Is lucidity really that good ?

Printable View

10-23-2007, 05:03 PM
Dsouza

Is lucidity really that good ?

Dreams are messages from your sub-concious mind to your concious mind, right ? So if they're that important and they're meant to tell your concious mind about something then why would you want to go lucid in your dreams because then you can just totally change the dream and the message will go unheard.

Please reply with your veiws as I'm deciding right now whether or not I want to learn the ability to go lucid because once you start sub-conciously looking for dream signs in the real world and the dream world it will be very hard to lose the ability of awarness in your dreams
10-23-2007, 05:14 PM
mylucidworld

First of all yes LUCIDITY IS THAT GOOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I understand what your saying though but when you are lucid your subconscious is able to get whatever message it is trying to get through to you easier. Even when you are lucid your sub-conscious is still doing it's thing. So you don't have to worry about the message going unheard.

If anything it increases your chances of getting the message.
10-23-2007, 05:15 PM
Chris182t

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dsouza

Dreams are messages from your sub-concious mind to your concious mind, right ? So if they're that important and they're meant to tell your concious mind about something then why would you want to go lucid in your dreams because then you can just totally change the dream and the message will go unheard.

Please reply with your veiws as I'm deciding right now whether or not I want to learn the ability to go lucid because once you start sub-conciously looking for dream signs in the real world and the dream world it will be very hard to lose the ability of awarness in your dreams

Hey Dsouza.
Hmm, i kind of disagree that dreams are "messages" from you subconscious to your conscious mind. Dreams are just the product of your brain clearing itself up at night. It's quite true that you can learn more about yourself from dreams..but i wouldn't put it as you did.
Becoming Lucid will most likely happen less than once a week, probably even once a month, and in that time you would have had hundreds of dreams, therefore i don't think it's going to do too much damage.
Also, most of our dreams go unremembered anyway, in which case the "messages" would be lost, regardless of whether we stay away from lucid dreams.
Well, that's my view anyway :)
And to answer your topic title, yes, lucidity really is that good :D
10-23-2007, 05:22 PM
Robot_Butler

Part of learning to LD is improving your dream recall. This makes all your 'normal' dreams much more vivid, you remember them better, study them more critically, and recall multiple dreams every night.

Like LD Master says, lucid dreams are still heavily influenced by your subconscious. Think of it as a normal wacky dream where you have the ability to think critically, and act of your own free will. It gives you the opportunity to really experience your dreams more fully, so any message will come through even better.

And hell yes! Lucidity is that good.
10-23-2007, 05:33 PM
Oneiro

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dsouza

Dreams are messages from your sub-concious mind to your concious mind, right ?

That's purely an unsubstantiated theory put about by people who can't prove it one way or another. Nobody knows. It just seems to be fashionable here on this forum to believe such things, with no fact-based backup at all.
10-23-2007, 05:37 PM
Caradon

Yes, Lucid dreaming is the ultimate high!
I would also like to mention, that just because you are Lucid does not mean you have to change anything. If you just want to observe your dream to interpret it. You can do that from within the dream itself. It can be quite fascinating just observing things that are going on in your dreams.
10-23-2007, 05:44 PM
Caradon

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oneiro

That's purely an unsubstantiated theory put about by people who can't prove it one way or another. Nobody knows. It just seems to be fashionable here on this forum to believe such things, with no fact-based backup at all.

Well...at least a person can study their own dreams. And come to their own conclusion about such things. Without the need for other peoples facts or proofs.
10-23-2007, 06:00 PM
Oneiro

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caradon

Well...at least a person can study their own dreams. And come to their own conclusion about such things. Without the need for other peoples facts or proofs.

Well, if you say so.. but I see very little evidence of that on this forum. Most of the people here just seem content to play childish video game-type "LD" scenarios, without any urge to "study" as you put it.

So.. are you any good at LDing? Because if so, I've got a challenge for you: next time you have the control and memory in an LD, try asking your DCs if they are figments of your imagination.. I predict that it won't matter what your "opinion" about it is.. it won't affect their answer..

.. and if you can't do that, try searching this forum for the very few people who have already done this, and prepare for a shock..
10-23-2007, 06:12 PM
Redrivertears

It doesn't actually matter what you believe dreams to be. Even the most 'lucid' of 'lucid dreams' are 99% non-consciously determined, at least!

-Redrivertears-
10-23-2007, 07:32 PM
polmc

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dsouza

Dreams are messages from your sub-concious mind to your concious mind, right ? So if they're that important and they're meant to tell your concious mind about something then why would you want to go lucid in your dreams because then you can just totally change the dream and the message will go unheard.

Please reply with your veiws as I'm deciding right now whether or not I want to learn the ability to go lucid because once you start sub-conciously looking for dream signs in the real world and the dream world it will be very hard to lose the ability of awarness in your dreams

You see, even if you LD everynight, you still have enough 'normal' dreams for you 'subconscius' express himself, unless you LD for 3 or 4 hours per night, which I doubt :P
10-23-2007, 07:35 PM
polmc

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oneiro

That's purely an unsubstantiated theory put about by people who can't prove it one way or another. Nobody knows. It just seems to be fashionable here on this forum to believe such things, with no fact-based backup at all.

There are too many criticizable flaws in such a short paragraph. It's just too vague and unfundamented. So please don't talk so fast, if your knowledge in the subject is so limited, that it reaches prejudice.
10-23-2007, 08:03 PM
Caradon

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oneiro

Well, if you say so.. but I see very little evidence of that on this forum. Most of the people here just seem content to play childish video game-type "LD" scenarios, without any urge to "study" as you put it.

So.. are you any good at LDing? Because if so, I've got a challenge for you: next time you have the control and memory in an LD, try asking your DCs if they are figments of your imagination.. I predict that it won't matter what your "opinion" about it is.. it won't affect their answer..

.. and if you can't do that, try searching this forum for the very few people who have already done this, and prepare for a shock..

LOL! Sounds like you have some issues. I couldn't care less either way. like I said, that's for the individual to decide on their own.
10-23-2007, 08:23 PM
Chris182t

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caradon

I could care less either way.

Couldn't care less.
:bigteeth:
10-23-2007, 08:44 PM
Caradon

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris182t

Couldn't care less.
:bigteeth:

Thanks for the correction.:lol:
10-23-2007, 09:00 PM
Oneiro

Quote:

Originally Posted by polmc

There are too many criticizable flaws in such a short paragraph. It's just too vague and unfundamented. So please don't talk so fast, if your knowledge in the subject is so limited, that it reaches prejudice.

Did your LDing process teach you how to talk out of your arse? You do it well..
10-23-2007, 09:02 PM
Oneiro

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caradon

LOL! Sounds like you have some issues. I couldn't care less either way. like I said, that's for the individual to decide on their own.

The only issues I have are with bullshit.

"I couldn't care less.." So much for your penchant for "study". What a pile of shite.
10-23-2007, 09:02 PM
Sugarglider11

well, all the members we have here dont seem to have suffered any problems from lucid dreaming, so I say it is OK.

Even if lucid dreaming was bad it probably would not effect us, we would end up remembering more dreams and only a small percent of dreams are lucid, so we would still have many other dreams.

so dont worry about, keep going with it.
10-23-2007, 09:09 PM
Oneiro

Huh? Is that posted in the right thread?
10-23-2007, 09:18 PM
Caradon

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oneiro

The only issues I have are with bullshit.

"I couldn't care less.." So much for your penchant for "study". What a pile of shite.

Now I'm confused.
How is it a pile of shit, for somebody to come up with their own answers. Rather than letting somebody who already thinks they know it all, tell them what to believe?

Because thats the only thing I was trying to say.
My own personal beliefs are completely irrelevant here.
10-23-2007, 10:28 PM
dodobird

First of all, it is only a theory that dreams are messages from the subconscious. It is not proven, and there are other theories which are just as possible.
and even if has some truth, it may be true for only some of the dreams, while the rest are quite random.

Secondly, you don't have to change a lucid dream, you can continue the dream as normal, and the only thing that change is that you have a much higher awareness of what is going on, and are able to remember the dream much better. In that respect LD are a better way to learn about your mind. You can also question dream characters directly, and view finer details.
You can even interpret the dream as you are experiencing it, with the advantage that you don't need to try to vaguely remember the dream after waking up.

In normal dreams we like behave and think as if we are heavily intoxicated. In an LD your mind can be clear and, well, lucid, which is a much better state to explore your consciousness.
10-24-2007, 03:40 PM
polmc

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oneiro

Did your LDing process teach you how to talk out of your arse? You do it well..

If this is a about my spelling/english, then I agree because Im not a native speaker and I tend to write with many mistakes...

but if you're saying that because of what I replied to your post, then it means you have no argments, hence you rely on these 'clever' statements to defend yourself...
10-24-2007, 04:04 PM
mikestankus

Whose the LD master?
10-24-2007, 04:25 PM
jamous

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dsouza

Dreams are messages from your sub-concious mind to your concious mind, right ? So if they're that important and they're meant to tell your concious mind about something then why would you want to go lucid in your dreams because then you can just totally change the dream and the message will go unheard.

Please reply with your veiws as I'm deciding right now whether or not I want to learn the ability to go lucid because once you start sub-conciously looking for dream signs in the real world and the dream world it will be very hard to lose the ability of awarness in your dreams

On another thread I was talking to someone about participating in a dream's symbolism while lucid. If you're right, and I've wondered the same thing, I would bet there would still be a certain way to lucid dream that would still allow you to learn from the messages of dreaming, possibly even more so. Maqybe if you learn the language of your dreams, you could know how to react to what the dream environment throws at you.

I would bet lucid dreaming is something that should be done sparingly, like a psychedelic trip maybe. It definitely is not natural for most people.
10-24-2007, 05:30 PM
Oneiro

Quote:

Originally Posted by jamous

.. to lucid dream that would still allow you to learn from the messages of dreaming..

In my opinion there are no "messages" in LDing and no hidden meaning or symbolism.. it's all theory and all untrue.
10-25-2007, 12:32 AM
jamous

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oneiro

In my opinion there are no "messages" in LDing and no hidden meaning or symbolism.. it's all theory and all untrue.

I dunno about literal "messages" but there is definitely meaning in dreams.
The way your subconscious creates the dream environment can tell you alot about yourself. I dunno about many theories, it's just logical.

You ought to expand on what you're saying
10-25-2007, 12:33 AM
Michael

It's awesome the first thousand or so times, then it just becomes another drug. Which is still awesome... it just loses its excitement, or something.
10-25-2007, 12:34 AM
jamous

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oneiro

That's purely an unsubstantiated theory put about by people who can't prove it one way or another. Nobody knows. It just seems to be fashionable here on this forum to believe such things, with no fact-based backup at all.

what are messages anyway? sort of a debatable term no?
10-25-2007, 12:38 AM
Mrs. Jones

Yes.
10-25-2007, 03:31 AM
innerspacecadet

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dsouza

Dreams are messages from your sub-concious mind to your concious mind, right ? So if they're that important and they're meant to tell your concious mind about something then why would you want to go lucid in your dreams because then you can just totally change the dream and the message will go unheard.

Please reply with your veiws as I'm deciding right now whether or not I want to learn the ability to go lucid because once you start sub-conciously looking for dream signs in the real world and the dream world it will be very hard to lose the ability of awarness in your dreams

IME, lucidity is always good...kind of like what some people say about sex and pizza - even bad lucidity is still pretty good. A few minutes of awareness could be the only thing I recall from a dream, or just enough to get me out of harm's way in a nightmare.

Personally, I don't believe dreams are messages from the subconscious at all. I think they're random. But even if you do become lucid, your "subconscious" will still be doing most of the work, filling in most of the blanks and providing its own pace and scenery in the areas in which you're not actively trying to change the dream. (And heck, sometimes it can outright thwart your attempts to change the dream. I've had lucid dreams where I've tried to fly but I couldn't. So I settled for something else.) Your sphere of control in a lucid dream is probably rather small. You can make yourself fly or get out of a pickle, but you can't dictate every moment of every dream scene. At least, not at the level of aptitude I've reached from my on-and-off experience.

In fact, your "subconscious" does most of the work in your waking perception, too. You actually see a lot of things that aren't there, and fail to see a lot of things that are there, in your waking life. Not to mention that there's some arbitrariness to the assignment of the particular sensation of "red" and "blue," for instance - we don't have to see these colors the way they do. The way we see them is the whim of the human nervous system.
10-25-2007, 03:46 AM
Abra

Meh. I doubt dreams are random. Nothing is truly random when it comes to life. For whatever reason, they seem to reflect our stresses, desires, or subconscious thought (as in, something that you weren't aware you were thinking of earlier in the day). As for 'messages.' The origin of the dream's theme should be obvious to the dreamer.

Messing with messages? Nah. Lucid dreaming has enabled me to explore past my normal, mundane dream scene (work, home, friends) and into a unique planet all my own. I think it gives my subconscious a fool-proof form of imaginative expression. As for whatever biotic function pure dreaming provides: even experts can't lucid dream all of the time. Even then, they don't have complete control.

As mentioned, the prerequisite of recall allows you to interpret the origins of your dreams. Lucid dreaming, for so many reasons, is in no way harmful.
10-25-2007, 10:07 AM
Torcher

Lucidity is THAT good. I've done a plethora of drugs, and LDs top all, always, even if they suck.
10-28-2007, 06:27 PM
Grod

Everyone has probably said this but... yes. Lucidity really IS that good.:D
10-28-2007, 08:59 PM
Seeker

OK, everyone calmer now? I thought I'd step into the ring and put forth my two cents worth. BTW, some of the behavior in this thread has been noticed and discussed in the staff forum.

Dreams are such strange things. I'll let you in on a secret. NOBODY KNOWS EXACTLY WHY WE DREAM. That said, although we don't know all there is about it, we DO know a good many uses of dreams.

I've been studying sleep and dreams most of my 46 years on this earth, here are a few things I've learned:

Dreams DO carry messages from your subconcious.

Dreams help you sort out things you have learned and experiences you have had during the day.

Dreams are probably not messages from aliens.

You should not try to control all of your lucid dreams, instead, reserve at least half of them and just go with the flow. You can learn a lot more from your subconcious if you do so.

Lucid Dreaming is probably one of the most amazing things I have ever learned. It is a vehicle for exploration, knowledge, fun, and fantasy.

Lucid dreaming experience should not be compared with those that are chemically induced. A lucid deam is much closer to visions than trips.

In the end, it's all about balance. So, Please dream non lucidly, dream lucidly without control, and dream lucidly with control. Doing these three things will help keep you mentally healthy and happy! :D
10-29-2007, 05:26 AM
jamous

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seeker

You should not try to control all of your lucid dreams, instead, reserve at least half of them and just go with the flow. You can learn a lot more from your subconcious if you do so.

Lucid Dreaming is probably one of the most amazing things I have ever learned. It is a vehicle for exploration, knowledge, fun, and fantasy.

Lucid dreaming experience should not be compared with those that are chemically induced. A lucid deam is much closer to visions than trips.

In the end, it's all about balance. So, Please dream non lucidly, dream lucidly without control, and dream lucidly with control. Doing these three things will help keep you mentally healthy and happy! :D

well said! Seriously, I feel that completely.

"OK, everyone calmer now? I thought I'd step into the ring and put forth my two cents worth. BTW, some of the behavior in this thread has been noticed and discussed in the staff forum."
What was discussed exactly?