Pain After LD? (Also, what sort of LD is this?)

I had a weird experience this morning where I went into SP three times, The first 2 with frightening hallucinations. On the third one, I got this image of a black cat in my head, at first it was just my imagination thinking, you know... only about as clear as when you're wide awake imagining something. Then it seemed to get more realistic and move on its own.

That's when I remembered reading here somewhere that someone uses a self made technique, where they visualize a scene when they're really tired and focus on it, and then eventually reach out and grab something in the scenery and they're in the dream. Well, I reached out and picked the cat up and after the initial shock that it worked, I opened my eyes and got out of bed, RC and realized I'm in an LD.

When I woke up though, (and this was only 10 minutes later) I had a pain from my head down my spine, and I know it had something to do with the LD since my body felt worn out when it hadn't only 10 minutes before.

So I have some questions...
A) What type of LD would that be called? It happened entirely by accident as well, and only happened because my body kept insisting on going into SP and having terrible hallucinations (voices, feeling presences touch my arms).

B ) Has anyone else experienced physical symptoms of LDing after awakening? Is it normal? Should I be worried :/ I've had odd muscular and neurological problems that stump doctors and dont know up on MRIs since I started practicing LDing, and I never connected the two until today.(Actually, I stopped practicing for about 2~3 months but it still happens by accident) I've only had three LDs but ever since I learned about Lds in the first place, I keep getting Sleep Paralysis much more often and by complete accident. And before that hallucinations like voices and touches never used to accompany it.

C) This time I tried climbing into a mirror in the room I woke up in the LD in.
My hands just hit the glass and I couldn't climb through. Any tips?

D) At one point I tried standing up from a sitting position, and suddenly my body became very heavy and hard to control. It was a struggle to stand and move much. Any help with this, or why that happens?



I know this was long winded. Sorry, there's just so many aspects of LDing I'm still not familiar with.

A) Sounds like a WILD, wake induced lucid dream. That was pretty good catching that false awakening.

B) Some people report feeling a residual pain on waking from dreams where they were in pain. But it's never intense and fades very very quickly. If it was like that, then it was probably just the result of reaching into your own head. If not, it's probably linked to your medical problems.

C)Dive through it and break the glass.

D)THat seems to happen randomly in dreams. Some common occurrences are the infamous "slow punch" and the old "lead legs". Don't know of anyone who's managed to overcome that. I had it so bad once, along with the feeling of being tired, that I layed down and went to sleep in the dream. I'd suggest giving that a try and starting fresh from a dream within a dream.

Lmao! I didn't even realize that was an FA till you just congratulated me on catching it XD Hmm, I thought it was only a WILD if you consciously are attempting to LD. I wasn't, I was just kind of staring at the random imagery in my head when I realized how realistic and of its own accord it started getting (the cat).

Also, my medical problem I'm thinking might be being caused my LDing.
The pain in my neck confused me but somehow I know it is linked to the LD.
I was perfectly comfortable before going into the LD, and ten minutes later when I woke up the pain was there.

I have a theory though...
Can your physical body move when you're in an LD?
And if you do something that involves strenuous movement in your dream,
Would your body in real life tense up?

Another thing though...
My friend posed the idea that all of the odd things that go on with your brain related to LDing could be causing me the neurological problems I'm having. I mean when you think about it, Lucid Dreaming is very unnatural. For people who don't know about LDing it doesn't happen often to them, you have to consciously attempt to do it, or have a previous knowledge of what an LD is and how to control it when it happens by accident to really stabilize it. So.. if you think about it that way, couldn't it have negative physical and mental effects on you?

Tips for putting your hand through a mirror:

You have to believe it will happen. Dreams are in your head so it makes sense. I try to fly through ceilings and when I believe it will happen it does, but the one time I doubted it I couldn't do it.

About the pain, I recently had a non-lucid in which I was sitting in a car, driving home. In the dream my abdomin hurt from sitting so long. I woke up and my abdomin hurt. It could have been vice versa, my abdomin could have been hurting in the dream because of real-life pain...maybe caused by sleeping in a painful position (curled up too long maybe).

The mind is very strong though. Who knows if it is capable of causing you real pain.

My body moves in my sleep sometimes, a lot of people's bodies do. I wake up often, whil dreaming about going down stairs or tripping, and my legs are kicking. It scares me.

^ But nothing in my dream was hurting me, I just woke up like "Whyyyy does it feel like lucid dreaming is making my spine cave in ;__; "



...............So like...
No one else has any input on whether or not LDs can harm you?
I know most people here want to just say its impossible, so they don't have to worry but. I mean isn't there the chance that I could be fucking with my head a little too much? Could it cause some people pain and some none?

D= I seriously hope I get at least a bit more input.
Its not good LDing is you're subconsciously worrying about recurring pain.

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Originally Posted by Yume.no.ato

Lucid Dreaming is very unnatural. For people who don't know about LDing it doesn't happen often to them, you have to consciously attempt to do it, or have a previous knowledge of what an LD is and how to control it when it happens by accident to really stabilize it. So.. if you think about it that way, couldn't it have negative physical and mental effects on you?

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Lucid dreaming is perfectly natural. Many people do it all the time without knowing what it was called. You don't need any previous knowledge of it. If fact I think not LDing is unnatural. Probably why the world is as messed up as it is, people lack awareness. For instance lacking the awareness that those Nike shoes you wear were made by child labor perpetuates their plight.

ANd yes, you can sometime move in sleep. I almost broke my toe kicking the wall in a dream where I was playing soccer. I'm also prone to talking and yelling in my sleep.

Hmmm, you're very convincing except for "not LDing is unnatural"
I mean, if that really were the case then we wouldn't naturally not do it, right?
I think what you mean is that its less beneficial or something,
But I wouldn't go so far as to say its unnatural not to,
Otherwise we'd all be LD pro's by nature :0


Also I'm not even sure if awareness is the problem with the world, sadly )=
I think its more like a lot of people notice and then don't care in the end.
People who know about sweatshop products still buy them. Its a sad sad world D=

And yeah, I guess you're right, people must be able to do it without prior knowledge, otherwise how would people know about it at all right?

But think about it this way, if it was perfectly healthy I mean, we wouldn't be so prone to wake up after LDing. Sleep is supposed to occur for many hours, and (I could very well be mistaken) but don't the majority of people wake up after their LDs which usually last much less than an hour (but can last up to one)? If it was something that was perfectly natural it'd be much more likely (though I know it does happen already) that we'd stay asleep for hours on end most of the time.

This is why I wonder if I'm messing with something that, while it can open up many opportunities like knowing how it feels to fly a cloud ect, at the same time it might just be healthier to not do it. There isn't a larrrge amount of research done on it so I can't say this for sure one way or another, but I haven't heard anyone put up a good reason for why it can't possibly be dangerous and that worries me. I like to have all the facts about something before I go into it head on.

I want someone to seriously give me some solid rationality. I mean, I'm not saying you weren't rational, but it doesn't really tell me why it can't possibly be harmful.

I've never heard of anyone getting hurt from LDing. At least, no one before you. Unfortunately I have nothing to prove that it can't be dangerous. When you think about it, nearly anything can be dangerous; what if you're taking out the trash and you trip and break your ankle? You may have gotten hurt one time, but that doesn't mean that taking out the trash should be considered dangerous.

Has this happened frequently, or just one time? It's very possible that it was just a coincidence. If it's a recurring problem, you may want to stop trying to LD until you look into it further.

As for waking up after lucid dreams, you actually wake up at the end ever REM cycle. It's just that you go back to sleep right away and usually forget ever waking up. I'm guessing that your heightened awareness during a LD makes you more likely to wake up and remember waking up.

Sorry, I know that wasn't really what you were looking for.

^ It was that one time, but I could tell it was caused by some sort of strain the LD put on my head or something. I know it seems like there's no way I could inference that but I'm sure we've all had instances where you intuitively know what caused it. Plus, I was pain free ten minutes before that and when I woke up it was immediately noticeable and went away after being awake for 5 minutes. It was like merely being awake took the pressure off my head/spine. D=

Thanks for the input, though~

I suppose no one will have proof otherwise, then ;___; awww.
Perhaps I'll try LDing again and if the problem persists then....
At the same time I'm not even sure if I want to push it at all.
Bummer, I was so excited about LD too : /

Someone might know something. I did a quick google search. Almost all of the sites I found (I just read the descriptions) said that it wasn't possible for a dream to hurt you because it's just like a regular dream. I found two examples of people getting hurt. One was where the person didn't like LDing because he always seemed to get hurt in his dreams that were lucid and it felt real. He didn't mention anything about hurting after waking up though. The other person sometimes thought he was in a dream when he was awake and walked into walls and such. Neither of those is the same as your problem though.

If I were you, I'd keep trying to LD and see if it happens again. If it happens more than very occasionally, you might want to ask your doctor about it and/or stop lucid dreaming. If you believe in beyond dreaming stuff, you might want to ask in that section of the forum. I really don't know much about beyond dreaming topics, but I'm sure someone there could help you or at least point you to someone else who can help.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Yume.no.ato

Hmmm, you're very convincing except for "not LDing is unnatural"
I mean, if that really were the case then we wouldn't naturally not do it, right?
I think what you mean is that its less beneficial or something,
But I wouldn't go so far as to say its unnatural not to,
Otherwise we'd all be LD pro's by nature :0

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I mean sitting in front of the TV or computer all day, sitting behind a desk at work or school, the endless mind numbing electronic entertainment we are constantly bombarded by, those things are unnatural.

I suspect if it wasn't for all that crap, there would be a lot more LDers in the world.

About the pain I am kind of worried for you. From what you said I too think the LD could of caused the pain especially because you had no pain before and the fact that it was from your head down into your spine. It seems improbable you could kill or even harm yourself from WILDing though.

I'm thinking the pain could be just in your mind or not real kind of like the wierd physical feelings I get when in SP sometimes. You said you do have weird medical history, so not sure.

The muscular / neurological problems could have to do with opening your chakras the wrong way through LDing, I don't know enough on the subject though.

Um also how often do you go in SP?
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haha and Cusp your right, Tv etcetera is much more unnatural than LDing, most definitely!

O_O Wow I didn't know anyone had actually replied haha.
I didn't get the email notification.

Well I get SP pretty often, for instance that time it was like 3 times in a row...
And I get it sometimes multiple times throughout the week, or even twice a night. Sometimes I have an SP drought and wont have one for a couple of weeks maybe even a month, but it does come in abundance when it does ;_;

Yikes. Well I'm not sure what to do on the subject anymore really.
Its not like I can tell a doctor without them thinking I'm a loopy hippy,
And theres not enough research anyway. Should I continue with LDs? I got another DILD by accident last night and didn't wake up with tooo much pain...only the usual shittiness I feel XD.

But, could LDs be causing the odd medical problems? The pain in my head is an odd pressure that keeps returning, and really it only started after I started having LDs......... Like very close. ;__; neurologists say it doesn't show up on a CT scan, bloodwork is clean, Xray was fine, so I'm stumped and it seems likely connected with LDing especially after waking up that morning with the neck pain. This sucks entirely since I am very excited about the concept of LDing, and if I have to stop it would suck about 50 balls.
auuuuuuuguhhh.

You could try stopping LDing, and if the pain goes away then that's good. If it doesn't, well... I guess that means that whether or not you LD doesn't makes a difference, so you might as well keep LDing.

I still have a hard time believing that LDing could actually hurt someone, but, well, you never know.

I did for a while, actually when the pain happened the LD was accidental. (sorta, I suppose I didn't have to pick up that cat). I stopped for the very reason that I was worried it was causing the pain. Even worse, I keep having SP aaaaaaaaaand LDing like, accidentally (only twice but its bound to happen again)

;___; Ugh.

But you're right, I'll keep trying to have a long LD drought, if it works and yet I still have pain, then... I'll just keep LDing since I'll have pain either way.

hmm, you said in your last couple of posts that your neck was hurting. Are you sure you weren't sleeping in a way that stretches your neck? Let me explain: The last couple of days when I sleep, I was sleeping on my back with my head facing to the right. When I woke up, I would have very bad neck pain. Since I noticed this, I fixed my neck position and I haven't had the same problem. I think the only way you can get hurt from LDing is if you do something like what happened to the Cusp and his toe, as in acting out the dream, but, that shouldn't happen due to SP and the fact that you do crazy things in non-lucids as well. Maybe it's something from your past medical history? :P

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Yume.no.ato

A) What type of LD would that be called? It happened entirely by accident as well, and only happened because my body kept insisting on going into SP and having terrible hallucinations (voices, feeling presences touch my arms).

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I once had those horrible hallucinations as well. I heard screamings so badly in my head that I wanted to get out, even though I knew I was close to fall into a WILD. I think if you´re good in controlling your dreams you could just turn down the volume.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BigFan

hmm, you said in your last couple of posts that your neck was hurting. Are you sure you weren't sleeping in a way that stretches your neck? Let me explain: The last couple of days when I sleep, I was sleeping on my back with my head facing to the right. When I woke up, I would have very bad neck pain. Since I noticed this, I fixed my neck position and I haven't had the same problem. I think the only way you can get hurt from LDing is if you do something like what happened to the Cusp and his toe, as in acting out the dream, but, that shouldn't happen due to SP and the fact that you do crazy things in non-lucids as well. Maybe it's something from your past medical history? :P

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I don't think so. I was in that position for 10 minutes, tops.
The pain I think was more than it should have been for such a short period of time. Though, it is a possibility despite me doubting it.