The Benefits of Flaming

**Original Poster** · 11-09-2008 09:01 PM

I'd like to use Foreverlucid's recent comeback as an example for what I'm talking about.

He showed back up at DV and started posting threads revealing the "truth," which were all basically a collection of youtube videos he'd been watching. I guess the jist of his "discoveries" was that Satan himself, who's actually an alien, is behind the illuminati and etc... you know the story.

Aside from what he posted, he also participated in threads revealing some incredible radical, buttfucking wild views when it came to things like homosexuality.

He wasn't "duped." He learned from people that genuinely believed what they were talking about, because they found a way to rationalize their crazy ideas. That's the thing, you can call his views irrational, but what is rational? Anything can be rationalized, a hundred thousand theories can be made about the nature of who controls the world and they can all be argued in a rational, logical way.

But he was met with criticism, a lot of it by useless trolls that never bothered looking up his material because he gave off that crack-head vibe. Anyway, no one took him seriously, people ripped his shit to hell, and a thousand others that preceded him, coming here and posting their threads rationalizing world events in some bizarre way. People here either leave, start thinking more pragmatically, or they're just concerned about having the "right" answer.

Here is where I bring up the point of this thread. Project Avalon is a website meant for all the people organizing together to prepare for all the horrible world calamities coming upon us. Likewise, it draws in a lot of foreverlucids since most of the planning is being motivated by a bunch of unverified youtube videos.

The atmosphere is very friendly, everyone compliments each other on their posts and arguing is restricted. This is supposed to be desirable right? Everyone is supportive and listen's to everyone's ideas with an open mind... etc. The problem is, half the people there have been inducted into the lightworker police and make buttfucking wild posts. Even if someone says, "That's unverified" it's often not paid attention to. It's like everyone can catalyze each other's impractical thought processes and further solidify these radical interpretations of the world. Sometimes I wish I could just respond to a post, "What the fuck are you talking about, you're making absolutely no sense at all," but it'd get reported and I'd probably be warned.

So my point is, sure being supportive and open minded to other people is important, but "truth" must be tested in everyone. If you have something you claim as true, that idea should be forced out of your grip as hard is possible, it should be destroyed. Then, whatever remains after going through the incinerator, that's truth. Even better, it's truth you can argue over making you a catalyst to the changing paradigm. If you just ignore criticism, and hide your truth, then it helps nobody.

So what do you think, flaming good?

**hungrymanz** · 11-09-2008 10:13 PM

Stfu cumbag.

**Original Poster** · 11-09-2008 10:49 PM

lo sabia que pase

**drewmandan** · 11-09-2008 10:52 PM

Originally Posted by Omnius Deus

So my point is, sure being supportive and open minded to other people is important, but "truth" must be tested in everyone. If you have something you claim as true, that idea should be forced out of your grip as hard is possible, it should be destroyed. Then, whatever remains after going through the incinerator, that's truth. Even better, it's truth you can argue over making you a catalyst to the changing paradigm. If you just ignore criticism, and hide your truth, then it helps nobody.

Right. So when are you going to start listening?

**Needcatscan** · 11-09-2008 10:59 PM

Originally Posted by hungrymanz

Stfu cumbag.

LOL.

I would have to say that flaming is usually personal insults. I think "flaming" with respect to putting someone's proverbial truth through the ringer is what makes arguing and debating work.

**Forsaken** · 11-10-2008 01:21 AM

Originally Posted by hungrymanz

Stfu cumbag.

^that's flaming^

I think you actually meant that unrestricted DEBATE is good.

**Original Poster** · 11-10-2008 04:31 AM

No, a line is a line. There is "constructive criticism" in Project Avalon but it's not that kind of criticism that causes people to leave DV. It's relentous, mocking criticism. I don't mean that people should ignore each others' arguments and post mean shit for no reason, nor am I saying DV or other forums that are even worse have the "right means" when it comes to combatting irrational ideas. I'm only saying to people that think bannage is the right way to handle things could look at the flip side. Maintaining a pleasantville atmosphere is not necessarily ideal. A certain amount of negativity is crucial. Everybody who's studied psychology knows that negative conditioning is more effective than positive.

**tnemrot** · 11-11-2008 01:36 AM

Whatever happened to FOREVERLUCID?

**Tyler** · 11-11-2008 01:56 AM

Originally Posted by hungrymanz

Stfu cumbag.

God that sounds so much like seismosaur.

**Grod** · 11-11-2008 02:32 AM

That's not Seismosaur, I assure you.

**Tyler** · 11-11-2008 05:38 AM

lol.
i was just saying he sounded like him.

**Xaqaria** · 11-11-2008 06:00 AM

Originally Posted by Omnius Deus

Everybody who's studied psychology knows that negative conditioning is more effective than positive.

I studied psychology and learned the exact opposite, actually. In fact, I know its true not just from studying psychology, but also from actually putting it into practice while training an animal.

In these circumstances, negative conditioning is not good for the person being criticized. There is only the perception of good for the person flaming, because the person they don't like leaves.

Foreverlucid didn't realize what he was doing wrong by being here. He left because we weren't open to his insights, and he's probably doing the exact same thing on another forum as we speak. He learned nothing from being flamed, except that he didn't like us either.

There is a line and although I'm not one to advocate drawing it and enforcing it; I will say that the side of unrestricted debate is much different from the side of blatant and unproductive/uninformative insults.

Edit: This also doesn't belong in R/S

**Original Poster** · 11-11-2008 02:48 PM

I swear I read negative reinforcement is more effective.

It wasn't to teach foreverlucid that he was wrong. It has the opposite effect than that because he just got reactionary when people started flaming. It did, however, correct his behavior.

Maybe it was that inconsistant reinforcement has longer lasting results...

And I put this in R/S because it's about R/S specifically not the whole forum.

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