Before I begin I want to be very clear... I am recovering from some sort of virus - flu I think - very weak - hard to think. In fact I wrote this thread in (mostly) that condition, except I felt stronger then.
XEI, Stormcrow and Scatterbrain
Please forgive me if I presume incorrectly or take anything out of context here. My impression of you three is as follows:
- You are all very intelligent/educated.
- You all subscribe to the religion/theory of evolution.
There are a couple things wrong with what you all have said...
In the first place whatever you know or believe about the origin of all life has to be a theory. Why? Well you weren't standing there when God created everything, should that theory be true, or when the first creature crawled out of the water, should that theory be true. You can theorize, study the scientific results of others (and you have to trust that these are accurate and unbiased), create and use a vast array of instruments, but ultimately you were never there, so you can never know for sure.
In the second place I asked you to not regurgitate what you have been taught, to look inside and pull out what you, personally, subscribe to and why you believe that. Yet despite the intelligence you obviously have, or want us all to believe you have (I make no assumptions either way), somehow you manage to not follow simple instructions. None of you have told me exactly why you think/believe/feel as you do.
Now if you don't want to that's fine - this is your right. I would never presume to force anyone to do anything that don't want to do. Flowing is always better than resistance, so it seems in my limited experience living in flow. Trying to blast a hole in the rock may shatter it, will definitely harm the rock. Flowing against it over time will cause water to flow through, and the rock will be unharmed, taking on a new and interesting shape. I am not calling anyone here a rock, or implying anything. Just using an illustration for the way I try to live and interact with others.
Finally I am not regurgitating the beliefs of others which have been taught to me. This was a direct attack on me and blatantly untrue. I told you what my beliefs were, my own, current, personal belief system, and why I believed that. I set an example I wanted others to follow. Please read my posts more carefully before you post your response.
I will re-iterate this... It is my personal belief, in agreement with, not subscription to, that everything which exists was created. Looking at the complexity of the physical world, and then the additional complexity of the spiritual world, it is easier for me to see a hand behind it all than random chance. I believe there is mutation, brought on by environmental changes as well as adaption. But I believe everything on earth that is here now is very similar to everything on earth when it was made. I believe in one of two possibilities...
1. God spoke everything into existence, and this would explain the sound I have read which vibrates through everything.
2. God thought everything into existence, and this supports the Christian idea of omnipotence, as it is easy to be perceived as being everywhere if everything is in one's mind. (Dreamers are omnipotent in this way.) This also supports the idea mentioned in several books on astral projection of thought manifesting, very quickly, as form, even faster in the higher vibrational states, and of course God is in the highest state.
This is my origin theory/hypothesis, completely and uniquely my own, developed from my studies, experiences, and personal observations, built, as I said, on the foundations of Creationism, but also independent of this theory. My origin theory/hypothesis is completely flexible and fluid, able to evolve through the adaption of new truths and discarding of anything that is not true.
BLUELINE976
Of all the posts so far I found yours to be the most thorough and enlightening, thank you!
PhilospherStoned
I appreciate your approach as well, thank you! I will be re-reading both of your posts when my head doesn't feel like it's stuffed with cotton balls.
mcwillis
Thank you for your defense, I really appreciate it! Thank you!
Everyone Else
Just a few clarifications needed... When I said ape I was speaking in general terms. I was of course using it as an all-inclusive label for the primates it is theorized/believed we evolved from.
As I recall there were tests done on the sun and solar events that proved a limited lifespan of all suns, to give a better time estimated 10s of thousands of years, not millions, were the estimated average lifespan. I used to read a lot of hard core, science based science fiction and studied this subject extensively. But I do not have any of the information on hand, so consider this merely my belief. A theory/hypothesis I subscribe to.
Someone said that evolution would take more than a human lifetime to complete. Of course, I do understand the theory. What I am saying as that even in our lifetimes, something should have evolved to a higher lifeform, because according to the theory it started the process many millions of years ago. Evolution is as far as I know an ongoing processes. Therefore brand new creatures should be attaining the next stage in their evolution in our lifetimes, yet nothing has been reported. New creatures have been discovered, but that are new discoveries, not new creatures. There are still parts of the rainforest and ocean that we have not fully explored. The primates the theory says we evolved from should have themselves evolved into whatever else their next stage is.
But lets just toss that last paragraph out and call it mindless drivel. Instead let's ask a question... How does Darwin, a man born over a hundred years ago, without modern technology or science, know anything at all about the origin of life? What's his proof? Sure they have skeleton's. The evolutionists keep digging up pieces of what they call the missing link. But over and over again the bones have proven fake or not what they were said to be. How can modern scientists follow the findings of a man with questionable motivations from over a hundred years ago? Isn't that the equivalent of digging out a surgical textbook from the 1800s and using its instruments and processes on a current patient, ignoring all modern science and tools? The truth is neither of these paragraphs can be ignored. There are holes in this theory/religion, simple as that.
Please understand a few things...
1. I was not aware that others have posted similar threads, and I had no intention of dredging up old debates. I may have similar beliefs to whoever started these posts that caused such offense, but I am not those posters. I violated forum law here, I did not search. Didn't want to, to be honest. I wanted to start this thread with my own take and questions, not sift through the postings of others. I apologize for any offense.
2. My beliefs are not set in stone. If you can prove to me that evolution is true I will change my beliefs. I have no attachment or aversion here. I seek out the truth, and will discard anything that is proven untrue. I draw from my own experiences and feelings, lacking any scientific basis from which to work, and have developed my current beliefs on the foundations of those I acquired as a Christian. I was a Creationist, and still have Creationist beliefs, but unlike when I first became a Christian I am now willing to let these beliefs go should they prove false. Understand this! You can say I have Creationist beliefs, but you can not label me a Creationist, any more than you could label me an Evolutionist if I adopted any of its beliefs. I simply have beliefs from various sources, but I do not belong to any particular camp anymore. If you must label me you can call me a TrueOriginist, or something like that, because this is the only thing my final collection of beliefs could be housed under. Once again I stress... I seek the truth. I see holes in the theory/religion of Evolution. I don't see them in the theory fo Creation - yet.
Much of what I have learned came from here:
The Institute for Creation Research
They may have changed but they used to approach things from a scientific angle, not throwing out Bible verses alone but using actual scientific proof to support what they teach. This is unique among Christian teachings. Sure they attack Evolutionists, but usually to expose lies, deceit and untruth. I admire them for fighting so long and hard against such a great opposing force. But again if it is proven that they have been lying or misleading, then I would no longer read their materials or support them. No attachment, no aversion.
I think I covered everything... I would still like to know why yogic/spiritual teachers support the theory/religion of evolution...
- DreamBliss
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