As you I should have known, Universal gets to dictate the subject of discussion. You win dude. You will continue to lead the topic astray until you find ground that you are comfortable on and then when beaten on that ground you will accuse me of going off topic so, you win. You are right, I am wrong;
Keeper, I return the thread to you. I've lost my stomach for these circular arguments against people claiming to know the true nature of the universe. They obviously know more than I; for I am a lowly human.