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Originally Posted by
Sageous
I'm just letting you know that I never got to that all-important last paragraph of your post because the condescension on your part was simply too sickening
I'm sincerely sorry you feel that way. I was not trying to be condescending and explicitly tried to make it clear that I wasn't being rude but just responding to you as rigorously as I could, but it looks as though that has backfired and looked condescending instead. But in all honesty I can only really think of one part of my post that might have caused such outrage -- that is, the bit about the physics error, which apparently caused you to stop reading in disgust. I do stand by making that comment. Like I said, you have referred heavily to the concept of energy whenever you were pushed on the central question, so your large misconceptions about energy was of significant import to the discussion -- and if you'd continued reading you'd have found that energy was very important to the main point I was making. You don't seem to reject the actual content of my criticism as untrue, so I'm not sure what you'd prefer to me to have done. I could have not pointed out the weakness in this part of your argument, but that would have been dishonest of me, and really, one should be willing to have their arguments contradicted in such a discussion. Being frank is how I treat people with respect. Pulling punches for fear of upsetting somebody over a highly abstract discussion... that's the behaviour I would have considered condescending.
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but it looks as though that as was the fact that you chose to cherry-pick my post in a manner that pretty much everything to which you responded (as listed) was taken out of the context of my post, and apparently meant to make me look like a fool. So, since you are more interested in winning something than discussing a fairly simple concept, and I am not, I felt no need to sit here listening to your contrivances.
You are not a fool and I had absolutely no designs on making you look like a fool. Everything I said was carefully considered as part of the overall argument, and nothing I said was contrived or intended to "win" by intimidation. I think this is a pretty unfair thing to say. You only need to scan my post to see that I have gone to a lot of effort to detail what I was thinking in simple terms. The only time I can recall using an obscure concept was when I referred to a normed vector space, but that's simply because that is the mathematical structure that corresponds to space, and you asked for a definition. It's not contrived at all. It's my answer. And like I said, you can look up the details. I only omitted them because they're simple and boring. And as you didn't ever actually read the central part of my post, which I repeatedly referred to, you're not really in any position to call anything I said "contrived". I literally asked you at the start to skip out all of this stuff if you wanted to, because the main argument was at the end... so complaining that I was trying to argue by contrivance and intimidation is just... dishonest on your part, really.
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But before I take the high road and cease responding to your sophomoric nonsense carefully cloaked in lots of words that pretty much keep saying the same two things (basically that you can prove the existence of space because it shows up in lots of math equations, which oddly ties right into what I was saying about space being a tool, and your odd obsession with the definition of nothing)
That really wasn't my point. You didn't finish the post, and I made it very clear that the important stuff was at the end.
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Gravity waves certainly exist; I never said they did not. Why does the fact that gravity can pass through space in waves, just like light, mean that space must be comprised of something?
It doesn't pass through space in waves, it's a wave of space. I stated this in the question.
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* If you look up the word "nothing" in pretty much any dictionary, you will find more than one definition. If you look up the word "space" in pretty much any dictionary, you will find more than one definition. You might also note that every definition listed for one word is not directly interchangeable with every definition of the other word. That was all I was trying to say; how you came up with all that other stuff is beyond me.
Which definition of "nothing" were you taking to be synonymous with "space"?
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* You completely missed my point about newton-meters
Well yeah, it was false.
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as you also obviously missed my point about space (vectors, distance, shape, or however else you choose to describe it) being an important tool for understanding our universe. By proving how I am wrong with pretty much nothing but math examples sort of made my point for me.
All covered at the end of the post. Again, it's pretty unfair to be accusing me of intentionally ignoring points when you didn't actually read to the end of the post, and especially when I made it clear throughout that the important response was at the end. With that in mind, I don't really understand why you're asking me further questions.
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Telling someone, while dripping condescension, that I "please don't take" what you're about to say "as an insult" is about as firm an insult as you can make. Thanks.
I've already covered this of course. Apologies again that you were insulted. The fact was that you didn't have a firm grasp on some of the basic concepts in physics. That's not saying that you're stupid, it's just saying that... you haven't studied much of the nitty gritty of physics. Most people haven't. So what? They pursue other interests. That's all I meant by clarifying it wasn't meant as an insult. It wasn't a personal attack. It was just very relevant to the argument, at least in my opinion.
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Finally, with all your math and projections of superior knowledge, you still did not tell me whether there is a space/time particle or wave, which was basically all I was talking about.
I'm sorry I missed it. It depends on what you mean. Waves and particles are the same thing on a fundamental level. If you mean space/time as in relativistic spacetime, yes, they are the gravitational waves I referred to. If you mean space waves or time waves... well, there are waves in space, like electromagnetic waves, which wave over time. Is space made of particles, or is space made of particles? No, but neither's energy, which I discussed at length at the end of my post.