Thread: Fitting infinity in a moment of dream

What?! YOU! Y-Y-You tricked me with that title D:

Yeah, we usualy REM only for 30min but sometimes we dream about a party that last for hours and even people that had a lifetime experience.
Well, time is relative and in our dreams, time mostly comes with focus!

To all the people trying to extend they dream time I usualy say to them "Read this ->", so...

Read this -> Tutorial for extending Lucid Dream Time Hours of LD

That was a beautiful article JPDreeamnz! Now need to figure how to dream a whole year without time skipping

Just go for it, i'll be here cheering for you ^^
ahh, remember to record on your dream journal, we'll love to read how you've made it \/

Hukif, an experienced LDer on DreamViews has explored the realm of time dilation. When I talked to him a while back he told me how he created two worlds, both which he dilated time with. In one world he started an entire civilization and watched it grow. At nighttime he would go back to his house in this world and practice something he would not tell me. In the other world he started his own family and designed the world to self destruct after 10 years. I remember him telling me how it felt extremely long and how it felt just like all the years he stayed there, but of course it's alot to remember. I've heard other accounts of time dilation as well, but Hukif's experience is by far the most intriguing.

I remember reading a post from another experienced LDer a long time ago where he said that he spent an entire lifetime in a dream. Imagine that.

All that being said, I completely believe in time dilation. So far I have only stayed in most Lucid Dreams for a few hours, but thats most of my LDs anyway. The most time I've spent in a dream felt like half of a day. I walked around exploring and such and listened to music on my ipod the entire time while flying and banging a couple of chicks. Its pretty fun to say the least haha.

You never hear of such experiences because most people don't even think about it while immersed in the full enjoyment of their LD. Plus, I doubt many think it is possible anyway. But I know it is because there was no way I slept a full 12 hours to experience that half day LD.

Welp I don't know about the time dilation biz. Some experiences seem longer than they really are, especially if you're trying something new (scientific facts here). So it might feel like hours, and maybe even days, but usually if you count the things you did, it'll be around the rem cycle time.

If you suspect that in some cases, dream time can go faster than real time (maybe you brain would be working faster or whatever??) then I dunno. I'm weiry about that. Wish it would be true and not just mind tricks. Maybe it is, I dunno. Maybe we can invent something in the future that does that özö

I'm really curious about this time dilation, I want to know how it's possible and not just because I want to try it out (although I do). I wonder if there is any science on this but I'm reluctant to search for it because there is a lot of unscientific (bogus) things on this subject, maybe I will spend some time searching later on. I read the article OneUp linked to and I hope I can try these things out soon

There is obviously a limit to how much time you can dilate, but we shouldn't underestimate the power of the brain. I'm not talking about spooky unjustified metaphysics. When I got interested in psychedelics, in trip reports I read about many people who talked about feeling an eternity on drugs like LSD and magic mushrooms. People on DMT have experienced things in a 10 minute trip that are comparable to hours on LSD. And this feeling of eternity seems genuine, people really have experiences that they can only describe as eternity. Sam Harris said "I can only describe it as knowing that I have always been and will always be in this very moment." If you're having a bad trip, you'll probably feel like you died and landed in hell, if you're having a good time it'll probably feel like you've died and gone to heaven Or whatever your idea of salvation or damnation is.

It's really fascinating and worth exploring, I mean, just imagine being lonely and being able to spend hours or a day with a dream friend or lover. You can get away from the bullshit of waking life. You can have more excitement in a year than most people have in an entire lifetime.

To dilate time you don't want silence get this song from Heart on an LP and a special record player that constantly switches from playing forwards to backwards and listen to it while you sleep if you can get the thing to oscillate at 40Hz you will be able to dilate to infinity.



Studies have shown that people dream in real time. If you want to believe, believe I guess otherwise just enjoy the song, its pretty good

Yeah I know about that study, it's by Stephen LaBerge, but I don't think it's legitimate. The subjects had to move their eyes in a certain way once every x amount of seconds, the eye that moves in the dream also moves in real life. So the experimenters can see if the dreamer experiences time at the same rate. But what if doing this, paying detailled attention to the passage of time (instead of just vaguely noticing it) puts the passage of time back to waking life speed? Maybe if you're not specifically counting seconds time can actually be dilated? Plus, there are many many people that report experiences of time dilation.

Yeah but its also been shown that our brain operates way faster during REM then it does during waking life. One study even suggested that dreams occur in seconds at a time, so if that's true then that changes alot.

That's interesting OneUp, do you think you could link me to the article or video where you found that?

Originally Posted by OneUp

Yeah but its also been shown that our brain operates way faster during REM then it does during waking life. One study even suggested that dreams occur in seconds at a time, so if that's true then that changes alot.

You mean higher frequency brain wave? Ppl enter that during meditation too. I don't think it has to do with time dilation, but i might be full of shit. But I'm glad you guys are proposing the possibility of time dilation as a phycological occurance rather than some mistical magic spirit whatever thing.

It would be very nice to be able to dilate time in dreams.

Oh but be cautious about anecdotes. The never prove anything when it comes to these things or we would be believing in ghosts, yeti, dragons from old times, etc.

Louia why do you think that in this case anectodes are unreliable?

Originally Posted by Ginsan

Louia why do you think that in this case anectodes are unreliable?

Well bcz if anything, dreams are the most 'phsycho' things ever, if you know what I mean. You know how dream experience can be, and how our phsychology and mind is during it. It's very tricky.

Now don't get me wrong, I'm open to the concept of time dilation, but it needs scientific proofs, not anecdotes. They just fail in things like these. Or at least, we should be weiry about them. I can't just say that it's proven cuz of anecdotal evidence.

Anyways, if it is true, it'll be proved later with technological advancements I guess.

But what makes them unreliable? When someone says that she dreamt about sitting in an airplane, then she dreamt about sitting in an airplane unless she is lying. Likewise, I think if someone says her dream felt like it lasted 4 hours, even though the rem period only lasted 90 minutes, I would believe her unless I thought she was lying. And there are many people reporting experienced time>actual time why wouldn't you believe it?

I experienced time dilation without skipping (nothing extremely long though) and dream sharing. I know these are real from experience. But when I bring up these subjects I am told these don't mean anything these are only theories and haven't been proved. Obviously this is just an other way of saying "You might be lying, why should I believe in your words?". I understand this, it is far from scientific to "believe" in somebody's story.

It's one thing to believe someone's story just because they said it. But people's stories are still data and you can gain information from them. If many people (like you) report experiencing time dilation how can you say it's unscientific to conclude that people experience time dilation?

Sure, people reporting time dilation is data, it is a "reason" to run an experiment, to be exact. Until time dilation is proven with scientific methods, it will be unscientific to say "people experience time dilation". But perfectly fine and correct to say "many people have reported time dilation"

Hmm interesting. So you think that people's reports on time dilation are unreliable, right? I'm not sure whether I agree or disagree with that, I'll think about it and come back later on

Yeah. If I, myself hadn't experienced this, I would have no reason to believe nor disbelieve.

Originally Posted by figurefly

Sure, people reporting time dilation is data, it is a "reason" to run an experiment, to be exact. Until time dilation is proven with scientific methods, it will be unscientific to say "people experience time dilation". But perfectly fine and correct to say "many people have reported time dilation"

Okay I totally agree with that now. People reporting it is no experimental proof of time dilation, it's proof that people are reporting it . Then I'll take a step back and say that it's reasonable to think that many people are really experiencing time dilation in dreams. Because otherwise they would have to be either lying or having false memories, do you agree? Or do you maintain that (if you hadn't experienced it yourself) unless it can be experimentally proven it's unreasonable to think so?

I do agree with that. It is reasonable to think that many people are really experiencing dilation rather than considering the possibility of everyone lying/having false memories.

Alright cool I was wondering about how we always experience time differently at different moments in waking life too, so I'm going to look around on Youtube and Google if I can find some info on that. Maybe it can tell us things about time dilation in dreams.

Originally Posted by Ginsan

I don't think it's legitimate. The subjects had to move their eyes in a certain way once every x amount of seconds, the eye that moves in the dream also moves in real life. So the experimenters can see if the dreamer experiences time at the same rate. But what if doing this, paying detailled attention to the passage of time (instead of just vaguely noticing it) puts the passage of time back to waking life speed? Maybe if you're not specifically counting seconds time can actually be dilated? Plus, there are many many people that report experiences of time dilation.

The reason the reports can't be trusted, is that by definition when you are asleep your brain is half turned off.

Science needs experiments, I don't see why people reject the counting and eye movements as a flawed experiment. The theory above seems to be that it is because of the contentedness of the eye movements that are being consciously controlled in the real world while counting is being consciously done during the dream.

Therefore we would need a way to measure something unconsciously controlled in the real world to break the link.

So what would be required, a different experiment. Lets say that you could show that the galvanic skin response (an unconscious response) could be linked to a conscious act such as lying to DC's in a lucid dream. The DC's aren't real the lie isn't real, and response doesn't have to be thought about like eye movements in response to counting. You would then need to have subjects that could lucid dream be trained to lie continuously or refrain from lying for what they perceived to be a fixed amount of time during normal-time lucid dreams, then have them trained to supposedly dilate time, then have them dilate time and tell an equal number of lies. Eventually you could try to do experiments where they switch from lying to truth telling during the lucid dreams as you measure the oscillation of skin response.

I doubt such an experiment is possible. In the end it just seems likely that consciousness requires time, otherwise why couldn't we just close our eyes and compose a years worth of books in our heads in just a few minutes, because thinking like dreaming, takes time.

Of course if it could be done, then we could use the dreamers lies to prove they were telling the truth.

Great! Will research too. Would be great if you shared your findings and new thoughts here. Also pm me about anything.