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    Thread: What happens if you woke up and knew everything?

    1. #26
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      Quote Originally Posted by nerve View Post
      I've had this argument before and no one seems to get my answer...

      it isn't possible for all information to exist in a single point.

      let's say for the sake of argument, you woke up tomorrow and knew absolutely everything. the way I see it, you would (hypothetically, since this is completely impossible) essentially become something like a black hole, suck all of the universe into you, and then nothing would exist.

      do you get it or would you like me to elaborate?
      Elaborate.
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      why would you turn into a black hole how does that make sense assyuming that the brain pwower of the human is capable of holding in all this information what woudl make you think that?

    3. #28
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      Quote Originally Posted by SupremeUltimateSuperMega View Post
      why would you turn into a black hole how does that make sense assyuming that the brain pwower of the human is capable of holding in all this information what woudl make you think that?
      You honestly can't disprove of it. Since we can't even necessarily explain a black hole.

      But I still don't get Nerve's theory or whatever. I don't think it would consume everything. Since there are billions of black holes everywhere, and we are still here.
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    4. #29
      Xei
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      We believe in black holes precisely because we understand them. We haven't actually directly observed them.

      Black holes occur when something is too dense. The object's gravitational field then outmuscles the repulsion forces between particles and the volume of the body shrinks to 0.

    5. #30
      Jesus Fucking Christ OldManRiver's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Xei View Post
      Your brain isn't a 'single point'. :l

      We know a finite number of things. Presumably there are only a finite number of other things to know, so it's just an extension of the same situation.

      Although my assertion there are only a finite number of facts is patently untrue. There are an uncountably infinite number of facts. Knowing all of the prime numbers is an infinite subset of this infinite set.

      However, such a thing seems trivial. Can we restrict 'facts' to interesting facts which are actually about understanding; for example, understanding what a prime number is, why there are infinitely many, how to find them, how they are distributed, etcetera. A better question would be 'what happens if you wake up and understand everything'.

      An interesting question though: is it actually possible for a conscious system to know everything? I tried reducing the problem down to an extremely simple universe where there simply exists only an algorithm capable of thinking. Can this algorithm understand itself, including how it thinks?

      I'll have to mull that potent question over. Perhaps Godel has something to do with it.
      How is your brain not a single point? If a person knew everything, that information would be stored in said persons brain. This person having complete knowledge of everything, would completely change everything that exists, and all of that change would spawn from a single point, their mind.
      nerve likes this.

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      A Natural The Invisible Man's Avatar
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      Figure out how to have more money than Bill Gates and more women than James Bond. I'll be an Egoist genius.


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    7. #32
      Member Indecent Exposure's Avatar
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      its slightly frustrating when people try to talk about something extremely complex like they are an authority on the subject when they don't have the first fuckin clue about it. I commented on it on the Communism debate and here it is again.
      First claiming that people are going to turn into black holes, then claiming that we can't explain black holes. Please only make these kinds of comments with some prior understanding of the topic.

      On topic: If I woke up and knew everything I'd go and invent all the stuff that hadn't already been invented that the potential to be invented.
      Then probably retire to the Caribbean and start growing what I knew to the most potent strain of weed in what I knew to be the most fertile patch of soil.
      "...You want to reclaim your mind and get it out of the hands of the cultural engineers who want to turn you into a half-baked moron consuming all this trash that's being manufactured out of the bones of a dying world..." - Terence McKenna

      Previously known as imran_p

    8. #33
      bleak... nerve's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by imran_p View Post
      First claiming that people are going to turn into black holes, then claiming that we can't explain black holes. Please only make these kinds of comments with some prior understanding of the topic.
      it was a FUCKING METAPHOR

      if you're too fucking ignorant to understand that (this goes for you too, Motumz) then I'm not even going to bother elaborating.


      Ignorant bliss is an oxymoron; but so is miserable truth.

    9. #34
      Jesus Fucking Christ OldManRiver's Avatar
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      It's slightly frustrating when people are so ignorant that they cannot see that nerve was using a METAFUCKINGPHOR.
      Last edited by OldManRiver; 03-03-2010 at 03:11 AM.
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    10. #35
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      Quote Originally Posted by nerve View Post
      it was a FUCKING METAPHOR

      if you're too fucking ignorant to understand that (this goes for you too, Motumz) then I'm not even going to bother elaborating.
      I don't understand what turning into a black hole can be a metaphor for. I obviously misunderstood that your intentions, relax mate, I'm sorry if I offended you.
      Care to elaborate on the nature of the metaphor?
      "...You want to reclaim your mind and get it out of the hands of the cultural engineers who want to turn you into a half-baked moron consuming all this trash that's being manufactured out of the bones of a dying world..." - Terence McKenna

      Previously known as imran_p

    11. #36
      bleak... nerve's Avatar
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      sure, since you asked so nicely.

      I obviously wasn't talking about a literal black hole, and all I understand about black holes is as much as the next idiot: they're big and suck everything around them in. (I never even said black hole, I said essentially, something like a black hole.)

      I've thought about this before, and it seems to me that if ALL information were to suddenly exist in a SINGLE POINT, it would "wipe everything out" like a "black hole." of course this wouldn't physically happen, but just for picture's sake, I used a black hole as a metaphor to mean eradicate everything.

      ok, say you are the one who is to suddenly know everything. in order for you to know everything, you'd have to know exactly what it's like to be me. right? that is part of everything, isn't it? but not only would you have to know what it's like to be me now, you'd have to know what it was like being me at age 6, as an infant, 5 years from now when I'm 26 (assuming I make it to there :p), when I'm elderly, every thought, every experience, every feeling, everything.

      but how could you know all of this without actually living my entire life? to actually know, you'd have to actually be, actually experience. otherwise, you'd just have second-hand knowledge, not true knowledge. (please please please, if I'm wrong, anyone, correct me here).

      so to know e v e r y t h i n g, you'd have to live everyone's lives (not to mention animals), from the dawn of humans until god knows what happens to them in the future, all this, in ONE MOMENT. the way my uneducated, simple mind currently perceives it (and that wasn't sarcasm), in order to know everything at once, you'd have to be everything at once, and if you suddenly BECAME EVERYTHING, in one point, it would essentially, basically, just for a hypothetical, metaphorical picture, create the biggest black hole ever, and all of existence would be sucked in.

      and then (maybe) nothing would exist.

      please tell me if I'm wrong, but these are just little philosophical ponderings of mine so I may not know what I'm talking about.
      Last edited by nerve; 03-03-2010 at 04:57 AM.
      SkA_DaRk_Che likes this.


      Ignorant bliss is an oxymoron; but so is miserable truth.

    12. #37
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      Quote Originally Posted by nerve
      but how could you know all of this without actually living my entire life? to actually know, you'd have to actually be, actually experience. otherwise, you'd just have second-hand knowledge, not true knowledge. (please please please, if I'm wrong, anyone, correct me here).
      Quote Originally Posted by nerve
      basically, just for a hypothetical, metaphorical picture, create the biggest black hole ever, and all of existence would be sucked in.
      I like your way of looking at this subject. But your take on the subject is a bit contradictory.

      First you say , that a person who knows everything there was ever to know would be like a black hole, instead of drawing and absorbing light, the person would draw and absorb information right?

      But then you say that to know every piece of information there ever was and ever will be, you would in a sense literally be everything and everyone in the universe? (I don't disagree with this premise)

      How can a person be like a black hole, in the sense of drawing in and absorbing information, and at the same time be analogous to everything and everyone there ever was?



      Quote Originally Posted by AccountableMasses View Post
      What would happen to you if one morning, you woke up and knew everything? And I do mean every thought, idea, memory, language, person, dream, ability everything you could think about. Just everything about everything and everyone in existence, what would you do?

      And what would you believe your life be like if something like this happened to you?
      As Cliche as it is, the saying "Life is a journey, not a destination" holds true here.

      Besides actually knowing or being able to do something, the most reward comes in arriving or honing at that particular skill or piece of knowledge, be it practicing a skill, reading a book, taking a university course. etc

      I would much rather read a few books on a particular subject that I am interested in, rather than just know everything and anything on that subject.

      That act of learning or practicing a skill (like basketball, skiing or playing the violin) is much more valuable than actually just knowing it right from the get-go.

      What would the point of life be if you already knew everything there was to know, and possessed every skill and ability there was to acquire?
      Last edited by SkA_DaRk_Che; 03-03-2010 at 01:18 PM.
      Quote Originally Posted by Siиdяed View Post
      Talking about women and sex --> instant testoteroney arguments among pasty white internet shut-ins everywhere.

    13. #38
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      Quote Originally Posted by Invader View Post
      I would no longer be myself.
      I cannot answer a question for someone else.
      Your always somebody else.
      "...You want to reclaim your mind and get it out of the hands of the cultural engineers who want to turn you into a half-baked moron consuming all this trash that's being manufactured out of the bones of a dying world..." - Terence McKenna

      Previously known as imran_p

    14. #39
      bleak... nerve's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by SkA_DaRk_Che
      How can a person be like a black hole, in the sense of drawing in and absorbing information, and at the same time be analogous to everything and everyone there ever was?
      because, like I said: in order to know, they'd have to be. it would be like everything, everything, all physical matter and all else, suddenly "sucking" into a single point. if everything that is were suddenly "sucked" into one single point, you could hardly call it anything.

      again, this has nothing to do with actual black holes; I just used it for a picture of everything being "sucked" into one point. of course, it wouldn't even be like this, because it would be instantaneous, just all of a sudden..."nothing."

      is this any clearer? or do you still see a contradiction that I'm missing? I don't see anything, but then, this is a crazy abstract concept so possibly I'm confused.

      I wish more people would comment...don't take that personal, I would just like more people to share their views on this. I'd really like to know if what I'm saying makes any sense or not.


      Ignorant bliss is an oxymoron; but so is miserable truth.

    15. #40
      Sleeping Dragon juroara's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by nerve View Post
      ok, say you are the one who is to suddenly know everything. in order for you to know everything, you'd have to know exactly what it's like to be me. right? that is part of everything, isn't it? but not only would you have to know what it's like to be me now, you'd have to know what it was like being me at age 6, as an infant, 5 years from now when I'm 26 (assuming I make it to there :p), when I'm elderly, every thought, every experience, every feeling, everything.

      but how could you know all of this without actually living my entire life? to actually know, you'd have to actually be, actually experience. otherwise, you'd just have second-hand knowledge, not true knowledge. (please please please, if I'm wrong, anyone, correct me here).

      so to know e v e r y t h i n g, you'd have to live everyone's lives (not to mention animals), from the dawn of humans until god knows what happens to them in the future, all this, in ONE MOMENT.
      This is how I imagine God's consciousness works actually - literally experiencing everything from those individual experiences all simultaneously at once. And at the same time being an observer experiencing experiences. Thank you for your post! I'm too lazy to double check, but I think you are the first person to really illustrate that to know everything is to live and experience every subjective experience as your own.

      And the idea of all of this stemming from a single point of consciousness, as you imagine would absorb everything, is even more mind blowing when you understand we all come from a single point, that is the singularity! And even more insane when you understand that all black holes are also..singularities! Where do the parallels end!

      I don't imagine that this single point would absorb everything like a black hole. That's just kind of insane! But, I'm only saying it's insane to think about!

      To add some weight to your argument, this is more or less what some hindus believe Brahman will do. In the out breath is the expansion of the singularity (Brahmen is the singularity in this case), this out breath expansion means we are also created. But in the in breath. . . we will be taken back in to that one single undivided point!

    16. #41
      Member SkA_DaRk_Che's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by nerve View Post
      because, like I said: in order to know, they'd have to be. it would be like everything, everything, all physical matter and all else, suddenly "sucking" into a single point. if everything that is were suddenly "sucked" into one single point, you could hardly call it anything.

      again, this has nothing to do with actual black holes; I just used it for a picture of everything being "sucked" into one point. of course, it wouldn't even be like this, because it would be instantaneous, just all of a sudden..."nothing."

      is this any clearer? or do you still see a contradiction that I'm missing? I don't see anything, but then, this is a crazy abstract concept so possibly I'm confused.

      I wish more people would comment...don't take that personal, I would just like more people to share their views on this. I'd really like to know if what I'm saying makes any sense or not.

      Chill man, I get that it is an analogy, no need to patronize.

      However I was talking about your two analogies which seemed to contradict each other.To me, standing alone they both work to illustrate the concept of "waking up and knowing everything",

      But when you use the two of them together they seem to contradict themselves for the reasons stated in my Original Post.
      Quote Originally Posted by Siиdяed View Post
      Talking about women and sex --> instant testoteroney arguments among pasty white internet shut-ins everywhere.

    17. #42
      bleak... nerve's Avatar
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      noooo I didn't mean to patronize, I actually looked over my post to make sure it didn't seem that way. I failed :(

      I just didn't see the contradiction you were referring to, which is why I just reiterated. sorry if it came off condescending, I honestly didn't mean it to be.

      anyway, I think I see what you're saying now...maybe.

      OH, yes, you're saying one could not be everything and a 'black hole' at the same time. well, exactly, that's what I'm trying to get across. bottom line, it is impossible to know everything. that's just the illustration I use to show why, because some people seem to think it's possible, they don't think it through. everything I said is a contradiction, but the contradiction is supposed to prove that you can't know everything.

      it just isn't possible, because you'd essentially have to be everything and nothing at the same time.

      I hope we're on the same page now? o_o


      Ignorant bliss is an oxymoron; but so is miserable truth.

    18. #43
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      I would write down everything I thought to be important, then promptly stab myself in the heart.

      I would not like to function like this.
      I would go absolutely crazy.
      With everything I saw, a million thoughts would come to me. These would all link to other things, which I would then think of. These would link other things, and it would just keep multiplying‼ Eventually things would start linking to the original things and everything would go in a terribly vicious circle.

      I would have a mental breakdown.

      So, I would kill myself before this could happen.

    19. #44
      Reggie
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      This would be a half half situation.

      1. i would feel terrible aswell, because life is what you experience and learn. I believe we are put on this earth to enjoy and experience life. If you know everything ect, whats the point?
      2. I think i might enjoy knowing everything. but this doesent back up option 1.

    20. #45
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      Quote Originally Posted by AccountableMasses View Post
      What would happen to you if one morning, you woke up and knew everything? And I do mean every thought, idea, memory, language, person, dream, ability everything you could think about. Just everything about everything and everyone in existence, what would you do?

      And what would you believe your life be like if something like this happened to you?
      You wouldn't exist in an aspect. That is why you aren't born with the knowledge of everything. If you were, then how could you have the knowledge of everything if you never had the experience of learning.

      One way you could look at it is that the universe consists of everything. So, the universe knows everything, but we don't see it as an entity, so in an aspect it doesn't exist. There is a catch though, we dwell within the universe and are a part of it's everything, which we don't know everything and instead learn. I guess you could say the universe is learning about itself?

      Kind of like a coexistence between everything and nothing or knowing everything and knowing nothing.


      Side note: I think this thread and the thread Consensus Reality go hand-in-hand.
      Last edited by ArcanumNoctis; 04-02-2010 at 07:44 AM.

    21. #46
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      I would be very bored and probably feel as though I had been stupid pre-knowledge. I wouldn't want to know everything at the same time. It is fun to learn.

    22. #47
      Demi-Demi-God wannabe Jonny the Nameless's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Cacophony View Post
      I think only the person who knew everything would be able to answer this.
      I thought your signature was the "this", and tried to answer it.

    23. #48
      Member defygravity's Avatar
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      what fun would living be if you knew everything?
      Dream Resolutions for 2010

      ( ) Write all Dreams in a dream journal
      ( ) Develop an effective reality check
      ( ) Lucid Dream at least 5 times a week
      ( ) Learn more about Lucid Dreaming
      ( ) Gain more clarity and better recall of dreams.

    24. #49
      bleak... nerve's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by ArcanumNoctis View Post
      You wouldn't exist in an aspect. That is why you aren't born with the knowledge of everything. If you were, then how could you have the knowledge of everything if you never had the experience of learning.

      One way you could look at it is that the universe consists of everything. So, the universe knows everything, but we don't see it as an entity, so in an aspect it doesn't exist...

      Kind of like a coexistence between everything and nothing or knowing everything and knowing nothing.

      this is pretty much what I was trying to say.


      Ignorant bliss is an oxymoron; but so is miserable truth.

    25. #50
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      I believe that in this specific situation, it is impossible to answer your question since the knowledge of all existence will impact the situation too much.
      No matter where you go or what you do, you live your entire life within the confines of your head. ~Terry Josephson

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