New Christian Lucid Dreamer

Hey there everybody. I've been a Lucid Dreamer for quite some time but finally got tired of having to keep it to myself all the time. Isn't it so strange how many people are unenthusiastic towards the phenomenon of the lucid dream? If you ask me, it's one of the most amazing experiences that life has to offer.

I make note of my spiritual beliefs in the title of this post because it's been an indispensable part of my lucid life. The beliefs that I carry in this waking realm concerning my identity as a child of God, the spiritual authority of man, nothing being impossible and the power of faith-filled words... these have been key ingredients in my experiences in the lucid realm.

So to anyone else who has found that their beliefs in their spiritual identities has effected their experiences in the lucid realm, I invite you to post here with more details. We're explorers of consciousness and while people in the waking world question and debate whether God exists, we are of the few who know experientially what it's like to be a God. I'd like to think that gives us a leg-up.

Welcome to Dreamviews! I agree, I can't believe people aren't interested in being able to do ANYTHING you want inside of their dreams.

I am a Christian as well, but a lot of people here on Dreamviews are atheists. I personally have not tryed to experiment with spiritual or religious things inside my dreams, but I do find it very interesting and might have to give it a try one time. It seems like you have already had many lucid dreams. How long have you been doing it?

Other than being god like in dreams where you can have ultimate control, religion has as much to do with this as it does with balloon animals.
It is only similar, but not the same. You can be god in a lucid dream, but as in master of everything, not some divine creator who made everything that ever was.

Personally, I'm atheist, but I don't feel an obsessive need to prove you wrong lol, so don't worry.

To me religion has nothing to do with lucid dreaming.

Hi, welcome.
It is certainly true that one's beliefs effect one's dreams.
Although I don't believe in a god, sometimes my lucid dreams and regular dreams feel like spiritual experiences.

Hello and welcome!
I agree, it's one of the most amazing things in life!

I'm also Christian. I think it was meant to be, that I found out about lucid dreaming, because it helps me a lot in my dailyday and life. It makes me happy. :)

Happy dreams, my friend.

:welcome:

You will find the lucid dreaming group very friendly and open minded. Just for fuck sake stay out of the religion forum. I've had plenty of lucid dreams with various deities. I've met satan, demons, angels, gods, demigods... all fun, not that I believe in any of that. They sure can be fun.

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Originally Posted by Evolventity

Welcome to DV. So are you a genuine Christian or one of those "GOD HATES F*GS" 'Christians?

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Just by reading it he dosen't seem like a "GOD HATES F*GS" Christian, to me he sounded reasonable enough and I can't see why that question is necessary.

Anyway, welcome to DV, and it is primarily atheist as mentioned above, just for a heads up. However I know alot of people use lucid dreaming to explore spirituality ( christian and non-christian), so you will probably be able to find a few people at the least who have their spirituality play a large roll in dreaming.

Hi Felix! When I started out as a LDer, I was also a Christian. My dreams have always reflected my spirituality, or vice versa, rather. My dreams were a big reason I finally deconverted, and I've been doing a lot of exploring since then. I think that dreaming helps you understand yourself and what your deepest beliefs and values are. :)

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Originally Posted by siuol

Just by reading it he dosen't seem like a "GOD HATES F*GS" Christian, to me he sounded reasonable enough and I can't see why that question is necessary.

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Part of the reason of this forum is introducing yourself. I see this to be a personal aspect attributed to the forum and my question was meant towards that. It's okay to learn more about someone in a introductory thread about themselves, is it not? Although someone may seem reasonable as a whole, they can have drastically negative views, which I have learned from my own experience. It was a simple question. If you take a look at the question in a neutral perspective, without stigma or annotations, it's not aggressive like you may initially perceive.

Welcome in Felix, I hope you find everything you need in here for your future journeys through your subcoinsciousness :) I believe that ones faith can have a big impact on ones dreams. Not that all of your dreams have to revolve around god and angels and such, but it is likely that you will have another picture and perspective of them in your dreams than us atheists do :)

As long as people are reasonable and don't try to push their beliefs down each others throats its all good. :)
To other people it should only matter what you do (in relation to them), not what you believe in.

But since you mentioned Christianity, I must admit that I really don't know that much about that religion.
But recently I met a man who was Christian but also intrigued by lucid dreaming and astral projections.

We got to talk and his attitude was that lucid dreaming and astral projections take place in Astral plane (like some writers do claim that its the same 'space').
Then he found in some Christian books that after someone dies that first they pass thru the 'Realm of Demons'. Which also connects to the thought that after people physically die they spend some time in Astral Plane.
So he connected those two and came to the conclusion that Astral Plane is filled with Demons which will lie and trick you. And that no one should go to Astral Plane, or has anything to look for there. Because God is not there.

Also I must say that I only talked with this man. That everything is purely theoretical. And that he was not like "YOU WILL ALL BURN IN HELL FOR PRACTICING LUCID DREAMING AND OBEs", he was just talking what he came across.

Thanks everyone for the feedback. It's been a few days since I've checked my messages so it might take a while to go point by point and respond to every thread. So just a big thank you to everyone for taking the time to reply. A few things stood out in my mind after reading all the responses though. First off, unlike many who profess my faith, I don't presume to know the answers to all of life's mysteries. There's only one mystery that I claim to have any comprehension of and it's the paradox of strength through weakness and progress through grace.

Of all ways that my faith has impacted my dream-life, this is probably the most significant. In the past, I used to be a practitioner of various spiritual disciplines including Tibetan Dream Yoga. Even though lucid dreaming was always something I naturally experienced and enjoyed, once it became an object of my spirituality I started to approach it with a very workman-like attitude. My nights generally consisted of meditating my way into sleep, entering into deeper meditation while in the dream, trying to resolve "karma" (avoiding emotional reactions to anything in the dream in hopes of touching the state of pure consciousness). This, combined with my waking efforts to achieve "enlightenment" pretty much exhausted me and pushed me to the breaking point.

Finally, in a moment of submission, who I believe to be the Spirit of God started to impress upon my heart that my efforts to reach Him were futile. I saw the arrogance of my pursuit, as the builders of the tower of babel before me, I sought to "build a tower high enough to enter into heaven" not realizing that the distance between heaven and earth (mankind and deity) was far greater than what I'd originally perceived it to be. In a revelation of self (through the Spirit of God) I realized that rather than pursue God, I'd have to entertain the idea that perhaps God was trying to pursue me. Many think to serve God, but not many look at all of creation and come to the conclusion that it's God who is the servant of all.

So perhaps it was a very uncommon introduction into the Christian faith (no churches, no pastors, no bible) but a direct experience with the idea of Grace. Since then of course I've dedicated my mind to the scriptures and have been growing in understanding, but it's all about the same point: strength through weakness and progress through grace. So how this applies to my lucid dreaming experience is simple. Rather than willing myself into a state of lucidity, meditating my way into waking induced lucid dreams or reality-checking my way into D.I.L.D, I rely on the Spirit of Grace to give me the experience of lucidity as a gift. My dreams aren't always lucid, but when they are, I see it as an opportunity for me to exercise my identity as an image [son] of God. When it's not lucid, I take it as a symbolic signified message through which God is showing me things that I stand to benefit in knowing.

Certainly, I don't believe that God hates any man regardless of sexuality or activities. So with the idea of a gracious compassionate deity being the most prominent thought in my consciousness, the nature of my dreams are certainly lighter and there's no way that I can express misjudgement or rejection to any person in good conscious. So no worries. Though I do apologize on behalf of others who claim the name "christian" but attempt to exalt themselves as Gods by pushing down people of opposing faiths. I simply agree with Jesus when He says: "If anyone hears My sayings and does not keep them, I do not judge him; for I did not come to judge the world, but to save the world. -John 12:47

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Originally Posted by Ivan452

As long as people are reasonable and don't try to push their beliefs down each others throats its all good. :)
To other people it should only matter what you do (in relation to them), not what you believe in.

But since you mentioned Christianity, I must admit that I really don't know that much about that religion.
But recently I met a man who was Christian but also intrigued by lucid dreaming and astral projections.

We got to talk and his attitude was that lucid dreaming and astral projections take place in Astral plane (like some writers do claim that its the same 'space').
Then he found in some Christian books that after someone dies that first they pass thru the 'Realm of Demons'. Which also connects to the thought that after people physically die they spend some time in Astral Plane.
So he connected those two and came to the conclusion that Astral Plane is filled with Demons which will lie and trick you. And that no one should go to Astral Plane, or has anything to look for there. Because God is not there.

Also I must say that I only talked with this man. That everything is purely theoretical. And that he was not like "YOU WILL ALL BURN IN HELL FOR PRACTICING LUCID DREAMING AND OBEs", he was just talking what he came across.

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I have to disagree with this fear about the dream realm, or any other realm. My faith clearly states that all planes of existence exists in the domain of God's kingdom, and that He Himself holds all things together. And apart from that, as heirs and children of God, all things belong to us (including the dream realm). Plus there's never any justification for fear when you profess to believe the Book:

"He existed before anything else, and he holds all creation together." (Colossians 1:17)

"He who did not spare his own Son, but gave him up for us all--how will he not also, along with him, graciously give us all things?" (Romans 8:32)

"the world or life or death or things present or things to come; all things belong to you." (1 Corinthians 3:22)

"And I am convinced that nothing can ever separate us from God's love. Neither death nor life, neither angels nor demons, neither our fears for today nor our worries about tomorrow--not even the powers of hell can separate us from God's love." (Romans 8:38)

Kinda starting to preach a little bit now.

I know I don't have to read this thread everytime it updates, but DV was always a site that was filled with Lucid dreamers, not white lucid dreamers or religious lucid dreamers or muslim lucid dreamers or whatever. Just lucid dreamers.

Can we maybe keep the discussion to Lucid dreaming?

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Originally Posted by Origami

Kinda starting to preach a little bit now.

I know I don't have to read this thread everytime it updates, but DV was always a site that was filled with Lucid dreamers, not white lucid dreamers or religious lucid dreamers or muslim lucid dreamers or whatever. Just lucid dreamers.

Can we maybe keep the discussion to Lucid dreaming?

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The purpose of this thread wasn't to preach or influence anyone's beliefs; I do hope that your beliefs are secure enough to not be threatened by contrary rules. This thread is meant to discuss the interesting relationship between the beliefs we carry about life beyond the natural realm in waking life, and our experiences in dream life. Certainly we're dealing with a field of consciousness that finds it's very root and being in belief. All things in dream emanate from belief, from my perspective of course.

Though this is open to anyone who has any interest in the phenomenon (whether Spiritual Practitioners or not) I do primarily hope to connect with the Spiritual Practitioners who see and utilize the dream realm as a means of heightening consciousness, experimenting with the forces of human creativity, or possibly even connection with who they see as being dream guides/angels/spirit's of God etc. If you are not comfortable with this discussion I do apologize and look forward to interacting with you in other threads that don't deal specifically with this topic. However, I'd be doing a great disservice to the lucid dream community if I were to censor my experiences and potential contributions to the world of lucid dreaming. For instance:

1) Rather than traditional WILD or DILD perspectives of entering dream's, I offer a personal approach which uses the very force of belief which creates dreamscapes to initiate the L.D. to begin with. Through the powerful faith-based expectation of LD's being a gift, we find a new way of entering into the dream realm.

2) Many in the Lucid Dreaming community struggle with fears, especially when they begin to enter the OBE side of the phenonmenon. These boards are filled with posts about demons, malevolent dream entities, etc. I put forth how I personally avoid all of these negative phenomenons through the belief of the power of Love being a sufficient protection. I've read books on Lucid Dreaming that recommend a person visualize their hearts and the force of love surrounding them whenever they run into unsavory experiences in the dream realm. Rather than promote a specific visualization technique, I simply put forth the faith-words (affirmations) that keep me protected.

3) I didn't get to this topic yet, but in regards to dream control I also have faith-based recommendations that any or all people may benefit from. It's well-known that the use of verbal commands are a great way to influence and control dream environments and characters. I find basis for this belief in an interesting way through faith as well. A simple verse (affirmation) that equips me for such dream activity is "Thou shalt decree a thing, and it shall come to thee." (Job 22:28) Just as Jesus through His words silenced storms, I through my words silence unsavory dream situations. As He says that if you believe and doubt not in your heart, you shall have whatsoever ye sayeth? I too carry these words in my heart and find that it has literally allowed me to move mountains and create universes in the dream realm.

So again, I apologize if your sensitivity to posts of this nature is preventing you from gleaming valuable insights on the intentional use of belief for the enriching of the lucid dream experience. But glib insulting accusation of me attempting to "preach" and saying that my point of view has no place here in this community, that my lucid dreaming isn't pure but is religiously tainted.. or even the accusation that this entire discussion was about anything other than lucid dreaming are both false and unfounded.

Uh, no, sorry. I didn't say (or intend to say) that this was simply a preaching thread and all you wanted to do was convert everyone here! That would be absurd.
I just wanted to keep Dreamviews a lucid dreaming site, like it is. We have a religion section for specific threads about religion itself and often how it interacts with lucid dreaming.

I wasn't telling you to stop or leave or believe what I believe. You are just putting forth your opinion and of course, like everyone else, that really get's on my nerves when it's not what I think lol.

Believe what you like, what you want, what you know. I'll stick with the chemical reactions and natural happenings of the brain that induces lucid dreaming and what not.
I am open to the idea of astral projection and shared dreaming, but not when people jump to conclusions and say it's an act of god or some spirit or some kind of super consciousness. That is unproven and there isn't even a shred of evidence to prove that could even be possible. All are theories.

I suppose reading this thread and seeing you explain how god (directly or indirectly) helps you, not necessarily with lucid dream induction, but how you go about in them makes me immediately think that this is silly or wrong or whatever.

That is always everyone first reaction, to defend what they believe in.
The second post is always to explain why they never really meant any conflict.

Fair enough. Thank you for elaborating. Since this is the section of the forum where people introduce themselves to one another, I believe that I've done that adequately and gave the DreamViews community some insights into my personal life, spiritual life, and most importantly my dream life. Now that these foundations have been laid down, I'll explore the "religion section" that you recommended and hopefully continue discussions over there. My greatest hope is to learn new things and to share what I've learned. Freely I've received, and freely I will give. Thank you for the direction and hope to see you around the forum.

I don't mean you have to go to the religious forum just because I said so! If it's lucid dreaming you are talking about, then post anywhere. If it mainly about god and religion and how it affects your attempts, then I would suggest post in there. You don't see many religion related topic in attaining lucidity or general discussion because they in a way don't belong there, but discussion of lucid related topics such as faith count and can be posted there.

I'm no mod or admin so you can disregard everything I say, but that's how it generally goes.

Hi, and welcome to DV! :welcome:
I'm actually Christian too, and I have a lot of questions about the connections with Lucid dreaming and religion.
Anyway, hope you enjoy the forum as much as I (and probably many others) do :)

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Originally Posted by FelixLucid

1) Rather than traditional WILD or DILD perspectives of entering dream's, I offer a personal approach which uses the very force of belief which creates dreamscapes to initiate the L.D. to begin with. Through the powerful faith-based expectation of LD's being a gift, we find a new way of entering into the dream realm.

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I find your faith-based approach to lucid dreaming interesting. It makes since that this would work for you since lucid dreaming is primarily effected by ones belief, positive or negative.
I try meditating and asking for higher guidance (even if it's a part of myself) in my dreams and with lucid dreaming, and I try to feel that will receive help if I ask for it.
But then all sorts of doubt gets in the way.

Hey Felix! And welcome. I must say, you have me intrigued. I also happen to be a Christian, but I'm pretty inexperienced with lucid dreaming so far (granted I haven't been working at it lately, just because I have a lot going on, but at least now I know I can lucid dream). I'm glad to see that other believers are also lucid dreaming enthusiasts - you and some others above. I really enjoyed your scripture-based tips. Perhaps we can exchange PMs about the subject sometime.

Welcome. I too believe in god but many here don't.