge) too bad I didn't trigger. At one point the rude waitress behind the counter said something that should have made me trigger talking about underwear, but instead I just became incredulous.

I would not recommend incredibly high doses of melatonin, if only because there aren't any(?) studies on the long term effects of all that stuff. We've had this conversation before: http://www.dreamviews.com/general-lu...effect-me.html (with cooley advocating very high doses of M--up to 100 mg per night--and others advising caution). I think what many would be concerned about/interested in is melatonin's ability to cause depression. But many of us take between 3 and 5 mgs in a night to help us sleep.

At this point you're about two weeks into lucid dreaming. I wouldn't worry about supplements; just work on building dream recall and awareness naturally.

I usually point out that I wouldn't take high doses if you're a young female as it can interfere with cycle. As for long term studies, they need to be just that long, and thus take a long time to establish such safety. There are plenty of cautions that are written on the bottles for pregnant or nursing or taking other medications.

I take some for blood sugar and its one where there is concern for effect on blood glucose levels.

As for high dose studies there have been some that show well tolerated at much higher doses then I have taken but they were only a few months or a few years (like treatment studies of ALS using 300mg daily but that wasn't taken orally)

the recommended dose for sleep is .3mg, 1mg, or 1.5mg depending on age, but for Vividness of dreams most people suggest much higher doses on the order of those used to treat cancers such as 50mg/day

I have been trying all sorts of different doses to see what effect they have on me at very high dose I have had side effects of crying (this usually happens the next day for a little while likely when the remaining dose has fallen to much lower levels) and slightly upset stomach (sometimes in the middle of the night)

I have never experienced headache, nausea, or grogginess (I use buses and trains to travel to work I would be careful if you drive)

I experience visions (hallucinations) at high dose but this is one of the things I am trying to use to target the right dose. The real problem with melatonin is that it has such a short half life that the dose is always falling quickly. It isn't clear what dose will saturate the ability to be broken down, surely at some high dose it won't be destroyed as quickly as its half life of only 40 minutes or so, If I could still find partial slow release melatonin I would likely go back to the way I used it before, I certainly wish I could find slow release only formulations that were linear over an 8-10 hour period, but that isn't even how the embedded matrix stuff I had been using worked.

It seems I may be building a tolerance to it or am just unable to take it consistently because of the times of sleep and wake, and some doses it seems to cause insomnia, but at very high dose it doesn't seem to cause it in me.

the right dose for you will depend on what your taking it for, certainly if your taking it for sleep 30-50mgs is too high, 5 or ten is the most that will help you fall asleep, and likely you should try 3mg or less if that is your goal

if your goal is vividness try increasing it until you see an effect you want

In that thread it seemed to be 'pressure' that claimed no ill effects, but then he seems only to use up to 50mg per day in any posts and hasn't posted lately

as for what is really causing insomnia in me at some doses it is hard to really tell, because I also take 5HTP most of the time, and it is possible that intentionally interrupting my sleep is the real cause, as a result of intention setting like 'I will wake after my dreams, I will remember my dreams, I will become lucid' etc.

B6 is a vitamin (but it is neuro toxic if you take a lot for a long time) no prescription should be necessary even for Australia
5HTP is the intermediate between the Amino Acid Tryptophan (which you could take instead) and Serotonin, I don't know its status in Australia, but certainly for Tryptophan you wouldn't need a prescription. If you get 5-HTP you will want to get the natural stuff made from the seeds of Griffoina Simplicifolia not the synthetic stuff. (never take the B6 same time or before the 5HTP as it will catalyze the stuff into Serotonin before it can reach your brain, Tryptophan and 5-HTP can cross the blood brain barrier, Serotonin can't cross)

As for Melatonin, in the United Kingdom it isn't for sale so I don't know about Australia, generally in UK countries you are allowed to order online like a 30 day supply or some such. I think it is the same in Canada.

Here in the US you can get melatonin in drinks, and even gummy bears. I would go for time released tablets tho (make sure the stuff doesn't have extra B6 in it, sometimes you get like 5mg melatonin tablets, and when you read the bottle it has 10mg of B6 but its in the fine print)