Thread: Camdave's Workbook

Lesson 2 - Placeholder

1) Find a technique that suits you.

After having read through over 100 pages of tutorials on the site (from the links) and trying to distill things down to their essence, I think that the technique that best suits me is DILD/MILD - I'm not entirely sure what the exact difference is between the two methods, as at face value they seem pretty similar in concept.

An important part of this that I have discovered that I wasn't aware of was the need for awareness (no pun intended . . .). I began to practise meditation last week to help to build awareness and also as a way of de-stressing and relaxing after lunch at work; I do a 10 minute session at lunchtime and then a 15 minute session in the evening before bed - I find that this helps me to relax and get ready for bed. I'm historically a light sleeper who takes a while to fall asleep, but I've found that meditating and clearing the mind of thoughts works well.

I have started to incorporate some visualisation during meditation or general daydreams to try to reinforce what lucid dreaming is like (from the couple of times I've managed it) and how I will realise that I'm dreaming. I still need to build a greater self-awareness, however, as I'm still missing things in my dream that seem obvious when I wake up. I find that I quite often realise that I'm dreaming - I even told myself last night in my dream that something I did in my dream was OK as it was only in the dream world and not the real world - presumably this counts as a lucid dream in which I am not controlling the dream.

Over the next few days I shall be performing WBTB. I've experimented waking up 4.5/6 hours after going to bed and staying up for 30/45 minutes - at the moment, the best combination for me seems to be waking up after 6 hours for a 30 minute wake-up session in which I note that night's dreams, go through previous nights' dreams and read through some DV forums. I'm going to try 15 minutes tonight as I need to be up fairly early for work tomorrow, as the Monday traffic is awful around the London area, so the earlier I go in, the better.

2) Choose a second induction technique

I think WILD could be a useful technique for me in the future, when my wife returns home on Friday. WBTB is going to be impractical when sharing a bed, but my wife quite often wakes during the night to go to the bathroom and thus this could serve as a good "jumping-off" point for a brief WBTB/WILD.

General to-do over the coming week(s):
- Practice waking awareness by engaging all the senses and focus on the details. Try to do this approximately once an hour to develop a second-nature for doing this. I should also think about how I affect my surroundings and how I am affected by them; how I got to this place and where I am going afterwards (with visualisation). This will be accompanied by a couple of RC's (nose-pinch and one that is relevant to the area, such as mirrors, digital clocks etc.). Start to question everyday things such as conversations people are having, the warmth of a tea-cup and environmental sounds.
- Visualise dream control and performing it when daydreaming. Perform dream incubation before sleep to reinforce dream scenes and the sensation of becoming lucid, imagining obviously lucid behaviour.
- Keep recording waking times and recording in dream journal (I have a book for this).
- Develop own mantra for repetition when sleeping.

Welcome to intro class, Camdave! From my experience and also observations around the forum, wbtb is a great method to help you achieve lucidity! Wish you success with on your ld induction path! If you have any questions, feel free to ask here or in the http://www.dreamviews.com/intro-class/145523-raise-your-hand-intro-class-q.html thread.

Take care!

Thanks I just have a couple of questions at the moment - no better time to ask them than during a WBTB period!

1) Is it necessary to wake up in an REM period for better recall? If I wake naturally (presumably during after REM sleep and back into a non-REM stage) then my dream memory is usually worse than if I’m woken in the middle of a dream. (but with thought and recall techniques I can still remember them)

2) When using incubation techniques, is it worth keeping the base "world" that you incubate consistent in order to further reinforce it? Having something that is fixed in your mind as being a sort-of gateway to the dream world, I presume, would be useful as a mental signpost for dreaming. I guess I would act as some kind of mentally pre-fabricated dream sign.

Here is some brief info about sleep cycles and recall. First of all, we tend to naturally wake after the end of each cycle, which finishes with REM. Some people are aware of these moments, while others are not. In the beginning of the night we experience more N-REM phases and REM sleep is shorter, we sleep deeper, so it may be hard to become aware of those micro-awakenings. As the night progresses and we become well rested, REM cycles become longer and our natural wakes might be more noticeable. Also, while there is a tendency to state that each sleep cycle lasts 90 mins, the truth is this is an average and they can vary between 70 and 120 mins, therefore it can be hard to exactly pinpoint the time where one cycle ends and the other one begins.

The implications of this for wbtb:

- with wbtb you usually will set the alarm or use a natural wake after 4-6 hrs of sleep or something like that depending on your sleep schedule, the amount of time you have available, etc. This means that REM cycles will already be somewhat longer, so there is a greater chance that your alarm might hit during REM (in case you want to have some pre wbtb recall) and it will be easier for your to use natural wakes for wbtb and recall.

2) Yes, it will be better if you keep your baseworld consistent and don't change many elements. When you repeat the same process/though over and over, it will be committed better to memory than if you alter things. But you can have a portfolio of baseworlds, dreamscenes, etc. You can later use elements of these portolios or the entire portfolios to shape your dreams (i.e. summon items, change the scene). You can also try to use them as dream signs, if you associate them with the realization or feeling of lucidity.

Good luck!

Thanks for your reply I tried a "natural" WBTB last night and found that I woke up quite naturally after roughly 5 hours 45 minutes of sleep - does this necessarily correspond to the end of an REM cycle? I was under the impression that you generally awaken during the first NREM stage in between cycles, in a phase of light sleep. In this case I stayed up for 15 minutes and tried to WILD, but lost focus and dropped off! When I woke up I had zero recollection of the last dreaming but, but as I was going to work I got into my car and remembered the dream - I dream a LOT about driving and being in cars, so I'm now taking more care to be aware in the vehicle and notice all the small details.

I'm still a very inconsistent lucid dreamer, but I think that building my self-awareness will unlock it. I'm still in the stage of "how did I NOT notice that?" - I even had a déjà-vu last night, whereby I saw a very specific scene whilst driving a car and having an option of going down a small gradient on the left or a set of stairs (!?) on the right - the first time I encountered this I drove down the stairs, but this time I took the smooth path to the left. I didn't even realise this memory until I wrote it down in my dream diary this morning and recognised it.

I've read quite a bit about dream-scapes over the past few months - some quite advanced things about constructing them from scratch and the visualisation needed for that. I think I'll start small and work my way up! I've put together some images as a visual cue to read from time to time that represent my dream-scape (a private island somewhere warm - the UK is blessed with many things but tropical weather is not one of them ) and am working hard to internalise it with as much awareness of the place as possible. At the moment I'm also including lucid dreaming cues (such as a oddly-coloured coconut that is very light to pick up, flying to my beach cabin and making clouds transform into shapes) - I'm hoping that this will reinforce things further.

One interesting thing that has happened is that I've noticed a dream character of someone who I don't think I know from my awakening life has been consistently appearing in my dreams; this has mainly been in the background, but a couple of days ago it came to the front as we were at some indoor waterpark (again, blame the UK weather for this memory!) and having fun together. Usually if I dream about being close with a member of the opposite species then I feel remorse (as I'm married!) and other dream character's also notice this and question it. However, when with this character I feel totally at ease and feel like they have been a best friend for a long time; I do not feel any sense of remorse and other dream characters are completely accepting of it. Have I found my dream guide? I've not yet met them whilst lucid, but I'm trying to visualise meeting them so I can ask them more questions. I've read quite a bit about dream guides and it seems that this DC appears to fit virtually all of the requisites; if it is the case then it gives me an added motivation for lucid dreaming.

edit/ I'd also just like to mention/ask, how specific does a mantra have to be? I've been struggling to consciously think about one specifically, and then when I was meditating one night I just thought "I am ready", and it seems to fit. This triggers thoughts of mental relaxation and visualisation of my dream scene so I presume it's OK - does the mantra have to be more explicit in its worded intentions?

Hope the pics upload properly. Unfortunately, some of these hypnograms would to put the wake up point at different places of mostly REM (possibly because it varies?) which can be so confusing if you are a lucid dreamer!

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Well, I can't tell for sure at which point of your sleep cycle you woke up, but it's very likely that it was at the end of REM. If you fall asleep too quickly after wbtb, you may increase the time a bit, do some mental gymnastics. Actually, what do you do during your wbtb? I usually get up, if too sleepy stay out of bed for a while thinking of mantras, goals, then continue this in bed till I fall asleep and adjust the intensity depending on if I am sleepy or not. If very sleepy, more task thoughts and mantras, if too awake I just try to relax. I takes some practice and adjustment.

What you are telling me about this DC sounds so exciting. Maybe that is your dream guide. It will be cool if you remember to recognize her as a dream sign and become lucid next time you do encounter her.

About mantras - anything that has an appeal for you and elicits the necessary association will do. Short ones are somewhat more effective and easier to repeat. As long as you have the intent attached to it and associate it with lucidity "I'm ready" will work too. I usually go for "I realize that I am dreaming" and then one or two words for any tasks I have planned for the ld.

Thanks for the pictures - that's cleared it up. Last night my sleeping followed it almost to a tee - I went to bed at 10:20 pm and then had awakenings at 1:32, 4:58 (dream recall) and then awoke at 6:14 (also with dream recall). I've been experimenting with different time periods during wake (I go and re-read a few dreams from the journal and highlight dream signs, and come onto these forums or read up about the awareness techniques) - last night I tries just going straight back to bed and it didn't seem to help. Next time, I shall force myself to get up and go to the bathroom or have a sip of water in the kitchen to try to prompt the conscious into activity. At 4:58 for example, I really struggled just to force myself to write down the time at which I woke up and a couple of lines for later dream recall! It's progress though, as a couple of weeks ago I would have just dropped straight back to sleep

I'm almost certain that this DC is my dream guide, as looking back through other dreams from previously, I've noted the presence of a woman whose face was in the background and I couldn't make out, but I could notice their presence; this happened again last night when I saw a "picture" of her on the dream-internet. I made a rough sketch so I can try to Google it later on, but I can't help but feel that this is needle-in-a-haystack sort of searching! I'm relying on my subconscience, I suppose, to leap out if I go past the correct picture on Google images.

I tried repeating my mantra last night when falling back asleep after a brief awakening, but found that I quickly forgot to say it and fell asleep. Just need more practice and focus, I suppose! My recall has definitely improved - I'm now starting to remember multiple dreams at night and writing a couple of pages in my notebook each night (rather than a couple of lines when I started out). I've always been able to remember a couple of dreams every week (and have had some really vivid ones when I was a child/teenager that I still remember clearly now) - I feel like I just needed that extra push to really recall them.

My wife tells me that I quite often sleep-talk about seemingly random things and that I appear awake when I do so (upright and looking at her) - she can ask me a question and I'll respond in gibberish. I've done this when I was a child too - my Dad often told me that I slept-talked, and on one occasion when I was about 4-5, there was a lunar eclipse and I got out of bed to see if with my Dad. I was talking to him about the positions of the constellations (I loved space-stuff when I was a child!) and Dad took several photos of us with the lunar eclipse, but I had zero recall of it the next morning! Is this a case of REM atonia not quite kicking in fully on occasion, or is it something quite common in the LD community?

At 4:58 for example, I really struggled just to force myself to write down the time at which I woke up and a couple of lines for later dream recall! It's progress though, as a couple of weeks ago I would have just dropped straight back to sleep

Lol, that sounds familiar. Sometimes when I wake I'm so sleepy it's really hard to convince myself to do a proper wbtb. Then the day after when I'm angry enough I missed my ld chance I find the strength to do it...

Is this a case of REM atonia not quite kicking in fully on occasion, or is it something quite common in the LD community?

It could be. I haven't come accross many Qs regarding this here, but I've seen and experienced similar things over the years. This includes family members, friends, etc. As long as you're not waving arms around or see a sudden continuous spike in that kind of activity, I think it's kind of normal, especially if you've had it since kid.

Thanks for your replies; it's good to be able to discuss these things and pick the brains of people with experience! Wall of text incoming . . .

Originally Posted by NyxCC

It could be. I haven't come accross many Qs regarding this here, but I've seen and experienced similar things over the years. This includes family members, friends, etc. As long as you're not waving arms around or see a sudden continuous spike in that kind of activity, I think it's kind of normal, especially if you've had it since kid.

Yeah, I did a bit of background reading into it and it seems that children are regular sleep-talkers (presumably because of their elongated REM periods / brain activity) and most people grow out of it, but I never did. I don't do anything physical other than the occasional sitting up in bed when asked a question! (i.e. I won't just sit up on my own accord, but only as a response to an external stimulus) There's no Bart Simpson-style windmilling

Well I had a pretty good session last night. I've been working hard on waking awareness and it seems to be paying off as I feel more aware of dreaming. I went to bed at 22:17, woke up at around midnight with no recollection and then 4:10 with no recollection. At this time I thought that this was an ideal time to WILD, but I managed to get myself out of bed and went to have a glass of water and read some notes that I made about WILDs (so I didn't need to turn the computer on). I went back to bed at 4:17 (I thought at the time that the symmetry was nice with the bed time!) and tried to do a finger-initiated one for 3-4 goes just to see if it worked, but it didn't quite work for me; I was pretty awake when I went back to bed and I think that this didn't help.

I then tried to WILD and stayed still for the best part of around 15-20 minutes repeating my mantra and visualising a dream scene, but I never managed to drop off to sleep. I remember a few times feeling some kind of sensation swoop through and thinking "ah, maybe this is it" but I wasn't sure whether to RC or not by pinching my nose as that would involve moving. After a while I tried it and found that I couldn't breathe through my nose; what would be a good secondary RC to do in a dark room? Whenever I'm doing awareness practise, I always do a back-up RC just-in-case; I found during dreams last night that the pinching nose didn't always work as a RC.

On one occasion I woke in bed, and I always do a noise-pinch RC here as I've had quite a few false awakenings. I pinched my nose and found that I couldn't breathe, but decided that I could be dreaming anyway from a general feeling; if I could have backed this up with a secondary RC then this would've been great.

I tried to find my dream guide last night when I became lucid in a dream (I was driving in a residential area that I know - driving is a big dream sign for me - and the road wasn't correct; I realised that the road wasn't correct and that I must be dreaming) and ended up walking up a road shouting her name, and the other DCs were looking at me in surprise. I just said to them "no, you're not her, keep walking"! When I had the FA above, I also climbed into the cupboard as I believed that if I was dreaming then it could act as a teleportation device - I've been visualising this in case I wake up in my room! However, it didn't work - I presumably didn't fully convince myself that I was dreaming as the RC had failed.

I also had another odd sensation whilst trying to WILD; towards the end of my attempts, I did a nose-pinch RC and found that I could breathe through my nose, so I thought "finally!". I sat at the side of the bed, rubbed my hands to try to stabilise the dream (as it was dark in my room, so couldn't see anything) and then stood up. When I stood up, my body suddenly felt very heavy and I "fell" very slowly to the floor; once I hit the floor, I woke up.

I presume that this is all down to practice and training your mind for stabilisation in a dream and becoming used to not only the feeling of being lucid, but the ability to control dreams. I've been able to recognise logical fallacies in dreams for quite a long time (I'm an engineer by background, so I guess rationality is generally the norm!) but have never acted on them and have just accepted them - for example, in one dream I justified someone pulling down their trousers after hearing thunder as "the zipper has metal in it, so it's safer to be lower to the ground". Made perfect sense in the dream world, and other DCs agreed with me! It seems in the last few days that I've really started to question in my dream now - instead of recognising something as being strange, I'm now looking around and doing RCs in my dreams.

I also can't help but feel I'm trying to dive straight into the deep-end by trying to find my DG straight away by summoning/teleporting - am I better off doing some training first, Rocky-style? I was hoping to find my DG and let them do the teaching!

I have had recent success with WBTB but this is not viable in the long run as I share my bed with my wife. I need to develop DILD and ensure that I regularly complete reality checks in order to perform them in dreams more often.

For what it's worth, I share a bed with my wife as well and employ WBTB for the great majority of my lucids. I can't use alarms or anything, so I've had to try to form a habit around WBTB. Getting to bed early helps. When you're first forming the habit of waking in the very early morning, drinking some water pre-bed helps ease you into the process. Just resolving to be more aware and to wake up after your dreams helps, too.

I also can't help but feel I'm trying to dive straight into the deep-end by trying to find my DG straight away by summoning/teleporting - am I better off doing some training first, Rocky-style? I was hoping to find my DG and let them do the teaching!

I say just try to get lucid as often as possible! Don't get too hung up on whether you can meet a particular goal, but if shooting for the stars motivates you, cool!

A good starter goal I recommend is to try cranking up dream vividness as high as it can go. Check something out in great detail and see what your brain can produce. It's a truly mind-expanding experience and you just never look at dreams the same way after that. And of course, flight!

But honestly, go for whatever you find motivating. There's no better way to learn than to simply have lots of lucid dreams IMO. Good luck!

Well congrats on the awesome night of dreaming!

I also had another odd sensation whilst trying to WILD; towards the end of my attempts, I did a nose-pinch RC and found that I could breathe through my nose, so I thought "finally!". I sat at the side of the bed, rubbed my hands to try to stabilise the dream (as it was dark in my room, so couldn't see anything) and then stood up. When I stood up, my body suddenly felt very heavy and I "fell" very slowly to the floor; once I hit the floor, I woke up.

From reading your description here I get the impression that the wild was indeed successful! You actually did transition!

what would be a good secondary RC to do in a dark room? Whenever I'm doing awareness practise, I always do a back-up RC just-in-case; I found during dreams last night that the pinching nose didn't always work as a RC.

Some transitions can be very subtle. One moment you are lying in bed in your room, the next moment you are in your dream room, in the same position. How can you tell? One of the things that tips me off is that while my eyes are originally closed and I am looking at the darkness ahead, parts of the room become visible, as if you are seeing through your eyelids. At other times I have felt my dream eyes suddenly open when I fully transition. You might want to wait a bit depending on your gut feel, then either slowly get up or imagine some movements. Here you can imagine all sorts of motions, repetitive ones, touching surface, grabbing objects. If your dream body reacts to these thoughts and they become more real, then you are already in. You can also try summoning different objects - maybe a flashlight would be cool! Summoning or tk can be a RC then. Also, the numbers on your clock if they change or stay the same.

When I had the FA above, I also climbed into the cupboard as I believed that if I was dreaming then it could act as a teleportation device - I've been visualising this in case I wake up in my room! However, it didn't work - I presumably didn't fully convince myself that I was dreaming as the RC had failed.

That's a great idea to try! Maybe spend a little more time in the cupboard next time, examining it from the inside, to give the outside world more time to change? You can try this with doors too, btw.

It seems in the last few days that I've really started to question in my dream now - instead of recognising something as being strange, I'm now looking around and doing RCs in my dreams.

That's the perfect attitude to have!

I also can't help but feel I'm trying to dive straight into the deep-end by trying to find my DG straight away by summoning/teleporting - am I better off doing some training first, Rocky-style? I was hoping to find my DG and let them do the teaching!

Do whatever feels right for you! There are really no steps with dream control, although one could put things in categories to allow us sort of mental order for our mind. If you look for other things to do, then you can check out our tasks of the month and year. At any rate the more practice, the better! Have fun!

Tasks of the Month & Year

I posted a reply this morning but it didn't seem to go through - did my RCs at the time and I don't think I was dreaming

Thanks again for your replies - they are a great help. I unfortunately didn't have any dream recollection last night as I wasn't feeling well, so I ended up having a very scattered sleep. Attempting to WILD made my headache worse, so I gave up after a while to just try to sleep. It did give me a little time to reflect, however, and I've just got a couple of questions about WILDs:

1) What is the best thing to do with your mind whilst attempting a WILD? I've read several sources that say it's good to just focus on breathing and notice changes in body sensations (HI, onset of atonia etc.), some say repeat a mantra and others say proceed with visualisation and dream incubation. I've tried visualisation/incubation - this usually also happens when I repeat a mantra as the mantra, to me, implies the concoction of the dream - and my conscious seems to become a little too stimulated/excited at the prospect of lucid dreaming. Is it just a case of needing to keep relaxing for the incubation to be more successful, or should I try just focussing on breathing? (I think just focussing on breathing makes it too easy to lose your consciousness, without lots more meditation practice!)

2) I've had a couple of goes at a finger-induced LD and found that they weren't successful, although the technique appears to have a lot of endorsement amongst the community. This has always been after a 5 minutes (or so) WBTB session of getting up and having a glass of water. Is the FILD technique better to do immediately after waking without "waking up" your conscious mind as much?

As an aside, I saw someone this morning at work walking into the office looking around and pinching his nose. I think I spotted a fellow lucid dreamer!

What is the best thing to do with your mind whilst attempting a WILD

Unforunately, there is no best practice as the process is very subjective and experiences vary for people and even with the same individual. One very important thing to keep in mind is not to get overexcited when getting closer to an ld. It's about finding the perfect mix of awareness and relaxation. Personally, since I tend to sway more towards the wakefulness side, I rely more on simply relaxing and following my breathing. I may repeat the occasional mantra to make sure I'm focused on lding and don't drift off into normal dreams. The best thing is that even if you fall asleep as usual and miss the transition, all the effort and expectation might translate into a DILD later on. I think it's best if you try out different things to see which one works best for you. Here's a very good link with our wild class, don't hesitate to also ask sageous for some more tips on this.

WILD

Also, there's this quite nice technique that works well for both dilds and wilds, it's called SSILD. You can try doing a few of these cycles - they help you maintain awareness while keeping you relaxed at the same time.

http://www.dreamviews.com/induction-...eam-ssild.html

Is the FILD technique better to do immediately after waking without "waking up" your conscious mind as much

I haven't used this tech but from what I read is that you need be more sleepy, yes.

As an aside, I saw someone this morning at work walking into the office looking around and pinching his nose. I think I spotted a fellow lucid dreamer

Awww! That's awesome!

Thanks for pointing out the SSILD technique - I hadn't come across it before. I gave it a go last night but haven't been successful for the past 3 days in dream recall; I seem to wake up with nothing in my mind, not even a small fragment. I've been a bit busy at work and my wife came home last night from abroad so maybe I was more distracted than usual; when I woke up after 5 hours sleep last night, for example, I did a few SSILD cycles and fell asleep straight away!

I've read quite a lot about people having "nights off" from lucid dreaming and recollection. Do you think that the poor/zero recollection of the last 2-3 days is just my brain taking a rest? I've been going at things pretty hard (in terms of research, trying techniques, all-day awareness etc.) for the last two weeks with pretty good success.

I've read quite a lot about people having "nights off" from lucid dreaming and recollection. Do you think that the poor/zero recollection of the last 2-3 days is just my brain taking a rest? I've been going at things pretty hard (in terms of research, trying techniques, all-day awareness etc.) for the last two weeks with pretty good success.

You've been doing great. Don't worry if recall isn't top notch or even slacking some days, that's pretty normal. Sure, you don't have to try to ld every day, just don't put it aside for too long. Even on days where you're not too involved with ld practices, there are small things that you can do to keep it at a certain level - RC when waking up, some thoughts about lding pre bed and the occasional critical thought during the day.

Have a nice weekend!

Thanks for the kind words; I'm starting to realise just how much of an impact the mental state has on the success (or not) of dream recollection and lucid dreaming. When I woke up in the morning, I just instantly thought "I can't remember anything!" in a panic as recollection usually comes immediately to mind, like a short-term memory. This morning when I woke up I made an effort to just let the mind wander and pick up the fragments of what I'd been dreaming about, and I recalled five dreams of which I think one was a continuation of an earlier dream after a brief awakening. Unfortunately no lucidity, but I did question the situation a few times without following it up with a reality check.

I've been trying the SSILD technique after a WBTB for the past couple of days, but I find it makes me almost too relaxed; I complete the short cycles to relax and then about 1/2 cycles into the longer time periods I fall asleep! The dream following this was the one in which I questioned things the most, but as mentioned I didn't gain lucidity or follow things up with a RC. I think this just needs a little more focus on my behalf, so I shall combine the SSILD cycles either with a mantra or following breathing to keep conscious thought; at the moment I start to get amplifications of thoughts and get carried into them a little too easily. I'm starting to sense better what is needed for lucidity and how to get into the correct mental state for it; I've also noticed positive steps in meditating (self-adjusting my position, becoming relaxed and focussing more quickly, improved visualisation etc.) so I know that the hard work is slowly paying off

Thanks for the kind words; I'm starting to realise just how much of an impact the mental state has on the success (or not) of dream recollection and lucid dreaming

Indeed, it has a great impact. Whatever we think/say to ourselves sinks in directly in the subcon and can affect our success rate.

The dream following this was the one in which I questioned things the most, but as mentioned I didn't gain lucidity or follow things up with a RC. I think this just needs a little more focus on my behalf, so I shall combine the SSILD cycles either with a mantra or following breathing to keep conscious thought

Good idea! I think you have the right mindset, so keep up the great practice. Sweet dreams!

I've had good recall recently but haven't made it back into the lucid state. I've been busy at work and so have been slacking a little on the all-day awareness, but I had a relatively light day of work today (and not very much sleep last night) so hopefully tonight will be a good one. I almost had a nap when I got home as my wife isn't in this evening!

I was wondering about naps - I always assumed that naps weren't long enough to get into REM, and I don't think from any naps I've had that I actually fall asleep, but just get very groggy and go over thoughts in my mind. Is it true that naps are actually very conducive to lucid dreaming? If so, do you aim to WILD into it, or just drift off and let DILD take over as your conscious mind should be pretty active?

Well, I'm not much into napping, but from what I've read - you usually go straight into REM when napping. I guess this would hold mostly if you had a decent amount of sleep prior to that. For me it, takes way too long to fall asleep to be able to take any advantage of any benefits. There are lots of dreamers that say napping is very conductive for lding. You might want to ask Gab or Scionox regarding their nap routine for more info on how they usually do it.

Well good news to report, and a wall of text to go with it! Again, my recall has been pretty good over the last couple of days and I've settled more into a rhythm of questioning reality and performing reality checks regularly during the day, and then at night time hoping for a M/DILD early on and then waking up about 5-6 hours into the night to attempt a WILD. For this I set an alarm, but I've not yet had to use it as either I or my wife wake up throughout the night anyway.

As per the comments above, I've found that for the WILD I relax and prepare myself for the onset of atonia and generally get to the stage where my body begins to feel heavy before getting lost in thoughts and falling asleep. Last night I tried to WILD on my back as I've never before fell asleep in that position - in the past I have tried but always end up rolling onto my side. (my usual position is on my side, either foetal / "yearner" position) I didn't WBTB last night as when I woke up I felt confident that I'd be able to lucid dream. I relaxed and started going into paralysis, but again fell asleep! I had an odd dream in which I was playing a Fallout-style game for someone who couldn't beat the boss of a certain level, which turned out to look like a large version of Homer Simpson. Unfortunately this didn't prompt me into a DILD (!), but the person who I beat the level for thanked me and said "as a reward, you will now wake up in a lucid dream - enjoy!".

I woke up in my bed and did a nose-pinch reality check, and I found that I could breathe through my nose! So somehow my brain has "granted" me permission to lucidly dream I got out of bed and tried to "open" the door (light was shining through the cracks even though it was about 4.30 am - should be totally dark) to my private beach/tropical island (I've been visualising this regularly) but found that it didn't work, and I entered the hallway. I sat down in the study instead and found that the table is pretty much replicated perfectly in my dream - nothing odd or strange about the objects, after having taken a mental photograph and comparing it to what I see now. I touched the objects and rubbed my hands to stabilise the dream and did another RC just to confirm, and then I managed to summon an object in my pocket by thinking about it. I then could start to feel my body in bed whilst sitting in the chair and began to wake up - about 30 seconds of lucidity but it felt great!

I tried to DEILD in order to get back into the LD, but I've not really read up too much about it. I woke up on my back so stayed still and tried to get back into the dream, but found consciousness coming back quickly so I turned over to my side to sleep. Again I fell asleep as I couldn't keep concentration on my previous brief dream, but when I fell back asleep I found that I was consciously aware that I was dreaming. I was in a different location, walking out of a house and I saw an African Grey parrot sitting on a perch in the garden. I told the parrot that I knew I was dreaming, and then summoned a peanut in my pocket to give him. So I suppose I chained together two lucid dreams inadvertently - in the second one I didn't perform any RCs as I had supreme confidence in the fact that I was dreaming. I suppose the peanut-summoning is an inadvertent RC.

One thing I have noticed is that my (lucid) dreams are actually pretty realistic. I've been doing a lot of observation and awareness during the waking day - I did it last night in my first dream and everything was pretty much spot-on. I was impressed by the subconscious memory, but I was expecting some crazy and out-of-place things! I did manage to change the colour of an object by focussing on it, though, so I guess that's one manipulable thing. I'm assuming this is something to do with awareness and your conscious mind starting to become active, so that would explain the lack of "irrationality" that is standard in the lucid dreamscape vs a regular dreamscape - that is, until you intentionally introduce the irrationality!

I also notice that I quite often dream of "home", but with this not being a constant place or somewhere I've been. Is it common that an emotional feeling (in this case, homeliness) becoming attached to certain places to trick your mind into being grounded somewhere? I quite often wake up in (or return home to) flats, houses, castles etc. and feeling like I am home - in fact, my actual home is almost never visited apart from during false awakenings!

That's fantastic, congrats on the lds and the successful chaining, Camdave!

It looks like your confidence played a great role with inducing the lds! I liked how you went from non-ld to ld after this DC told you about your reward. Nice dream control too!

Your contemplations about realism and out-of-place items are interesting. I haven't thought of the randomness as a result of being further away from waking, but it makes sense.

Apologies for the lack of updates! It's been busy recently at work and with my wife home I'm no longer allowed to set my alarm in the middle of the night, so I've had a few nights of sleeping completely through. I'm trying to change my schedule a little at the moment to fit this - changing my mantra to wake up after each dream and drinking water to get around the no-alarm rule

My dream recall is still pretty good, but a little patchy compared to previously. I've not had a lucid dream since a week ago, but I assume that they are in general not a regular thing until you develop the skill and the mental awareness for it. Just so I've got a ballpark figure, for a beginner what sort of frequency do you think is possible? My dream diary seems to suggest one every 10 days or so, which I think is just coinciding when conditions are perfect from the day - good awareness throughout the day, waking up in the night and not falling asleep instantly when going back to bed.

I think I'm going to try sleeping on my back more often too, as I think most of my lucid dreams have occurred when sleeping on my back. I've never been able to sleep in this position before, even when very tired (I'm a side-sleeper) - I think the combination of meditation before bed and a better understanding of relaxation techniques has helped me to get over the mental block of sleeping on my back.

Hey Camdave, nice to see you around again!

I'm trying to change my schedule a little at the moment to fit this - changing my mantra to wake up after each dream and drinking water to get around the no-alarm

It's great to hear that you haven't given up the ld practice despite the recent ld routine change and trying to find ways to make it work. I had some sleepless days in the last few weeks which totally threw my wbtb and ld shedule off track. Recently, I have been trying to offset the days when it's absolutely impossible to do wbtbs with some prebed ld thoughts and also increase day work and focus on dream signs. That way lucidity attempts are never fully out of the picture for long.

Just so I've got a ballpark figure, for a beginner what sort of frequency do you think is possible?

Oh, we really don't have average statistics and it's difficult to compare one lder to another. My overall impression is that you had quite a good start so far and if you keep up your enthusiasm and practices, you should be nicely progressing towards getting more lds.

Thank you, as ever, for your replies. I've had better recall over the last few days but nothing lucid as yet - I'm banned from setting an alarm in the night by my wife so I've had to be a bit more creative and drink plenty of water before bed instead, but it's a little unreliable for timings!

I remember dreaming last night when I woke up a couple of times but didn't write anything down as I don't want to disturb my wife too much - I'd have to sit up in bed or get out of bed to go and write on a table. Is there any way round this other than just getting up and getting on with it? I convinced myself in bed that I'd remember my dreams, and then when I woke up in the morning I couldn't remember anything. I had a couple of fleeting moments where recollection started to come back, but then I found that I couldn't remember again.