Originally Posted by ThePreserver
The developers of the theory would say that dedications and certain aspects of every society are created in part because of our fear of death. Religious institutions (for obvious reasons), but also the pursuit of wealth. Wealth means well-being and in-group ties in consumer societies, and in-group ties are stronger when an individual is either consciously or subconsciously reminded of death.
One of the studies they performed was an experiment where the subjects had to perform a task. The task was straining some pebbles out of paint, but the only way they could do this successfully was by using the American flag the subjects were given. Before the test, the control group was given a general questionnaire with no mention of death (height, weight, some questions about personal beliefs, etc.) and the other group was given a questionnaire that had multiple references to death, bringing the idea of death to the mind before having them perform the tasks. Those who had not been reminded of death were quick to "deface" the flag, using it as a strainer, and those who were reminded of death took far longer to do so. They performed similar experiments with a crucifix and other "in-group" symbols.
I agree that a true artist/musician would do it for the sake of their art, the theory doesn't deal with just an artist or musician. It deals with entire societies and in-group bonds, and how they are affected by the constant presence of death.
The book "Denial of Death" was the inspiration for the theory, and the documentary "flight from death" is a great overview of the theory. of course there are flaws to it, but much of what the professors developing the theory say makes sense. I found the documentary very interesting.
(If by interpretation of death, you mean 'afterlife' or what happens after we die, those "interpretations" would, according to this theory, arise out of our fear; the idea of an afterlife arises out of fear of death, and there are many atheists who accept "nothingness," some of whom are likely reacting according to the same principles.)
I find Survival Instinct does not need to be lobbed in with fear of death. I think Survival Instinct is automatic and written into our genetic code while fear of death is learned and requires attachment to an identity, making it part of the ethosphere. Much of the arguments you've put forth can relate to simple survival instinct without any need to bring the more complex understanding of death of consciousness. For instance the instinct to acquire money and form in-group bonds is supported by natural selection alone, free of any need for influence from fear of death. People that did not develop in group bonds or obtain resources simply did not reproduce as much.
This doesn't mean the social change we experienced as modern civilization was inevitable, but I'll get to that. I'll be paraphrasing the Story of B to explain this.
Humans became humans the same way any other animal evolved, with or without knowledge of death or sense of identity. Good method was rewarded, inferior method proved itself inferior by not surviving in the gene pool. Humans developed language to an extent no other species has before. Our language centers are leagues more advanced than our closest cousins, the chimpanzee. This is because the difference between our niche and their's in our habitat was that we became hunters, while they're mostly gatherers. We still gathered but hunting became a big enough staple in our food supply that behavior which made us better hunters was substantially reinforced by natural selection. From this behavior, the religion known as Animism formed. Animism predates modern religion, and frankly I believe it stands apart from the fear of death because its purpose can be completely understood in regard to natural selection.
It was not a way for humans to explain natural phenomenon free of scientific understanding, this is also a myth. It was a way for trackers to understand their surroundings and communicate them. Survival is all about risk management. It's much easier to take a risk when you believe you have the power of the gods behind you. When dealing with uncertainty, the first inklings of religion was used to invoke courage. We evolved into avid story-tellers because we had to communicate with each other in order to hunt, and we had to tell stories about the environment based on the foot prints and markings. We became story-tellers in order to understand history. We became religious in order to brave the future. And I don't mean death. I mean food, water and shelter.
But fear of death does serve a purpose in modern religions. I'm just saying it's not the source of religion. And one need not fear death in order to pick for themselves a larger identity. Enlarging your identity is also reinforced by natural selection. All organisms mass into larger groups to gain advantage.
As far as the experiment you mentioned, I have to say I drew different conclusions. Obviously fear of death and survival instinct are related. But as I mentioned earlier, one is not necessitated by the other. One does not need to fear death to have a survival instinct. Natural Selection will continue to remove people that do not try as hard as their competitors to survive. The line can get wobbly though. For instance if I claim I do not fear death, then what do I label the compulsion which causes me to avoid driving into oncoming traffic? Noting this wobbliness, however, I still believe there is a distinction, but it's difficult to explain when people are stubborn about how to label things.
The conclusion I drew from the experiment you mentioned is that people became more insecure after taking a survey about death. Getting the idea of death in their minds beforehand kicked in their survival instinct to a greater degree. Much like how the body will pull blood from the limbs in colder weather to keep the core heated, we naturally prioritize things differently depending on the environment we're in. When you bring up death, most people find themselves in a less secure environment then when you talk about weight and height. Because they feel insecure, they're more likely to cling to a greater identity such as their citizenship.
But again I digress, this is distinct from fearing death and joining a modern religion in order to sit with the comfort that you'll be immortal because of it.
Originally Posted by Warheit
I'm busy taking care of my grandmother right now. I am not dodging.
How about Western versus Eastern views on death and spirituality. For example: Western cultures usually, if not almost always see death as finality. Ceasing to exist. Kaput. Done over. Eastern spiritual philosophies widely vary, with the soul transcending onto something different, perhaps greater or into a completely new existence. Some believe in an afterlife. Some do not.
So death is finality of life? Not everyone would agree. As I said, there are tons of examples and myriads of different views. Once I can provide links and not plagiarize scholarly works from others on the subject, I will share more.
Sound good?
If you consider infinity, the same problem comes along whether or not you believe in the continuation of self. Eventually you realize even if you can come back, or hang out in a paradise, or whatever, it doesn't matter. Because if its infinite, it's meaningless. And these two fears walk hand in hand.
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