Same here. except I've never been Lucid before. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by N@vi
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Same here. except I've never been Lucid before. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by N@vi
um, dreams are created by your mind so how on earth would you learn something new?
I don't know. Somehow I'm scared of nothing. I know it will all be a dream, but yet I'm still afraid. :?
They should treat you exactly the same way you treat them Mew151, at least mine do. So if you want them to treat you with respect, then treat them with respect.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mew151
They really are nothing to fear. On the rare occasions that I have encountered mean DCs, one of them being once in an underground parking garage, where I saw a bunch of bullies drive up and get out of their car and start walking my way, I realized that I was dreaming, so just stood there and laughed at them as they hit me, because their fists were going right through me.
On other occasions when I used to encounter what seemed to be a very negative entity, I just imagined white light expanding out from me, and it blew him into bits. Needless to say, that bastard, whoever he was, never comes around anymore.
Those times are rare though. Most of my DCs are more than willing to communicate with me and help me with whatever I ask, because I approach them the same way I would approach someone in the physical, with respect.
Well... maybe the brain got the processing of info while it was on the dream, so it would tell you the "new" thing while your in the dream.Quote:
Originally Posted by WILDinitall
my philosophy is AK-47 time when they start getting hostile
Well I'm new and all with Dreamveiws, but I have had some experience with LDs and DCs so I just thought I'd add my 2 cents. One thing I find very fascinating is talking to DCs and examining how they react to certian questions.
Ok one example, I'm a big fantasy novel type guy so recently I've been expreimenting with dream control. So I become lucid one night and I'm in this water park so I say to myself, "Hey what better way to learn dream control than from your own subconscious? So I walk over to one DC, (who reminds me of a friend from school) and ask, "Hey what do you think is the best way to shoot lighting. Then he says well I might as well show you". So he turns toward some random building, puts forth his hand and frigin lighting shoots out of his hand!!! :shock:
OK another example I have another LD and I remeber I'm in some neighborhood and It's night. So I walk over to some Middle-age mom who for some reason decides to walk outside the house I standing in front of. So I decide to ask her, "So what your opinion on the best way to TK cars". (hey it's dream logic we all do things in dreams which we later realize is strange) so after I ask her and then she looks at me as if I've grown a second head and responds with something like, "I dont who the hell you are but get out of here before I call the cops" :?
So I guess DCs really are figments of your imagination created by your subconscious. So in a sense they are sort of derect links to your mind so you never really know what to expect from them. Sometime they act like mouthpieaces for you sub, like the first example or they behave like a normal person would if you ask them lucid questions.
But then again I'm kinday of a noobie so maybe I dont know what I'm talking about :D
Great examples Omega Man. Just goes to show that no two DCs are alike.Quote:
Originally Posted by Omega Man
I think that even the make up of DCs can vary, with some of them being cardboard like figures who would be worthless to try to talk to, while others are so real they almost seem human, and maybe are other humans who are just dreaming, while others are certainly just figments of our imagination.
You sound pretty experienced to me. Thanks for sharing those examples.:goodjob2:
Yesss - I had my first conversation with a DC today, but actually she didn't act how I expected her to do. It was a friend of mine who I haven't seen in a while now and we were talking and laughing about I-don't-know-what when I suddenly had the feeling that I had been awake a few minutes before and that this had to be a dream (I don't have a dreamsign).
Me: "Just answer me one question: Is this a dream?"
DC: "As far as I know it is, of course. Behind it is a temple and a serg."
Me: "What's a serg?" oO
DC: "A temple-area."
*lol*? xD
Hello! Another newbie here. Lucid dreaming is pretty easy for me. I'd gotten a little bored (a little) of sex with DC's, and was looking for some new things to try, when I found this forum. Last night, I tried communicating with my DC's. I walked into a room and four old women were sitting around a table.I asked,"what can I do to stay lucid?" Three of the women kind of looked at me and each other, while the fourth got up and went to leave the room. As she left she said, "try picking up your cat." That did'nt make sense so I went into another room where there were four young women were sitting on the floor, maybe watching TV. Two were redheaded twins with freckles. I asked them the same question, and as they were replying, my alarm started going off!! I was really mad this morning! In another dream a few weeks ago, I found myself walking in a store with a DC when I realized I was dreaming. I told her that she was in my dream and she could do anything she wanted. She told me to prove it so I took off flying. When I looked back down on the land, there were a whole lot of DC's running around like scattered ants. It was like they did'nt know what to do with their freedom. They were kind of crazy. I kind of drifted off after that. Anyway I like this forum and look forward to trying new dream things. Thanks for the ideas!
Because your subconcious mind picks up alot of things that your concious mind misses. Since dreams are influenced greatly by your subconcious you can learn a whole lotQuote:
Originally Posted by WILDinitall
Very true. A person who learns to listen to their dreams can learn about any number of things before they occur. Things such as dangerous future situations, future health problems, can often be detected by the subconscious mind, and show up in ones dreams before they ever manifest themselves in the physical realms.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Prodigy
Below is a link to a book called Conscious Dreaming that contains numerous examples of people who have been warned and helped by their dreams.
ttp://www.amazon.com/Conscious-Dreaming-Spiritual-Path-Everyday/dp/051788710X
That may be because this world is just a shadow of what comes next. That true reality is incomprehendible to our physical and limited bodies. With that logic, this would be the pseudo life. It may be that what we percieve as the after life is not that at all, as it is our true life. Maybe it's more like this world is just our pre-life.Quote:
omeone mentioned asking about what happens after we die...I remember this one conversation with the guide where I mentioned "the afterlife." He said, "Don't call it that. nobody here calls it that. It makes you sound like an idiot."
I've never thought of talking to DCs before (during a lucid dream). Once I'm aware that I am dreaming I usually discount everything in my dream as such -a dream. Next time I have a lucid dream I'm going to talk to the DCs rather than ignore them. Sounds interesting
Edit:
Sort of off topic but it goes along with the theme of learning during dreams
I have worked on designs for things I've built during lucid dreams. When I was 12 I solved a problem I was having with a hovercraft (a little RC toy I made out of broken RC cars/dustbuster) skirt design during my sleep.
Hmm I had a lucid last night with this really cute guy with blue eyes. I tried to give him a nice accent. He went from American to British and I kept telling him to talk with an Australian accent, he was trying so hard but never got it... hahaha!
Whenever my DCs are hostile I make deals with them. I usually don't have to hold up my end of the bargain, and they become very friendly :)
I have had hostile and friendly ones. Seems to depend on my feelings of the environment I'm in. When I'm in dark, misty, unknown areas and/or I am stressed, my DCs are often aggressive or creepy. When I'm in my house or other familiar places, either they are nicer because that's what I expect from those environments, or because usually the DCs are people I know from those places. I don't usually communicate with them much, though. I've had a couple promise to show up in my dreams and make me become lucid... every once in a while they show up once I'm already lucid :doh:
sometimes i feel when i am fully in deep conservations with dcs, i feel they are real somehow. i cant explain it.
i was told once to quit smoking weed if i wanted to lucid dream better:banana:
Quote:
Originally Posted by acillis
I cut weed from my diet, and to be honest I haven't noticed a difference...
but beyond the topic of your words aciliis, I agree they are real somehow.
btw, I am almost bored enough to search for tha deathblade, again....
<3 cya around ....
************************************************** ************************************************** ************btw*********************************** ********************tag*************************** ****************you're**************************** *********************************it....*********** ***************lawzl****************************** **************
CD, try picking up your cat. Your mind will focus on the feel of the cat, keeping you "awake"!
You guys are acting stupid.
as if these DC are real, they may seam it, but they are just figments of your imagination, whether their shallow or not is up to you.
I have a feeling there was a nicer way to say that :P
DC's never talk in my dreams, it's weird. I just KNOW what they're "saying" as if they're sending their thoughts to me (and assuming their thoughts are just as emovisual as mine, not just spoken word).
I agree with you. There seem to be various indicators. What of the following can you confirm?Quote:
Originally Posted by Oneiro
- The dream world has its very own set of physical rules. They may be a lot different from the waking world, but you can't just break them.
- The dream world (or part of it) focusses on you like a stage play in that you are the protagonist, no matter if it pleases or evokes fear. It wants strong emotional feedback from you, that's why you are put into situations e.g. from your childhood. It's almost as if your environment is created on the fly to adapt to your situation or to purposely lead to a situation.
- Many DCs want physical contact and/or your direct attention. Today I had a dream where I was tricked into directly focussing and sending energy to a DC. I felt though, that my resources are unlimited, so I didn't care. It felt very powerful having access to so much energy. Could have been a trick too of course.
- Some DCs don't want your focus and attention and they behave very different. Once in a LD I met an old guy that smiled at me and said "If you want to help people, you need to care for the wanderers." With "wanderers" I felt he meant unconscious dreamers. I saw a few of those later, almost like zombies.
So what if they harvest our energy in the dream world, feeding on our emotions? I can't say I like that thought very much, though I still think we have an unlimited supply, something they do not have. For me it's another reason to achieve consciousness in dreams. That way I have the choice of giving energy or not and not being milked like a cow. A good motivator.
P.S. "Subconsciousness" is just a word. The mind is a black box and nothing has been proven. You would do better distinguishing provable scientific facts from scientific hypotheses (fiction), which psychology and the various models of the mind do indeed belong to. The hypothesis that the dream world is as real as the waking world (or as unreal) seems more plausible to me than the model of the mind that psychology works with.
"Dreams are real while they last, can we say more of life?" - Havelock Ellis
- The dream world has its very own set of physical rules. They may be a lot different from the waking world, but you can't just break them.
It's only limited by your mind. We are restrained by our minds rules, but what rules are you insinuating can't be broken? 'Anything' that is conceivable to the mind can be done in a dream.
- The dream world (or part of it) focusses on you like a stage play in that you are the protagonist, no matter if it pleases or evokes fear. It wants strong emotional feedback from you, that's why you are put into situations e.g. from your childhood. It's almost as if your environment is created on the fly to adapt to your situation or to purposely lead to a situation.
It focuses on you because without your attention, nothing exists. If you are in a city ad want togo through a door into a building. There is nothing inside the building at all. That is, until you go inside. At that point nothing exists 'outside' the building.
- Many DCs want physical contact and/or your direct attention. Today I had a dream where I was tricked into directly focussing and sending energy to a DC. I felt though, that my resources are unlimited, so I didn't care. It felt very powerful having access to so much energy. Could have been a trick too of course.
Or it could have just been what you expected. You don't expend energy in a dream. You don't have a dream world mana bar. It's just about how long you can hold a balance of concentration.
- Some DCs don't want your focus and attention and they behave very different. Once in a LD I met an old guy that smiled at me and said "If you want to help people, you need to care for the wanderers." With "wanderers" I felt he meant unconscious dreamers. I saw a few of those later, almost like zombies.
It should be established that DCs don't really want anything .They have no desires of their own. With absolute confidence and good dream control, you could make that DC not 'want your energy' but 'want' to ride a flying unicorn.
Next time a DC does that violently stand there blankly, with a vacant stare. Don't react or even focus your attention on him. He will more than likely dissapear. Why? Because the DC has no solidity in any realm other than what 'you' can think of him.
P.S. "Subconsciousness" is just a word. The mind is a black box and nothing has been proven. You would do better distinguishing provable scientific facts from scientific hypotheses (fiction), which psychology and the various models of the mind do indeed belong to. The hypothesis that the dream world is as real as the waking world (or as unreal) seems more plausible to me than the model of the mind that psychology works with.
I must say I don't understand how the science of phsycology can be deemed fiction, whilst speculation and conclusions drawn from a few encounters that are certainly nowhere near beyond the realm of explainability can be deemed more plausible. There is certainly no 'distinguished provable' facts there. But the relation to REM sleeping and the relation to the triggers in the brain related to dreaming have bee shown scientifically. It is not speclulation at all.
I am not entirly dismissing the idea. I am simply bringing up the likelihood that our dreams are our own. ( Perhaps with the exception of some spiritual encounters.... I'm not sure.) At any rate, viewing the dreamstate, (not dreamscape,) as non static will most likely hurt your control and understanding of yourself.
One of the greatest things about lucid dreaming is being able to use introspection into your sub-conciouss self and better understand who you are. That is downplayed with the suggestion that it is not our own creation but something else. With that in mind some, (I'm not saying you guys,) could use that as a cop out to explain away some element in their dreams that they don't want to self-evaluate as part of themselves.
I like how you equate hypotheses (which are testable predictions derived from a scientific theory) with fiction. That makes perfect sense. :roll:Quote:
Originally Posted by gigaschatten
I also like how you seem to be under the impression that there is some universally accepted theory of the mind in cognitive science. There is not, and even if there was it certainly wouldn't be the Freudian model to which you seem to be referring. The term subconscious may be common in the "pop psychology" books on the shelf at Barnes and Noble, but it is conspicuously absent from serious scientific writings.
As for the "plausible hypothesis" that dreams are some sort of nightly adventure in a parallel dimension (which, by the way, is actually a theory and not a specific hypothesis) - I really have nothing to say to that.
Really? How do you know that? I would bet that you've just read that somewhere. Have you successfully tried everything "conceivable to the mind"? I would have to say that I strongly doubt that.Quote:
Originally Posted by spockman
There are several "simple" things that most so-called "LDers" cannot do.. and several not so "simple" too.
I disagree. Many things exist irrespective of one's personal attention. Now.. if you had written "things disappear if you don't focus your attention on them.." well.. that would be different.Quote:
Originally Posted by spockman
Speaking from my own personal experience, I had absolutely NO expectations whatsoever when I first started to "talk to DCs" in lucid dreaming.Quote:
Originally Posted by spockman
Come on. A human expends energy all the time, whether awake or asleep.Quote:
Originally Posted by spockman
Huh? Your empirical evidence?Quote:
Originally Posted by spockman
No you couldn't.. not necessarily. Don't believe the hype about "everything is possible" in LDing. It isn't. And if you want to cite anecdotal evidence such as is found on this site, I would strongly advise you to remember the "validity quotient".Quote:
Originally Posted by spockman
Evidence? None. Just speculation. Oh.. and btw.. EVERYTHING "disappears" if you don't focus your attention on it, asleep OR awake.Quote:
Originally Posted by spockman
You mean Psychology? Heh. Ever had a good rap with a Psychologist? Their "science" changes all the time.. goalposts move.. it's possibly the most inexact science that there is. In effect, they are shooting at the moon.. and an honest one will admit it. A bad example to use, spockman.Quote:
Originally Posted by spockman
Huh? A "few encounters"? Why are you assuming that? Projecting? Isn't it you who has "conclusions" after just a few LDs?Quote:
Originally Posted by spockman
Aaaaah. Our first agreement. Internet waffle proves nothing, one way OR the other. I would have thought that without "proof" one way or the other, people would sit on the fence.. but they don't.. strange.Quote:
Originally Posted by spockman
Ummm.. yes.. so are you saying that this proves that LDing is "all in the mind"? Because if so, it doesn't at all. It just proves that something is going on in the brain whilst LDing, that's all.Quote:
Originally Posted by spockman
Your conclusions about it are speculation, however.Quote:
Originally Posted by spockman
"Likelihood"? Sounds like bias to me.Quote:
Originally Posted by spockman
I disagree. That may be true for non-lucids, "dream incubation" and all that.. but IMO in proper LDing it is NOT your subconscious that is at the forefront.. it has to be your conscious self IF you do it properly. Otherwise it wouldn't be "lucid" dreaming, you know, being conscious while fast asleep.Quote:
Originally Posted by spockman
I sit on the fence about it all.:)
@DuB
In the end it's one hypothesis vs. another, subconscious vs. access to otherworld and after all it only matters, because it influences the way we perceive and act. I like otherworld better than dream = mindfart = who cares. It makes me behave differently, because I care for other creatures. I probably wouldn't care if I knew they were pure imagination, like a pixel alien I kill in an ego shooter. Fact is, there is absolutely no way we can be sure, so I have to acknowledge the possibility that ruthless behavior in dreams may harm actual beings, no matter how they appear to me.