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    1. #1
      Consciousness in the Void Universal Mind's Avatar
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      Does nonexistence exist?

      If nonexistence exists, then how is it nonexistence? If nonexistence does not exist, then how is it not between two triangles that share a side? Also, (Marc's idea in another thread) if nonexistence does not exist, does the nonexistence of nonexistence exist? If it does, wouldn't that be an example of how nonexistence does exist?
      Quote Originally Posted by really View Post
      God cannot destroy himself because He is Omnipotent.


    2. #2
      D.V. Editor-in-Chief Original Poster's Avatar
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      nonexistence nonexists, just as neither existence nor nonexistence doesn't exist nor nonexist

      Everything works out in the end, sometimes even badly.


    3. #3
      Member Tyler's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Universal Mind View Post
      If nonexistence exists, then how is it nonexistence? If nonexistence does not exist, then how is it not between two triangles that share a side? Also, (Marc's idea in another thread) if nonexistence does not exist, does the nonexistence of nonexistence exist? If it does, wouldn't that be an example of how nonexistence does exist?
      Quote Originally Posted by Omnis Dei View Post
      nonexistence nonexists, just as neither existence nor nonexistence doesn't exist nor nonexist
      your logic makes my head hurt....
      This shit never happens to me

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      Category error baw.

    5. #5
      Member really's Avatar
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      "Non-existence" exists as merely a concept and nothing more.

      Otherwise, there's nothing to talk about.

    6. #6
      Consciousness in the Void Universal Mind's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by really View Post
      "Non-existence" exists as merely a concept and nothing more.

      Otherwise, there's nothing to talk about.
      Then what is between two rectangles that share a side?
      Quote Originally Posted by really View Post
      God cannot destroy himself because He is Omnipotent.


    7. #7
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      This sentence is a lie.

    8. #8
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      Quote Originally Posted by Universal Mind View Post
      Then what is between two rectangles that share a side?
      If they share a side, there is no "between" them.

    9. #9
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      Quote Originally Posted by really View Post
      If they share a side, there is no "between" them.
      But you're talking about it?


      So it is a concept, and nothing more.

    10. #10
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      Quote Originally Posted by Carôusoul View Post
      But you're talking about it?


      So it is a concept, and nothing more.
      We talk about two different rectangles, and that they share a side. Drawing such a diagram, we see the shared side is no longer a side at all.

      Now, they "share a side", and thus: They're united as one larger rectangle, and the sides disappear into each other. Thus, the sides no longer exist, and thus, no line to be drawn, unless we reconsider them as separate.

    11. #11
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      Quote Originally Posted by really View Post
      We talk about two different rectangles, and that they share a side. Drawing such a diagram, we see the shared side is no longer a side at all.

      Now, they "share a side", and thus: They're united as one larger rectangle, and the sides disappear into each other. Thus, the sides no longer exist, and thus, no line to be drawn.
      So there isn't even a concept?

    12. #12
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      Quote Originally Posted by Carôusoul View Post
      So there isn't even a concept?
      Yeah, there is - that's the point. Concepts!


      Now, let's examine Universal Mind's avatar. How is that physically possible?

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      Quote Originally Posted by really View Post
      Yeah, there is - that's the point. Concepts!


      Now, let's examine Universal Mind's avatar. How is that physically possible?
      See I don't think we do have a concept of it.

      Nor do we of "nonexistence". We may have an innacurate concept of surrounding features but not of the intrinsic nature of the things.

    14. #14
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      Quote Originally Posted by Carôusoul View Post
      See I don't think we do have a concept of it.

      Nor do we of "nonexistence". We may have an innacurate concept of surrounding features but not of the intrinsic nature of the things.
      I think it is a concept, because it is a mentation; an automatic assumption of the dualistic mind. Sometimes the mind may even think its existence could be subject to non-existence, which is impossible. It's just a conceptual assumption.

      I don't think there is any use asking the OP question, or even saying that "existence exists", because they are self-definitions and self-evident.

    15. #15
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      Quote Originally Posted by really View Post
      I don't think there is any use asking the OP question, or even saying that "existence exists", because they are self-definitions and self-evident.
      Agreed on this.

      Rest is nothing.

    16. #16
      Consciousness in the Void Universal Mind's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by really View Post
      We talk about two different rectangles, and that they share a side. Drawing such a diagram, we see the shared side is no longer a side at all.
      It's still a side even though the two rectangles together form another rectangle. There are proofs based on that principle.

      Quote Originally Posted by really View Post
      Now, let's examine Universal Mind's avatar. How is that physically possible?
      Trick photography.
      Quote Originally Posted by really View Post
      God cannot destroy himself because He is Omnipotent.


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      Just admit I had it right the first time.

      Everything works out in the end, sometimes even badly.


    18. #18
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      Quote Originally Posted by Universal Mind View Post
      It's still a side even though the two rectangles together form another rectangle. There are proofs based on that principle.
      Yeah? Does it have anything to do with any "infinitely" small space between the two shapes?

      My example was more metaphorical I guess.

      Quote Originally Posted by Universal Mind View Post
      Trick photography.
      It would be interesting also to physically build something similar to that, yet have it as a visual illusion at a specific angle.

    19. #19
      I am become fish pear Abra's Avatar
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      I smell a language fault here. Language creates unneeded double meanings which would inevitably form a paradox. "This statement is false." Y'dig? So I'll tackle this in a practical manner.

      Nonexistence cannot be matter, energy, or thought. Anything that hasn't been thought of yet is nonexistent. The "quality" of nonexistence exists, in one aspect. The only reason nonexistence can be a quality of something that does not exist (this is where the paradox is), is because of how humans think.

      This is going to make less sense than I originally intended. Whatever.
      Abraxas

      Quote Originally Posted by OldSparta
      I murdered someone, there was bloody everywhere. On the walls, on my hands. The air smelled metallic, like iron. My mouth... tasted metallic, like iron. The floor was metallic, probably iron

    20. #20
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      Quote Originally Posted by Abra View Post
      I smell a language fault here. Language creates unneeded double meanings which would inevitably form a paradox. "This statement is false." Y'dig? So I'll tackle this in a practical manner.

      Nonexistence cannot be matter, energy, or thought. Anything that hasn't been thought of yet is nonexistent. The "quality" of nonexistence exists, in one aspect. The only reason nonexistence can be a quality of something that does not exist (this is where the paradox is), is because of how humans think.
      This.

    21. #21
      Consciousness in the Void Universal Mind's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by really View Post
      Yeah? Does it have anything to do with any "infinitely" small space between the two shapes?
      There is nothing between them, but whether or not nothingness and infinite smallness are the same is something we debated very vigorously in two threads recently. Apparently, they are the same "thing".

      Quote Originally Posted by Abra View Post
      I smell a language fault here. Language creates unneeded double meanings which would inevitably form a paradox. "This statement is false." Y'dig? So I'll tackle this in a practical manner.

      Nonexistence cannot be matter, energy, or thought. Anything that hasn't been thought of yet is nonexistent. The "quality" of nonexistence exists, in one aspect. The only reason nonexistence can be a quality of something that does not exist (this is where the paradox is), is because of how humans think.

      This is going to make less sense than I originally intended. Whatever.
      Yeah, I think you nailed it about as well as language will allow.
      Last edited by Universal Mind; 01-25-2009 at 05:49 PM.
      Quote Originally Posted by really View Post
      God cannot destroy himself because He is Omnipotent.


    22. #22
      Member really's Avatar
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      So, do we all agree on eternal life, then?

    23. #23
      D.V. Editor-in-Chief Original Poster's Avatar
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      Once again I find myself living in my own paradigm.

      Maybe some day people will look back at me in wonder. Hell, if that singularity thing is true maybe it'll be sooner rather than later.

      Everything works out in the end, sometimes even badly.


    24. #24
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      Is anybody else not surprised O'nus hasn't posted in here?

    25. #25
      Consciousness in the Void Universal Mind's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by really View Post
      So, do we all agree on eternal life, then?
      Hmmm... Existence is eternal, and I am nothing other than existence. So the only thing that I am is eternal. I am eternal.

      Quote Originally Posted by Daniel Danciu View Post
      Is anybody else not surprised O'nus hasn't posted in here?
      Why are you not surprised?
      Quote Originally Posted by really View Post
      God cannot destroy himself because He is Omnipotent.


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